What's ridiculous is how you never became the head coach at Iowa.
I mean, you seem so qualified and knowledgeable.
Not.
thoughts from the game
- Thread starter General Tso
- Start date
What's ridiculous is how you never became the head coach at Iowa.
I mean, you seem so qualified and knowledgeable.
Not.
That guy scored 19 with 7 boards against MSU so it was definitely a significant loss to their lineup.
Just like when Iowa played at Purdue without Keegan. At least MN had their best player (Battle) and they were at home.
No one is a P5 coach on this board, but direct stats like Rebounds, points, shooting percentage, turnovers, steals are pretty easy to analyze. The plus/minus stat value especially on one game is what is being questioned.
Why get into a pissing contest? Poster were objectig to the stat, not you.
The plus minus stat---it is not only a measure of the player, it is also a measure of the crazy lineups Fran will put out with said player and how long they play/when and who the oppoenent coach is playing. KrisM for instance pretty much plays on 2nd team, supposedly the 2nd best players at each position, might that not affect his plus and minus?
It is pretty obvious Keegan was best player on floor vs mInny and Kris was best player on floor vs Indiana...Plus minus doesn't back that up, hence its value is questioned.
JBO has done a lot of good for Iowa B-ball. He doesn't seem to fit in well on a team without a pure post presence like Garza and doesn't seem to be getting enough shots and making enough shots recently to offset his defensive weakness. So some queston his minutes.
The plus / minus stat for ONE GAME has been used by Iowa basketball and many beat reporters for quite a while now.
'
Yet all of the above posters falsely claim plus/minus is useless for one game.
Just a few examples going back 5 years:
From 2017:
This is from Iowa Basketball. But what do they know?
From 2020:
Brendan is a writer for the Athletic.
From 2021:
Mike has been an Iowa beat writer for a long time.
From 2019:
Chris obviously covers the Clowns
From 2019:
Adam is a Buckeyes beat writer for the Columbus Dispatch.
You were wrong. Nothing wrong with admitting that.
If you can't, you should really seek help.
Sure sure, you're never wrong. I know. Keep living in your fantasy land where Keegan was the 4th best Hawk today, and Rebraca was the best Hawks against the Hoosiers while Kris was the 7th best. I look forward to some silly reply about how I think I know more than beat writers or something else to deflect from the actual discussion. I'm done now, have a good night.
You clearly don't understand what +/- is.
It has no specific correlation to a players individual performance.
Why wouldn't you just ask what it was instead of continuing to double down and look like a fool?
As good as we looked in minutes 5 -30, we sure weren't good in the other 15 minutes today. Not sure if we were sure we had won, but we stopped executing on either end. I have been a Fran defender, but he sure didn't react well in the final 10 minutes.
If you remember that the Hawks had no Keegan or a recovering Keegan in our 3-game losing streak, it kind of changes your perspective on the team's performance for the year. In contrast, Illannoy has been fortunate to play against other better teams when top opposing players were either out or not 100%. Hawks had that benefit today.
I don't pay much attention to +/- and don't really fully understand it. I can tell you that if Patrick was the best and Keegan only 4th best today, it is either misleading or almost useless. Honestly, Patrick frequently plays low percentage offense, and he is probably our worst half-court defender (his length makes him good in the press).
Next game against Rutgers is a pivotal game IMO. Hard to win on their court.
If you remember that the Hawks had no Keegan or a recovering Keegan in our 3-game losing streak, it kind of changes your perspective on the team's performance for the year. In contrast, Illannoy has been fortunate to play against other better teams when top opposing players were either out or not 100%. Hawks had that benefit today.
I don't pay much attention to +/- and don't really fully understand it. I can tell you that if Patrick was the best and Keegan only 4th best today, it is either misleading or almost useless. Honestly, Patrick frequently plays low percentage offense, and he is probably our worst half-court defender (his length makes him good in the press).
Next game against Rutgers is a pivotal game IMO. Hard to win on their court.
BirdistheWord
HB Legend
We looked like a deer in the headlights when they threw the zone at us. Weird. I thought that and their 3 point shooting in the last 10 minutes really changed the game. We were fortunate to pull out the win. Keegan should have gotten a lot more touches down the stretch. I thought Joe T, Rebraca and PMac played pretty well. I am concerned with our overall 3 point shooting. But our rebounding was a bright spot.
Wrong again. I have been wrong before.
But you falsely claimed that plus/minus is useless for one game. You were wrong. Nothing wrong with admitting that. But you won't. Instead, I am sure you will have ANOTHER silly response.
I have shown that the Iowa basketball team, national beat writers and myself clearly understand plus/minus. That's why we all have used it for one game.
I also have shown that you were wrong when you falsely claimed that plus/minus is useless for one game.
You clearly don't understand what +/- is and why Iowa basketball and national beat writers use it for one game.
So, why don't you admit that you were wrong instead of continuing to double down and look like a fool?
Hes not good. Criminal he is playing 30 mins while Kris plays 11.
You say that Fran did not react well in the final ten minutes. What would you have liked to see him do differently? Fran took the second team out after three minutes of play in the second half after they gave up eight points. Fran then took out Joe and had Jordan run the point when Minnesota went to the zone so he could get another shooter on the floor (Kris). There are plenty of threads complaining about the above moves, but Fran did at least do something to keep his team in the game and pull out the win.
Not a complaint but obvious observation. Patrick needs to shoot more shots when he is in balance.
He is a floater and a pull up jump shot would be helpful. I coached basketball for 30 years and see things.
He is a floater and a pull up jump shot would be helpful. I coached basketball for 30 years and see things.
I think we have to get Sanfort more playing time. He had 2 beautiful assists in the first half. He is one of the better shooters on the team. Right now, no one can consistently make three pointers.
I think Patrick has a lot of potential, his biggest issue is that he seems to largely avoid contact on both ends of the floor. This shows up in (lack of) rebounding as well as those awkward throw the ball at the backboard shots. He does a good job driving, but needs to take it the rest of the way and create contact or pull up for that short jumper.
Yes, JBO has defensive problems, but what I do not understand is why we don’t run more screens and double screens to get him shots.
Go back and watch that 20-4 run. I think KeMurray touched the ball exactly once, maybe? In any case the 3 was huge and to that point, this offense should run through Keegan, if not Kris.
+/- doesn't correlate directly to individual performance. Thats why it's only useful for season long sample sizes.
You can have a high or low +/- in a single game based entirety on the performances of other players in the game. Its just measuring the score of the game,
In a small sample size it has no relevance.
Just the fact that Patrick was +11 and Keegan was only +6 should have been enough for you to see its meaningless.
"I went up to Tony pretty much and got the ball from him and shot it. I just feel as a leader, I need to get the ball more late in the game." Keegan agrees that he needs to touch the ball late in the game and it was good to see him go get it.
You are flat out wrong when you say plus/minus is meaningless for one game.
If it were meaningless for one game, then why has the official Iowa basketball Twitter account and MANY national beat writers all utilized plus/minus during ONE GAME over the last several years? Well, the answer is obvious; plus/minus for one game is meaningful information.
So, you keep being wrong and I will once again provide examples that go back 5 years showing that plus/minus is meaningful information for one game.
From 2017:
This is from Iowa Basketball. But what do they know?
From 2020:
Brendan is a writer for the Athletic.
From 2021:
Mike has been an Iowa beat writer for a long time.
From 2019:
Chris obviously covers the Clowns
From 2019:
Adam is a Buckeyes beat writer for the Columbus Dispatch.
You're embarrassing yourself.
As a high school coach of 20 years myself, I totally agree with your points about Patrick. He does bring good things onto the court but his shot selection is frustrating. Too many off balance, running shots off the backboard that have a low % of going in. When he is balanced he can be dangerous. Hopefully he will quickly learn to play more under control of offense.
I wouldn't say he does a good job of driving. There needs to be a purpose when a player drives. They are either driving to get to the rim or set a teammate up. Typically when he drives, he gets to nomans land and has to throw something up because he has no other options.
Yes. That is why he has such a low shooting percentage from 2 point range. He gets it in his mind that he's going to drive wide of the basket and shoot it whether it's there or not.
Fair point, and what I actually meant is he needs to take those drives to the rim and not 5' outside of it so he can chuck the ball up against the backboard.
I have shown you are wrong. Everyone can see it.
And now you are just embarrassing yourself.
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