Coaching Lost that Game

[Eternal Return]

It's OK to agree to disagree.

The 97 % vs 96.7% is razor thin but I disagree often with ESPN, their coverage, their politics and their "so-called". metrics.

In any event it was a great game, the Hawkeyes played well and fought to the very last second. and inches (See Hooker's fingers and the football on the last play)

That's fair. But I think it does point out that it's not an open and shut case either way. I remember Recinos missing most of his attempts last year and having had the one blocked earlier? I think that's why my gut pushes me toward what statistically might seem to be the somewhat lesser probability.

 

[Eternal Return]

I'll just add that I like being able to have this argument. Before kickoff I was thinking Iowa would lose by about 3 TDs.

 

[GPRHAWK]

Coaching nearly won us that game. We nearly beat a team we had no business beating.

 

[hif in fairfax]

Yes he did have a fg blocked, but it was an illegal block according to hawkeye radio. You can't jump over the center anymore, so there should have been a penalty called

 

[MeetTheFerentz]

If Iowa coaches tell the offense to not score on our final position,we win this game. Run clock out at 5 yard line and kick game winning field goal we are basically assured to win that game. Extra point conversion percentage is 97% in college football.

Old school mentality of power football, ignore statistics is a thing of the past.

I don't see why we'd give them the ball back with 2 mins left.

Sorry I didn't read this whole thread, but I'd like to know of one example in the history of football where a player had a 30+ yard run in the final two minutes of a game that could have given his team the lead, but then he took a dive at the 1-yard-line, for the purpose of running time off the clock before making the final score.

I'd love to see KF in the post-game presser if he went with your strategy and the FG was missed. Better yet, I'd love to see this board.

 

[nitewing]

didn't read the whole thread. but maybe just maybe the better and more experienced team won. I know a unwanted possibility on a boards that only wants to blame the coaches.

 

[ArturoFuente]

Sorry I didn't read this whole thread, but I'd like to know of one example in the history of football where a player had a 30+ yard run in the final two minutes of a game that could have given his team the lead, but then he took a dive at the 1-yard-line, for the purpose of running time off the clock before making the final score.

I'd love to see KF in the post-game presser if he went with your strategy and the FG was missed. Better yet, I'd love to see this board.

I asked the same earlier..no answer.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Moron...

Grab your remote and keep playing NCAA football 2006

I asked the same earlier..no answer.

Read the thread. People have posted examples. And as always just because something's never done before, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Dinosaur strategy isn't best strategy.

 

[ArturoFuente]

Read the thread. People have posted examples. And as always just because something's never done before, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Dinosaur strategy isn't best strategy.

Your title is Coaching Lost That Game. The question still remains...give me "one example in the history of football where a player had a 30+ yard run in the final two minutes of a game that could have given his team the lead, but then he took a dive at the 1-yard-line, for the purpose of running time off the clock before making the final score."

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

Your title is Coaching Lost That Game. The question still remains...give me "one example in the history of football where a player had a 30+ yard run in the final two minutes of a game that could have given his team the lead, but then he took a dive at the 1-yard-line, for the purpose of running time off the clock before making the final score."

I literally just said man, people have given examples in this thread. read it and stop repeating yourself. Peyton Manning has done it before. And again as I said, just because it's not common doesn't mean it's not the higher probability and more intelligent strategy.

 

[ArturoFuente]

I literally just said man, people have given examples in this thread. read it and stop repeating yourself. Peyton Manning has done it before. And again as I said, just because it's not common doesn't mean it's not the higher probability and more intelligent strategy.

y

Manning and Westbrook..who else? Really, who else? You're trying to portray yourself as intelligent..you should have a lot more real examples when you talk of probabilities and percentages....100% chance we win if Hooker brakes up that pass. See how easy that is...and I'm not smart...just a shit load of common sense.

 

[anon_0pi0cv8t1ggvb]

You're trying to portray yourself as intelligent

lol ok bud? Literally just stating my opinion on the optimal strategy for winning the game. Sorry it offended you so much.

 

[MeetTheFerentz]

Read the thread. People have posted examples. And as always just because something's never done before, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Dinosaur strategy isn't best strategy.

Westbrook was protecting a lead, and I don't know anything about the Manning example, but I seriously doubt he had scrambled 30+ yards then took a dive at the 1 with nobody close to him, when behind on the scoreboard.

You "strategy" is not football ingenuity. That type of situation has been discussed before, especially after the Broncos first Super Bowl win, when the Packers purposely let the Broncos score a TD to give them some time to answer. I'm sure many, including me, were concerned that we "scored too soon," but I think a coach telling a RB to take a dive at the one yard line if he has an open shot on a long run, especially when the offense had been struggling all night, is asking for trouble. KF and company would have had a lot to answer for if that backfired.

 

[Titanhawk2]

If Iowa coaches tell the offense to not score on our final position,we win this game. Run clock out at 5 yard line and kick game winning field goal we are basically assured to win that game. Extra point conversion percentage is 97% in college football.

Old school mentality of power football, ignore statistics is a thing of the past.

I don't see why we'd give them the ball back with 2 mins left.

Because after minus 3 yards on 11 carries you certainly expected a 35 yard run to the end zone

 

[myteamcanbeatupyourteam]

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that the coaches train the players and make sure they remind them before this drive that if they break free and are about to score, to just go down at the 3 yard line. Then we can kneel it and kick the extra point field goal to go ahead and take all of the time off the clock. That's a 97% win rate according to college football extra point conversion percentages.

NOBODY coaches that way.

 

[David1979]

If Iowa coaches tell the offense to not score on our final position,we win this game. Run clock out at 5 yard line and kick game winning field goal we are basically assured to win that game. Extra point conversion percentage is 97% in college football.

Old school mentality of power football, ignore statistics is a thing of the past.

I don't see why we'd give them the ball back with 2 mins left.

good god this is dumb. Can you imagine if the coaches told them to don't score if you have the opportunity and then the FG they kick is blocked and they lose on that?

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

good god this is dumb. Can you imagine if the coaches told them to don't score if you have the opportunity and then the FG they kick is blocked and they lose on that?

Furthermore, the OP is neglecting the fact that Wadley is the guy who made the play. For all we know, they've coached guys to have situational awareness ... and perhaps all he was thinking was "score." I'd be shocked if the coaches taught the players to pass up on an obvious scoring scenario - but, who knows?

Besides, the OP also isn't remarking upon how the coaching game-plans (particularly that of the D) ultimately let Iowa remain in the game in the first place. The adjustments made on O ultimately led to the Hawks moving the football in the 2nd half. It strikes me that the coaching wasn't too bad, all things considered.

It's easy to second guess and pick nits after an emotional defeat ... but that shouldn't take from the great effort made by our players and coaches. Even in defeat, that had to be one of the better games of football I've ever seen. Win or lose ... I'm proud of OUR guys!

 

[David1979]

Furthermore, the OP is neglecting the fact that Wadley is the guy who made the play. For all we know, they've coached guys to have situational awareness ... and perhaps all he was thinking was "score." I'd be shocked if the coaches taught the players to pass up on an obvious scoring scenario - but, who knows?

Besides, the OP also isn't remarking upon how the coaching game-plans (particularly that of the D) ultimately let Iowa remain in the game in the first place. The adjustments made on O ultimately led to the Hawks moving the football in the 2nd half. It strikes me that the coaching wasn't too bad, all things considered.

It's easy to second guess and pick nits after an emotional defeat ... but that shouldn't take from the great effort made by our players and coaches. Even in defeat, that had to be one of the better games of football I've ever seen. Win or lose ... I'm proud of OUR guys!

Exactly. And with how hard points were to come by, I don't see how you pass up a sure 6 for a 3 that is not for sure. Remember they still had 2 timeouts as well. So they still would have gotten the ball back with about a minute to go or just under a minute and would have only needed a FG to win it.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Exactly. And with how hard points were to come by, I don't see how you pass up a sure 6 for a 3 that is not for sure. Remember they still had 2 timeouts as well. So they still would have gotten the ball back with about a minute to go or just under a minute and would have only needed a FG to win it.

Such a close loss if tough on fans ... particularly ones who may have been inebriated. The term fan is derived from "fanatic" ... so the standards we should hold for the rationality of fans should be measured accordingly.

 

[RocknRollface]

Not scoring in that situation is a completely idiotic suggestion. Absolutely ridiculous.

You never risk not scoring when you are behind. Period.

In that situation a bird in the hand is worth 100 on the bush.

When defensive players go down after a TO its when they're ahead and or they dont want to turn it back over because they're not used to carrying the ball. Not at all comparable situations.

 

[GunnerHawk]

If Iowa coaches tell the offense to not score on our final position,we win this game. Run clock out at 5 yard line and kick game winning field goal we are basically assured to win that game. Extra point conversion percentage is 97% in college football.

Old school mentality of power football, ignore statistics is a thing of the past.

I don't see why we'd give them the ball back with 2 mins left.

I thought of that yesterday also but with 1:40 left on the clock and they had two time outs, if we took a knee twice they would still of had around 50 seconds on the clock with no time outs. We would still need to make a field goal, not a given. Then they would have some time to get in field goal range.

What were the odds of us breaking a 36 yard run for a TD. Without that long run, Wadley only had 50+ yards on the day. I can see it now, "Akrum when you break a long run, which we know you will" fall down 2 yards from the goal line.

Let's stop finding fault in the coaches, overall a great game. We unfortunately came up short. Penn State made at least 5-6 incredible plays to get the ball in the end zone. They are a very good team and our Hawks played their hearts out. Hats off to Kirk and the team.

 

[RocknRollface]

You could literally just kneel the ball and run clock out so we are guaranteed to have last possession with a field goal that is essentially an extra point. Extra point conversion rate is 97% in college football. So, yes I'll take the risk of a blocked extra point over giving PSU the ball back with 2 mins when our defense is gassed.

Again, that old school mentality of "you have to score a TD if it's there" is dated. You have to play the probability game.

No coach in the world would do that.

You're percentage doesn't factor in the possibility of penalties.

 

[Jan Itor]

If Iowa coaches tell the offense to not score on our final position,we win this game. Run clock out at 5 yard line and kick game winning field goal we are basically assured to win that game. Extra point conversion percentage is 97% in college football.

Old school mentality of power football, ignore statistics is a thing of the past.

I don't see why we'd give them the ball back with 2 mins left.

 

[SCKCtb93]

Another piece of the puzzle to consider that nobody has brought up is that the Iowa defense had already played close to two games worth of snaps. The defensive line was obviously gassed during that last drive and understandably so after playing 99 snaps in the game.

I understand both sides of the argument clearly. The first thing I thought when Wadley scored the touchdown was that there was way too much time for a tired defense to stop an explosive offense that would have 4 downs to get every 10 yards they needed.

I disagree with the OP in that I would not kneel the ball and then kick the field goal. I would run the ball still trying to get the touchdown on the three downs and make sure the running back has two hands on the ball for the entirety of each play. If Wadley does not get in, then we kick a field goal at extra point distance with around 30 seconds left in the game. If Wadley does get in, then Penn State still needs a touchdown and they have closer to 1 minute to get it instead of 2.

There are risks both ways. I don't think people should be calling the OP an idiot when the strategy they are advocating for ended up losing the game.

 

[IamHawkeye]

No coach in the world would do that.

You're percentage doesn't factor in the possibility of penalties.

Or fumbles. Gee, maybe Iowa shouldn't have blitzed on the final play and there would have been more defenders on the pass catchers (but probably room for a running TD)

 

[bman546]

Wadley scores and PSU still had two timeouts remaining with 1:42 left on the clock. If Iowa makes a field goal, PSU still gets the ball with a minute left in the game, and only needs a fg to win. Dumb idea.

 

[Ngnosis hwk scence]

Another piece of the puzzle to consider that nobody has brought up is that the Iowa defense had already played close to two games worth of snaps. The defensive line was obviously gassed during that last drive and understandably so after playing 99 snaps in the game.

I understand both sides of the argument clearly. The first thing I thought when Wadley scored the touchdown was that there was way too much time for a tired defense to stop an explosive offense that would have 4 downs to get every 10 yards they needed.

I disagree with the OP in that I would not kneel the ball and then kick the field goal. I would run the ball still trying to get the touchdown on the three downs and make sure the running back has two hands on the ball for the entirety of each play. If Wadley does not get in, then we kick a field goal at extra point distance with around 30 seconds left in the game. If Wadley does get in, then Penn State still needs a touchdown and they have closer to 1 minute to get it instead of 2.

There are risks both ways. I don't think people should be calling the OP an idiot when the strategy they are advocating for ended up losing the game.

Sorry about if this quote or re-quote does not work.

You are right .. 78 snaps for the defense and then another 12... 1 snap too many... IOWA LOST.
Question remains. Will anyone ask the question to the powers to be. Making 6 or 7 figures.

Did you consider telling Akrum to go down within 5 yards?

PS: I am still 97% pissed at the refs... Flow a flag for Akrum HIGH STEPPIN !!!!! Hawks get the ball at the 19 yard line, first and down... let us see what happens

 

[farhawks]

 

[farhawks]

 

[MilleGinja]

It does not take a genius to comprehend that the clock stops if he slides down at the 1 yard line for the first down. The 23 seconds or so that it starts running after the first down brings you down to about 1:20 give or take. Two PSU timeouts are left so you are only going to run off four seconds or so if you kneel twice. Then one more kneel down with a 40 second running clock brings you to 35 seconds left giving PSU the ball back and the clock stops on every first down they make (they did not have anything but incomplete passes and first downs on their last drive). And PSU only needs a FG. Difficult situation, but not any more difficult than driving 80 yards in 12 plays with 1:42 on the clock and having to put in in the endzone - which PSU was having difficulty doing the whole night.

Not a coach in football would do what you suggest.

This. In a game like that, where not even a field goal is guaranteed, you take the points where you can get them. And you let the defense do what it had done pretty much all night, keep Penn State out of the end zone. Unfortunately it didn't work out on the last drive. There's nothing to be ashamed of. These players and coaches should keep their heads up high. We can (and have) beat this dead horse again and again, but we lost and there are a lot of reasons why. One of the biggest being Penn state was just flat out the better team. We did a hell of a job competing with them but they were better.

 

[MilleGinja]

Yes he did have a fg blocked, but it was an illegal block according to hawkeye radio. You can't jump over the center anymore, so there should have been a penalty called

I think I was reading it is legal if it is within a yard of the line of scrimmage? So they can't run and jump over the line. Not sure if accurate and can't recall if they did that or not. Will try to look up later.

 

[elvis63]

Years ago Joe's brother, George Paterno, once said on his radio show that " the other team tries hard also, fans seem to forget that." As fans of a team when tend to down play certain things, and sometimes over state other things. Jewel stops Barkley on that 3rd and 6 and maybe Iowa wins. The last pass gets tipped and PSU loses. It was that close. I don't see how either team could fault their coaches.

Because the other guy tries hard too.

 

[JWB389]

I think I was reading it is legal if it is within a yard of the line of scrimmage? So they can't run and jump over the line. Not sure if accurate and can't recall if they did that or not. Will try to look up later.

The guy that blocked that filed goal came off the edge.

https://www.blackshoediaries.com/20...-apke-flukily-blocks-iowas-field-goal-attempt