Importantly, Kris Murray didn’t foul out

Lighting Hawk

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He missed several easy buckets, defensive assignments, and was out of position for rebounding. That was obvious. You might have missed it but McC didn't nor did I. I love Kris but he is still thinking too much, especially when he's in the paint. That's the difference between him and Keegan in a nutshell. Not that he's going to be Keegan but he's not going to tap his potential until he gets more aggressive.

Were you referencing ISU or what? I would say he was plenty aggressive defensively and offensively in that game. He’s not a polished product by any means, but he gathered 2 steals and 2 blocks & 6 rebounds in 16 minutes. That’s production we aren’t seeing from anyone else outside of Tony and Keegan maybe. Kris was handcuffed for being too aggressive by McC against ISU when he got a BS second foul. Fran went nuts at the official but still stuck to his guns and benched him for the rest of the half.
 
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BBHawk

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Perfect example of him stepping up in a huge way, just thought I’d get your further analysis on what he didn’t do against VA and Illinois, because in limited minutes I thought he was our best player in the second half, followed by Tony and Keegan. Jbo did most of his damage in the first half but was decent in the 2nd compared to the first. IMO Kris is ready for more minutes & more weight based on limited sample size.
And if anyone should be lauded for their effort in that game it is PMac. His shooting stats weren't as good but a lot of his misses were on shots he got hammered while driving to tge bucket. That's why he led the team in scoring. Kris was very passive in the first half and made several mental mistakes that led to him getting pulled. Tony played much better.
 
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BBHawk

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Were you referencing ISU or what? I would say he was plenty aggressive defensively and offensively in that game. He’s not a polished product by any means, but he gathered 2 steals and 2 blocks & 6 rebounds in 16 minutes. That’s production we aren’t seeing from anyone else outside of Tony and Keegan maybe. Kris was handcuffed for being too aggressive by McC against ISU when he got a BS second foul. Fran went nuts at the official but still stuck to his guns and benched him for the rest of the half.
Purdue game, as you mentioned.
 

Lighting Hawk

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Purdue game, as you mentioned.

Oh well yes, originally I was talking about that but asked about VA and Illinois too. I thought it was pretty obvious to anyone who watched that he had a good game. He went on a 6-0 run by himself to force a timeout in the last 4 minutes I believe. That’s crunch time, primarily what we have been focused on, as well as aggression. Was he perfect, absolutely not, we were down double digits in the first half and shooting awful. In Mackey on the road, in your first start against the #2 soon to be #1 at the time, that’s going to happen to a number of players out there.

Our entire team played well in the second half primarily the last 8 minutes when we shut them down and almost pulled off the upset; yes Pmac should be definitely credited for his performance, it was Kris’ first collegiate start, and Patrick’s what, 15th? Everyone like I said, put in a shift that game, Tony, Ahron, so did Joe, so did Kris, Filip, and Pmac. Josh o especially was a difference maker. I am not going to make excuses for Kris’ faults because everyone has them in games, I’m here to point out what he’s done well while not ignoring the limitations and small sample size, he’s in the discussion as the second best on our team. I would probably give it to Tony at this point and then Jordan/Kris, would be close behind. Don’t think it’s laughable to think that given the statistics and the eye test for me.
 

Lighting Hawk

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@BBHawk think we can both agree on wanting us to kick the sh*t out of Utah State by double digits on Saturday, and I don’t think either of us cares who scores and how lol
 
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PHawkKenyon

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I understand I have a different perspective as a former player, coach and father, but I know a little about player evaluation (as does Fran). I am not Nostradamus, but I have been pretty spot on with what I said KnK could/would become. Kris is where Keegan was last year and with more court time, he can be as versatile as Keegan. Our conversation always is about how Kris can be more effective when he is on the floor. Experience is key for him. His role on this team is different. Role comparison last year to this year: Keegan=Garza, Jbo=Frederick, Toussaint/Uhlis=Jbo (without the shooting), Patrick=Weisy (w/o the shooting), Connor=Connor, Kris=Keegan. Understand that new roles take time to feel comfortable in them and we have hit a snag. What is needed is a perspective that this is a process. A process that may not fit the timeline that all want, but a process non the less. Take the good with the bad, look for the positives in each player, celebrate the good, while correcting the bad and most of all, remember what it was like to be a 21 year old when discussing these players. This is about GROWTH!! I have seen it first hand what the power of patience and persistence can do for players who commit to those two things.
 
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Ronman

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Kenyon, didn't I see an light hearted interview with you concerning your sons during which you stated that Kris has declared that he is the best player in the family/team? Maybe it was just sibling rivalry/smack talk between brothers, but I thought it was funny. I hope it gets to the point that it will be a tough choice as to which one is the better player.
 
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Lighting Hawk

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You guys should check out the On Iowa Podcast, CMac and PMac, and Kris and Keegan on there, it was uploaded yesterday and it was pretty hilarious hearing how those two interact. Didn't realize Kris talked so much! @PHawkKenyon I trust the process, clearly you know first hand seeing as they both stated you've been their only trainer they've ever had... We are all witnessing the process of how they've bloomed into two amazing D1 athletes from two that barely had a D1 sniff out of HS. Remarkable work ethic and determination.
 
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BBHawk

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Kenyon hits the nail on the head. Kris just needs the time to develop his confidence. Will he get pulled at times? Heck yeah, but that's normal. If he makes a mitake hustling, he won't get pulled, guaranteed. But if he gets caught watching a couple of times in a row, he'll sit. Same with any player.

Kris has tons of talent. We're going to see it over the next 2 years. Patience.
 

ROCKY MOUNTAIN HAWK

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Kris & Perkins are the whole key to this season & our only hope imo.

They both need more minutes. Kris needs to start but I actually like bringing Perkins off the bench. He needs to be put in sooner in the first halves though & play more minutes overall.
 
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KcTo

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Kris & Perkins are the whole key to this season & our only hope imo.

They both need more minutes. Kris needs to start but I actually like bringing Perkins off the bench. He needs to be put in sooner in the first halves though & play more minutes overall.
Totally agree that Perk and Kris both have the greatest upside and therefore greatest potential for elevating IOWAs ceiling
 
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Lighting Hawk

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Here’s a scary stat I heard from Leistikow:

6 mainly rotational guards (Jbo, cmac, ulis, perk, Sanfort and joe T) have a combined 10 rebounds in the last 2 games where we outrebounded horribly.

Most notably - and surprisingly, the worst is Perkins who has 1 rebound in 49 minutes played, which is the most minutes out of all of them, and the lowest contribution.

If we win on the boards tonight I think we will win the game but our guards have to stop leaking out and help get the damn ball possessed. That should be something hammered home by Fran with our obvious struggles and breaking down film. Heck it’s gonna happen all season if we don’t box out cuz we are undersized.
 

HawkRugged17

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Here’s a scary stat I heard from Leistikow:

6 mainly rotational guards (Jbo, cmac, ulis, perk, Sanfort and joe T) have a combined 10 rebounds in the last 2 games where we outrebounded horribly.

Most notably - and surprisingly, the worst is Perkins who has 1 rebound in 49 minutes played, which is the most minutes out of all of them, and the lowest contribution.

If we win on the boards tonight I think we will win the game but our guards have to stop leaking out and help get the damn ball possessed. That should be something hammered home by Fran with our obvious struggles and breaking down film. Heck it’s gonna happen all season if we don’t box out cuz we are undersized.

Better rebounding vs Utah State and hopefully that continues.
 
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Bearhawk0505

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Kris played a great game….hopefully this is him finding his groove for the rest of the season!
Fran needs to start him. He is way too good not to start. Just like Keegan last year(should have started at the 4 all year). The twins can guard any position and are our best rebounders. They both should see 34+ minutes a night unless in foul trouble.
 
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Lighting Hawk

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Fran needs to start him. He is way too good not to start. Just like Keegan last year(should have started at the 4 all year). The twins can guard any position and are our best rebounders. They both should see 34+ minutes a night unless in foul trouble.

If he doesn’t start he definitely needs to be the 6th man and play 25-30 minutes
 
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KcTo

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If he doesn’t start he definitely needs to be the 6th man and play 25-30 minutes
I’m totally OK with Kris not starting, as long as he’s finishing and getting 25-30 minutes a game

actually I’d play Keegan and Kris every minute possible
 

Ronman

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Quote from KenPom:
"Coaches are gradually getting more conservative about playing guys with foul trouble in the first half. Even with foul rates declining to historic lows last season, coaches were less willing to play a guy after he picked up his second foul. It makes one wonder if there is a level of fouling low enough to make coaches reconsider their philosophy."

Last time I saw numbers on this subject, about 50% were on McCaffery's side of this issue.
 
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KcTo

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Quote from KenPom:
"Coaches are gradually getting more conservative about playing guys with foul trouble in the first half. Even with foul rates declining to historic lows last season, coaches were less willing to play a guy after he picked up his second foul. It makes one wonder if there is a level of fouling low enough to make coaches reconsider their philosophy."

Last time I saw numbers on this subject, about 50% were on McCaffery's side of this issue.
Good insight

somewhere I saw that 2 foul 1st half minutes participating %, by coach, and Fran was in the 95th percentile of not playing players…

so ~95 % of all coaches had a different approach…