ADVERTISEMENT

Shouldn't We Be Going After Grad Transfer WRs HARD?

iowalaw

All-Conference
Jan 20, 2015
413
551
93
Scottsdale
While our recruiting classes continue to hover in the 40s in the national rankings year in and year out, our WR recruiting has been abysmal. This year, of our 25 commits, the 2 WR commits (Darby and Young) were the lowest rated of the bunch. In fact, in the past 4 years, we have got commits almost exclusively from 2 star WR recruits, while loading up with talent at other positions.

So fine, we can't recruit WRs. Shouldn't we then make lemons out of lemonade and go after some stud Wrs as graduate transfers? Or maybe a stud JUCO who can be plugged in immediately and give CJ a deep threat? We have one of the best QBs in the country and literally no one to throw to.

It looks like Alabama, who stocks up on 5 star recruits every year, just bolstered their roster with the top WR in the MAC, a kid from Bowling Green, as a grad transfer.

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2016/02/13/alabama-lands-mac-star-wr-transfer-gehrig-dieter.html
 
D'Vario Montgomery is available....just kidding....

Iowa tried to get involved with Juco- Taj Williams this recent cycle...he took his talents to TCU

Iowa once again "kicked the tires" this past fall, on Juco-Derrick Willies...he said"no thanks" and took his talents to Texas Tech...
 
  • Like
Reactions: iowalaw
Couldn't agree more w/ the OP! This is a head scratcher and has been for years. C.J. Jones was a God send in '02 and theres no reason not to duplicate or at least to attempt that. This years WR core is gonna be brutal. Thats my opinion. Vandeberg is the No.1? Good player for sure but c'mon not a 1. While CJB is a top 10 QB and has the arm to back it. The staff just cant seem to figure out how to recruit WR's so the Juco/ transfer route for this position is a reasonable strategy. Going to be a long year for the passing game. No one can get separation and id be willing to bet we have the worst WR core in the Big10. Really no excuse for it. Thats whats puzzling.
 
Well, for one they don't have any room for more players. Second, they must feel good about the guys that they have at WR. Vandeberg has gotten better every year and J. Smith showed flashes of his potential and can be a deep threat. Ogwo has big time speed and Facloner and Scheel both have a lot of potential. And while he was a good blocker, Hillyer wasn't a very good WR. I actually think they will be better at wideout than they were last year. T. Smith had a pretty disappointing senior season.
 
I'm not sure what it is about Falconer that makes you say he has a lot of potential? He played last year and had zero catches. He was a two star recruit who's best offer was Western Kentucky. While J Smith did have catches in a couple of games, him and CJ had a hard time getting in sync most of the time and he had a lot of targets that were not catches. I can't tell if it was route running or just giving up on routes, but there were tons of misses. Then there's Ogwo? Have not seen him play, but one can assume since he was below Falconer on the WR depth chart, he's not going to walk in and be a big time target.

All in all, I think Kirk dropped the ball big time in WR recruiting this year. We had a LOT to sell potential recruits coming off a Rose Bowl with a returning stud QB. We couldn't get a single JUCO/grad transfer WR to step in with the promise of immediate playing time/starting? There have got to be a ton of WRs playing at lesser schools going into their redshirt sr year who would kill to be part of a Big 10 championship caliber team. Obviously there were punters out there who saw a chance to come in and play right away due to a hole in our roster.

Thank goodness we have a lot coming back at RB, cause WR might not be pretty.
 
i think Frank Darby is the WR recruit they need to qualify this year because he is the best of the 2 and his film looked really good.

This is what hawkeyegamefilm said about him in one of Morehouse's latest articles.
Frank Darby, WR, 6-1, 180 (Lincoln High School, Jersey City, N.J.)

Darby is a lean, speedy WR prospect who brings an excellent vertical element. He shows excellent ball skills at the catch-point on deep balls. He flashes those skills on both routine, uncontested catches as well as contested jump balls. He effortlessly tracks the ball in the air and has excellent body control to adjust on the fly. He is a weapon in the screen game and if given a lane he can turn it into a big play or TD. Despite not being an overly big prospect, he does show the ability to beat arm tackles and turn short catches into big plays.

He is listed at 6-1 180, but looks both shorter and lighter to me. He plays primarily on the outside in his HS system but will need to add some size and strength to protect himself in traffic over the middle. He outclasses his level of HS competition and often separates on pure athleticism; he will need some work as a route runner as well. He does tend to use his body to catch the ball on shorter routes and it’s area where he can improve.

He does have a habit of not securing the football as a runner, which could be a barrier to seeing the field early. If he does see the field early it likely would be as a kick returner but I think a redshirt year will be needed. To me, Darby is a high 3-star WR prospect who has some traits comparable to 4-star WR prospects. His lack of major D1 offers and interest is surprising to me even if his size is a concern.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IaHawk44
What about moving Parker to receiver? (Serious) Know he can play a mean game of hot potato, but does he have hands, or ever catch balls? He has the speed to be a deep threat, wonder if they've ever tried him out.
 
I'm not sure what it is about Falconer that makes you say he has a lot of potential? He played last year and had zero catches. He was a two star recruit who's best offer was Western Kentucky. While J Smith did have catches in a couple of games, him and CJ had a hard time getting in sync most of the time and he had a lot of targets that were not catches. I can't tell if it was route running or just giving up on routes, but there were tons of misses. Then there's Ogwo? Have not seen him play, but one can assume since he was below Falconer on the WR depth chart, he's not going to walk in and be a big time target.

All in all, I think Kirk dropped the ball big time in WR recruiting this year. We had a LOT to sell potential recruits coming off a Rose Bowl with a returning stud QB. We couldn't get a single JUCO/grad transfer WR to step in with the promise of immediate playing time/starting? There have got to be a ton of WRs playing at lesser schools going into their redshirt sr year who would kill to be part of a Big 10 championship caliber team. Obviously there were punters out there who saw a chance to come in and play right away due to a hole in our roster.

Thank goodness we have a lot coming back at RB, cause WR might not be pretty.

If you look at falconer's film you can tell. There is a reason they chose not to redshirt him and that is because they think he is going to be good. He didn't have any catches because he played mostly special teams and I don't know if he ever saw any time with the ones but that isn't surprising. He had upperclassman ahead of him. And I would say Cincinnati and Memphis are better offers than Western Kentucky.

Ogwo has worldclass speed. He is behind some of the other guys because he quit football for awhile in high school to focus on track but then came back his senior year and CJ raved about him in camp last year. He was also on the smaller side. I am not saying they for sure are going to be good but you can tell they have a lot of upside.

Again, they had two WRs committed they liked and they had other positions they needed to fill, mainly TE and OL. It isn't the amount of stars from Rivals that matters. By the way both Darby and Young were composite 3 star recruits on 247. The only site that had them at 2 stars was Rivals.

So you don't think Smith is going to be any good either?
 
  • Like
Reactions: IaHawk44
What about moving Parker to receiver? (Serious) Know he can play a mean game of hot potato, but does he have hands, or ever catch balls? He has the speed to be a deep threat, wonder if they've ever tried him out.

They did move him to WR. Probably still figuring trying to figure out how to be a WR. He is a kid they need to get on the field though. He is serious speed.
 
David - I'm excited to hear that Ogwo has world class speed. We definitely need a guy who can stretch the field and maybe he will be a Powell type player. An endorsement from CJ is always a good thing! It is concerning, however, that a guy with world class speed had offers from Louisiana Monroe rather than LSU. Time will tell.

Like everyone, I'd love to think that Smith is the real deal, and watched him intently last year...I just don't see it with him. Hopefully things will click with him after more film study, because he had a ton of passes thrown his way that were not even close due to miscommunication/weird route running. These things can be corrected, though, and I don't recall him having many drops.

I'm still holding out hope that Scheel will be the real deal and will leapfrog the rest to be our 2nd leading receiver this upcoming year. He looks the part on paper, and played great in the spring game. Not sure what happened to him.

Also, maybe Parker can be the deep threat we need. He's super short, but he can fly. Can he catch?



If you look at falconer's film you can tell. There is a reason they chose not to redshirt him and that is because they think he is going to be good. He didn't have any catches because he played mostly special teams and I don't know if he ever saw any time with the ones but that isn't surprising. He had upperclassman ahead of him. And I would say Cincinnati and Memphis are better offers than Western Kentucky.

Ogwo has worldclass speed. He is behind some of the other guys because he quit football for awhile in high school to focus on track but then came back his senior year and CJ raved about him in camp last year. He was also on the smaller side. I am not saying they for sure are going to be good but you can tell they have a lot of upside.

Again, they had two WRs committed they liked and they had other positions they needed to fill, mainly TE and OL. It isn't the amount of stars from Rivals that matters. By the way both Darby and Young were composite 3 star recruits on 247. The only site that had them at 2 stars was Rivals.

So you don't think Smith is going to be any good either?
 
It seems like first year WR's with talent don't see the field, so I'm not sure this is a good idea. It apparently takes more than speed, or talent to make our offense go, so it seems unlikely a grad transfer would do us much good.
 
I think it's great if WRs can block, BUT my sense of things under KF is that blocking is the No. 1 criterion for a WR to see the field for the Hawkeyes. To me, that's pretty backward thinking. KF likes to use baseball analogies for some reason, and so it seems to me his WR priorities are equivalent to basing your starting pitching rotation on who the best bunters are. Bunting runners over can be helpful, but getting guys out is really the pitcher's job. Likewise, WRs who can block are helpful, but their real job is to run fast and catch the ball.

As has been noted, especially with a QB with CJ's talent, Iowa needs to play kids who run fast and catch the ball. If they can block a little, cool, but if they run fast and catch the ball the offense won't need them to do much blocking, just like if a pitcher gets guys out he won't have to worry about doing much bunting.

WRs who study Iowa see that they would be coming to a place where WRs are evaluated on secondary criteria like blocking rather than on game-breaking criteria like running fast and catching the ball. Until that philosophy changes, and it hasn't for 17 years, it's hardly a mystery that Iowa can't scrounge up playmaking WRs.

Having said all that, I believe Iowa has some talent and speed in their young wide receivers. But that talent and speed will be wasted (Damond Powell, anyone?) if history is any indication. And that would be a horribe, horrible shame.
 
I think with a year under their belt, the younger guys will step up and be better than last year's receivers. If they can surprise and pick up a couple guys off the 2017 offer list, they should have some depth for the future. I expect the guys with the speed, Smith and Ogwo, to take the next step up. An extra year in a program can make a big difference in a player's comfort level and maturity. The Hawks have a good QB, I'm confident they will have a good passing game to match their running attack. GO HAWKS!
 
Iowa hasn't developed good WRs since before Soup was hired from Michigan as WRs coach. That previous coach slips my mind. Maybe Carl Jackson? Anyway he brought in WRs with potential and developed them. Maybe that's a position coach that needs to show some improvement.
 
I'm not sure what it is about Falconer that makes you say he has a lot of potential? He played last year and had zero catches. He was a two star recruit who's best offer was Western Kentucky. While J Smith did have catches in a couple of games, him and CJ had a hard time getting in sync most of the time and he had a lot of targets that were not catches. I can't tell if it was route running or just giving up on routes, but there were tons of misses. Then there's Ogwo? Have not seen him play, but one can assume since he was below Falconer on the WR depth chart, he's not going to walk in and be a big time target.

All in all, I think Kirk dropped the ball big time in WR recruiting this year. We had a LOT to sell potential recruits coming off a Rose Bowl with a returning stud QB. We couldn't get a single JUCO/grad transfer WR to step in with the promise of immediate playing time/starting? There have got to be a ton of WRs playing at lesser schools going into their redshirt sr year who would kill to be part of a Big 10 championship caliber team. Obviously there were punters out there who saw a chance to come in and play right away due to a hole in our roster.

Thank goodness we have a lot coming back at RB, cause WR might not be pretty.
So let me ge this straight. Ur upset that we don't go after a 1 yr kid from Bowling Green but disappointed we are getting a kid with an offer from Western Kentucky? Gosh, ur entertaining at the best and not very bright at the worst. But u make laugh. Could u please change ur screen name to Common Fan!
 
  • Like
Reactions: nu2u
So let me ge this straight. Ur upset that we don't go after a 1 yr kid from Bowling Green but disappointed we are getting a kid with an offer from Western Kentucky? Gosh, ur entertaining at the best and not very bright at the worst. But u make laugh. Could u please change ur screen name to Common Fan!
Let me help you out with that one Mr. Wizard...National champs Alabama landed Bowling Green grad transfer WR Gehrig Dieter who tweeted out that he's transferring. The 6-3, 207-pound wideout was a go-to receiver for one of the nation's top offenses in 2015. Dieter caught 94 passes for 1,033 yards and 10 TDs. He also ate up Tennessee in the Bowling Green opener going for seven catches and 133 yards.The kid from Bowling Green is a proven talent. The kid with Western Kentucky offer doesn't have one catch in college football.
 
  • Like
Reactions: iowalaw
Hawksrock - I couldn't have said it better myself. Guys like fryvet have the analytical abilities of a poodle.

Yes, there is a HUGE difference between going after a 5th year senior that dominated the MAC and is a known commodity rather than going after undersized 17 yr olds who only had offers from MAC schools. It is the difference between taking an exam you didn't study for and taking an exam with all of the answers on a cheat sheet hidden up your sleeve.
 
Hawksrock - I couldn't have said it better myself. Guys like fryvet have the analytical abilities of a poodle.

Yes, there is a HUGE difference between going after a 5th year senior that dominated the MAC and is a known commodity rather than going after undersized 17 yr olds who only had offers from MAC schools. It is the difference between taking an exam you didn't study for and taking an exam with all of the answers on a cheat sheet hidden up your sleeve.
He went to Alabama! I'll say it one more time - we are not Alabama. Not because we don't work hard or don't desire a National Title but because we don't have the population base, weather, etc. Just because u want it doesn't mean it is possible. The new facilities will help but we still don't have the population, wather, tradition. Be Happy! U don't know that which u claim to know.
 
Sorry to say this, but Derreck Willes isn't looking very bright, right now.

Had he stayed at Iowa, he would have been a member of a Big10 West Championship, as well as travelled to Pasadena for a Rose Bowl trip of a lifetime. Instead, he's playing for some Jr college in who knows where.
 
I'm not sure what it is about Falconer that makes you say he has a lot of potential? He played last year and had zero catches. He was a two star recruit who's best offer was Western Kentucky. While J Smith did have catches in a couple of games, him and CJ had a hard time getting in sync most of the time and he had a lot of targets that were not catches. I can't tell if it was route running or just giving up on routes, but there were tons of misses. Then there's Ogwo? Have not seen him play, but one can assume since he was below Falconer on the WR depth chart, he's not going to walk in and be a big time target.

All in all, I think Kirk dropped the ball big time in WR recruiting this year. We had a LOT to sell potential recruits coming off a Rose Bowl with a returning stud QB. We couldn't get a single JUCO/grad transfer WR to step in with the promise of immediate playing time/starting? There have got to be a ton of WRs playing at lesser schools going into their redshirt sr year who would kill to be part of a Big 10 championship caliber team. Obviously there were punters out there who saw a chance to come in and play right away due to a hole in our roster.

Thank goodness we have a lot coming back at RB, cause WR might not be pretty.
Oh nothing like the off-season for fans to bitch and moan, hey at least it is tougher to find things to bitch about this off-season! But as always you found something you can gripe about and you can go on pretending once again that you have a clue.
 
Oh nothing like the off-season for fans to bitch and moan, hey at least it is tougher to find things to bitch about this off-season! But as always you found something you can gripe about and you can go on pretending once again that you have a clue.
Thanks for the great post! U, my friend, have commonsense!
 
He went to Alabama! I'll say it one more time - we are not Alabama. Not because we don't work hard or don't desire a National Title but because we don't have the population base, weather, etc. Just because u want it doesn't mean it is possible. The new facilities will help but we still don't have the population, wather, tradition. Be Happy! U don't know that which u claim to know.
Nebraska has never had an edge in population or location, but they achieved the impossible....
 
Sorry to say this, but Derreck Willes isn't looking very bright, right now.

Had he stayed at Iowa, he would have been a member of a Big10 West Championship, as well as travelled to Pasadena for a Rose Bowl trip of a lifetime. Instead, he's playing for some Jr college in who knows where.
As far as individual production goes...he might have ended up making a decent decision...Obviously, "team" wise, he won't have near as much success..He had something like 50 catches for 1200 yards and 15 td's for a #1 seeded Juco in Tx(that might be a regional seeding), and is now scheduled to attend Air Raid U(Texas Tech).... I have no idea why he rebuffed Iowa's numerous attempts to bring him back...He also turned down the opportunity to play at Oklahoma...I guess we all will see if he made very poor decisions, or if he ends up being a star, at an avg at best,B12 school..
 
  • Like
Reactions: And1Hawk
Couldn't agree more w/ the OP! This is a head scratcher and has been for years. C.J. Jones was a God send in '02 and theres no reason not to duplicate or at least to attempt that. This years WR core is gonna be brutal. Thats my opinion. Vandeberg is the No.1? Good player for sure but c'mon not a 1. While CJB is a top 10 QB and has the arm to back it. The staff just cant seem to figure out how to recruit WR's so the Juco/ transfer route for this position is a reasonable strategy. Going to be a long year for the passing game. No one can get separation and id be willing to bet we have the worst WR core in the Big10. Really no excuse for it. Thats whats puzzling.

LOL. Vandeberg was Iowa's number 1 receiver last year. He lead the team in catches, and it wasn't even close.
 
LOL. Vandeberg was Iowa's number 1 receiver last year. He lead the team in catches, and it wasn't even close.
Smith and MVB would have been closer in total catches if Smith hadn't missed 3 games...If his avg had held up in those 3 additional games, he would have had more yards, a higher avg per catch, and more TD's....The totals look a little decieving due to Smith's abscense from those games...MVB still would have had more total catches,though
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Hawks_Rock_12
Smith showed promise last year, but after his his 1 good early game was plagued with drops as I recall. If people think he has T. Smith hands they should revisit last years tapes.
 
I love WR threads. They really show how stupid some posters are and their lack of football knowledge. My favorite is "Parker needs to play WR! The kid can fly!" Speed alone doesn't make a good WR - See Damon Powell. You need to be able to catch and run routes too. McNutt was arguably one of Iowa's best receivers of all time and he was not fast. Last season everyone was clamoring for J Smith to see the field more. Now that he will see lots of PT next season, we're not sure how good he is. Everyone has been drooling over Scheel since he committed and now he will get his chance. KF has a solid group of athletic WR's. They will be able to do enough to win a lot of games next year if the OL can continue to be able to run the ball and improve their pass protection from last season.
 
Let me help you out with that one Mr. Wizard...National champs Alabama landed Bowling Green grad transfer WR Gehrig Dieter who tweeted out that he's transferring. The 6-3, 207-pound wideout was a go-to receiver for one of the nation's top offenses in 2015. Dieter caught 94 passes for 1,033 yards and 10 TDs. He also ate up Tennessee in the Bowling Green opener going for seven catches and 133 yards.The kid from Bowling Green is a proven talent. The kid with Western Kentucky offer doesn't have one catch in college football.
And who was taking bets that if Iowa pursued him, he would not have chosen Alabama?
 
And yet most schools, even in the MAC, actually have kids at WR who run fast and catch the ball. That's the job description for WRs at most schools, but not at Iowa. Just because you can run fast doesn't mean you can't catch a football. Most schools know that, but Iowa is an anomaly. Why? Because, like I said, at Iowa if you're a WR you're a blocker first. Most talented and fast WRs aren't into that blocking thing so much.

Back in Hayden's day, Chuck Long was throwing to Robert Smith, a speedy little guy who dropped a ball now and then and who wasn't much of a blocker, but who was pretty damn effective at running fast and, usually, catching the ball. Damond Powell could have had a similar career at Iowa. But not under the present WR coaching philosophy of block or don't see the field.
 
Uhhh, whatsup...in your attempt to call posters "stupid for lack of football knowledge," you cited Damon Powell as proof that speed is not important in a WR. Hmmm. You do realize that Damon Powell played for the Arizona Cardinals, one of the best teams in the NFL, last year.

Yes, he was grossly underutilized by the Hawkeye coaching staff, who value blocking skills over WR talent, and who played 3 yard check down Jake Rudock over CJ Beathard, so very few deep passes were ever thrown to Powell. But NFL teams were drooling over him for precisely that, his speed. So maybe graduate from high school and watch a few football games before attacking the intellect of message board posters. lol


I love WR threads. They really show how stupid some posters are and their lack of football knowledge. My favorite is "Parker needs to play WR! The kid can fly!" Speed alone doesn't make a good WR - See Damon Powell.
 
Uhhh, whatsup...in your attempt to call posters "stupid for lack of football knowledge," you cited Damon Powell as proof that speed is not important in a WR. Hmmm. You do realize that Damon Powell played for the Arizona Cardinals, one of the best teams in the NFL, last year.

Yes, he was grossly underutilized by the Hawkeye coaching staff, who value blocking skills over WR talent, and who played 3 yard check down Jake Rudock over CJ Beathard, so very few deep passes were ever thrown to Powell. But NFL teams were drooling over him for precisely that, his speed. So maybe graduate from high school and watch a few football games before attacking the intellect of message board posters. lol

He didn't play for the Cardinals. And the statement "NFL teams were drooling over him" is pretty laughable.
 
Nebraska has never had an edge in population or location, but they achieved the impossible....
Uhhh, whatsup...in your attempt to call posters "stupid for lack of football knowledge," you cited Damon Powell as proof that speed is not important in a WR. Hmmm. You do realize that Damon Powell played for the Arizona Cardinals, one of the best teams in the NFL, last year.

Yes, he was grossly underutilized by the Hawkeye coaching staff, who value blocking skills over WR talent, and who played 3 yard check down Jake Rudock over CJ Beathard, so very few deep passes were ever thrown to Powell. But NFL teams were drooling over him for precisely that, his speed. So maybe graduate from high school and watch a few football games before attacking the intellect of message board posters. lol
5 Top Ten finishes under Kirk! The "intellect of message board posters"...now that is good, clean humor! Your credintials again IowaLaw??? Again, if u stated all of ur coaching experience it would provide some credibility. Please state? Or are ur suggestions just guesses???
 
5 Top Ten finishes under Kirk! The "intellect of message board posters"...now that is good, clean humor! Your credintials again IowaLaw??? Again, if u stated all of ur coaching experience it would provide some credibility. Please state? Or are ur suggestions just guesses???
What are you smoking?? I never said anything negative about Kirk. All I said was that NE was able to win it all from a crap state......so it is possible.
 
Uhhh, whatsup...in your attempt to call posters "stupid for lack of football knowledge," you cited Damon Powell as proof that speed is not important in a WR. Hmmm. You do realize that Damon Powell played for the Arizona Cardinals, one of the best teams in the NFL, last year.

Yes, he was grossly underutilized by the Hawkeye coaching staff, who value blocking skills over WR talent, and who played 3 yard check down Jake Rudock over CJ Beathard, so very few deep passes were ever thrown to Powell. But NFL teams were drooling over him for precisely that, his speed. So maybe graduate from high school and watch a few football games before attacking the intellect of message board posters. lol
1) I never said speed in not important in a WR. It is very important. It is one of the many important things an athlete needs to be a good WR. Vandeberg, McCarron, J Smith, Ogwo, Scheel, and Falconer are all fast. Do they all have elite sprinter speed? Probably not but they are all fast enough to be good WRs.

2) Please define 'played for.'
 
If you are a scholarship WR at a P5 school, you are going to be fast. Probably a 4.5 guy (electronic/not wind aided that is fast). Occasionally you will get an outlier who has elite speed at 4.4 (Powell) or has elite size and body control and is a 4.6 guy (McNutt).

So we can continue under the assumption that if you are playing WR at Iowa, you are fast. Now what else can you do to separate yourself from the other fast guys?

Are you fast? Check.
Do you know the offense?
Can you read the coverage?
Are you on the same page with the QB?
Can you beat press coverage?
Can you run routes?
Which routes can you get open running?
Can you catch?
Do you high point the ball?
How high can you jump?
Do you catch with your hands?
Can you catch and run?
Can you catch in traffic?
Will you go over the middle?
Can you evade defenders after the catch?
Can you hold on to the ball after the catch?
Can you block?
Will you block?
Can you block without committing a penalty?
 
  • Like
Reactions: NevadaHawk
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT