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Iowa High School Wrestling Idea…

I guess I don't logically see this at all. Of course it has bearing on performance, as those teammates are the wrestling partners. That doesn't mean Happel can't be good, it just makes it more improbable that he's the best.

150/class is about 3x the size of many 1A schools. But good to know about their wrestling specific consolidation, as I said, I have no idea how their small schools would compare.

I only see fans winning in this, not schools or 99% of students.

It's not a question of who wins and who loses; it's a question of the purpose of the individual tournament. Is it an elite event to find the best wrestler in each weight class, or is it a way to generate a bunch of money and let as many kids as feasible participate.

I believe the purpose should be to create an elite event to find the very best wrestler. Most here believe it's more about having as many fans and wrestlers in one place at one time.
 
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It's not a question of who wins and who loses; it's a question of the purpose of the individual tournament. Is it an elite event to find the best wrestler in each weight class, or is it a way to generate a bunch of money and let as many kids as feasible participate.

I believe the purpose should be to create an elite event to find the very best wrestler. Most here believe it's more about having as many fans and wrestlers in one place at one time.

I'm not sure what an "elite event" is supposed to be defined as other than wanting a direct competition with other states, which I don't think a state should want or strive for.

What is the benefit of determining the best of the best? Prepping obviously D1 kids for inevitable D1 scholarships?

You make it seem, to me, as though you think Iowa's tournament is somehow watered down to obscurity which I find absurd and almost insulting.

I think the #1 goal of the state association in this as well as wrestling supporters should be maintaining and increasing participation in wrestling, which likely leads to better education overall. I think any decisions should have that in the forefront of their mind.

If a change will increase participation, do it, if not, don't. I don't know the answer to that, my instincts say the latter, but there are countless people in a better position to make that determination than me.

Making sure we fans know who the best of the best is isn't enough for me to hurt that goal.
 
Why would it kill small programs if conference foes were basically the same size?

As far as state tournament pageantry goes, doesn't 336 place winners (8 x 14 weights x 3 classes) in a state the size of Iowa seem a bit excessive? The best 24 kids in the state at each weight make the podium.

I think it would be more exciting to see the best kid in the state crowned champion at each weight. Why water down the competition in an individual sport? That reeks of awarding participation trophies, and prestigious ones at that.
Not excessive at all. That many more kids were able to compete and have a legitimate chance of getting a reward that is worth something. The purpose is to provide a forum for the kids to compete. It is not to make recruiting easier or develop college wrestlers.
 
I'm not sure what an "elite event" is supposed to be defined as other than wanting a direct competition with other states, which I don't think a state should want or strive for.

What is the benefit of determining the best of the best? Prepping obviously D1 kids for inevitable D1 scholarships?

You make it seem, to me, as though you think Iowa's tournament is somehow watered down to obscurity which I find absurd and almost insulting.

I think the #1 goal of the state association in this as well as wrestling supporters should be maintaining and increasing participation in wrestling, which likely leads to better education overall. I think any decisions should have that in the forefront of their mind.

If a change will increase participation, do it, if not, don't. I don't know the answer to that, my instincts say the latter, but there are countless people in a better position to make that determination than me.

Making sure we fans know who the best of the best is isn't enough for me to hurt that goal.

That does seem to be the goal for most, which is fine I suppose. But making it easier for kids to win a medal just seems to be the antithesis of sports in general and wrestler in particular.
 
If you want to grow the sport, the one class tournament is not the way. The more participants means a deeper pool, more friends and family made into fans.

To succeed at the national level freestyle/greco club wrestling is what produces those athletes. Iowa has a smaller population, smaller group of families that have the income that can do club wrestling at the national level. A single class tourney will not change that.

My Class 1A school has been letting the entire school out with excused absences for our wrestlers since the 70's when there is a state qualifier. I don't think the current tourney is a participation award, it still a legit tournament for kids from a similar resource pool. Not too many former D1 wrestlers coaching in 1A vs 2A or 3A.

If more kids wining state medals helps grow the sport, keep the current format. Do I wish Iowa produced more D1 talent, yes. It would be nice to have scholarship programs for kids who want to do post season wrestling and camps to help develop them.
 
That does seem to be the goal for most, which is fine I suppose. But making it easier for kids to win a medal just seems to be the antithesis of sports in general and wrestler in particular.
There you go again, denigrating wrestlers because of Iowa's 3 classes. Do you really think it is that watered down?

Also, we disagree about the thesis of sports, as does history. Especially high school sports.

I get that "participation trophy" has become complaint du jour over the last decade, but I think it is misguided, incorrect, and rather insulting. This isn't Ricky Bobby.
 
Not excessive at all. That many more kids were able to compete and have a legitimate chance of getting a reward that is worth something. The purpose is to provide a forum for the kids to compete. It is not to make recruiting easier or develop college wrestlers.

This. Plus, it's still incredibly hard, I'm not sure making it even harder benefits anybody but a select few, the select few we really shouldn't be that concerned about.
 
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If you want to grow the sport, the one class tournament is not the way. The more participants means a deeper pool, more friends and family made into fans.

To succeed at the national level freestyle/greco club wrestling is what produces those athletes. Iowa has a smaller population, smaller group of families that have the income that can do club wrestling at the national level. A single class tourney will not change that.

My Class 1A school has been letting the entire school out with excused absences for our wrestlers since the 70's when there is a state qualifier. I don't think the current tourney is a participation award, it still a legit tournament for kids from a similar resource pool. Not too many former D1 wrestlers coaching in 1A vs 2A or 3A.

If more kids wining state medals helps grow the sport, keep the current format. Do I wish Iowa produced more D1 talent, yes. It would be nice to have scholarship programs for kids who want to do post season wrestling and camps to help develop them.

I hear a lot of people saying Iowa needs more clubs, which makes sense. I believe clubs make a huge difference. My suggestion would be for some of you to go out and start one. You don't even have to know much about wrestling -- you just need access to somebody who does. There's a guy in NJ who was a below-average HS wrestler, but he loves wrestling. He started a club called Iron Horse. They don't even have a facility; they find a high school that is willing to let them use their wrestling room 3 or 4 nights a week from April through October. He has volunteer coaches from area high schools, and brings in some D3 coaches (who see it as a recruiting tool) and lets kids roll around for a couple of hours. After a few years it started attracting better and better wrestlers, until now he has a room full of state placers every night.

A couple of years ago you could see David McFadden, Johny Sebastian, Ethan Ramos, even Nick Suriano in the room on the same night. After a while they started entering team tournaments, and usually winning them. The next level down kids could also come in and mix it up with the best, which helped them get better. It's not Young Guns but it's a contributor to NJ wrestling.

Off the subject, but I just wanted to throw out that any individual person who wants to make a difference in the sport can do it themselves -- it just takes time and effort.
 
There you go again, denigrating wrestlers because of Iowa's 3 classes. Do you really think it is that watered down?

Also, we disagree about the thesis of sports, as does history. Especially high school sports.

I get that "participation trophy" has become complaint du jour over the last decade, but I think it is misguided, incorrect, and rather insulting. This isn't Ricky Bobby.

Yes, I think it's very watered down. It's not as bad as Virginia, where they have six groups and placing at states at some weight classes doesn't mean much more than showing-up, but it certainly is watered down.
 
Am not seeing the logic of how changing a state tournament format will lead to turning out better top end wrestlers. I do agree with the argument that a one class system would be extremely interesting and exciting and allow all of us old farts a chance to predict and understand who the best wrestlers are....calling Mr. Obvious.

I argue that our favorite sport is in trouble. The fact that NJ and CA run a 1 class state tournament hasn't helped our cause. Rather, we need to be looking for ways to get more young wrestlers involved and at all levels in each of our states.

Top end wrestlers are a mix of a lot of things....but generally they will always be top end wrestlers because they have the mindset, they do extra strength training, they do freco, they travel for competition, and their families are all-in. Changing our state tournament format won't give us 10 more D-I quality wrestlers in Iowa.

I enjoyed the comment from the poster mentioning wrestling quality in our state would improve if we could get Iowa State to suck less....I think you can also throw Northern Iowa into the sucking less category as well. Both those programs need to pick up the pace. Bobby Douglas and Don Briggs don't look like such bad coaches all of a sudden.
 
Few thoughts on this topic.

1) What exactly is the point of high school and high school sports? Is it to only make great college athletes? If so then drop the school part all together and go only to club teams. Heck drop little kids clubs too make it only about being the greatest wrestler of all time and force kids to practice non-stop. I hate participation trophies as much as the next guy but high school sports isn't just about finding out who the biggest baddest wrestler or football player, or basketball player, baseball player is.

2) Seeding the state tourney. It works in theory but how well did seeding it work at the NCAAs? Heck how well did seeding the basketball brackets work in the Iowa state tournament this year? So well that not a single #1 seed made the finals in fact only in 2A did either of the top 2 seeds make the finals. So not real sure that seeding it will help sure it might put the 2 guys who you think should be top seeds on opposite sides of the bracket but if they don't both get there does it really matter?

3) We are constantly saying we need to grow wrestling if we want it to be better and continue to reach more people. Will dropping it to 1 class really help us reach more? No in fact I would say it would reach less due to fewer people qualifying so less people attending. It's great that NJ, CA, Ohio have only one class it works for them but that's not how the Iowa is set up so really who cares?

4) How will dropping Iowa to one class make the wrestling better? It's still the same kids competing. It's not like because we only have one class suddenly Mark Hall or Spencer Lee will just appear. The kids who are coming through the high school ranks in Iowa just aren't as good as the other states sometimes, just like there are times when are states aren't as good as Iowa. Dropping it to one class isn't going to suddenly change that.
 
It doesn't hurt small schools in NJ, some of the best wrestlers come from small schools. Is the feeling that unless you reward 24 kids at each weight kids from small schools won't to wrestle?

What hurt small schools is the new weight classes. Tough for a small school to field four wrestler over 180 pounds.
I've always hated the 220 lb class. I felt it diminishes the competition in both 195 and hwt. I honestly think it was put there for football purposes instead of wrestling.
 
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Am not seeing the logic of how changing a state tournament format will lead to turning out better top end wrestlers. I do agree with the argument that a one class system would be extremely interesting and exciting and allow all of us old farts a chance to predict and understand who the best wrestlers are....calling Mr. Obvious.

I argue that our favorite sport is in trouble. The fact that NJ and CA run a 1 class state tournament hasn't helped our cause. Rather, we need to be looking for ways to get more young wrestlers involved and at all levels in each of our states.

Top end wrestlers are a mix of a lot of things....but generally they will always be top end wrestlers because they have the mindset, they do extra strength training, they do freco, they travel for competition, and their families are all-in. Changing our state tournament format won't give us 10 more D-I quality wrestlers in Iowa.

I enjoyed the comment from the poster mentioning wrestling quality in our state would improve if we could get Iowa State to suck less....I think you can also throw Northern Iowa into the sucking less category as well. Both those programs need to pick up the pace. Bobby Douglas and Don Briggs don't look like such bad coaches all of a sudden.

My logic, based on what I saw from kids who I coached in NJ, is that the more difficult the goal is -- the more work it requires -- the more work the kids who want to reach that goal are willing to put in. Every good wrestler I worked with worked harder than they otherwise would have because it was so hard to succeed.

Of course, with more kids motivated to work harder, the more demand there is for wrestling clubs. Demand will bring supply, so there would be more clubs. More clubs makes it easier for any kid to go to a club, which means more kids putting in more work and more kids getting better. It's not something that would change things overnight -- and it would have to work in tandem with a lot of other things -- but I do believe it would put an upward pressure on the level of wrestling in the state.
 
I've always hated the 220 lb class. I felt it diminishes the competition in both 195 and hwt. I honestly think it was put there for football purposes instead of wrestling.

It was; there was no other possible rationale. The new weight classes are an abomination. Most HS meets end with a stretch of four of five middle-school level matches.
 
It was; there was no other possible rationale. The new weight classes are an abomination. Most HS meets end with a stretch of four of five middle-school level matches.
There were 2 classes, 12 weight classes when I wrestled and I often wish that it was that way now.
 
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My logic, based on what I saw from kids who I coached in NJ, is that the more difficult the goal is -- the more work it requires -- the more work the kids who want to reach that goal are willing to put in. Every good wrestler I worked with worked harder than they otherwise would have because it was so hard to succeed.

Of course, with more kids motivated to work harder, the more demand there is for wrestling clubs. Demand will bring supply, so there would be more clubs. More clubs makes it easier for any kid to go to a club, which means more kids putting in more work and more kids getting better. It's not something that would change things overnight -- and it would have to work in tandem with a lot of other things -- but I do believe it would put an upward pressure on the level of wrestling in the state.

art: Don't know if you've been to the Iowa HS Wrestling Tournament lately, but I think you would get a huge kick out of 75 kids in a school bus dressed in state t-shirts unloading to cheer on just one average wrestler (by your standards) that likely is gonna go 1-2 with an early exit. All of us Iowans know before he even showed up that his real future is becoming a CPA, an engineer, or an agribusinessman, and he has zero future in being a D-I wrestler.

Qualifying for the Iowa HS State Tournament is far from a participation trophy, but I would agree the field is not and cannot be as strong as what you describe in NJ. I understand your points, but the greater good here in Iowa terms is turning out a lot of good kids (with interscholastic athletics as part of their life skills artillery) that will be future productive, law abiding citizens. We will plug our best into the D-I wrestling programs...just as we've always done....and most of those will be highly involved with club wrestling...just as you've alluded.
 
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My logic, based on what I saw from kids who I coached in NJ, is that the more difficult the goal is -- the more work it requires -- the more work the kids who want to reach that goal are willing to put in. Every good wrestler I worked with worked harder than they otherwise would have because it was so hard to succeed.

Of course, with more kids motivated to work harder, the more demand there is for wrestling clubs. Demand will bring supply, so there would be more clubs. More clubs makes it easier for any kid to go to a club, which means more kids putting in more work and more kids getting better. It's not something that would change things overnight -- and it would have to work in tandem with a lot of other things -- but I do believe it would put an upward pressure on the level of wrestling in the state.

This seems to presume that 1A kids aren't working as hard as they can toward their 1A championship goal ... because it isn't one single class.

I don't think that is accurate at all, because a 1A championship IS extremely important in Iowa, I don't see that changing if all of a sudden it was even more important. Happel isn't denigrated for what he did at that level, he is celebrated.
 
I am not in favor of going to a 1 class system in Iowa. I think many small schools would drop the sport thus diminishing participation. Diminishing participation also reduces mathematically the total number of Good wrestlers. There are always late bloomers in the lowest classifications and sometimes they are a gem. Wrestling programs are there for educational and life lessons as well as delivering D1 wrestlers. I do very much like the idea of taking the three class winners each weight plus a wild card for a special tournament after State. It doesn't have to be State sanctioned, it very well could be an IAWrestle event. Someone else suggested this very thing. It would be very entertaining.
 
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The next time I meet a wrestler whose primary goal is win the most dual meets, it will be the first.

Actually (and I realize philosophy varies from state to state) most of the wrestlers in NJ who are just above average or lower are VERY interested in dual meets. That's where they have a chance to contribute to the team, it's where they get to wrestle in front of the entire gym (instead of wrestling on mat #7 while most of the people in the stands are paying attention to pretty much anything else) and it's where their match feels important. We have a lot of school rivalries, and I've never felt any tournament was nearly as much fun as a dual meet, in a darkened gym under a spotlight, with two or three hundred (or more) spectators cheering your every move.

If kids don't care about duals it's because they've been told the team doesn't matter, only the individuals matter. I see that a lot, and I think it's a huge detriment to the sport.
 
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Here in Mn we have the same problem to many small schools. The added weights really hurt small schools here also hard to find a 220 most of them wrestle it during regular season at 190 and then drop down for state tourament.
When my boys wrestled had only 2 clases A and AA. To qualify had to win at least 5 districts matches and then 5 regional matches to make state. Now with the 3 classes sometimes only have to win 1 or 2 matches to make sub sections then maybe 3-4 to win sectional.
When wrestling first started in Mn Blue Earth was one of first schools to have it. One class we had to fwrestle Albert Lea,Mankato Worthton and other larger schools also lots of Iowa schools. They also went every year
to Boys Town in Neb for a big tourney. For many years we had the most state champions but of course Apple Valley has now passed us. It really is all about money for SHS leauge. My self would like to go back to at least 2 classes..It just seems to watered down now. Just my 2 cents.
 
When looking at the All-Americans by state, I see that Cali and NJ had 5 and 4 respectively. Iowa had 5. Of our six AA, 2 are from 1A, 3 are from 3A, and Gilman wrestled in Neb. Our population doesn't compare with those, so our state produced way more AA per capita. Maybe they should have more classes.
12 = PA
10 = OH
6 = IL, MI
5 = IA, NJ
4 = CA, MD
3 = MO, CO, NY
2 = NE, MN, OK
1 = HI, WY, WI, TX, SC, Canada, GA, FL, NM, MT, WV, WA, VA
 
When looking at the All-Americans by state, I see that Cali and NJ had 5 and 4 respectively. Iowa had 5. Of our six AA, 2 are from 1A, 3 are from 3A, and Gilman wrestled in Neb. Our population doesn't compare with those, so our state produced way more AA per capita. Maybe they should have more classes.
12 = PA
10 = OH
6 = IL, MI
5 = IA, NJ
4 = CA, MD
3 = MO, CO, NY
2 = NE, MN, OK
1 = HI, WY, WI, TX, SC, Canada, GA, FL, NM, MT, WV, WA, VA

If Iowa State and, to extent, UNI were pulling their weight we'd be up there with PA and OH. There is no excuse for guys like Meeks not to be an AA.
 
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When looking at the All-Americans by state, I see that Cali and NJ had 5 and 4 respectively. Iowa had 5. Of our six AA, 2 are from 1A, 3 are from 3A, and Gilman wrestled in Neb. Our population doesn't compare with those, so our state produced way more AA per capita. Maybe they should have more classes.
12 = PA
10 = OH
6 = IL, MI
5 = IA, NJ
4 = CA, MD
3 = MO, CO, NY
2 = NE, MN, OK
1 = HI, WY, WI, TX, SC, Canada, GA, FL, NM, MT, WV, WA, VA

Gilman wrestled in Nebby,but I thought he lived in Iowa and crossed the river to go to school and wrestle. So since he lived in Iowa shouldn't he be counted as Iowa AA, not Nebby? o_O
 
I have trouble understanding the sentiment. You're saying a group of kids who just started wrestling and who don't wrestle year round ought to have a good chance to qualify for the state tournament? That seems to reek of the participation trophy attitude. How about their goal being to become a pretty good wrestler and a stronger and more disciplined person?

And are you saying the primary motivation is the individual tournament? Can they not be motivated to band together as a team, encourage each other and make each other better, and each season win more dual meets than the previous? I would think a group of novice wrestlers ought to be more motivated by the idea of becoming a competitive team than thinking they can become elite wrestlers individually.

This all seems like an attitude that is just the opposite of what I typically see in wrestling.

They are very competitive kids and work very hard to improve individually and as a team. They are starting to take things a lot more seriously now and wanting to do more summer work because of the success they have now seen.

The fact is we were like the 5th smallest school in the state to have wrestling. In year 2 we beat 2 teams that qualified for regional duals. This year we had a conference champ and 3 finalists with 2 district qualifiers. That might not seem like much to but it has helped build excitement within the community.

I live 70 miles from the school and there is nobody in the community to full run a youth program because nobody has ever wrestled there before. If I never coach a state champion or even a Qualifier I can live with that because I know the value/lessons that wrestling has brought to these kids will benefit them in the future endeavors.
 
Yes, I think it's very watered down. It's not as bad as Virginia, where they have six groups and placing at states at some weight classes doesn't mean much more than showing-up, but it certainly is watered down.
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VA has 6 classes for its 8.6m population. That's ~ 1 state champ at each weight for 1.4m people.

But consider Wyoming with 3 classes. Its population is 580,000. That works out to a state champ at each weight for 197,000 people.

That is at the extreme opposite end of CA with its 40m population crowning one state champ per weight. I believe there are some leagues in CA that have more people than 197,000.

There are state champs and then there are state champs.
 
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VA has 6 classes for its 8.6m population. That's ~ 1 state champ at each weight for 1.4m people.

But consider Wyoming with 3 classes. Its population is 580,000. That works out to a state champ at each weight for 197,000 people.

That is at the extreme opposite end of CA with its 40m population crowning one state champ per weight. I believe there are some leagues in CA that have more people than 197,000.

There are state champs and then there are state champs.

Yowza! I tend to look at the # of wrestlers, and Wyoming only has about 1,000 wrestlers. With 42 state champions (14 x 3) that's about 1 out of every 23 wrestlers. And if they place to 8th, that one in 3 wrestlers places. Holy crap!

There are state champs and then there are state champs.

I should say so.
 
I've always hated the 220 lb class. I felt it diminishes the competition in both 195 and hwt. I honestly think it was put there for football purposes instead of wrestling.
It was put there because it allows kids with football aspirations in college to keep their weight, AND primarily because 195 to 285 is one hell of a gap for a "normal" kid who wants to wrestle, but doesn't want to give up 70 lbs or more to his opponent. It's a very good idea IMO.
 
My logic, based on what I saw from kids who I coached in NJ, is that the more difficult the goal is -- the more work it requires -- the more work the kids who want to reach that goal are willing to put in. Every good wrestler I worked with worked harder than they otherwise would have because it was so hard to succeed.

Of course, with more kids motivated to work harder, the more demand there is for wrestling clubs. Demand will bring supply, so there would be more clubs. More clubs makes it easier for any kid to go to a club, which means more kids putting in more work and more kids getting better. It's not something that would change things overnight -- and it would have to work in tandem with a lot of other things -- but I do believe it would put an upward pressure on the level of wrestling in the state.
Yes, it may, but at what cost? If it ultimately costs you participants in the sport at multiple High Schools across the State, then it's a HORRIBLE idea, and in a rural State like Iowa, I have a feeling that is what would happen. New Jersey and California are densely populated, which is why I will never live in either place, but the list of eligible participants isn't as greatly effected when one kid doesn't want to participate, but is quickly replaced by another dozen who do. That won't work in Outpost, Iowa, where you're fortunate if you have 14 wrestlers, and they are spread out to occupy all the weights.

The discussion of Iowa having 1 "true" Champion and the debates in specific years where Iowa has 2 or 3 reps at one weight headed to wrestle in college in all 3 classes to wrestle it out has been going on far longer than the Gable-Zalesky-Brands run at the Hawkeye Helm.
From a fan perspective of course the current format of 3 Champs facing each other after the traditional meet is the Grand Poobah. It's also a pipe dream.

Iowa's talent pool or number of State Champions in High School isn't the sole reason the Hawkeyes aren't winning NCAA Championships (not even close IMO), and any changes made to Iowa's High School format isn't going to change that. It's the same format that GREATLY helped produce 23 NCAA Team Championships. The cream will always rise to the top, the State of Iowa isn't currently producing quite enough cream compared to some previous cycles, its that simple for me (but still creating some fine DI wrestlers relative to the population).

Aside from the fact that Derek St. John didn't win State his last year, but won an NCAA Title (did the guy that beat him do that? No). Cory Clark lost his only High School match his Senior year prior to the State Tournament and won it 4 times. Does anybody on the planet think Larry Owing is better than Dan Gable?

Point being, one match on one day doesn't "truly" determine the best wrestler, it proves who was better that day at that particular time (and if you "prove it" multiple times, then I'm a believer).

Wrestling clubs don't dot the landscape in every sector of Iowa (or maybe they do and I'm not aware), but there are several througout the State in the more highly populated areas, and none of them appear to be creating the next Mark Ironside (but there might be a dozen or so of them that are currently 10 years old and we'll find out down the road).

To Summarize - Iowa High School changing the game plan isn't going to change the fortunes of the Iowa Hawkeyes, IMO. The collective efforts of the Iowa Athletic Administration in conjunction with it's Coaching Staff and Wrestlers are the only ones who can do that.
 
Iowa has many 1A schools of just a couple hundred students, but consolidation over the years has gotten rid of the really small ones.

I have no idea the veracity of this link, but it shows the smallest NJ high school with a senior class of 55, so I presume high school of ~220, similar to a lot of Iowa's 1A class. http://www.nj.com/hunterdon-county-democrat/index.ssf/2012/06/south_hunterdon_njs_smallest_p.html
South Hunterdon also doesn't have a wrestling program. The smallest public school in NJ with a wrestling program is Bogota, at 239 students. (I believe they used to co-op with Weehawken, but it looks like they pulled the plug on that fairly recently)
 
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South Hunterdon also doesn't have a wrestling program. The smallest public school in NJ with a wrestling program is Bogota, at 239 students. (I believe they used to co-op with Weehawken, but it looks like they pulled the plug on that fairly recently)

My town, Cedar Grove only has 400 kids, approx 200 boys , a small Group 1, yet won the N2 Group 1 sectional. Lost to Bound Brook (2 state champs) in the groups, but BB is an Open Enrollment Group1 public w their best wrestlers coming from out of town.

Same tiny town, Cedar Grove, sent Bob Diaco to Iowa a few years ago (All Big 10 Football LB, now coaching UConn), also has had several D1 Football players in past several years.

Some small schools produce good talent, but most don't.
 
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