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Did he kill her?

The sheriff helicopter flew out over that area around 11 pm but only did a few passes and returned to the airport. There was some chatter on the police scanner at the same time mentioning the preserve and the chopper but they switched to a closed frequency.

Could be a random person out there but they saw someone around 11 pm in the area where they had been searching.





 
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I have never killed anyone. But I do think I have watched enough forensic files and other murder shows to know how to get away with it.

Not a chance. Way too many ways to get caught these days. Especially if you know the victim personally.

You almost have to have zero acquaintance with the person. Show up in some random town, off someone, and drive away shortly after. Even then your DNA might be in a database somewhere and you're caught.
 
Time the murder with a burial so you can place the corpse under where they put the coffin.

Most cemeteries in Iowa require a vault be placed in first before the coffin goes in. Wibert Vault is a huge supplier here in Iowa. My assumption is FL is similar as are most states. Helps keep the ground stable.

Is FL similar?
 
Enhanced photos of the second camera on the Red White and Bethune bus. This captured a front view of the van. You can see what looks like the boyfriend with his face up behind the front passenger seat looking at the bus drive past.

See the post that starts with 174 Cray Cray



E_3C71SVIAkZuNH
Those show nothing.
 
11 pm news last night. They will be back searching Carlton Reserve this morning

NBC Tampa


Fox Ft Myers
 
Not a chance. Way too many ways to get caught these days. Especially if you know the victim personally.

You almost have to have zero acquaintance with the person. Show up in some random town, off someone, and drive away shortly after. Even then your DNA might be in a database somewhere and you're caught.
Or a couple of your relatives DNA has gone to Ancestry, etc.
Those are already being mined.

Newborn Screening Programs already do blood tests on almost every baby born in the country. They’ve started testing DNA testing for some conditions. I would expect in time those DNA samples will be permanently logged for police reference.
When you have the DNA profile of 98%+ of the population, you have the DNA profile of basically the entire population. Those 2% are inextricably linked to their family.
 
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Most cemeteries in Iowa require a vault be placed in first before the coffin goes in. Wibert Vault is a huge supplier here in Iowa. My assumption is FL is similar as are most states. Helps keep the ground stable.

Is FL similar?
Yes
 
CNN was complaining this morning about how only white female victims get media coverage. Not sure why they were telling me about it instead of discussing internally at a “what should we cover at our media company” meeting.
They (the media) don’t want problems fixed, they want to exacerbate them. Means more views.
 
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CNN was complaining this morning about how only white female victims get media coverage. Not sure why they were telling me about it instead of discussing internally at a “what should we cover at our media company” meeting.
Because they actually only care about ratings and money.
 
Funny thing about the missing indigenous women story. They only make up 60 percent of the indigenous people that have gone missing across the time period mentioned. I can't recall a single national news story about a man missing of any ethnicity. I guess that is male privilege on fill display....
 
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CNN was complaining this morning about how only white female victims get media coverage. Not sure why they were telling me about it instead of discussing internally at a “what should we cover at our media company” meeting.
Yep. I feel there is a middle ground and a lot overstated too. Twitter was almost unbearable with people trying to garner street cred by bringing this up before her body is even properly buried. For instance there was a study cited, well, just about everywhere, that 710 Indigenous people were reported missing from 2011 to 2020 in Wyoming!!!! Pretty amazing and shocking stuff being repeated everywhere. Then you read the report and it states:

"Between 2011 and September 2020, 710 Indigenous persons were reported missing. Some Indigenous people were reported missing more than once during the time period, resulting in a total of 1,254 missing person records for Indigenous people. Eighty-five percent were juvenile, and 57% were female. They were reported missing from 22 counties in Wyoming. Ten percent of missing Indigenous people are found within the same day they are reported missing, 50% are found within one week. One-fifth of the Indigenous people reported missing were missing for 30 or more days, which is a higher percentage than White people missing for 30 or more days (11%). Currently, 10 Indigenous people are listed as missing (3 females and 7 males).

Good write up too though that does show the indigenous missing do not get enough and as much attention as missing white people. I think we can all admit this to being true for a host of reasons, mainly race and income. Yet everyone is shouting from the hills, including news folks that "OMG 710 indigenous people are missing in Wyoming from 2011-2020" when report says 80% of them were found within first 30 days and there are only 10 still missing at time of its publication. I don't care about twitter justice warriors pulling this stuff but irritating to see journalists retweeting.


 
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It is amazing.that someone would label you that way when what I see is a call for due process from you
It's fine. It's just a message board, and people are having fun. I absolutely understand why most people rushed to judgement on this one.

I've seen 2 very good friends be unjustly accused of crimes they didn't commit. They were ultimately acquitted, but at great financial cost and damaged reputations. I've also witnessed police misconduct. I played on a recreational basketball team with 6 deputies. They openly bragged about their misconduct in front of me. So I have a distrust of the system.
 
It's fine. It's just a message board, and people are having fun. I absolutely understand why most people rushed to judgement on this one.

I've seen 2 very good friends be unjustly accused of crimes they didn't commit. They were ultimately acquitted, but at great financial cost and damaged reputations. I've also witnessed police misconduct. I played on a recreational basketball team with 6 deputies. They openly bragged about their misconduct in front of me. So I have a distrust of the system.

I remember you posting about playing basketball with the Escambia deputies. Their ex-sheriff is a piece of work having a statue of himself commissioned at taxpayer expense though he did later reimburse the agency for the statue.
 
The sheriff helicopter flew out over that area around 11 pm but only did a few passes and returned to the airport. There was some chatter on the police scanner at the same time mentioning the preserve and the chopper but they switched to a closed frequency.

Could be a random person out there but they saw someone around 11 pm in the area where they had been searching.






Would presume they've got a few FLIR cameras, and can pretty easily pinpoint objects of interest at night...
 
Yep. I feel there is a middle ground and a lot overstated too. Twitter was almost unbearable with people trying to garner street cred by bringing this up before her body is even properly buried. For instance there was a study cited, well, just about everywhere, that 710 Indigenous people were reported missing from 2011 to 2020 in Wyoming!!!! Pretty amazing and shocking stuff being repeated everywhere. Then you read the report and it states:

"Between 2011 and September 2020, 710 Indigenous persons were reported missing. Some Indigenous people were reported missing more than once during the time period, resulting in a total of 1,254 missing person records for Indigenous people. Eighty-five percent were juvenile, and 57% were female. They were reported missing from 22 counties in Wyoming. Ten percent of missing Indigenous people are found within the same day they are reported missing, 50% are found within one week. One-fifth of the Indigenous people reported missing were missing for 30 or more days, which is a higher percentage than White people missing for 30 or more days (11%). Currently, 10 Indigenous people are listed as missing (3 females and 7 males).

Good write up too though that does show the indigenous missing do not get enough and as much attention as missing white people. I think we can all admit this to being true for a host of reasons, mainly race and income. Yet everyone is shouting from the hills, including news folks that "OMG 710 indigenous people are missing in Wyoming from 2011-2020" when report says 80% of them were found within first 30 days and there are only 10 still missing at time of its publication. I don't care about twitter justice warriors pulling this stuff but irritating to see journalists retweeting.



Yeah, there is no question that white blonde middle class victims sell, and that there's a significant element of racism in what gets covered.

But it's also way more complicated than that as well. When's the last time a poor white sex worker's murder went viral? Or white homeless man? The truth is, we don't care about people on the fringes, the poor, people in chaotic situations. When we hear about those, we say "How sad, but not surprising."

Indigenous peoples have the highest poverty rate of any group. Very high instances of substance abuse. That's where the real scandal is, not so much in the coverage when one is murdered. People who are neglected in all aspects of their lives...surprise, they're neglected when they go missing as well.

We pay attention to the people who we think "shouldn't have had that happen to them."

We also usually need a villain in these stories...negligent parents, spouses, boyfriends. Picking middle class white folks usually makes for easy villains, rather than forcing us to deal with complex questions we don't want to ask ourselves as a society.

When kids go missing, we don't really want to crack open a broken foster care system, or failures of CPS, or domestic abuse. We don't want to wonder how we failed these women and children.

We want to speculate the mom buried the kid in the yard so she could run off with her tennis instructor. That's the satisfying and easy outlet, with justice that can be satisfied. We can see the boyfriend end up in jail...we can't fix a system that puts at-risk people in harm's way.

That's why these cases are catnip to media and viewers, and I say this as a pretty avid "consumer" of true crime.
 
Would presume they've got a few FLIR cameras, and can pretty easily pinpoint objects of interest at night...

I know the sheriff's helicopter does but when it flew over last night around 11:15 it was at too high of an altitude to use the FLIR camera. Whether the too high altitude post I read is accurate, the sheriff's helicopter didn't circle the search area. It only did one pass and then went back to the airport.
 
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I know the sheriff's helicopter does but when it flew over last night around 11:15 it was at too high of an altitude to use the FLIR camera. Whether the too high altitude post I read is accurate, the sheriff's helicopter didn't circle the search area. It only did one pass and then went back to the airport.

Yep. You need a ultra-hi-res camera (those run $100k or more), or some optical attachments to improve the resolution. And those cannot be "regular glass", which isn't fully transparent. They make them out of quartz ceramics, I believe.

So, it's not a tool that any random county is going to have on hand. Feds would certainly have some they could lend out.
 
Funny thing about the missing indigenous women story. They only make up 60 percent of the indigenous people that have gone missing across the time period mentioned. I can't recall a single national news story about a man missing of any ethnicity. I guess that is male privilege on fill display....

Bingo that's the missing thing.

Like it or not in order to make it into a national story you need a young pretty white girl. If any of those things are missing than it's not a national story. If it's a man. . . not a national story. If she's not white, not a national story. If she isn't young and pretty. . . not a national story.

The bias is looks based, gender based, and race based.
 
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9 am there was a chopper circling the same spot. No mention if this was police or media. Yesterday the FAA had a no fly zone for media over the reserve so it is likely this is a government helicopter




Drones are being used to search the areas that the off road vehicles cannot reach

 
Yeah, there is no question that white blonde middle class victims sell, and that there's a significant element of racism in what gets covered.

But it's also way more complicated than that as well. When's the last time a poor white sex worker's murder went viral? Or white homeless man? The truth is, we don't care about people on the fringes, the poor, people in chaotic situations. When we hear about those, we say "How sad, but not surprising."


I would add 1 additional item that has added to this case's fervor, which is the amount of video that has been available. The coverage has made it seem like it was already a Dateline special.
From Gabby's posts to the police stop, to the vlogger who found the van , people have watched the crime happen in a way and have become invested in its outcome.

Similar coverage is never going to be given to a missing person case no matter the color without the detail this case has given viewers.
 
Not a chance. Way too many ways to get caught these days. Especially if you know the victim personally.

You almost have to have zero acquaintance with the person. Show up in some random town, off someone, and drive away shortly after. Even then your DNA might be in a database somewhere and you're caught.

My DNA isn't in the Alabama Match.com (ancestry.com) for this reason exactly. What if I wanted to off someone in the future? I don't want folks having my DNA and I have never been in the slammer (yet).
 
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My DNA isn't in the Alabama Match.com (ancestry.com) for this reason exactly. What if I wanted to off someone in the future? I don't want folks having my DNA and I have never been in the slammer (yet).
They caught the Golden State killer because a couple of his relatives (cousins, if I recall) were in the database.

How long before you can '3D print' some made to order genetic material and plant it at the crime scene ala Mark Furman and the Colombian hit on Nicole Brown.
 
Yeah, there is no question that white blonde middle class victims sell, and that there's a significant element of racism in what gets covered.

But it's also way more complicated than that as well. When's the last time a poor white sex worker's murder went viral? Or white homeless man? The truth is, we don't care about people on the fringes, the poor, people in chaotic situations. When we hear about those, we say "How sad, but not surprising."

Indigenous peoples have the highest poverty rate of any group. Very high instances of substance abuse. That's where the real scandal is, not so much in the coverage when one is murdered. People who are neglected in all aspects of their lives...surprise, they're neglected when they go missing as well.

We pay attention to the people who we think "shouldn't have had that happen to them."

We also usually need a villain in these stories...negligent parents, spouses, boyfriends. Picking middle class white folks usually makes for easy villains, rather than forcing us to deal with complex questions we don't want to ask ourselves as a society.

When kids go missing, we don't really want to crack open a broken foster care system, or failures of CPS, or domestic abuse. We don't want to wonder how we failed these women and children.

We want to speculate the mom buried the kid in the yard so she could run off with her tennis instructor. That's the satisfying and easy outlet, with justice that can be satisfied. We can see the boyfriend end up in jail...we can't fix a system that puts at-risk people in harm's way.

That's why these cases are catnip to media and viewers, and I say this as a pretty avid "consumer" of true crime.

We wouldn't know about her If she was 15 pounds heavier. There are so many variables why a case like this explodes in social media/media.
 
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