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3boysmom

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Dec 21, 2001
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This is going to be long because I don't know how to condense it to get the best advice. What I ultimately need is just direction on where to go from here.

I've posted a little about this a few months ago but I'm making my own thread because we are really not sure how to proceed with it. On December 16 I got a call from my middle son's boss. He was letting me know that my son was being taken to the ER after having a seizure at work. If it matters, he is 26 and no previous history of seizures. When we arrived at the ER we found out that he had seized for a prolonged period of time requiring them to give him some kind of paralytic to stop the seizures and was on a ventilator to help him breathe. His CT scan showed some bleeding on the brain but they weren't terribly concerned with that. He also had some vertebral fractures both new and old. Initially the doctors thought he probably hit his head and started seizing. After speaking with his coworker he said that he walked into my son's office to let him know that he was heading home and he was sitting in his chair with a blank stare. He walked over to try to get his attention and my son started seizing. He was ventilated for 24 hours and then able to be woken up and breathe on his own. He spent another 3 days in the hospital. They did 2 EEGs in the hospital, both were normal with no seizure activity. His tox screen was not clean so after some additional follow up they figured that was the cause of the seizure and it was likely a one time thing.
Fast forward to last Wednesday. I got another call that he was transported to the ER again after he had an episode at work where was unresponsive and started sweating profusely. At the ER they said that this was another seizure, put him back on Kepra, and said to get a repeat EEG which he did today. He hasn't talked with the neurologist yet but he sees the result of the EEG in his patient portal and it is showing normal results. His tox screen this time was completely clean. He was told that the CT scan from last week was normal as well. I was out of town when this happened so all of my info is coming from my son and husband. I feel like we are back at square one trying to find out what caused this so that we can try to prevent it in the future.
I guess I am second guessing whether the second episode was a seizure as well as whether the first seizure was a response to something else. We have zero family history of any kind of seizure disorder but there are heart attacks and strokes all up and down the family tree. Is this something we should bring up to the neurologist when they call hopefully tomorrow? They have never asked previously. Are there questions we should be asking or information that we need to be giving in order to help get a diagnosis? And because I know someone is going to bring it up, he had covid before vaccines were available and had the J&J vaccine. So no need to discuss it at all.
 
My biggest concern would be the bleeding on the brain and the old and new vertebral fractures, can you elaborate more on the old fractures
 
Why are we still doing CT scans here? MRIs and a neurologist at Mayo. My cervical spine consists of titanium discs, rods and a titanium mesh cage. I’ve lost most of the right side of my upper body. I guess I’m confused about the lack of action with the brain bleeding and seizures. Strokes are a thing with cervical issues along with seizures.
 
Any bleeding in the brain should raise flags for a 26 yr old without obvious trauma to the head. He needs an MRI/MRA looking at perfusion of the brain and if there are narrowing of his arteries, as well as the fractures in the spine. What part of the spine are these fractures present, (cervical, thoracic, lumbar?). Sounds like these seizures are secondary to a larger problem and need to do more thorough work up for a stroke or vascular disease. Hope you can get more answers.
 
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Normal spot EEGs is not shocking. Most of the time we don't capture one of the concerning events.

Absolutely mention everything to his neurologist.

He needs an MRI/MRA. Although I'd maybe be shocked if he hadn't already had one.
 
I've absolutely seen seizures related to substance use (all kinds).

I think you've mentioned one of the kids is in construction. Many construction guys way overuse caffeinated drinks, which lowers your seizure threshold. Any chance he's over doing caffeine?

Source-residency where we had a construction guy come in with multiple unexplained seizures. After further questioning, he drank 10+ red bulls daily.
 
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My biggest concern would be the bleeding on the brain and the old and new vertebral fractures, can you elaborate more on the old fractures
We honestly have no idea about the fractures. Old or new. He has had several knee injuries and a concussion but never hurt his back to our knowledge and he says he doesn’t have any back pain.
I don’t remember if they said specifically which vertebrae had fractures. And of course he didn’t do the follow up on that. He says he thinks T8 and T9 but I don’t even know if that’s a thing.
 
I've absolutely seen seizures related to substance use (all kinds).

I think you've mentioned one of the kids is in construction. Many construction guys way overuse caffeinated drinks, which lowers your seizure threshold. Any chance they're over doing caffeine?

Source-residency where we had a construction guy come in with multiple inexplained seizures. After surgery questioning, he drank 10+ red bulls daily.
I do have a son in construction but this is a different son. He manages an auto shop. But he absolutely overdid caffeine. I believe he had several energy drinks plus coffee the day of the big seizure. And he was terrible about proper nutrition and sleep. He’s gotten better since the first seizure.
 
Sounds like they are working him up appropriately. Mri and CT are both beneficial depending on what they are looking for and the time frame since injury.

The CT is used as a quick scan to determine if he had bleeding in the brain. If they are worried about an aneurysm or stoke them an mri is beneficial. But damage from a stoke may not be clear until a week or two out. If he had a continuously bleeding aneurysm this would have been visible on the CT(sort of), so it's probably not necessary to get an mri yet.

What was on the tox screen? The vertebral fractures and bleeding on the brain may indicate he has been having seizures for a while and has fallen due to them and hit his head hard enough to cause a fracture. Since he has multiple fractures old and new tells me he probably has had several falls.

It's always a challenge to pin point what comes first.
Seizures > fall > fracture/head bleed.
Or
Head bleed > fall > seizure

Different areas of bleeding in the brain indicate if it was a traumatic bleed or a spontaneous bleed. So ask the neurologist what they are suspecting if they have not told you already.

Ask your son to tell you the truth about everything that has been happening with him. Drug use or any weird things that he has noticed. Sometimes it's embarrassing for a 26 year old to admit what they know, but that info could help diagnose his condition. It may also to be beneficial to ask a friend he spends a lot of time with to see if they have noticed anything being off.

Good luck with everything, I hope he gets healthy and you can get some answers.
 
Sounds like they are working him up appropriately. Mri and CT are both beneficial depending on what they are looking for and the time frame since injury.

The CT is used as a quick scan to determine if he had bleeding in the brain. If they are worried about an aneurysm or stoke them an mri is beneficial. But damage from a stoke may not be clear until a week or two out. If he had a continuously bleeding aneurysm this would have been visible on the CT(sort of), so it's probably not necessary to get an mri yet.

What was on the tox screen? The vertebral fractures and bleeding on the brain may indicate he has been having seizures for a while and has fallen due to them and hit his head hard enough to cause a fracture. Since he has multiple fractures old and new tells me he probably has had several falls.

It's always a challenge to pin point what comes first.
Seizures > fall > fracture/head bleed.
Or
Head bleed > fall > seizure

Different areas of bleeding in the brain indicate if it was a traumatic bleed or a spontaneous bleed. So ask the neurologist what they are suspecting if they have not told you already.

Ask your son to tell you the truth about everything that has been happening with him. Drug use or any weird things that he has noticed. Sometimes it's embarrassing for a 26 year old to admit what they know, but that info could help diagnose his condition. It may also to be beneficial to ask a friend he spends a lot of time with to see if they have noticed anything being off.

Good luck with everything, I hope he gets healthy and you can get some answers.
The tox screen showed cocaine and marijuana. So it was definitely reasonable to suspect that was a contributing factor. But with the new episode and negative tox screen I’m guessing it puts that a little more into question.
After the latest episode he says that he believes he’s had several of those over the past year. He thought they were anxiety attacks. To his knowledge he hasn’t fallen or hit his head but when he was seizing in December I would be shocked if he didn’t hit it pretty hard on the concrete floor he was laid on. They didn’t get it under control until he got to the hospital. He played football and wrestled in high school so I would think it’s possible old injuries may have happened then?
 
There are lots of triggers for seizures as well. Some people can have photosensitivity that can cause seizures. This can be caused by a contrast of bright and dark lights flashing at a specific speed (usually between 5 - 30 htz). Strobe lights, computer screens, flickering lights can cause this.

This condition only accounts for about 3% of epilepsy, but since he was in his office both times its worth asking him if his head felt "fuzzy" or like there was "electricity in his brain" before the episode.
 
The tox screen showed cocaine and marijuana

Seems like a lot of good advice above. I'm curious how much of a drinker he is? Seizures are common among people who drink excessively and try to stop abruptly. Usually there are tell tale signs before you get to that point, but not always.

Regardless, best of luck moving forward. I hope you figure out what it is. I empathize with how helpless it must feel not knowing what is root cause.
 
I am so sorry for what you are going through. We have been dealing with a life changing medical condition with my oldest now 21 year old daughter for two years. It took a long 8 months to get it properly diagnosed and that was accomplished by working with insurance and getting her into the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, which after dealing with the numpties in Tallahassee, felt like going from an inner city high school to Harvard University. The level of care and doctors they threw at her in several multiple day visits was astounding and a game changer. So if you feel similar frustrations, I highly recommend looking for a similar entity nearby that offers higher level medical care and diagnosis if it is possible.

After taking a year off from FSU, she is back in and hopefully on track to graduate next year, though she has another round of chemo coming up (not cancer - Wegener's granulomatosis) . It is tough on the whole family to be dealing with such things that can have life changing and life shortening outcomes so stay strong and don’t be afraid to see a therapist if you need. It takes a toll mentally not just on your kid but the parents, grandparents and siblings. Definitely keeping your family in my prayers.
 
The tox screen showed cocaine and marijuana. So it was definitely reasonable to suspect that was a contributing factor. But with the new episode and negative tox screen I’m guessing it puts that a little more into question.
After the latest episode he says that he believes he’s had several of those over the past year. He thought they were anxiety attacks. To his knowledge he hasn’t fallen or hit his head but when he was seizing in December I would be shocked if he didn’t hit it pretty hard on the concrete floor he was laid on. They didn’t get it under control until he got to the hospital. He played football and wrestled in high school so I would think it’s possible old injuries may have happened then?
The cocaine, excessive energy drinks would be a giant red flag with no other history. Does he go to the gym much. If he consumes some of that pre workout cocktails. That could be added to the cumulative affect of various substances. But as Wolf sad above shocked he hasn’t had an mri yet.
 
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This is going to be long because I don't know how to condense it to get the best advice. What I ultimately need is just direction on where to go from here.

I've posted a little about this a few months ago but I'm making my own thread because we are really not sure how to proceed with it. On December 16 I got a call from my middle son's boss. He was letting me know that my son was being taken to the ER after having a seizure at work. If it matters, he is 26 and no previous history of seizures. When we arrived at the ER we found out that he had seized for a prolonged period of time requiring them to give him some kind of paralytic to stop the seizures and was on a ventilator to help him breathe. His CT scan showed some bleeding on the brain but they weren't terribly concerned with that. He also had some vertebral fractures both new and old. Initially the doctors thought he probably hit his head and started seizing. After speaking with his coworker he said that he walked into my son's office to let him know that he was heading home and he was sitting in his chair with a blank stare. He walked over to try to get his attention and my son started seizing. He was ventilated for 24 hours and then able to be woken up and breathe on his own. He spent another 3 days in the hospital. They did 2 EEGs in the hospital, both were normal with no seizure activity. His tox screen was not clean so after some additional follow up they figured that was the cause of the seizure and it was likely a one time thing.
Fast forward to last Wednesday. I got another call that he was transported to the ER again after he had an episode at work where was unresponsive and started sweating profusely. At the ER they said that this was another seizure, put him back on Kepra, and said to get a repeat EEG which he did today. He hasn't talked with the neurologist yet but he sees the result of the EEG in his patient portal and it is showing normal results. His tox screen this time was completely clean. He was told that the CT scan from last week was normal as well. I was out of town when this happened so all of my info is coming from my son and husband. I feel like we are back at square one trying to find out what caused this so that we can try to prevent it in the future.
I guess I am second guessing whether the second episode was a seizure as well as whether the first seizure was a response to something else. We have zero family history of any kind of seizure disorder but there are heart attacks and strokes all up and down the family tree. Is this something we should bring up to the neurologist when they call hopefully tomorrow? They have never asked previously. Are there questions we should be asking or information that we need to be giving in order to help get a diagnosis? And because I know someone is going to bring it up, he had covid before vaccines were available and had the J&J vaccine. So no need to discuss it at all.
What did the tox screen show? Needs to be seen by a neurologist. This is pretty serious. Need to put all cards on the table to see if it might be a reaction to medications or unrelated.
 
I am so sorry for what you are going through. We have been dealing with a life changing medical condition with my oldest now 21 year old daughter for two years. It took a long 8 months to get it properly diagnosed and that was accomplished by working with insurance and getting her into the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, which after dealing with the numpties in Tallahassee, felt like going from an inner city high school to Harvard University. The level of care and doctors they threw at her in several multiple day visits was astounding and a game changer. So if you feel similar frustrations, I highly recommend looking for a similar entity nearby that offers higher level medical care and diagnosis if it is possible.

After taking a year off from FSU, she is back in and hopefully on track to graduate next year, though she has another round of chemo coming up (not cancer - Wegener's granulomatosis) . It is tough on the whole family to be dealing with such things that can have life changing and life shortening outcomes so stay strong and don’t be afraid to see a therapist if you need. It takes a toll mentally not just on your kid but the parents, grandparents and siblings. Definitely keeping your family in my prayers.
Hey! We don't call it Wegener's anymore because he was a Nazi. It's granulomatosis with polyangitis. Which really rolls off the tongue better.
 
So sorry to hear about all of this @3boysmom. Here’s hoping they get him sorted out ASAP. I’d be an absolute mess if this was happening with one of my kids, just frightening.
 
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Seems like a lot of good advice above. I'm curious how much of a drinker he is? Seizures are common among people who drink excessively and try to stop abruptly. Usually there are tell tale signs before you get to that point, but not always.

Regardless, best of luck moving forward. I hope you figure out what it is. I empathize with how helpless it must feel not knowing what is root cause.
He actually rarely drinks. That was something they asked a lot. His brothers confirmed that.
 
Would that still be the case with no use since the initial seizure? He wasn’t on any meds before the initial seizure and outside of 5 days of Kepra none since.
It would be a bit strange to have meds/cocaine in the system that long after yes. My concern would be if he might be epileptic. How is the referral to the neurologist going?
 
I am so sorry for what you are going through. We have been dealing with a life changing medical condition with my oldest now 21 year old daughter for two years. It took a long 8 months to get it properly diagnosed and that was accomplished by working with insurance and getting her into the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, which after dealing with the numpties in Tallahassee, felt like going from an inner city high school to Harvard University. The level of care and doctors they threw at her in several multiple day visits was astounding and a game changer. So if you feel similar frustrations, I highly recommend looking for a similar entity nearby that offers higher level medical care and diagnosis if it is possible.

After taking a year off from FSU, she is back in and hopefully on track to graduate next year, though she has another round of chemo coming up (not cancer - Wegener's granulomatosis) . It is tough on the whole family to be dealing with such things that can have life changing and life shortening outcomes so stay strong and don’t be afraid to see a therapist if you need. It takes a toll mentally not just on your kid but the parents, grandparents and siblings. Definitely keeping your family in my prayers.
Thanks! It has definitely been stressful for all of us. His brothers knew what he was doing before the first seizure and felt a lot of guilt about not stopping him. But he’s the type of kid who has to learn the hard way. I’m praying he has learned that he needs to take care of himself and that his brothers are learning along side of him.
 
I’d recommend bypassing general neurology in the community and requesting his PCP refer him to a medical center with a comprehensive epilepsy program, as long as he can be seen fairly soon. Not saying this is necessarily epilepsy (though it could be; it could also be a couple provoked seizures), but comprehensive centers not only have seizure-specialist neurologists, they have the highest level of support services (imaging, EEG monitoring units, neurosurgery, etc.). Again, not saying any of this is necessary, but I’d go for the highest level of speciality care given some of the complexity in the story.

Comprehensive epilepsy centers can be found at:
 
My daughter had seizures after her hubby left her. She’d had a closed head injury in high school and had been seizure free for several years. Stress. The Kepra helped.
She got through it and also stopped all alcohol. She’s been seizure free for almost three years.
Your son MUST stop the drug use. Any tendency to seizures is just going to be exacerbated by it.
I really wish you and your family all the very best.
 
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This is going to be long because I don't know how to condense it to get the best advice. What I ultimately need is just direction on where to go from here.

I've posted a little about this a few months ago but I'm making my own thread because we are really not sure how to proceed with it. On December 16 I got a call from my middle son's boss. He was letting me know that my son was being taken to the ER after having a seizure at work. If it matters, he is 26 and no previous history of seizures. When we arrived at the ER we found out that he had seized for a prolonged period of time requiring them to give him some kind of paralytic to stop the seizures and was on a ventilator to help him breathe. His CT scan showed some bleeding on the brain but they weren't terribly concerned with that. He also had some vertebral fractures both new and old. Initially the doctors thought he probably hit his head and started seizing. After speaking with his coworker he said that he walked into my son's office to let him know that he was heading home and he was sitting in his chair with a blank stare. He walked over to try to get his attention and my son started seizing. He was ventilated for 24 hours and then able to be woken up and breathe on his own. He spent another 3 days in the hospital. They did 2 EEGs in the hospital, both were normal with no seizure activity. His tox screen was not clean so after some additional follow up they figured that was the cause of the seizure and it was likely a one time thing.
Fast forward to last Wednesday. I got another call that he was transported to the ER again after he had an episode at work where was unresponsive and started sweating profusely. At the ER they said that this was another seizure, put him back on Kepra, and said to get a repeat EEG which he did today. He hasn't talked with the neurologist yet but he sees the result of the EEG in his patient portal and it is showing normal results. His tox screen this time was completely clean. He was told that the CT scan from last week was normal as well. I was out of town when this happened so all of my info is coming from my son and husband. I feel like we are back at square one trying to find out what caused this so that we can try to prevent it in the future.
I guess I am second guessing whether the second episode was a seizure as well as whether the first seizure was a response to something else. We have zero family history of any kind of seizure disorder but there are heart attacks and strokes all up and down the family tree. Is this something we should bring up to the neurologist when they call hopefully tomorrow? They have never asked previously. Are there questions we should be asking or information that we need to be giving in order to help get a diagnosis? And because I know someone is going to bring it up, he had covid before vaccines were available and had the J&J vaccine. So no need to discuss it at all.
Hoping for the best for him and your family.
 
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