Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC?

[SoDakHawk]

Actually, the BIG blunts this right now by offering KU and OU. Let UT go to the SEC, and let them deal with the Horns.

OU gets in the BIG and reunites with Nebby, same as KU. We get a top notch football and basketball program.

OU wants to be a top flight academic university. This gets them what they want, plus money, lots of money.

Split the baby here. Keep the RR Shootout OOC in tact.

Everybody wins, except what's left of the Big 12.

 

[IAHawk2011]

The correct move for the Big Ten is to raid the PAC-12. Add USC, Oregon and Colorado and dump Rutgers. Split the East and West divisions into 4-team pods:

West:

USC
Oregon
Colorado
Nebraska
————————
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Illinois

East:

Northwestern
Purdue
Michigan
Michigan State
————————
Indiana
Ohio State
Penn State
Maryland

You play each team in your pod, and two teams from each other pod, for a total of 9 conference games. Could keep the championship week concept for 10 conference games if desired. Market the Big Ten as America’s conference, spanning from coast to coast with a team in every time zone.

Each school could protect one rivalry game and still ensure you play every other team in the conference at least twice every six years.

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

Also for the B1G, invited members have to be AAU and don’t they have to be contiguous to the existing footprint? That would be a pretty small list I think. Off the top of my head, KU, ISU, Pitt, ND, and Virginia. Syracuse maybe? Not including SEC schools obviously.

They said that last time but apparently lots of stuff that mattered last time is no longer a deal-breaker. For instance last time we heard how Oklahoma couldn’t go anywhere without OSU and Texas politicians wouldn’t allow Texas to leave Tech hanging because UT is a public institution that receives taxpayer funding, etc.

I understand all of the reasons we added Rutgers and Maryland and now all member schools are set to get $50m checks as a result. But from what I’ve been reading a lot of this current move is driven by NIL and the thought that playing in a super conference will look really attractive to recruits who will all think they will get huge endorsement deals in a prestigious conference.

Looking at things from that perspective, I think the Big10 needs to consider which schools will move the needle from an NIL perspective. Obviously Kansas would do it from a basketball perspective and for geographic reasons I would love it. But there aren’t a ton of options that seem feasible that would really increase the NIL opportunities on the football side. I guess maybe someone like North Carolina or Georgia Tech, who the Big10 was rumored to be interested in back when they got Maryland. At least they would bring in some big media markets.

 

[SoDakHawk]

I think you all assume OU and UT to the SEC is a done deal. I just see this as those schools opening their recruitment.

I still say getting OU is the play with KU as the kicker. Maintains balance between the BIG and SEC.

You think the bottom half of the SEC sees adding OU and UT as a good thing? Especially in the already brutal SEC West? What do the Mississippi schools think if this? Or even LSU?

 

[nu2u]

you disagree. we shall see. this has always been the end game IMO. There will be money in an NFL sized super conference. A lot of money.

"alot of money" will never be enough to offset the money flowing into the Big Ten Academic Alliance (BTAA).

Members of the BTAA access more than $10B in research grants each year. No other conference comes remotely close to that level of funding..

The Big Ten Athletic Conference generates more revenue that any other conference, including the SEC. Total B10 athletic revenue for 2020 was approximately $900M (if I recall correctly)

The BTAA money pot is more than 10X the athletic revenues. Any current B10 member decision to withdraw from the BTAA would be made by the university's board of regents or other controlling authority -- the academics not the athletic director. It aint gonna happen.

 

[SoDakHawk]

"alot of money" will never be enough to offset the money flowing into the Big Ten Academic Alliance (BTAA).

Members of the BTAA access more than $10B in research grants each year. No other conference comes remotely close to that level of funding..

The Big Ten Athletic Conference generates more revenue that any other conference, including the SEC. Total B10 athletic revenue for 2020 was approximately $900M (if I recall correctly)

The BTAA money pot is more than 10X the athletic revenues. Any current B10 member decision to withdraw from the BTAA would be made by the university's board of regents or other controlling authority -- the academics not the athletic director. It aint gonna happen.

And the academic side is the shiny bait for a school like OU.

Okies, in their entire history, have been put down. Remember the Dust Bowl era? That feeling persists. An invite to the BIG would be huge for OU on a much higher level than sports.

Invite OU and KU to the BIG and settle this. Offer ND first, ahead of KU, and if they pass, well, good luck in the ACC.

This is much bigger than "sports".

 

[chuck285]

Waiting for the Nebraska considering move back to Big 12 article.

No way in hell....Couldn't afford the money loss...

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

I think you all assume OU and UT to the SEC is a done deal. I just see this as those schools opening their recruitment.

I still say getting OU is the play with KU as the kicker. Maintains balance between the BIG and SEC.

You think the bottom half of the SEC sees adding OU and UT as a good thing? Especially in the already brutal SEC West? What do the Mississippi schools think if this? Or even LSU?

Everything I’ve read says it was UT and OU that reached out to the SEC, not the other way around. A decade ago I think the academics would have demanded UT look to the Big10 instead of the SEC but it looks like times are different now. I think the college football landscape is about to change pretty dramatically and these schools want to make sure they are in a good place to navigate the changes.

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

Texas will bring the SEC a lot of viewers and a lot of money, that's for sure

And damn. Adding 2 blue bloods like OU & Texas is big time; think of all the huge match ups each week.

Yeah, I’m super jealous really. I hate the SEC but have to admit this is going to create lots of great games that will drive huge ratings. And with the playoff expanding, I think multiple-loss SEC teams will have no problem getting invited. In the past I always hated the idea of a second SEC team with a losses getting considered for the playoffs but how do you deny that now?

I just wish there were compelling teams available for the Big10 to add. The only comparable team to add would be ND but that no longer seems likely.

 

[SoDakHawk]

Well, if this goes down the BIG will still be fine. I'm not worried about the BIG or Iowa.

If I'm ISU or the other Little schools I'm crapping bricks. AAC, here we come!

 

[Fan In Black]

"alot of money" will never be enough to offset the money flowing into the Big Ten Academic Alliance (BTAA).

Members of the BTAA access more than $10B in research grants each year. No other conference comes remotely close to that level of funding..

The Big Ten Athletic Conference generates more revenue that any other conference, including the SEC. Total B10 athletic revenue for 2020 was approximately $900M (if I recall correctly)

The BTAA money pot is more than 10X the athletic revenues. Any current B10 member decision to withdraw from the BTAA would be made by the university's board of regents or other controlling authority -- the academics not the athletic director. It aint gonna happen.

why didnt Notre Dame jump at the chance to grab a piece of that pie?

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

My first thought with this was it will be good for Iowa because whatever happens with ISU it’s hard to imagine it won’t be a worse situation than they were in and with NIL becoming so important and only so many corporate endorsement opportunities in Iowa to go around we don’t need the competition.

But there is definitely a part of me that feels like we need to be careful what we wish for. I’m in favor of NIL because I don’t see how it makes sense that the coaches and everyone else all makes millions and the players for whatever dumb reason had to make zero. But there is a chance that things change in unpredictable ways that might not be so good for Iowa. I really think we need to accelerate the change to allowing schools to pay players directly. Iowa is actually a relatively wealthy program, it’s just that the current rules don’t allow us to share any of it with the players.

 

[SoDakHawk]

My first thought with this was it will be good for Iowa because whatever happens with ISU it’s hard to imagine it won’t be a worse situation than they were in and with NIL becoming so important and only so many corporate endorsement opportunities in Iowa to go around we don’t need the competition.

But there is definitely a part of me that feels like we need to be careful what we wish for. I’m in favor of NIL because I don’t see how it makes sense that the coaches and everyone else all makes millions and the players for whatever dumb reason had to make zero. But there is a chance that things change in unpredictable ways that might not be so good for Iowa. I really think we need to accelerate the change to allowing schools to pay players directly. Iowa is actually a relatively wealthy program, it’s just that the current rules don’t allow us to share any of it with the players.

Simple. Spin off an LLC booster club and pay them that way. There are ways around this.

 

[nu2u]

And the academic side is the shiny bait for a school like OU.

Okies, in their entire history, have been put down. Remember the Dust Bowl era? That feeling persists. An invite to the BIG would be huge for OU on a much higher level than sports.

Invite OU and KU to the BIG and settle this. Offer ND first, ahead of KU, and if they pass, well, good luck in the ACC.

This is much bigger than "sports".

Whenever the re-alignment topic is brought up, people tend to forget that we are talking about universities - education institutions that have an athletic department and not vice-versa. Board members, trustees and administrators have different priorities. University presidents give much more deference to the finance director than the athletic director.

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

Whenever the re-alignment topic is brought up, people tend to forget that we are talking about universities - education institutions that have an athletic department and not vice-versa. Board members, trustees and administrators have different priorities. University presidents give much more deference to the finance director than the athletic director.

Yeah, but isn’t Texas a good academic school that would theoretically prefer to be in a good academic conference? It sure seems like football is driving 100% of this decision. At one point a few years ago there was a rumor that Texas would look to join the Big10 because of the academic prestige, etc. Also they nearly joined the Pac12 for similar reasons. Today it seems like their priorities have changed.

 

[Mountain Man Hawk]

Simple. Spin off an LLC booster club and pay them that way. There are ways around this.

Yeah but so much of our revenue is from the TV contract rather than the boosters. If we had lots of wealthy boosters like the SEC schools I wouldn’t be in such a hurry to make the transition to allowing schools to share the TV money with the players.

 

[M3 ME PLEASE]

LMAO at all the dipshit Iowa state fans chirping over the last year

Their inevitable return to sucking is going to be accelerated if this goes down, so glorious

 

[nu2u]

why didnt Notre Dame jump at the chance to grab a piece of that pie?

It is my understanding that Notre Dame is still an associate member of the Big Ten Academic Alliance. It is not full membership; not sure what exactly that entails. \

The conference and ND have an interesting history - the conference blackballed ND at least twice in the early part of the 20th century. Former commissioner Delaney worked hard to add them as a member in the late 90s but they opted not to join. At the time, ND said that their independence was too valuable to be measured in dollars.

''Just as the Universities of Michigan or Wisconsin or Illinois have core identities as the flagship institutions of their states, so Notre Dame has a core identity, and at that core are these characteristics: Catholic, private, independent. As a Catholic university with a national constituency, we believe independence continues to be our best way forward.''
--Rev, Edward Malloy, President (1999).

Of course, at the time ND had a exclusive television contract with a major network for broadcasts to a national audience ..... before the advent of the Big Ten Network.

 

[anon_bb9wlf9kj42py]

Speaking of Lames, where did all those tough talking clown trolls go? I bet those recent ISwho commits are paying attention.

Most of this broke late yesterday. To be honest it makes me incredibly sad.

I'm 40 years old. I started at ISU when Mac went 9-3 and made the Insight bowl and ISU won the Big 12 in basketball and flamed out in the tourney against Hampton.

I drove 27 hours straight through a massive snowstorm with 5 other guys to go to Phoenix for the game. I drove to Boise for the Humanitarian bowl. I went to Shreveport. In fact I've only missed 1 bowl game in my life. I've been to a ton of Big 12 tournaments in KC, I went to the Maui Invitational a few years ago, several other holiday tournaments, etc.

Most of these experiences have been with my wife and now kids. It's been honestly an integral part of our relationship together and our primary hobby. It makes me sad to think there is a very real chance those things will not really be happening anymore. Even if ISU lands in the AAC or something, that's just going to cripple everything that ISU has been building to with Campbell. This is probably going to be the last chance for ISU to ever to do something special this season. I hope it happens.

 

[anon_b29nm7v7dwp6r]

The correct move for the Big Ten is to raid the PAC-12. Add USC, Oregon and Colorado and dump Rutgers. Split the East and West divisions into 4-team pods:

West:

USC
Oregon
Colorado
Nebraska
————————
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Illinois

East:

Northwestern
Purdue
Michigan
Michigan State
————————
Indiana
Ohio State
Penn State
Maryland

You play each team in your pod, and two teams from each other pod, for a total of 9 conference games. Could keep the championship week concept for 10 conference games if desired. Market the Big Ten as America’s conference, spanning from coast to coast with a team in every time zone.

Each school could protect one rivalry game and still ensure you play every other team in the conference at least twice every six years.

I actually love this idea….semi regular trips to USC, Oregon and colorado to watch the hawks? Yes please!

 

[anon_bb9wlf9kj42py]

As to what will happen for ISU, I think people are completely jumping the gun on the Big 10 or PAC 12 adding teams. What is the incentive? People seem to be assuming that KU would go to the Big 10 as they are an AAU member and they have great basketball. But that is flat out the worst football program of the modern era. It's worse than ISU in the 80s and 90s. If the SEC adds UT and OU, and the Big 10's response is adding KU... well that math don't add up no matter how good basketball is.

Why would the PAC12 have to add midwestern teams especially without especially KU? TT is in Texas, but they are so remote to the other parts of Texas it's not like it's a big TV market or anything. The distance from Lubbock to Austin is basically the distance from Ames to Chicago. It's massive. The PAC isn't adding TCU or Baylor so forget about that. Are they going to be in a big rush to add OSU, KSU, and ISU? Probably not.

I know there are people that will love to piss on ISU's grave here, but a lot of people are going to lose their jobs not just in Ames. ISU is like most Big 12 teams as well, with debt up to their eyeballs to keep up with the facilities arms race - in the AAC they won't be able to pay those debt obligations. I mean that just seems like a fact.

 

[anon_bb9wlf9kj42py]

Last thought: Sometimes I think about a time when I was a student, I don't know it had to be 17 or 18 years ago. There was a particularly exciting game at Hilton, and to be honest I don't even remember what happened who what game it was. But as I was walking out of the stadium on a super cold night, somebody grabbed my upper arm from behind, hard. Kind of shocked and surprised me. I turned quickly and there was an old man there that I didn't know. He was just so damn happy about the win and just yelled "Can you believe it! Can you believe it!" a few times and then carried on.

He was just somebody that was so overcome with joy he had to grab a random stranger and express it. He was probably in his 70s and I was probably 22 or something. Sports is one of the last things on Earth that can bring people together for those moments.

I don't think the outcome here will be good for college sports, and there will likely be less opportunities for those moments like that. And ultimately, even if some places end up better off, I think that's a sad thing.

 

[Big Hawk D-Port]

The correct move for the Big Ten is to raid the PAC-12. Add USC, Oregon and Colorado and dump Rutgers. Split the East and West divisions into 4-team pods:

West:

USC
Oregon
Colorado
Nebraska
————————
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Illinois

East:

Northwestern
Purdue
Michigan
Michigan State
————————
Indiana
Ohio State
Penn State
Maryland

You play each team in your pod, and two teams from each other pod, for a total of 9 conference games. Could keep the championship week concept for 10 conference games if desired. Market the Big Ten as America’s conference, spanning from coast to coast with a team in every time zone.

Each school could protect one rivalry game and still ensure you play every other team in the conference at least twice every six years.

I don't think it goes down like that. TV contracts are going to force the B1G and PAC12 together and the SEC and ACC together.

The PAC12 and B1G basically stay put in terms of membership. They will just formalize a relationship that will basically get rid of out of conference games against MAC schools and the conferences will play a few games against each other each year. Those MAC games might be winners for the individual member schools but they are losers for TV which is what really matters. Get ready for Big Noon Sunday to focus completely on PAC 12 and B1G games and College Game Day to talk solely about SEC and ACC games (more than they already do).

I could honestly see a Rose Bowl type championship game every December which I don't hate that at all.

I see the rest of the Big 12 forming a conference with the best of AAC or the MAC or the Mountain West. There will be realignment in those conferences which will actually lead to a stronger version of the AAC but still a clear step below the Big 4 conferences.

EDIT after looking at the map, my prediction is that the Big 12 adds BYU, Houston, and two of SMU, Memphis and Cincinnati, and then everyone else stays put.

 

[Swiv3D]

No way in hell....Couldn't afford the money loss...

You can always tell who has no grasp of reality when they say Nebraska would or want to leave the B1G. Anyone who's been to UNL campus or even Lincoln in general pre B1G and know what it looked like then compared to what it's like now understands what kind of impact joining the B1G had. People who only look at the on field results have no clue what the broad picture looks like

 

[percyland]

Texas sucks in the B12. Now they want to go up against LSU, Alabama, Georgia, and Florida?

 

[ichawk24]

The Big Ten is a collection of large research universities. Notre Dame does not fit in that group. They are a smaller school with a profile that fits in with similar schools in the ACC. They aren't an associate member of the BTAA. They are a B1G associate member in lacrosse.

UT and OU aren't joining the B1G. To paraphrase what was said last time around, they aren't flying their softball team to East Lansing on a Tuesday night.

Even if this goes down, B1G stands pat. Nothing moves the needle.

There is always going to be nationwide college football. The conferences may change in shape, but we're always going to have 60+ major college teams.

 

[Titanhawk2]

Yeah, but isn’t Texas a good academic school that would theoretically prefer to be in a good academic conference? It sure seems like football is driving 100% of this decision. At one point a few years ago there was a rumor that Texas would look to join the Big10 because of the academic prestige, etc. Also they nearly joined the Pac12 for similar reasons. Today it seems like their priorities have changed.

What if Texas and OU were baiting the Big 10 to ask them by putting a move to the SEC out there. Start a bidding war so to speak

 

[blhawk]

As to what will happen for ISU, I think people are completely jumping the gun on the Big 10 or PAC 12 adding teams. What is the incentive? People seem to be assuming that KU would go to the Big 10 as they are an AAU member and they have great basketball. But that is flat out the worst football program of the modern era. It's worse than ISU in the 80s and 90s. If the SEC adds UT and OU, and the Big 10's response is adding KU... well that math don't add up no matter how good basketball is.

Why would the PAC12 have to add midwestern teams especially without especially KU? TT is in Texas, but they are so remote to the other parts of Texas it's not like it's a big TV market or anything. The distance from Lubbock to Austin is basically the distance from Ames to Chicago. It's massive. The PAC isn't adding TCU or Baylor so forget about that. Are they going to be in a big rush to add OSU, KSU, and ISU? Probably not.

I know there are people that will love to piss on ISU's grave here, but a lot of people are going to lose their jobs not just in Ames. ISU is like most Big 12 teams as well, with debt up to their eyeballs to keep up with the facilities arms race - in the AAC they won't be able to pay those debt obligations. I mean that just seems like a fact.

I can see why clone fans are worried but nobody knows how this plays out. B12 could just add Houston and Cinci type teams (good for basketball) and all of the sudden the conference is a lot more winnable in fball. Could also get chosen by a better conference than b12. Definitely ups the ante on this season though. At least it's happening now and not 2 years ago so ISU still has a chance at a conference title. There was a reasonable chance MC was going to be gone after this season anyway

 

[dekhawk]

I can see why clone fans are worried but nobody knows how this plays out. B12 could just add Houston and Cinci type teams (good for basketball) and all of the sudden the conference is a lot more winnable in fball. Could also get chosen by a better conference than b12. Definitely ups the ante on this season though. At least it's happening now and not 2 years ago so ISU still has a chance at a conference title. There was a reasonable chance MC was going to be gone after this season anyway

But that new big 12 conference would have no football blue-bloods, which is needed for TV $$$

 

[Fsanford]

The Big Ten is a collection of large research universities. Notre Dame does not fit in that group. They are a smaller school with a profile that fits in with similar schools in the ACC. They aren't an associate member of the BTAA. They are a B1G associate member in lacrosse.

UT and OU aren't joining the B1G. To paraphrase what was said last time around, they aren't flying their softball team to East Lansing on a Tuesday night.

Even if this goes down, B1G stands pat. Nothing moves the needle.

There is always going to be nationwide college football. The conferences may change in shape, but we're always going to have 60+ major college teams.

Why? NFL, NHL, MLB, NBA limit the number of teams.

For schools like Texas, Ohio State, Bama and others, if NCAA football membership was reduced, it means even more money in their pocket.

In each conference the revenues are driven by a few schools. Lots of schools are along for the revenue ride.

Geogrgaphy could be a problem, since only 6 schools west of the Mississippi make the cut. But then again these schools would see so much more cash with a 30 team deal, travel may not be a big deal.

 

[StormHawk42]

Texas sucks in the B12. Now they want to go up against LSU, Alabama, Georgia, and Florida?

I said it on HROT but I suspect this is about more than the CFP. This feels like the SEC is preparing to break away from the NCAA and/or pay players with a salary and tell the NCAA to deal with it.

Because you’re right that the added competition wouldn’t make sense otherwise.

 

[VerbumDei]

Keep in mind academics are important in the Big Ten. The school that fits the profile in the Big 12 would be Baylor. I could see Warren wanting to gain exposure in the 2nd largest population state.

Could also see a scenario where WVU goes to the ACC and Pitt goes to the Big Ten to even it out.

Baylor is not a member of the AAU and would not be a serious candidate. The only AAU schools in the Big 12 are Kansas, Iowa State and Texas. Nebraska was an AAU member when they joined the B1G, but were kicked out shortly thereafter. They are the only non AAU member in the Big 10.

 

[squeezebox]

I said it on HROT but I suspect this is about more than the CFP. This feels like the SEC is preparing to break away from the NCAA and/or pay players with a salary and tell the NCAA to deal with it.

Because you’re right that the added competition wouldn’t make sense otherwise.

this makes zero sense, boosters can already pay players, why the need directly for the university to pay them?

 

[anon_bb9wlf9kj42py]

I can see why clone fans are worried but nobody knows how this plays out. B12 could just add Houston and Cinci type teams (good for basketball) and all of the sudden the conference is a lot more winnable in fball. Could also get chosen by a better conference than b12. Definitely ups the ante on this season though. At least it's happening now and not 2 years ago so ISU still has a chance at a conference title. There was a reasonable chance MC was going to be gone after this season anyway

The Big 12 could do that, but then the media rights would be worth 1/4 what they are now.

 

[onlyTheObvious]

Schools likely were looking at less money as some shifted to NIL payments instead of donations. Now some could be left outside the power 5 gravy train.

the next 3-5 years will be very interesting. No idea how it ends up but my guess is some schools making insane money and some schools finding they make less.

 

[Jizzer]

This is total nonsense. OU and Texas want to leave the Big 12 because it far and away generates the least amount of revenue among the 5 conferences. Michigan and Ohio St are perfectly happy in the Big Ten.

Let’s also not ignore the obstacles with this proposal. OU is going to run into trouble breaking off from the same conference as Oklahoma State.

Why would they run into trouble breaking off from OSU? They could still play them in an OOC game every year if they wanted.

 

[M3 ME PLEASE]

Iowa is soon to be Iowa States only marquee game on their schedule.

If Iowa was smart, now would be the time to end the series and leave them in the dust.

 

[onlyTheObvious]

Iowa is soon to be Iowa States only marquee game on their schedule.

If Iowa was smart, now would be the time to end the series and leave them in the dust.

If the big ten gets so big they have no cross over games, Iowa’s only big game every year might be Wisconsin.

 

[hawkfeever]

If the big ten gets so big they have no cross over games, Iowa’s only big game every year might be Wisconsin.

They would do away with divisions.

 

[hawkfeever]

This is total nonsense. OU and Texas want to leave the Big 12 because it far and away generates the least amount of revenue among the 5 conferences. Michigan and Ohio St are perfectly happy in the Big Ten.

Let’s also not ignore the obstacles with this proposal. OU is going to run into trouble breaking off from the same conference as Oklahoma State.

Not really. T Boone Pickens is dead. He was the firewall for OSU. His money influence is gone for the legislators.