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baddog25

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set to become the highest paid olineman in history. think what he could have done if he hadn't "settled" for Iowa.

sidebar: i'm not pissed cuz he (proctor) went elsewhere, thats his choice, but to be committed for months and then take visits the last 2 weeks b4 signing day. one to bama one week b4 just chafes my ass. sorry if pepsi.
 
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baddog25 said:
set to become the highest paid olineman in history. think what he could have done if he hadn't "settled" for Iowa.

sidebar: i'm not pissed cuz he (proctor) went elsewhere, thats his choice, but to be committed for months and then take visits the last 2 weeks b4 signing day. one to bama one week b4 just chafes my ass. sorry if pepsi.
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That part sucks but I don't know why he has to take shots at Iowa on the way out.
 
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EvilMonkeyInTheCloset said:
Not mature enough to know whether or not certain things are "smart" to say because lol in no way, shape, or form will they come back to bite you...........................................................
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I thought I was very mature for an 18 year old when I was that age, but looking back many years now I realize I wasn't even close.
 
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pistachio1999 said:
Cause he is 17 or 18. How mature do you think most are?
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17 and 18 year olds are old enough to be responsible to the level of making and holding to an agreement concerning their college choice. We are not talking about toddlers here. They can either vote or will be able to in a couple of months. They can enlist in the military and put their lives on the line. Excusing them from be a responsible person doesn't sit well with me. You make a promise, you keep it. Making excuses for them all the time possibly contributes to them making excuses all the time. It is like a "green light".
 
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baddog25 said:
set to become the highest paid olineman in history. think what he could have done if he hadn't "settled" for Iowa.

sidebar: i'm not pissed cuz he (proctor) went elsewhere, thats his choice, but to be committed for months and then take visits the last 2 weeks b4 signing day. one to bama one week b4 just chafes my ass. sorry if pepsi.
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The fact Iowa's coach was arrogant and stupid enough to bring the OC of the worst Iowa offense of my lifetime to his final in home visit chafes my ass. Oh well, the line will probably suck with or without KP.... they were terrible with Linderbaum in 21
 
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texas twister said:
17 and 18 year olds are old enough to be responsible to the level of making and holding to an agreement concerning their college choice. We are not talking about toddlers here. They can either vote or will be able to in a couple of months. They can enlist in the military and put their lives on the line. Excusing them from be a responsible person doesn't sit well with me. You make a promise, you keep it. Making excuses for them all the time possibly contributes to them making excuses all the time. It is like a "green light".
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So you're not a fan of Kaleb Johnson?
 
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Gonzo Bloor said:
So you're not a fan of Kaleb Johnson?
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Not relevant. There are always a few exceptions and I know nothing about Kaleb Johnson's situation. In the case of Procter, I doubt that the Iowa coaching staff treated him wrongly and he wasn't there yet to see him not getting much of an opportunity to play. Charlie Jones didn't think he was being used properly and he wasn't. Until there is involvement, there is no reason to be bailing on your commitment. You make a promise, you keep it. 17 and 18 year olds should still have personal integrity.
 
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texas twister said:
Not relevant. There are always a few exceptions and I know nothing about Kaleb Johnson's situation. In the case of Procter, I doubt that the Iowa coaching staff treated him wrongly and he wasn't there yet to see him not getting much of an opportunity to play. Charlie Jones didn't think he was being used properly and he wasn't. Until there is involvement, there is no reason to be bailing on your commitment. You make a promise, you keep it. 17 and 18 year olds should still have personal integrity.
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Kaleb Johnson made a promise to Cal, then broke that promise to come to Iowa. I'd assume if you're calling out Proctor's personal integrity for bailing on his commitment and going to Bama, you'd have the same integrity issues with Johnson for bailing on his commitment and coming to Iowa.
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
Kaleb Johnson made a promise to Cal, then broke that promise to come to Iowa. I'd assume if you're calling out Proctor's personal integrity for bailing on his commitment and going to Bama, you'd have the same integrity issues with Johnson for bailing on his commitment and coming to Iowa.
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As I said, I didn't know any specifics about Kaleb. If that is all there is to it, yes, I disagree with his change.
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
Kaleb Johnson made a promise to Cal, then broke that promise to come to Iowa. I'd assume if you're calling out Proctor's personal integrity for bailing on his commitment and going to Bama, you'd have the same integrity issues with Johnson for bailing on his commitment and coming to Iowa.
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There's 18 different reasons why Kaleb Johnson's recruitment was different, but here's 6 big ones off the top of my head.

1. Kaleb is from Ohio, not northern California
2. Kaleb wasn't taking Cal's booster's vehicles or cash.
3. This wasn't a last second flip, costing Cal a chance to recruit other players
4. Kid didn't flip because of NIL
5. Kaleb didn't lie or fail to inform coaches (or agents/collectives) about official visits he was taking
6. Kaleb was a late bloomer and didn't have Iowa's offer until late in the process.

That's a hell of a lot different of a process than the Proctor family used, which was something along the lines of, commit early to the hometown school, then taking advantage of the community goodwill for cash and a car, then auction him off to the highest bidder right before signing day, leaving that same community with no good recruiting options, and pockets that are emptier than before.

There's a reason the whole family left for Alabama.
 
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mikesright said:
There's 18 different reasons why Kaleb Johnson's recruitment was different, but here's 6 big ones off the top of my head.

1. Kaleb is from Ohio, not northern California
2. Kaleb wasn't taking Cal's booster's vehicles or cash.
3. This wasn't a last second flip, costing Cal a chance to recruit other players
4. Kid didn't flip because of NIL
5. Kaleb didn't lie or fail to inform coaches (or agents/collectives) about official visits he was taking
6. Kaleb was a late bloomer and didn't have Iowa's offer until late in the process.

That's a hell of a lot different of a process than the Proctor family used, which was something along the lines of, commit early to the hometown school, then taking advantage of the community goodwill for cash and a car, then auction him off to the highest bidder right before signing day, leaving that same community with no good recruiting options, and pockets that are emptier than before.

There's a reason the whole family left for Alabama.
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Every recruit's situation is different.

1. Just because Proctor is from Iowa doesn't mean he automatically owes something to the Iowa program.
2. I wasn't aware of anything with Proctor taking a car from a booster. Source/link?
3. Iowa has taken very late flips, ISM flipped to us on Feb. 1, leaving Minnesota in a worse bind because since Dec. 21 is the early signing date, we still had 6ish weeks to flip an OL to replace Proctor.
4. Proctor has said it wasn't about NIL, you're free to choose not to believe him, I'll take him at his word.
5. I wasn't aware Proctor lied or failed to inform coaches of late visits, do you have a source for that info as well as info confirming Kaleb informed Cal's coaches of his Iowa visit?
6. Iowa offered Kaleb in March of 2021. He committed to Cal in June 2021, and flipped to us in October 2021.
 
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IMO: Proctor's comments can no longer be trusted as truth any longer regarding the move to bama and the events around that.

Why are we re-hashing this again? Wasnt there already miles and miles of this Proctor crap? Let it go.

Keagen/KJ was supposedly injured all year but flipped as soon as he could, so I wonder just how bad was he.

They are both gone and DO NOT support the Hawks. Let it go. Next man in.

I think if this is about Tristan talk about Tristan - dont cloud it up with Proctor and Kaleb BS lol.
 
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Gonzo Bloor said:
Every recruit's situation is different.

1. Just because Proctor is from Iowa doesn't mean he automatically owes something to the Iowa program.
2. I wasn't aware of anything with Proctor taking a car from a booster. Source/link?
3. Iowa has taken very late flips, ISM flipped to us on Feb. 1, leaving Minnesota in a worse bind because since Dec. 21 is the early signing date, we still had 6ish weeks to flip an OL to replace Proctor.
4. Proctor has said it wasn't about NIL, you're free to choose not to believe him, I'll take him at his word.
5. I wasn't aware Proctor lied or failed to inform coaches of late visits, do you have a source for that info as well as info confirming Kaleb informed Cal's coaches of his Iowa visit?
6. Iowa offered Kaleb in March of 2021. He committed to Cal in June 2021, and flipped to us in October 2021.
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OK, let's assume it wasn't NIL....what was different in December when he flipped vs when he visited 'Bama last summer? He had the opportunity to commit then but chose Iowa....then flipped after a second visit. What changed?

I'm an occam's razor kinda guy. He came up with a lame excuse that made no sense (and cited things that, if true, were true last summer). The obvious answer is NIL and I have yet to see anyone come up with anything else that makes sense.
 
Hwk-I-St8 said:
Wait, did KJ visit Iowa in the summer, commit elsewhere then visit Iowa again and flip a few days before signing day?
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Dec. 21 isn't signing day.

KJ committed to Cal in June, then visited Iowa, then flipped his commitment to Iowa in October. If the big hangup is the timing of KP's flip, then why did we not all hate Smith-Marsette who flipped from Minney to Iowa on Feb. 1, which is signing day?
 
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Hwk-I-St8 said:
OK, let's assume it wasn't NIL....what was different in December when he flipped vs when he visited 'Bama last summer? He had the opportunity to commit then but chose Iowa....then flipped after a second visit. What changed?

I'm an occam's razor kinda guy. He came up with a lame excuse that made no sense (and cited things that, if true, were true last summer). The obvious answer is NIL and I have yet to see anyone come up with anything else that makes sense.
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KP committed to Iowa in June. I don't think it's unrealistic to believe that after committing in the summer, he watched the 2022 season unfold and saw possibly the worst Iowa offense in my lifetime, as well as some of the worst OL play in my lifetime, and didn't like the way our coaches were developing players, especially O-linemen, and had second thoughts.
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
Dec. 21 isn't signing day.

KJ committed to Cal in June, then visited Iowa, then flipped his commitment to Iowa in October. If the big hangup is the timing of KP's flip, then why did we not all hate Smith-Marsette who flipped from Minney to Iowa on Feb. 1, which is signing day?
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A few days before signing day isn't signig day either. Proctor can do what he wants....and he did. I just don't believe his excuse for why he did it. I don't hate Proctor...I hate Saban.
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
KP committed to Iowa in June. I don't think it's unrealistic to believe that after committing in the summer, he watched the 2022 season unfold and saw possibly the worst Iowa offense in my lifetime, as well as some of the worst OL play in my lifetime, and didn't like the way our coaches were developing players, especially O-linemen, and had second thoughts.
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That's a possibility...but the record for Iowa offensive linemen in the NFL is long and distinguished. If anything, that should have made him think the path to playing time was short. Let's see...play for homestate school with long history of developing linemen into NFL ready beasts seems like a pretty good deal.

If there's anything to that story, then it's more likely that Saban got into his head, but there's a more to the story than him simply going to bama. Actions of the family seem to indicate more going on there.

Regardless, the Wirfs news (and many other stories like it) tell me that Proctors excuse was lame at best.
 
Hwk-I-St8 said:
That's a possibility...but the record for Iowa offensive linemen in the NFL is long and distinguished. If anything, that should have made him think the path to playing time was short. Let's see...play for homestate school with long history of developing linemen into NFL ready beasts seems like a pretty good deal.

If there's anything to that story, then it's more likely that Saban got into his head, but there's a more to the story than him simply going to bama. Actions of the family seem to indicate more going on there.

Regardless, the Wirfs news (and many other stories like it) tell me that Proctors excuse was lame at best.
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Everyone will believe what they want. My only point was that it's not hard to believe that Proctor didn't like the fact that our offense became a national laughingstock in 2022 with godawful O-line play, and after rethinking he decided to go where he believed he'd get better coaching and be pushed and challenged daily by other elite players. I don't doubt that these are seeds that Bama may have cultivated in his head either.
 
texas twister said:
17 and 18 year olds are old enough to be responsible to the level of making and holding to an agreement concerning their college choice. We are not talking about toddlers here. They can either vote or will be able to in a couple of months. They can enlist in the military and put their lives on the line. Excusing them from be a responsible person doesn't sit well with me. You make a promise, you keep it. Making excuses for them all the time possibly contributes to them making excuses all the time. It is like a "green light".
Click to expand...
You kept every single verbal promise you made when you were 17? If you say yes, you are a liar. I bet you never lie either, even as old as you are now, no lies. You are a unicorn!
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
Dec. 21 isn't signing day.

KJ committed to Cal in June, then visited Iowa, then flipped his commitment to Iowa in October. If the big hangup is the timing of KP's flip, then why did we not all hate Smith-Marsette who flipped from Minney to Iowa on Feb. 1, which is signing day?
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Selective hate.
 
pistachio1999 said:
Selective hate.
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It's just hypocritical. People think Proctor's decision should be based on their fandom instead of his future. If the situation were reversed and we flipped a 4 or 5 star from Bama in the middle of December, the same people bashing on KP's character would have zero issues with the Bama kid's character, probably build him a statue.
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
Kaleb Johnson made a promise to Cal, then broke that promise to come to Iowa. I'd assume if you're calling out Proctor's personal integrity for bailing on his commitment and going to Bama, you'd have the same integrity issues with Johnson for bailing on his commitment and coming to Iowa.
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Isn't there a big difference there? Do you NOT recall the context with Johnson before?

Iowa was Kaleb Johnson's favorite and many folks thought that he'd pull the trigger for the Hawks ... but back then there was still a very strong residual "stink" relating to the whole Chris Doyle fiasco. A lot of programs were using that to negatively recruit against Iowa.

Anyhow, Cal's Wilcox was attempting to sell Kaleb on the promise that Cal had shown in '19 ... suggesting that the '20 season was merely an anomaly. Anyhow, Iowa starting the '21 season off at 6-0 (with an exciting PSU game - which arguably biased Kaleb in Iowa's favor) ... while Cal started off at 1-5.

Based on Kaleb's prior close relationship with Iowa AND combined with the promise that the Hawks demonstrated in '21 (we did go on to win our division, after all) ... that was apparently enough to sway Kaleb.
 
ghostOfHomer777 said:
Isn't there a big difference there? Do you NOT recall the context with Johnson before?

Iowa was Kaleb Johnson's favorite and many folks thought that he'd pull the trigger for the Hawks ... but back then there was still a very strong residual "stink" relating to the whole Chris Doyle fiasco. A lot of programs were using that to negatively recruit against Iowa.

Anyhow, Cal's Wilcox was attempting to sell Kaleb on the promise that Cal had shown in '19 ... suggesting that the '20 season was merely an anomaly. Anyhow, Iowa starting the '21 season off at 6-0 (with an exciting PSU game - which arguably biased Kaleb in Iowa's favor) ... while Cal started off at 1-5.

Based on Kaleb's prior close relationship with Iowa AND combined with the promise that the Hawks demonstrated in '21 (we did go on to win our division, after all) ... that was apparently enough to sway Kaleb.
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Yeah but a promise is a promise right, even if verbal?
 
Gonzo Bloor said:
It's just hypocritical. People think Proctor's decision should be based on their fandom instead of his future. If the situation were reversed and we flipped a 4 or 5 star from Bama in the middle of December, the same people bashing on KP's character would have zero issues with the Bama kid's character, probably build him a statue.
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I don't have any issue with his change of mind. He should have just gone and not said anything, but I don't expect a 17 year old to understand and be as mature as an 80 year old would be.
 
ghostOfHomer777 said:
Isn't there a big difference there? Do you NOT recall the context with Johnson before?

Iowa was Kaleb Johnson's favorite and many folks thought that he'd pull the trigger for the Hawks ... but back then there was still a very strong residual "stink" relating to the whole Chris Doyle fiasco. A lot of programs were using that to negatively recruit against Iowa.

Anyhow, Cal's Wilcox was attempting to sell Kaleb on the promise that Cal had shown in '19 ... suggesting that the '20 season was merely an anomaly. Anyhow, Iowa starting the '21 season off at 6-0 (with an exciting PSU game - which arguably biased Kaleb in Iowa's favor) ... while Cal started off at 1-5.

Based on Kaleb's prior close relationship with Iowa AND combined with the promise that the Hawks demonstrated in '21 (we did go on to win our division, after all) ... that was apparently enough to sway Kaleb.
Click to expand...
Context? Lol.
 
iowaathletes said:
IMO: Proctor's comments can no longer be trusted as truth any longer regarding the move to bama and the events around that.

Why are we re-hashing this again? Wasnt there already miles and miles of this Proctor crap? Let it go.

Kaleb was supposedly injured all year but flipped as soon as he could, so I wonder just how bad was he.

They are both gone and DO NOT support the Hawks. Let it go. Next man in.

I think if this is about Tristan talk about Tristan - dont cloud it up with Proctor and Kaleb BS lol.
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So, just for clarity, you're rather confused here. They are talking about KALEB Johnson the running back who will be the starter next year. You are talking about Keagan Johnson the WR, who was "supposedly" hurt all year and will playing for KSU next year......
 
iowaathletes said:
IMO: Proctor's comments can no longer be trusted as truth any longer regarding the move to bama and the events around that.

Why are we re-hashing this again? Wasnt there already miles and miles of this Proctor crap? Let it go.

Kaleb was supposedly injured all year but flipped as soon as he could, so I wonder just how bad was he.

They are both gone and DO NOT support the Hawks. Let it go. Next man in.

I think if this is about Tristan talk about Tristan - dont cloud it up with Proctor and Kaleb BS lol.
Click to expand...

Kaleb? Do you mean Keagan ?
 
ghostOfHomer777 said:
Expecting folks to appreciate the significance of context is too much given the quality of intellect on this board? You're too cynical!
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The only context happening here is from where, and to where, a recruit flipped. If a kid flips from Iowa to somewhere else, he's never again to be trusted and has major character issues. If a kid flips from somewhere else to Iowa, he's welcomed and beloved.
 
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