OT - Patrick McCaferry's #22
- Thread starter El Simbolo
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6-7 freshman at IC West who is learning the game on the varsity level. Rarely does more than pass the ball around and gets some rebounds when he's in the game, but anybody can see the potential talent this kid has. Will be fun to watch him develop over the next few years. Connor was the same as a freshman. Barely scored, but had incredible potential.
I'm interested to know what happens in 2017.
When Liberty High opens in North Liberty, that's going to fracture the Iowa City West program I'd think?
When Liberty High opens in North Liberty, that's going to fracture the Iowa City West program I'd think?
Going to watch the game tonight so looking forward to seeing the future Hawk and possible future Hawk.
Sorry about this as I am being the 'hyperbole' police but when I see a player labeled as 'incredible talent' I am thinking of a young Lebron James, Kobe Bryant, Westbrook, etc. type of player. I would suggest not using 'incredible talent' to label players. The 'talent' word is also something that drives me crazy because it's so over-used in sports. I am sure I can jump onto the Rutgers bball board and find posts labeling their guys as 'talented' despite going 1-17 in the B1G. Every guy playing in college probably has some degree of 'talent' so what does that really mean? It seems to me people use 'talent' to mean 'difference maker' but if that is the case it really needs to be reserved for the top 5-10 high school players in the nation? Sorry for the rant again.
Otherwise I agree with you.
ICW has stupid talent for an Iowa HS basketball program. Cedar Falls gave them one hell of a game last night (they've also upped their talent level since I lived there - it was a HUGE deal for CF to beat Waterloo East when I lived there). Crazy ending in that 4A semi. This whole tournament has had a lot of great games in all classes.
Somehow I didn't see "incredible talent" in the post;. I saw "incredible potential" and "potential talent." So why the rant?
Can anyone explain how Fran has a son that is 6'7'' as a freshmen? Any chance my son will be that tall?
Isn't Fran pretty tall himself? Holy hell apparently IC West has never played against a 3-2 zone before. Good move by Valley.
My bad. I am at the game but I do not see 'incredible potential' so far for Connor. No points at half time on 0-2 from the 3 point line. Not aggressively seeking to score nor has elite quickness. He has good size and has added some muscle to his frame since I saw him his freshman year. His jumper looked ok in warm ups. I think we are looking at a role player though.
Also not tremendously impressed with Pemsel. Gives good effort. Not horrible but just does not jump out at you in person. Plays below the rim. Does not look as tall as advertised.
Now Patrick McCaffrey is probably 2-3 inches taller than Connor. His feet are huge length wise. Moves ok for size. Lacks strengh big time as you can understand from a freshman. His outside shot is not as good in person as I expected it to be from earlier on-line highlights. Looks to have some potential though and should have some true height at least.
Both Connor and Pemsel just do not look like they have the power conference athleticism to be starters and/or difference makers but I hope I am wrong.
It's tough to take much away from HS games imo. In the games that have been on ESPN Cook doesn't look like a top 75 recruit. The HS game is so slow and congested compared to the wide open AAU style. Kids really don't have a lot of room to move against teams that pack in defenses or slow the game down.
However, you are correct for tonight. Connor isn't very aggressive and has shot poorly.
However, you are correct for tonight. Connor isn't very aggressive and has shot poorly.
I am wondering the same thing. I want to see if he can get off the floor like Wes. He's a very aggressive player.
Maybe just not a good game for Conner but this is the first time I've seen him play and I am not at all impressed.
Agreed. I expected a lot more from IC West. Lane was the only Trojan that looked like a legitimate D1 possibility.
Nobody in that 4A game impressed me. What a terrible game to watch.
Connor is not the answer at point guard. Just my opinion, but I was not impressed at all.
Man the negativity from the Hawks is making everyone down on everything remotely tied to the Hawks. It was a HS basketball game. With no shot clock, Iowa high school ball can be really ugly when a team like Valley decides to bleed clock. There's little flow or movement. Remember the kids do play games and have bad ones. People are watching too many highlight tapes.
I'm commenting on how he looked offensively. McCaffrey isn't a B1G quality player right now. Didn't have a good shot, didn't want to be taking the shots, wasn't finding other ways to score, etc. if a true B1G player was on that court, you'd have known it. Just what I saw though.
"Nobody in that 4A game impressed me. What a terrible game to watch..."
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Agree. Average basketball, yet this was the best in the state...and U of Iowa continues to recruit a lot of players from this hotbed called Iowa Basketball.
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Agree. Average basketball, yet this was the best in the state...and U of Iowa continues to recruit a lot of players from this hotbed called Iowa Basketball.
Just to be clear, I thought CMac was bad tonight as well. He needs plenty of work. Fortunately he knows some people that can help him out I'm sure. I can already tell though that unless he's all-B1G freshmen team, he will be one of the most scrutinized players of this fan base. Woodbury x 2
I was disappointed about the way he shot the ball. He wasn't very aggressive with the ball either. So many high school teams play so slow and deliberate nowadays. Not a very exciting brand of basketball. I never thought I'd say it, but maybe the high schools need the shot clock too.
I totally agree. Looked more like a junior high game with a little bigger bodies. Watching paint dry would be more exciting. They sure weren't guarding players close so they could have put up a shot at any time. If anyone thought they were defending if several did get in the middle of the floor it was because of poor spacing a very ho hum game.
I am a pretty positve poster in general and a supporter of Fran. Like many I attend Iowa games and watch players in person. I know TV is great and all but a live experience is still the best. You see more in person. I also attend these high school championships often. I've seen Paige, Barnes, McDermott, McCabe, Bohannen, Pemsel, etc. play. Connor is no where close to the type of player or athlete that Paige was as an example. Paige was dominant on the court but even he has struggled some at times and has had to stay 4 years at UNC. What does that tell you given the type of players recruited to UNC.
I am a firm believer in giving Connor a scholly if he deserves it and have said so on this board but after what I saw tonight I would really lean towards changing to a walk-on offer instead. That's not going to happen but it would be the best for the program and probably best for his psyche. Connor appears not to possess the base athleticism including foot speed to make it at the power 5 level agsinst the types of athletes he is going to see with programs like MSU, Maryland, Indiana, OSU, Michigan, Purdue, etc. Gesell is twice the athlete Connor is and we know about his struggles in the B1G. I am not sure that people really get that the B1G is an elite basketball conference most years and how freaking good you have to be to play meaningful minutes. If Connor was an elite shooter like we think Bohannen will be then maybe I could see it but that does not appear to be the case. He has a decent jumper but nothing off the charts and it does not appear that he can create for himself. Troubling to me is he was not able to blow by any Valley player off the dribble and their were multiple opportunities. No attempts at the rim. Lane was able to a few times. He also did not take advantage of his size mismatch on the 5'10" Valley guard on the block several times. He has a lot of work to do to make it.
I have concerns about Pemsel too and am curious about his true height. He played hard and was aggressive but I did not see an explosive player on the blocks. You know he's going to see players that will send his shot into the third row if he plays below the rim. He's going to have to develop some craftiness in his game that McCabe did around the bucket just to contribute. We will see.
Lane was interesting. Could not decide if he could make it at Iowa or not but he has more athleticism, quickness and aggressiveness than Connor. He actually drove it and finished a few in traffic. He hit a few outside shots. I do not think he is quite the leaper that Wasphun is which is the athleticism aspect that helps him to elevate as needed. He has an interesting body type as he is really solid/thick from the hips down. I think he'd be a better player for UNI than Tanner Lohaus will be (not impressed at all).
If you are going to error on a player, error on the side of quickness, explosion and toughness like what we see in Wagner. He lacks offensive skills at the moment but that can possibly be developed but you cannot develop the god-given qualities. If it does not materialize he can learn to play very good defense and rebound to contribute that way. That's my issue with bringing in guys like Fleming, Ellingson, now Connor & possibly Pemsel.
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Connor strikes me as a pass 1st PG. Much like Gesell, just better size but not going to be as quick. You can win games with a pass 1st PG, but you need to surround him with guys that can fill up the net. That has been Fran's problem, too many role players, not enough guys that can create their own shot.
I agree with the pass-first but honestly that's not going to get it done in the B1G, especially when your pass-first does not include any ability to break anyone down off the dribble.
Just comparing players ability to contribute, Baer is better and he has limitations.
He'd better improve a ton and dominate next year. Keep in mind this is Iowa High School bball - a far cry from the level/types of players that will be seeing in the B1G.
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Peter Jok and Jarrod Uthoff: Both Iowa high school basketball players, both All-Big Ten players
You do understand the concept of a 3-2 extended zone, right? No....I thought so.
You guys are dolts. Walk on? Come on. Get a grip. Valley zoned and did it well. They extended the zone. West never got into any flow because of it. But let's give a 4 star basketball player walk on status. Friggin moronic. How about giving credit to Valley for out coaching West and taking away virtually everything.
As for Pemsl, he will be just fine. Only somebody full of shit with an agenda would suggest he plays below the rim. Again, moronic. Xavier zoned as well to double and triple Pemsl. I swear the collective iq of the Iowa fan base has been piss poor as of late.
As for Pemsl, he will be just fine. Only somebody full of shit with an agenda would suggest he plays below the rim. Again, moronic. Xavier zoned as well to double and triple Pemsl. I swear the collective iq of the Iowa fan base has been piss poor as of late.
If that is the case i saw no indications of that in warm ups or game play. He did not limp and appeared to be moving and cutting as any other player.
Anyway you chalk it up he did not look like a 4 star player to me. I'm no recruiting expert but watching B1G competition live you get a sense of how good a player has to be just to hang. You are talking about elite level competition in the B1G so a zone by an Iowa high school team immediately shuts his game down? A high school team in Valley with no 4 star or D1 players (to my knowledge)?
He was also not selected to the all-tournament team as well so is that pretty common for a highly rated player as that encompass play over 3 games?
Keep in mind I want to be wrong and hope you are right but boy if that is the level of athleticism and play from a 4 star I have to wonder about rating systems. He was not even the best player on West last night. I've see Barnes, McDermott. Paige, McCabe, etc at the state tourney in person and pretty sure they saw some zone too and still dominated.
I can understand and saw the packed zone affecting Pemsel more as he was truly doubled and tripled at times when touching the ball. He was not bad but again I did not see an explosive athlete and he did not appear as tall as advertised. I will be interested to see him stand next to Wagner next year. He's going to have to have a crafty game around the bucket to contribute. I did not see a lot of foot speed and just was not wowed by him. He gave great effort, was unselfish and aggressive so that was good to see.
Neither player struck me as an impact player at the B1G level in anything I saw that's all. Again want to be wrong.
