NCAA Scoring - Win After Bye

[orion52240]

I am putting together a spreadsheet to follow the NCAA/B1G wrestling tourneys and I have a scoring question.

To the quick, if a wrestler does not wrestle in the "pigtail match", is a round of 32 win awarded 2 advancement points (win following a bye) or 1 advancement point? (Same question for 1/2 vs 1 on the backside.) I am fairly certain it used to be awarded, but I believe they changed it.

Thank you in advance





This post was edited on 3/3 5:45 PM by orion52240

 

[AsicsFanatic]

1 point plus bonus. No byes at NCAA's. Big Tens there will be two wrestlers at each weight class that get byes, assuming every team sends a wrestler at each weight, those wrestlers will get two advancement points if they win. If they lose after receiving a bye they get no points for the bye.

 

[AsicsFanatic]

NM

This post was edited on 3/3 6:03 PM by AsicsFanatic

 

[orion52240]

Much appreciated. I assumed that for both NCAA's and B1G's, but I did not want to get too deep into my spreadsheet and have to change it.

 

[LutherAce]

I will have a nationals template available hopefully after this weekend
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[LutherAce]

can someone confirm for me that a seeded wrestler would not be put in a pigtail? or am i just wishing.

Also, they seed to 16, correct?

 

[AsicsFanatic]

Last year, 2014, no seeded wrestler had a pigtail.

2013 #3 seed Donald Vinson from Binghamton had a pigtail match at 149. #8 seed Dylan Alton of Penn St had a pigtail match at 157.
http://i.turner.ncaa.com/dr/ncaa/ncaa/release/sites/default/files/files/DI-Wrestling-Brackets-2013-WR.pdf

2012 six seeded wrestlers had pigtail matches including #5 seed Ethen Lofthouse.
http://www.ncaa.com/content/2012-di-wrestling-brackets

2011 two seeded wrestlers had pigtails including #12 Grant Gambrall.
http://intermatwrestle.com/Files/pdf/10-11/ncaadivisionichampionships.pdf

So it either luck of the draw or they started last year saying no seeded wrestler gets a pigtail.

2014 NCAA Brackets

 

[01Hawk05]

The NCAA brackets are treated as 64 man brackets. Although it doesn't show it, every 1st round match that is not a pigtail is treated as a bye winner. So first round winners get 2 pts advancement.

If you win a pigtail you get 1 pt advancement. If you win a pigtail and then win your 1st rd match, you can only gain 1 more advancement.

And yes, seeded wrestlers can be in pigtails.

Backside is treated the same way with pig tail winners getting .5 and first round winners getting 1 (unless they won their pig tail consi, then they only get .5 more).

This post was edited on 3/4 9:00 AM by 01Hawk05

 

[LutherAce]

From the 2015 Pre-Championships Manual, page 12

Pairings and Seeding
The top 16 wrestlers in each weight class will be seeded with no requirement that wrestlers from the same conference/
qualifying tournament not meet in the first round. Further, all pigtail (play-in) matches will be randomly selected from the
pool of unseeded wrestlers. After the seeds have been determined and placed in the bracket, the remainder of the weight
class will be drawn randomly




Manual

 

[01Hawk05]

Originally posted by LutherAce:
From the 2015 Pre-Championships Manual, page 12

Pairings and Seeding
The top 16 wrestlers in each weight class will be seeded with no requirement that wrestlers from the same conference/
qualifying tournament not meet in the first round. Further, all pigtail (play-in) matches will be randomly selected from the
pool of unseeded wrestlers. After the seeds have been determined and placed in the bracket, the remainder of the weight
class will be drawn randomly

Well, there is that.

They must have changed that after 2013 because I always remember seeded wrestlers being in pigtails in years past.

 

[LutherAce]

Originally posted by 01Hawk05:
The NCAA brackets are treated as 64 man brackets. Although it doesn't show it, every 1st round match that is not a pigtail is treated as a bye winner. So first round winners get 2 pts advancement.

If you win a pigtail you get 1 pt advancement. If you win a pigtail and then win your 1st rd match, you can only gain 1 more advancement.

And yes, seeded wrestlers can be in pigtails.

Backside is treated the same way with pig tail winners getting .5 and first round winners getting 1 (unless they won their pig tail consi, then they only get .5 more).

This post was edited on 3/4 9:00 AM by 01Hawk05

No, it's treated as a 33 man bracket. Winners of Rd1 only get 1 advancement point. Pigtail wrestlers are the only ones that would get an extra advancement point.

 

[OILCHECKER]

Originally posted by 01Hawk05:
The NCAA brackets are treated as 64 man brackets. Although it doesn't show it, every 1st round match that is not a pigtail is treated as a bye winner. So first round winners get 2 pts advancement.

If you win a pigtail you get 1 pt advancement. If you win a pigtail and then win your 1st rd match, you can only gain 1 more advancement.

And yes, seeded wrestlers can be in pigtails.

Backside is treated the same way with pig tail winners getting .5 and first round winners getting 1 (unless they won their pig tail consi, then they only get .5 more).


This post was edited on 3/4 9:00 AM by 01Hawk05

What?

 

[01Hawk05]

Originally posted by LutherAce:

Originally posted by 01Hawk05:
The NCAA brackets are treated as 64 man brackets. Although it doesn't show it, every 1st round match that is not a pigtail is treated as a bye winner. So first round winners get 2 pts advancement.

If you win a pigtail you get 1 pt advancement. If you win a pigtail and then win your 1st rd match, you can only gain 1 more advancement.

And yes, seeded wrestlers can be in pigtails.

Backside is treated the same way with pig tail winners getting .5 and first round winners getting 1 (unless they won their pig tail consi, then they only get .5 more).

This post was edited on 3/4 9:00 AM by 01Hawk05

No, it's treated as a 33 man bracket. Winners of Rd1 only get 1 advancement point. Pigtail wrestlers are the only ones that would get an extra advancement point.

I am 100% sure thats the way they used to do it but that could have been thrown out last year too.

Here is a link to a 2012 bracket where it says right on each weights bracket that its scored as a 64 man.

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/big10/sports/m-wrestl/auto_pdf/2011-12/misc_non_event/B1GWRES12NCAAChampsFinal.pdf

 

[lookleft goright]

As long as it is not too confusing even the casual fan will be able to follow it.

 

[LutherAce]

i agree, they used to, but looking at last year for Old Dominion (used them for this purpose)

125 - Brandon Jeske (20-15) place is unknown and scored 3.00 team points.
Prelim - Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 won by fall over Corey Keener (Central Mich.) 19-14 (Fall 5:25)
Champ. Round 1 - David Terao (American) 34-10 won in tie breaker - 1 over Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 (TB-1 5-3)
Cons. Round 1 - Bradley Taylor (Wisconsin) 19-6 won by decision over Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 (Dec 5-1)

141 - Chris Mecate (28-9) place is unknown and scored 1.00 team points.
Champ. Round 1 - Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 won by decision over Joey Delgado (Oregon St.) 24-15 (Dec 4-2)
Champ. Round 2 - Richard Durso (Frank. & Marsh.) 37-6 won by decision over Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 (Dec 3-2)
Cons. Round 2 - Sam Speno (North Carolina St.) 26-12 won in sudden victory - 1 over Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 (SV-1 5-3)

Brandon Jeske was a pigtail and won, so he got 2 for fall, 1 for advancement

Chris Mecate did not have a pigtail, and he won his first match to advance 1 point.


I think it was all changed in 2013 when they went to 33 man bracket, instead of treating as a 64 with byes.

 

[01Hawk05]

Originally posted by LutherAce:
i agree, they used to, but looking at last year for Old Dominion (used them for this purpose)

125 - Brandon Jeske (20-15) place is unknown and scored 3.00 team points.
Prelim - Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 won by fall over Corey Keener (Central Mich.) 19-14 (Fall 5:25)
Champ. Round 1 - David Terao (American) 34-10 won in tie breaker - 1 over Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 (TB-1 5-3)
Cons. Round 1 - Bradley Taylor (Wisconsin) 19-6 won by decision over Brandon Jeske (Old Dominion) 20-15 (Dec 5-1)

141 - Chris Mecate (28-9) place is unknown and scored 1.00 team points.
Champ. Round 1 - Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 won by decision over Joey Delgado (Oregon St.) 24-15 (Dec 4-2)
Champ. Round 2 - Richard Durso (Frank. & Marsh.) 37-6 won by decision over Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 (Dec 3-2)
Cons. Round 2 - Sam Speno (North Carolina St.) 26-12 won in sudden victory - 1 over Chris Mecate (Old Dominion) 28-9 (SV-1 5-3)

Brandon Jeske was a pigtail and won, so he got 2 for fall, 1 for advancement

Chris Mecate did not have a pigtail, and he won his first match to advance 1 point.


I think it was all changed in 2013 when they went to 33 man bracket, instead of treating as a 64 with byes.

Thanks.

 

[ISUChip]

Originally posted by LutherAce:
I think it was all changed in 2013 when they went to 33 man bracket, instead of treating as a 64 with byes.

Correct. Des Moines was the first instance of the "new" scoring, and the change was not communicated very well to media/SIDs (and other folks who like to keep score).

 

[McK_Hawk]

Dumb question, does anyone kow wy they don't just have 32 wrestlers at each weight? Why is there 33?

 

[LutherAce]

not sure why they chose 33, but i think they went to an uniform number for all weight classes.

I think there was a time when each weight had a different number of wrestlers in it and it was all over the board.

Someone with more knowledge than myself can chime in.