ADVERTISEMENT

Why is our SOS so bad?

Hawkfan_08

Hawkfan_08

HB Legend
Nov 9, 2002
27,021
32,341
113
North Liberty
I feel like Fran put together a pretty solid non-conference so when ESPN just showed 86 and West Virgina was WAY better than us, I am scratching my head.

Everyone in the conference is good except Nebraska and NW. Literally zero games outside of those two will kill you if you lose.

Iowa St. is obviously pretty lousy this year but it was a great win at the time.

Syracuse isn't great in a pretty weak league so that win isn't sparkling.

We know DePaul fell apart despite having some really solid non-conference wins.

Texas Tech, Cincy and the loss to SDSU all were good games.

Does it really boil down to playing so many horrible 300+ teams as the scrub teams?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jonnymungo
Bpi means this?:

BPI is a power ranking calculated by simulating games based on Quantity of experience on roster (including transfers), Quality of that experience, Recruiting rankings for incoming freshmen, with an extra emphasis on five-star players, Coach's past performance.

wtf
 
  • Like
Reactions: Underscore2 and EvilMonkeyInTheCloset
RPI SOS currently sits at 77 largely because we played 3 teams with ranked 325 or worse in the RPI. It absolutely sinks your RPI to play those kinds of teams, but your RPI is not impacted if you play a D-2 team. One of the many reasons the RPI system was replaced.

If we still were using RPI as the metric, we’d probably be looking at best at a 7 seed at the moment as we rank 38th in the RPI. Meanwhile, UNI ranks 20th in the RPI with their best win being a 3 point win at Colorado. However, they never played a team ranked as bad as our 3 worse opponents.

This is also an example of why Iowa’s scheduling drove me nuts because we’d do the same thing every year. For the last 10+ years our RPI was worse than our Kenpom or other efficiency based metrics because we’d play a handful of god awful teams. Sure, we’d beat them by 40, but in the RPI beating a team by 1 is the same as beating them by 40. This led to us either missing the tournament altogether (e.g., 2013 we went to the NIT; Kenpom ranking was 29, RPI was 61), or being under-seeded when we did make it (e.g., 2014 was an 11 seed; Kenpom was 22; RPI was 60).

Every year our schedule sets us up to underperform in the RPI, but thankfully that no longer really hurts us.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JesusIsKing, ROCKY MOUNTAIN HAWK, mphawk and 2 others
They don’t use the RPI anymore so... I would think it was teams 300+ we’ve played yet there are some teams out of the big ten that have top 40 SOS with 4-5 of those games. We’ve had the discussion on here a few times that it’s shit. If they used Kenpom SOS and not the NET sos Iowa would be a 3 seed right now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawkfan_08, Razorhawk2 and EvilMonkeyInTheCloset
It's because the NET SOS mirrors much more closely to RPI, which only takes into account Results and Location. So while we've beaten really good teams, their records aren't all that great. Look at the overall records for Iowa State, Syracuse, Texas Tech... all of them have underperformed. Similarly, the B1G is beating up on each other, so even the top teams don't have a gaudy record this year.
 
There should be at most one team with an RPI above 300 on the schedule. DePaul was a fluke, and ISU is usually a really tough game.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SDHawkDoc
Their strength of schedule isn't bad. Non con SOS was better than usual even with Depaul tanking and ISU not being very good.
 
icantfindausernamethatisntused said:
RPI SOS currently sits at 77 largely because we played 3 teams with ranked 325 or worse in the RPI. It absolutely sinks your RPI to play those kinds of teams, but your RPI is not impacted if you play a D-2 team. One of the many reasons the RPI system was replaced.

If we still were using RPI as the metric, we’d probably be looking at best at a 7 seed at the moment as we rank 38th in the RPI. Meanwhile, UNI ranks 20th in the RPI with their best win being a 3 point win at Colorado. However, they never played a team ranked as bad as our 3 worse opponents.

This is also an example of why Iowa’s scheduling drove me nuts because we’d do the same thing every year. For the last 10+ years our RPI was worse than our Kenpom or other efficiency based metrics because we’d play a handful of god awful teams. Sure, we’d beat them by 40, but in the RPI beating a team by 1 is the same as beating them by 40. This led to us either missing the tournament altogether (e.g., 2013 we went to the NIT; Kenpom ranking was 29, RPI was 61), or being under-seeded when we did make it (e.g., 2014 was an 11 seed; Kenpom was 22; RPI was 60).

Every year our schedule sets us up to underperform in the RPI, but thankfully that no longer really hurts us.
Click to expand...

Dude, northern Iowa played two division 3 teams. Gaming the RPI like this is exactly why it no longer exists.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawkfan_08
The non conference was supposed to be really tough but it turned out to be slightly above average. 2 for sure tourney teams and 1 squarely on the bubble. It’s too bad Syracuse, Depaul, and ISU kind of sucked this year.
 
I don't really understand the NET ratings. If our SOS is good, and we have 7 wins against ranked opponents (most in the country?) and ranked #18 in both polls (for what that's worth), then why is our NET only 29? If you strictly by the NET ratings, that's basically an 8 seed. We keep beating ranked opponents, just 1 bad loss, yet it seems like we keep falling.

I don't get it. Are some of our other opponents that we beat or lost to really tanking and dragging us down?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawkfan_08
TampaHawkfan said:
I don't really understand the NET ratings. If our SOS is good, and we have 7 wins against ranked opponents (most in the country?) and ranked #18 in both polls (for what that's worth), then why is our NET only 29? If you strictly by the NET ratings, that's basically an 8 seed. We keep beating ranked opponents, just 1 bad loss, yet it seems like we keep falling.

I don't get it.
Click to expand...

3 words for you. Defensive efficiency.
 
  • Like
Reactions: paladinhawk
I thought our pre-conference schedule was really good....a number of good teams. Prior to the season I thought we might have bitten off more than we could chew.....but it was a really good schedule. I say if these raters don't like it then they can (you know what) off.

If we are rated way low because we had 3/4 bottom of the barrel teams on the schedule then to bad...Like I said, I liked our schedule and would take it every year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawkfan_08
TampaHawkfan said:
I don't really understand the NET ratings. If our SOS is good, and we have 7 wins against ranked opponents (most in the country?) and ranked #18 in both polls (for what that's worth), then why is our NET only 29? If you strictly by the NET ratings, that's basically an 8 seed. We keep beating ranked opponents, just 1 bad loss, yet it seems like we keep falling.

I don't get it. Are some of our other opponents that we beat or lost to really tanking and dragging us down?
Click to expand...
Our SOS is not "good". The NET has it at 89 (NC 227)
 
I don't think the non con schedule was all that great. sdsu being a big exception.
A lot of it clearly out of their control, like isu sucking so hard.
But I refuse to give Barta a pass for putting trash like kennesaw st, cal poly, and siue on the schedule. One of that bunch is too many. Three should not be allowed.
 
I really think it was just really bad luck. ISU was expected to be a tournament team with Haliburton, and they clearly underachieved. Cincinnati was expected to be a tournament team with Jaron Cumberland back to lead the way. Syracuse is always expected to make the tournament. Texas Tech was in the final four the previous year, and we also had DePaul assigned in the Gavitt Games. Cal Poly and North Florida were required games from the Continental Tire Las Vegas Invitational, so you're complaining about 3 bad teams on the schedule when we were already supposed to be playing 5 tournament teams in the non-conference (all away from home). You have to hedge somewhere, especially with a 20 game conference schedule.
 
St. Louis Hawk said:
True. And I've got 7 more words:

thirty-six point loss at Purdue
Click to expand...

But NET and RPI both cap margin of victory, KenPom and Sagarin do not and the latter two have Iowa's SOS in the top 10. KenPom also factors in defensive efficiency so again that is not the reason.
 
SDHawkDoc said:
I don't think the non con schedule was all that great. sdsu being a big exception.
A lot of it clearly out of their control, like isu sucking so hard.
But I refuse to give Barta a pass for putting trash like kennesaw st, cal poly, and siue on the schedule. One of that bunch is too many. Three should not be allowed.
Click to expand...

You can always schedule a DII or DIII school like UNI as it doesn't count for or against on the NET rankings. Duke also did this (played NW Missouri St and almost lost).
 
  • Like
Reactions: SDHawkDoc
HeRKeYHoPeFuL said:
Those look like the NET SOS numbers that are on the official team sheet (that would be RPI-based SOS).
Click to expand...

David1979 said:
yeah, those are crap numbers. All metrics show Iowa had an ok non con SOS and really good SOS overall.
Click to expand...

What part of the numbers on the official NET team sheet did you miss the first time? Are the committee members going to see or care about "non crap" SOS numbers? I doubt it.
 
33hawkfan said:
But NET and RPI both cap margin of victory, KenPom and Sagarin do not and the latter two have Iowa's SOS in the top 10. KenPom also factors in defensive efficiency so again that is not the reason.
Click to expand...

My response and his response to my response was about the NET ranking and not SOS.
 
paladinhawk said:
What part of the numbers on the official NET team sheet did you miss the first time? Are the committee members going to see or care about "non crap" SOS numbers? I doubt it.
Click to expand...
Yes they do use it. They look at Ken Pom sagarin and BPI as well as NET
If you weren’t so stupid, you would no that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

W

My Starting Lineup

Replies
2
Views
1K
Iowa Women's Basketball
ft254
ft254
IowasLaw

Disappointing End To a Disappointing Season...Will Next Year Be Worse?

Replies
51
Views
6K
Iowa Football
IowaHawk1994
IowaHawk1994
ThorneStockton

The Premier League Owners: Why half of clubs will soon be in American hands

Replies
7
Views
634
Off Topic
SolarHawk
SolarHawk
IowasLaw

IowaLaw's Objective Post Game Analysis: Northwestern

Replies
24
Views
3K
Iowa Football
hawkeyemark18
H
IowasLaw

IowaLaw's Objective Post Game Report: UCLA

Replies
33
Views
3K
Iowa Football
Rambler Hawk
Rambler Hawk
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT
Top Bottom
Back