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Meanwhile Franklin Graham with some pitiful thoughts

As to the passage of "Gehenna", it seems clear that Jesus was warning people about a bad place after death.

Do you agree with that?

Not likely. He seems to be drawing the distinction between an earthly death and a second, permanent death. When you view that passage in light of Revelation where the damned are cast into a lake of fire and destroyed, it makes more sense to interpret the passage that way.

It's also worth noting that Paul's epistles and the synoptic gospels present a much different view of the afterlife, as bodily resurrection at the end of the age is emphasized over the idea that people go to heaven or hell after dying. The Jews certainly didn't believe people went right to heaven or hell after death, so it seems pretty reasonable to conclude Jesus, a Jew, also promoted that idea.
 
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In some ways.
Gadzooks! I hope they don't all go to Hell!

God seems like the owner of an exclusive club... almost like a monarch, or a king. Obey or you got to hell. And, this is the same source for the creation of the Universe??? That's a tough one to square. It seems like we got some kind of mentally-challenged God.
 
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I think the overwhelming majority of Protestants are nuts. Not to mention delusional.
Now, that's a surprising take. Do you know many Protestants? The majority of Protestants, in my experience, are just like the majority of Catholics and Jews. They are sort of going-through-the-motions with the faith/church stuff and just trying to be good people.
 
I wasn't trying to make an indictment on Catholics. The Catholics I know personally are amazing, enlightened souls who actually seem more like agnostic themselves, except they're highly-educated and they, like me, have studied many, many forms of religious mythologies and accept them all as being legitimate. But, they accept, also, that restricting "God" to the mythology of an ancient Palestinian father figure that floats in the clouds is kind of a travesty to the vastness of consciousness and understanding. I mean... it's OKAY of that is all you need, I suppose. But, to me, it's sorta like forcing yourself to only eat rice for your entire life. "There's only one 'RIGHT' sustenance."

Yeah, most definitely. God is too big to be contained by one religion. I also believe it's likely souls go through some sort of purification process through reincarnation. Even the Bible seems to hint at that. I think we're also just beginning to scratch the surface on universal consciousness.

Regardless, my religious convictions center largely on the premise of probabilities and I don't know.
 
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Now, that's a surprising take. Do you know many Protestants? The majority of Protestants, in my experience, are just like the majority of Catholics and Jews. They are sort of going-through-the-motions with the faith/church stuff and just trying to be good people.

I once was one.

In general, for mainstream Lutherans, Methodists, etc., yes. But I was mostly referring to the prominent idea in many Protestant denominations and sects that your eternal salvation is all worked out in your head.
 
Not likely. He seems to be drawing the distinction between an earthly death and a second, permanent death. When you view that passage in light of Revelation where the damned are cast into a lake of fire and destroyed, it makes more sense to interpret the passage that way.

It's also worth noting that Paul's epistles and the synoptic gospels present a much different view of the afterlife, as bodily resurrection at the end of the age is emphasized over the idea that people go to heaven or hell after dying. The Jews certainly didn't believe people went right to heaven or hell after death, so it seems pretty reasonable to conclude Jesus, a Jew, also promoted that idea.

I think it's better to take Jesus's teachings on the topic as a whole. He also said Hell was the "outer darkness where people weep and gnash their teeth."

Regardless, if your interpretation of Hell is accurate and people are eventually destroyed, that's still a terrible fate.

Also, Jesus being Jewish isn't really relevant because his teachings went against Judaism. He's rejected by every Jewish sect.
 
I've asked several and they say Jesus is irrelevant to Judaism.

They say it's like asking a Christian about Buddha.

Again, not in dispute.

Is Jesus presented in the Christian Bible as the fulfillment of Judaism or is he not? Did Jesus say he came not to abolish the Mosaic Law but to fulfill or did he not?
 
Are you the Pastor who doesn't believe Hell is real?

Didn't Jesus talked about Hell many times in the Gospel of Matthew.

He said in Matthew 10:28:

"Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell."

What do you think Jesus meant by this and dozens of other references to Hell?

Was He just kidding or misinterpreted?

Just curious.

Please do a textual and historical criticism of Matt 10:28 before you come at me with prooftexting. I’ll take a full word study with original language analysis. And go ahead and give me a bibliography of accomplished scholars, not “Christianity.com.” Thanks.
 
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Please do a textual and historical criticism of Matt 10:28 before you come at me with prooftexting. I’ll take a full word study with original language analysis. And go ahead and give me a bibliography of accomplished scholars, not “Christianity.com.” Thanks.

Why do I need to? The words are very plain spoken.

Countless accomplished scholars over the past 2,000 years believe them including modern ones like Joseph Ratzinger and Father Thomas Joseph White as well the two greatest Christian theologians in history; Aquinas and Augustine.

My question is simply: why don't you?
 
Why do I need to? The words are very plain spoken.

Countless accomplished scholars over the past 2,000 years believe them including modern ones like Joseph Ratzinger and Father Thomas Joseph White as well the two greatest Christian theologians in history; Aquinas and Augustine.

My question is simply: why don't you?
I have. I went to seminary. That’s what you do there.
 
I have. I went to seminary. That’s what you do there.

Ratzinger and Father Thomas Joseph White taught at seminaries.

Can you explain what Jesus meant when he referenced Hell 28 times in the Gospel of Matthew and why you have it right and Aquinas and Augustine have it wrong?

I'm very curious.
 
No, you're not. You're crystallized.

Without your religion and The Bible, God even doesn't exist for you.

Nah.

I only believe in God because of personal experiences. I used to be an agnostic/atheist.

@Capernum doesn't believe in one of the central themes of the Gospel; separation from God, also known as "Hell."

I'm very curious as to why.
 
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I have. I went to seminary. That’s what you do there.

BTW, here's Father Thomas Joseph White's academic resume. Is yours better? 🙂


• D.Phil. in Theology, Oxford University, 2002.
• S.T.L. in Theology, Dominican House of Studies, 2007, summa cum laude.
• M.A. in Theology (Patristic and Modern Christology), Oxford University, 1995, 1st.
• B.A. in Religious Studies, Brown University, 1993, magna cum laude.
• Phillips Academy at Andover, 1989, magna cum laude.
 
Ratzinger and Father Thomas Joseph White taught at seminaries.

Can you explain what Jesus meant when he referenced Hell 28 times in the Gospel of Matthew and why you have it right and Aquinas and Augustine have it wrong?

I'm very
BTW, here's Father Thomas Joseph White's academic resume. Is yours better? 🙂


• D.Phil. in Theology, Oxford University, 2002.
• S.T.L. in Theology, Dominican House of Studies, 2007, summa cum laude.
• M.A. in Theology (Patristic and Modern Christology), Oxford University, 1995, 1st.
• B.A. in Religious Studies, Brown University, 1993, magna cum laude.
• Phillips Academy at Andover, 1989, magna cum laude
Do your homework. Study multiple perspectives and scholars. Do the research yourself. The debate of the academy is not what you think it is and you don’t do yourself any favors by assuming that you are well versed in this topic.
 
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Do your homework. Study multiple perspectives and scholars. Do the research yourself. The debate of the academy is not what you think it is and you don’t do yourself any favors by assuming that you are well versed in this topic.

Why won't you educate me on your perspective, then? I'm simply asking why you don't believe in Hell even though it's been a central part of Christianity for 2,000 years.

You said you went to seminary, but that doesn't mean much when so many scholars believe in Hell that also went to seminary.

Why are you right and they're wrong?
 
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