NYT: We kept schools closed too long
- Thread starter artradley
- Start date
I completely understand the "substance" of your post. You keep talking about what we should have done without for even a single second thinking about the actual people on the other end of that. What we should have done and what we could have done don't come remotely close to aligning and your inability to comprehend that is at the bottom of all of this.
Spot on.
Lots of older teachers didn't want to get exposed to Covid w/o a vaccine.
And even younger/middle aged ones who needed to care for aging parents and didn't want to expose them would be in the same boat.
I’m not talking about we should have done. I am talking about the comparisons between how different schools handled the pandemic, and what the results were. It is 100% focused on the people, and how it affected them. All I’m talking about is the bottom line.
Until you’re prepared to say the studies cited in the OP are wrong, you are not arguing to my point. It is nothing but sound and fury.
And so, an analysis of the results of the various policies is somehow irrelevant?
That “point” was supplying reasons as to why school closings would be the lesser of two evils. The studies we’re reviewing whether or not those predictions were true.
The article makes two points, are you refuting either of them?
If any of you bullsh1t artist truly gave a crap you would be far more concerned about phones in schools. They are far worse on education than Covid.
The Op Ed does not touch AT ALL on the issue of teachers becoming ill, or infecting family members who would be at risk.
The 1 school district in the metro (Millard) that went in person in fall of 2020 was open for 3 days before they shut down for multiple weeks because of a covid outbreak.
True. It did not focus on individual anecdotes but rather on statistics regarding entire communities. Usually this is considered a good thing by people trying to soberly assess the success of a policy.
I have lots of thoughts about education, what is effective, what isn’t, what the goals should be, diverting public funds to private schools, and yes, getting smart devices out of the classroom. Discussing one topic does not preclude people from holding strong opinions on other topics.
No; it did not analyze that topic at all. There's nothing "anecdotal" about it.
Meanwhile, there's a strong correlation between areas that kept schools open (Trump counties) and about a 3:1 ratio in deaths in those same areas.
And, as I'd already explained to you: many school districts were already struggling with coverage in having enough teachers. Losing a few for a month due to Covid, or permanently due to death, meant "no school" vs "remote school".
That the longer schools were closed, the farther behind children fell? I don't know who disputes that. Certainly, not me.
A "policy" can only be as effective as your ability to implement it. And examining it after the fact can only inform choices going forward - using it to thump your chest and proclaim how "right" you were is dumb.
In August of 2020, people were going to keep their children at home - they weren't concerned about the "entire community", they were concerned about their own households and they were far more concerned about Covid than any potential "learning loss". More than a year later, when given the choice between in-person instruction and remote instruction, most of the families in our district still chose to remain remote. So many of our teachers refused to return to the classroom that the district had to set up a totally remote school. I know the same thing happened in our neighboring district and their fully remote school is still open as parents protest plans to close it. Now you can somehow dismiss that reality in your attempts to demonstrate that we "got it wrong" but anyone with the slightest trace of common sense knows better.
A lot of Monday morning quarterbacking in this thread. There were more factors to consider than just “kids weren’t likely to die from covid”
Like the long term damage that would occur by keeping kids away from school and friends for months?
You're right, that factor didn't get the consideration it deserved at the time.
Like having to pander to teachers unions? You mean like the CDC and Fauci having to admit they were mistaken about a lot of things, which would cause them credibility issues?
It’s a lie to say kids didn’t spread Covid
And that was my point: https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/threads/nyt-we-kept-schools-closed-too-long.439763/post-11988461
" The point on any post-mortem is to look back at things when we are no longer in the heat of the moment to review what mistakes were made so we can hopefully do better the next time."
So what's the plan to deal with families and teachers who will - next time - refuse to report for in-person school? I don't understand what "doing better" means. I seriously doubt anyone does.
nice response to monday morning quarterbacking citing something that defines it.
Many knew it was a poor decision at the time. And, many said it at the time. You and others defended keeping schools closed, and you were wrong. The data proves it.
Certainly made sense to err on the side of caution. My wife's school went back in person to start the 2020/2021 school year but masks required. Except then half the parents took their kids to a chiropractor to get a note so they didn't have to wear masks.
Some of you people are so black and white. There were many different things to consider when it came to life with COVID. School were just one piece. People were concerned for their lives. You can declare schools open but then you better be prepared for teachers to not show up. Everyone had a decision to make for them. You can't expect people to risk their lives for others. If your kid is behind then you need to step up and help your kid, it's called being a parent.
So less education = less educated people?
I hope they didn't spend to much time and money on that research.
I hope they didn't spend to much time and money on that research.
That's fine when you are addressing an individual parent. From a public policy perspective, however, it is irresponsible. You have to understand that a significant percentage of parents do not have the tools to help a child succeed. Many did not have the luxury of jobs they could perform remotely, meaning children were home alone or with a just as unprepared relative.
Anyone making public policy knew that, and needed to take it into consideration. They also knew that the children who were least ready for remote schooling were also already the most vulnerable. As cavalier as many Republic governors were in reopening schools, many on the left were cavalier with the known harm that remote schooling was going to cause the most vulnerable of children.
And, instead of setting up social safety nets for those kids, we ban abortions, entirely, and cut taxes for the rich.
You need to let go. There was no way to force teachers to show up. it was a Pandemic. Get over it and move on, your more damaged from not letting go than the damage the pandemic caused you. See a doctor about letting go.
Teachers showed up where schools opened earlier. You’re arguing a prediction that didn’t come true.
Nice tactic, though, going personal when you lose on logic.
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