Golf ruling, need a little help.

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Went out and played this evening and had a situation I didn't know how to handle. Off the box I hooked my ball and thought it may have gone OB/ into the water. I dropped ("drop 2 hit 3") and punched my new ball out into the fairway. After I played my shot I circled back around because there was way more room than I thought and I found my original ball. Do I take a penalty for hitting the new ball or since I found my original do I just continue? I'm trying to get better at actually playing by the rules instead of being the "I shot an 80 but had 8 gimmies and 4 mulligans guy" .

 

[golfinghawkeye]

Once you play your penalty shot that is your score.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Once you play your penalty shot that is your score.

OK so I took the penalty stroke but do I play the new ball or the old ball?

*thank you

 

[hwk23]

“you can continue to play your provisional ball until you reach the place where the original is likely to be. If you make a stroke at your provisional ball at or beyond that point, the provisional becomes the ball in play and the original is considered lost.”

 

[Tmiller99]

If it went OB on the tee shot you would have to return to the tee and would be hitting 3rd off the tee. It it went in a lateral hazard like water off the tee, you would drop 2 and be hitting 3 without losing your distance. You would play the new ball going forward after declaring a lost ball.

 

[JMSBFD]

OK so I took the penalty stroke and played with my balls.

More interested if you got a decent rain on that new seeding? Hopefully if so, it was a gentle rain.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

OK. So as soon as I hit my ball from the spot I believed it went OB that was my new ball and score regardless of finding the original. In this case hitting 3.

 

[golfinghawkeye]

OK so I took the penalty stroke but do I play the new ball or the old ball?

Reading the original post it sounds like you hooked it into a water hazard/red stake. You took your drop and hit shot three. Your original ball you found is irrelevant as you played it as a lost ball in a water hazard. If it is a white stake the correct play was to re-tee and play 3 off the tee.

 

[hwk23]

OK. So as soon as I hit my ball from the spot I believed it went OB that was my new ball and score regardless of finding the original. In this case hitting 3.

I think your ok playing the original as long as you didn’t hit the provisional beyond that point. So if you found the ball (the original) , ahead of any point you hit the provisional, you can play the original and forget about the provisional.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

More interested if you got a decent rain on that new seeding? Hopefully if so, it was a gentle rain.

I did. First time for the sunflowers and sorghum. I'm not holding my breathe on the corn I put into my clover plots (tilled lines, covered and then packed by driving back and forth with the mower. The soil is clay) I'll add some photos to the garden thread tmrw. Also did a small patch of oats in hopes of getting more turkeys up my draw. Only plot left is my pumpkin patch that I will also add sunflowers into.

 

[theiacowtipper]

Went out and played this evening and had a situation I didn't know how to handle. Off the box I hooked my ball and thought it may have gone OB/ into the water. I dropped ("drop 2 hit 3") and punched my new ball out into the fairway. After I played my shot I circled back around because there was way more room than I thought and I found my original ball. Do I take a penalty for hitting the new ball or since I found my original do I just continue? I'm trying to get better at actually playing by the rules instead of being the "I shot an 80 but had 8 gimmies and 4 mulligans guy" .

Once you declared your ball lost or OOB and played your next shot, that’s your ball for the rest of the hole, regardless if you find your original. If you had stated it’s a provisional, you would have had to play the original once found, regardless if playing the provisional would have been advantageous.

 

[theiacowtipper]

I think your ok playing the original as long as you didn’t hit the provisional beyond that point. So if you found the ball, ahead of any point you hit the provisional, you can play the original and forget about the provisional.

I want to make sure I’m getting this correct. In his example, he declared his original lost, and was hitting three. He didn’t declare an original. In that case there is no way he can go back to his original.

Edit to add one more thing. the original poster said OB or water. In the case of a penalty area, hitting into that off the tee doesnt allow you to hit a provisional if you think the ball might be lost. You must attempt to find your ball and, if lost, return to the tee box to hit the provisional.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Reading the original post it sounds like you hooked it into a water hazard/red stake. You took your drop and hit shot three. Your original ball you found is irrelevant as you played it as a lost ball in a water hazard. If it is a white stake the correct play was to re-tee and play 3 off the tee.

O jeez I guess I dont know.


I lost it in the circled area.

 

[joelbc1]

also.....IF you hit your "provisional ball" from a point beyond where your original ball is/was found, the original ball is automatically out of play/abandonned. Just for future reference.

 

[JMSBFD]

O jeez I guess I dont know.


I lost it in the circled area.

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Where is that? Adel?

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Where is that? Adel?

5x80.

Menlo

 

[JMSBFD]

Oh shit, I should have known that. Is that still private? Used to be a titty bar the next exit down I believe.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

also.....IF you hit your "provisional ball" from a point beyond where your original ball is/was found, the original ball is automatically out of play/abandonned. Just for future reference.

Good to know and that is kinda why I'm asking. My "drop" was in a low spot and I had to punch out whereas my original shot allowed me a little better angle to hit out of. My drop was about 10 yards ahead of where I found my ball though.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Oh shit, I should have known that. Is that still private? Used to be a titty bar the next exit down I believe.

Yes. Public can play 3 times a year if you live in 5 towns around us. Unlimited if you are beyond the 5 towns. Never heard of the titty bar.

 

[golfinghawkeye]

O jeez I guess I dont know.


I lost it in the circled area.

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So if you are teeing off on third and you just hit a dead snap hook and your playing partners agree you went into the pond just play it as a water hazard/red stake. Speeds play up and your groups enjoyment. If money is involved with bets you should have hit a provisional as a shot that piss poor could be considered lost and you would be hitting 3 off the tee.

 

[hwk23]

I want to make sure I’m getting this correct. In his example, he declared his original lost, and was hitting three. He didn’t declare an original. In that case there is no way he can go back to his original.

Edit to add one more thing. the original poster said OB or water. In the case of a penalty area, hitting into that off the tee doesnt allow you to hit a provisional if you think the ball might be lost. You must attempt to find your ball and, if lost, return to the tee box to hit the provisional.

Technically, he needs to declare his second ball as a provisional, yes. I think he was talking OB, not sure if it was his tee shot or not. To be honest I used to be a 2 handicap but haven’t played in quite a while, so a little rusty on the current rules.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

So if you are teeing off on third and you just hit a dead snap hook and your playing partners agree you went into the pond just play it as a water hazard/red stake. Speeds play up and your groups enjoyment. If money is involved with bets you should have hit a provisional as a shot that piss poor could be considered lost and you would be hitting 3 off the tee.

I was by myself.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Technically, he needs to declare his second ball as a provisional, yes. I think he was talking OB, not sure if it was his tee shot or not. To be honest I used to be a 2 handicap but haven’t played in quite a while, so a little rusty on the rules.

It was my tee shot that I thought I lost.

 

[thewop]

Lost ball. You can hit 3 from the tee and your provisional becomes your ball when you pass the lost ball.

I'm 90% sure that after the 2019 rules change you can also lay out no closer to the hole anywhere through the green. So if, for example you lost it 150 yards out, you could lay in the middle of the fairway 150 out, and hit 4. This is for pace of play.

 

[golfinghawkeye]

I was by myself.

If you are concerned about an accurate handicap than it should have been three off the tee with a lost ball. A casual round after work and hoping to keep the pace of play up it went in the water.

 

[Hawkfan_08]

It was my tee shot that I thought I lost.

Dude... we don't have a gallery of marshalls and spotters to get your ball. I would have played the original and put your provisional back in your bag. You thought it was lost and took a gamble to see if it was in play. You never went OB.

I would have taken no penalty and played your first ball if in bounds. However, I would have also not hit a provisional if it were a lateral hazard and I'm the one who will stretch that 2 min limit to look for a ball because:
1- I hate losing money.
2- I hate losing strokes more.

 

[golfinghawkeye]

If you find yourself in a similar situation just hit a provisional of the tee and play two balls with a water drop and ask the clubhouse after the round for the correct scoring.

 

[Slim45]

Dude... we don't have a gallery of marshalls and spotters to get your ball. I would have played the original and put your provisional back in your bag. You thought it was lost and took a gamble to see if it was in play. You never went OB.

I would have taken no penalty and played your first ball if in bounds. However, I would have also not hit a provisional if it were a lateral hazard and I'm the one who will stretch that 2 min limit to look for a ball because:
1- I hate losing money.
2- I hate losing strokes more.

yeah this is definitely the correct answer. I get what he’s saying about not wanting to be “that guy” who shaves strokes and kicks the ball out from behind trees and gives himself mulligans. This situation isn’t comparable to that tho IMO. Tourney play/$ on the line different story.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Dude... we don't have a gallery of marshalls and spotters to get your ball. I would have played the original and put your provisional back in your bag. You thought it was lost and took a gamble to see if it was in play. You never went OB.

I would have taken no penalty and played your first ball if in bounds. However, I would have also not hit a provisional if it were a lateral hazard and I'm the one who will stretch that 2 min limit to look for a ball because:
1- I hate losing money.
2- I hate losing strokes more.

I broke 80 (legit) once last year. With the stroke I shot an 85 today and consistently shoot between 83-87 out there right now. I have set my goal as being able to shoot 80 out there, regularly, by the end of the year. I play primarily with my BIL and my brother in laws brother who are both scratch (ish) golfers and a guy, henceforth called "buddy" I used to work with that loves telling people he shoots in the 80s but somehow loses 3 balls a round. At the end of the day It's all fun but I'm getting good enough I want to beat my buddies ass legit and take away the fluffing, foot wedges, gimmies, mulligans, breakfast balls, and all the other shit he does and thinks he's actually good.

Edit to add: I play from the whites. My goal this year is consistently 80 from the whites.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

If you find yourself in a similar situation just hit a provisional of the tee and play two balls with a water drop and ask the clubhouse after the round for the correct scoring.

Ha. Jackie would have told me to lighten the **** up I was by myself. She is good shit.

 

[thewop]

Lost ball. You can hit 3 from the tee and your provisional becomes your ball when you pass the lost ball.

I'm 90% sure that after the 2019 rules change you can also lay out no closer to the hole anywhere through the green. So if, for example you lost it 150 yards out, you could lay in the middle of the fairway 150 out, and hit 4. This is for pace of play.

Confirmed on that second part about hitting 4. This is considered a local rule, so it may not apply in Tour events, but we'd most certainly apply to any round anyone on the HORT is playing..
Link: https://www.google.com/amp/s/golf.c...troke-distance-local-rule-save-strokes/?amp=1

 

[joelbc1]

Reading the original post it sounds like you hooked it into a water hazard/red stake. You took your drop and hit shot three. Your original ball you found is irrelevant as you played it as a lost ball in a water hazard. If it is a white stake the correct play was to re-tee and play 3 off the tee.

You cannot LOSE a ball in "ground under repair" (blue stakes).......white stakes are used to define course boundaries only....red stakes/marks define lateral water hazards, yellow stakes mark regular water hazards...blue stakes/marks are used to designate "ground under repair" and "no play from" wetland areas...but they need to be so defined by the local rules committee and a "free drop area" needs to be created to accommodate the golfer.....the golfer does not incur any penalty strokes for hitting a ball into a GUR or wetlands area.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

Next time I play (likely tmrw) I'm going to go look at the stakes over there. I honestly don't know what color they are.

 

[joelbc1]

Next time I play (likely tmrw) I'm going to go look at the stakes over there. I honestly don't know what color they are.

Iwould dare say the vast majority of golf course are "staked" incorrectly...

 

[golfinghawkeye]

You cannot LOSE a ball in "ground under repair" (blue stakes).......white stakes are used to define course boundaries only....red stakes/marks define lateral water hazards, yellow stakes mark regular water hazards...blue stakes/marks are used to designate "ground under repair" and "no play from" wetland areas...but they need to be so defined by the local rules committee and a "free drop area" needs to be created to accommodate the golfer.....the golfer does not incur any penalty strokes for hitting a ball into a GUR or wetlands area.

Great.

I was referring to red stakes as op was referring to a water hazard which are red. Not knowing the course layout before the op posted a map I gave him an option on white stakes. I have no idea if blue stakes are involved.

 

[joelbc1]

Dude... we don't have a gallery of marshalls and spotters to get your ball. I would have played the original and put your provisional back in your bag. You thought it was lost and took a gamble to see if it was in play. You never went OB.

I would have taken no penalty and played your first ball if in bounds. However, I would have also not hit a provisional if it were a lateral hazard and I'm the one who will stretch that 2 min limit to look for a ball because:
1- I hate losing money.
2- I hate losing strokes more.

I love to play "GOLF" and golf has rules.......I didn't write'm, I just play by them.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

I love to play "GOLF" and golf has rules.......I didn't write'm, I just play by them.

See that's where I am. I will say 75% of the time I go out and have fun and don't really care but when I play with my "buddy" it drives me nuts how he plays "winter rules" in June and then wants me to validate his "83" on the Grint. My BIL an BIL's brother are both much better than I am, mainly due to putting, so if they thin/fat one once in a blue moon and want to drop another ball just so they can hit the shot again every now and then I don't really care because we don't bet and they are much better than I am. For now.

 

[jberesford]

This one gets kind Into kind of a gray area. So it sounds like you believed you were in a lateral hazard. Wether you know that was a lateral or not is basically irrelevant. However once you put that new ball into play near where you reasonably felt your ball disappeared into the hazard became your 3rd shot. Now there are rules on properly taking a drop but that's not what this thread is about. This doesn't apply here, but there is a wild hypothetical occurrence where you actually find your ball in the hole. In that very circumstantial situation, the shot that actually went in is your score for the hole, regardless of how many strokes occurred after the one that went in.

Now an actual shot out of bounds or declared lost would require a re-play of the shot. For place of play it is recommended to hit a 'provisional' shot in the event that you are unable to find the original. Of note here is that it has to be declared as a provisional. You literally have to state to the playing partners that you are hitting a provisional ball. Things like 'Im gonna hit another, better hit a backup ball, I'm gonna tee another just in case' don't count. Without actually declaring the shot a provisional you technically made the first ball lost without even looking the moment you put another one into play. I've never personally heard of anyone getting hassled about it during a tournament or meet, but its one of those things that someone can rightfully penalize you for.

For a novice beginner player its important to know there are kind of 2 sets of rules. The actual USGA rules of golf (in the US, elsewhere may use that or the R&A), and local rules. Local rules are special conditions found on the scorecard or otherwise somehow established by the course or event organizers. Usually it involves how to take drops (free or otherwise) in non standard circumstances. For example if you hit into a flower bed or similar beautification. Many times a 'local' rule will give you the right to take free relief in order to keep you from going into it and trying to play out to avoid a penalty. Therefore the course encourages you to just lose your ball instead of doing damage looking for it. And then there's League play. Which is just a giant set of local rules designed for ease and pace of play as its still competition based, but has very few competitive players that fully understand the rules, and some really high handicap players. Out of bounds and lost balls are generally dumbed down to keep scores reasonable and keep people moving.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

There should be pro/tournament rules and rec rules. The whole “return to the tee box and re-hit” thing is ridiculous. Try that at your local course.

 

[Slim45]

I love to play "GOLF" and golf has rules.......I didn't write'm, I just play by them.

You’re as bad as the guy that stetches/doesn’t follow the rules. You follow ALL the rules like it’s the PGA tour and there’s big $ on the line. Golf for 99.9% of people is a game to go out and BS with buddies and have some fun. There are some rules, like this one where he actually found his original ball, that shouldn’t be followed. Definitely when you’re alone or there’s no $ on the line. If its a tourney or you’re counting it towards your handicap then ya, make it legit. Otherwise who freaking cares!