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Can Biden perform and can Trump be boring? Key questions ahead of high-stakes presidential debate

binsfeldcyhawk2

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Pretty good breakdown of the debate by the AP.

NEW YORK (AP) — Rarely, if ever, has one candidate in a presidential debate had so much material to use against the other.

Republican Donald Trump has been convicted of 34 felony counts with serious charges in three other indictments still pending. As president, Trump nominated three of the justices who voted to overturn Roe v. Wade and erode abortion access in America, creating a backlash even in conservative-led states. And his sweeping second-term plans include promises of retribution against political enemies in both parties.

Yet the big question for President Joe Biden, fairly or not, is whether he has the physical and mental capacity at 81 years old to press the case against Trump. Perhaps nothing matters more than the level of energy and strength the Democratic incumbent projects on stage.

Both men have glaring flaws that present their opponent with tremendous opportunity, and risk. They will face a huge national audience that will include many people tuning into their 2020 rematch for the first time and who won’t see another debate until September, magnifying each success or mistake.

Biden and Trump will face off Thursday at 9 p.m. for 90 minutes inside a CNN studio in Atlanta.

Can Biden perform?​

Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.



Democrats are hopeful that Biden can bring the same energy he did in his State of the Union address earlier in the year. But a face-off on live television against an opponent who delights in verbal combat is very different from a scripted speech before Congress.

Biden’s team is aware that he cannot afford to have a bad night with the nation watching.

Can Trump be boring?​

Having already locked up his base, Trump has an opportunity with persuadable swing voters and moderates who fueled Biden’s victory four years ago and now express concerns about both candidates.

But to win over the so-called “double haters,” Trump cannot simply lean into the red-meat talking points, personal insults and conspiracy theories that typically dominate his public appearances. Instead of more talk of retribution or lies about the U.S. election system, he’ll need to offer an optimistic vision for the future and a clear contrast with Biden on traditional kitchen-table issues like health care and education.

He was widely panned for his outbursts in the first 2020 debate with Biden, badgering the then-Democratic nominee and repeatedly interrupting him. Their second debate took a milder tone and focused on their sharply different governing visions.

In short, Trump needs to be somewhat boring on Thursday night. Can he stay disciplined? Some allies are hopeful. History may suggest otherwise.

Navigating the criminal records​

Trump’s extraordinary legal baggage creates opportunity and risk for both candidates on stage.


Biden’s campaign has signaled an increasing willingness to lean into Trump’s criminal record in recent days. But aside from a few jabs, Biden himself has largely distanced himself from Trump’s prosecutions to avoid the appearance of political interference.

Trump, who has been alleging for years without evidence that Biden is responsible for prosecuting him, won’t make it easy for the president to toe that line.

Recent polling shows that about half of U.S. adults approve of Trump’s New York conviction. And if voters don’t think the specific convictions are troublesome, Trump’s attempt to conceal an alleged affair with a porn actress is hardly bumper sticker material.

Meanwhile, Biden is aware that Trump may go after his son, Hunter, as the then-president did on the debate stage four years ago. Hunter Biden was recently convicted on three felony charges related to the purchase of a gun while allegedly being addicted to drugs. Trump has also raised questions about Hunter Biden’s foreign business dealings when his father was vice president.


Muted mics and moderators​

As is often the case, the moderators and the ground rules will likely shape the debate’s outcome. And the ground rules for this debate, the first of two scheduled meetings, are unusual.

It’s worth noting that the candidates are bypassing the traditional structure determined by the Commission on Presidential Debates and instead relying on a set of mutually agreed rules and conditions.

Biden and Trump will debate at a CNN studio in Atlanta with no audience. There will be no opening statements. Each candidate’s microphone will be muted, except when it’s his turn to speak. No props or pre-written notes will be allowed on stage. The candidates will be given only a pen, a pad of paper and a bottle of water.

A coin flip determined that Trump would deliver the final closing statement.
The event will be moderated by CNN’s Dana Bash and Jake Tapper, two well-respected anchors who have not been shy about calling out Trump’s lies and conspiracy theories.

While Bash and Tapper have led critical coverage of Biden at times as well, Biden’s camp is no doubt hoping that they’ll play an active role in rejecting Trump’s potential falsehoods in real time. While Biden’s microphone will be muted when Trump is speaking, for example, the moderators’ mics will not.

Abortion versus immigration​

While style sometimes matters more than substance on the debate stage, both candidates have serious policy challenges to navigate.

For Trump, no issue looms larger than abortion. His Supreme Court appointments while president enabled the court to overturn Roe vs. Wade, which triggered an avalanche of abortion restrictions across the nation. Trump has repeatedly said he was proud of his role in overturning Roe. And Biden will be eager to highlight Trump’s role.

Trump, of course, has said he would not support a national abortion ban if reelected. But given his track record on Roe, he may have more work to do if he hopes to convince women he can be trusted on a key health care issue.

Biden’s greatest political liability, meanwhile, may be immigration. The Democrat’s administration has struggled to limit the number of immigrants entering the country at the U.S.-Mexico border. His allies privately acknowledge the issue is a major political liability heading into the fall.

Trump loves nothing more than highlighting illegal immigration, so expect him to pound Biden on the issue.

At the same time, Biden will face tough questions about his leadership in the war between Israel and Hamas. The president has alienated some would-be supporters on both sides given his staunch support — and occasional criticism — of Israel.

He’ll have a major opportunity to defend his record on the complicated issue Thursday night. It won’t be easy.
 
I stopped reading after they asked if Biden will be the one able to perform. Trump is out there rambling about sharks and batteries. Dude doesn't even know we have a missile defense system. It's clear which candidate is a meandering clueless old man. Trump will get destroyed Thursday. Enjoy, Rs.
 
I stopped reading after they asked if Biden will be the one able to perform. Trump is out there rambling about sharks and batteries. Dude doesn't even know we have a missile defense system. It's clear which candidate is a meandering clueless old man. Trump will get destroyed Thursday. Enjoy, Rs.
Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?
 
Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?
Meanwhile idiot boy is out there claiming that Joan Rivers voted for him (despite the fact that she died two years before the election).

 
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Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?

Why Trump is suddenly talking up Biden after months of slamming his cognitive capacity

 
Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?
Setting the bar extremely low for your opponent is really dumb.
 
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That goes without saying, but they aren't the critical audience for this debate.
This.

This main focus of this debate is around 10% of the electorate. That's probably a high estimate....either way there's only a small portion of the population that's going to be swayed by the debate and it'll take a totally catastrophic performance to really move the needle in a meaningful way.
 
Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?
No. Fox will run with the headlines, "Supercharged on COCAINE, Joe Biden cheats in debate. Trump strong and steady".
 
This.

This main focus of this debate is around 10% of the electorate. That's probably a high estimate....either way there's only a small portion of the population that's going to be swayed by the debate and it'll take a totally catastrophic performance to really move the needle in a meaningful way.
Which is amazingly sad. 44 percent are locked in on the convicted felon who called guys like you suckers and losers
 
Trump will meander and babble. He'll try to clarify his sharks and electric boats comments in order to do a little jujitsu on the LAME STREAM MEDIA. And, Biden will say something about 1984 when he really meant 1986, and the media will pummel him. Trump has so normalized his insanity it doesn't register anymore.
 
Trump doesn't have it in him to not be a complete jackass. He could win the debate if he could master and stick to facts, express reasonable policies to address the largest problems, and simply act presidential (something he never did as POTUS). Trump is incapable of any of those things.

Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.
 
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Biden’s seeming low bar for success has been created, at least in part, by the 78-year-old Trump and his Republican allies, who have relentlessly mocked the Democratic president for apparent stumbles connected to his age for years. Trump’s allies have questioned whether Biden can even stay awake and stand up for the entire 90 minutes.

This is a really interesting point. If Biden simply shows up and acts sharp and focused, will that be considered a victory? And does that mean the GOP have shot themselves in the foot?
This is why they are pushing the narrative that he will get a magical elixir through shots that will suddenly make him look focused and smart. It’s hilarious.
 
Trump doesn't have it in him to not be a complete jackass. He could win the debate if he could master and stick to facts, express reasonable policies to address the largest problems, and simply act presidential (something he never did as POTUS). Trump is incapable of any of those things.

Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.

I disagree that Biden is under any threat of being removed from the ballot.

But the rest you are right. . . Biden just needs to look like he's there mentally and physically to score the win. Trump isn't going to suddenly change his entire personality.
 
Trump doesn't have it in him to not be a complete jackass. He could win the debate if he could master and stick to facts, express reasonable policies to address the largest problems, and simply act presidential (something he never did as POTUS). Trump is incapable of any of those things.

Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.
That's what I want to see. I overall thought he did okay to good in his SOTU Address but you could tell he had some stimulant. He spoke very clear and loud (almost yelling) to start then you could see the trail off by the middle/end.

Who wins if Trump isn't a total jackass and we can understand every word Biden says?
 
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Trump doesn't have it in him to not be a complete jackass. He could win the debate if he could master and stick to facts, express reasonable policies to address the largest problems, and simply act presidential (something he never did as POTUS). Trump is incapable of any of those things.

Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.
Trump and facts do not belong in the same sentence. As you said, Trump is incapable... yet that faction will still vote for him. Biden is a forgetful old man who stammers... but he's clearly at least capable of being presidential.
 
Setting the bar extremely low for your opponent is really dumb.
No one has ever accused Trump of brilliance.
Trump doesn't have it in him to not be a complete jackass. He could win the debate if he could master and stick to facts, express reasonable policies to address the largest problems, and simply act presidential (something he never did as POTUS). Trump is incapable of any of those things.

Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.
If Trump could stick to facts, express reasonable policies, and act presidential…well, he wouldn’t be Trump.

As a public speaker, he’s simply not capable of being disciplined for 90 minutes. I actually think he’ll have a solid start, but won’t be able to maintain that.
 
Comedy Central GIF by Another Period
 
No one has ever accused Trump of brilliance.

If Trump could stick to facts, express reasonable policies, and act presidential…well, he wouldn’t be Trump.

As a public speaker, he’s simply not capable of being disciplined for 90 minutes. I actually think he’ll have a solid start, but won’t be able to maintain that.
If I were on Biden's team I'd almost tell Joe to lull Trump in with just pure policy conversation then at the 45 minute mark toss in the word felony and see if the smoke from his ear is visible.
 
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Trump and facts do not belong in the same sentence. As you said, Trump is incapable... yet that faction will still vote for him. Biden is a forgetful old man who stammers... but he's clearly at least capable of being presidential.
Biden today isn't the same as Biden as a Senator. Biden has many, many moments where he's not presidential when dealing with the press, Jack.:p
 
Biden today isn't the same as Biden as a Senator. Biden has many, many moments where he's not presidential when dealing with the press, Jack.:p

When I think about the last non-Trump GOP candidates - McCain and Romney - I would almost definitely vote for one of them OR a third party candidate.
 
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Biden will need to appear sharp mentally and physically, for a little over 90 minutes, without appearing to be juiced up. Any major gaffes or physical incidents and the party elite will be pushing him out. Biden isn't trying to convince the public he should be POTUS as much as convince the party elite that he should be on the ballot.

And there it is. Our dose of cockamamie horseshit.

Can you list the names of some folks in “the party elite?” I mean aside from George Soros and the lizard people who live under the Denver airport…
 
No. Fox will run with the headlines, "Supercharged on COCAINE, Joe Biden cheats in debate. Trump strong and steady".
Lying Fox will continue to lie and their viewers will continue to believe them...even though Fox admits in court that they lie to their viewers. Until Republican voters develop logic and common sense this country is screwed. There has GOT to be a way to end that network and hold them accountable for being an enemy of the state.
 
Lying Fox will continue to lie and their viewers will continue to believe them...even though Fox admits in court that they lie to their viewers. Until Republican voters develop logic and common sense this country is screwed. There has GOT to be a way to end that network and hold them accountable for being an enemy of the state.
Can you let us know the lies being told by Fox News? I haven't watched since Colmes left. I mostly see Fox News stuff when the liberals post it here.
 
This.

This main focus of this debate is around 10% of the electorate. That's probably a high estimate....either way there's only a small portion of the population that's going to be swayed by the debate and it'll take a totally catastrophic performance to really move the needle in a meaningful way.

I don't think this, or any presidential campaign, is about the ever fickle and self-aggrandizing "middle" at this point in the game. At this point campaigns have to be about motivating the established voter base to turn out on election day, not chasing a nebulous group of people that don't share common policy opinions or are naively waiting for some mythical other candidate.
 
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I don't think this, or any presidential campaign, is about the ever fickle and self-aggrandizing "middle" at this point in the game. At this point campaigns have to be about motivating the established voter base to turn out on election day, not chasing a nebulous group of people that don't share common policy opinions or are naively waiting for some mythical other candidate.
I think it's a combination of both. Galvanize your base without losing votes in the middle.

Since presidential elections are determined by a percentage pt or two I still think the "middle" matters.
 
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