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Iowa vs Illinois thoughts/predictions

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Jay on HR

HB All-State
Apr 3, 2015
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Looking forward to this dual since it's probably one of the best teams Iowa will face this season. Thanks Big Ten. IA Wrestle preview had Clark listed so I am going with that being a positive sign that he is okay. Here is that preview: http://iawrestle.com/2016/01/06/iowa-resumes-dual-action-on-the-road-against-illinois/

Based off of that I am going
Gilman TF - he is killing it this year
Clark DEC
Ervin DEC
Sorensen DEC
IMAR MAJ
Rodrigues DEC
Brunson DEC - really down on Meyer at the moment
Brooks DEC
Burak DEC
Stoll DEC

I have Iowa winning 20-13 so I REALLY hope Clark is back for this dual.We all know IMAR can rack up a TF and a loss by just DEC at 133 would probably give Illinois the win.
 
With the exception of tOSU a couple years ago, Iowa simply seems more motivated and prepared to win each and every dual meet. Other than PSU(which seems to be following the blueprint that has made Iowa wrestling profitable) DI teams just don't seem nearly as interested/motivated to put out their maximum lineup and go at it 110%.

With the above said, I don't expect Illinois to put Iowa in danger. Now if this dual had real end of the year value(which I really wish duals did) things would change. I would still favor Iowa, but it would be interesting to see other teams value dual meet wins as much as Iowa does.
 
MSU158 said:
With the exception of tOSU a couple years ago, Iowa simply seems more motivated and prepared to win each and every dual meet. Other than PSU(which seems to be following the blueprint that has made Iowa wrestling profitable) DI teams just don't seem nearly as interested/motivated to put out their maximum lineup and go at it 110%.

With the above said, I don't expect Illinois to put Iowa in danger. Now if this dual had real end of the year value(which I really wish duals did) things would change. I would still favor Iowa, but it would be interesting to see other teams value dual meet wins as much as Iowa does.
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What are you talking about? I guarantee Illinois has this meet circled on their calendar. In fact, Iowa is the one meet of the season that teams give their best shot. Illinois will be out for blood on Friday. They might beat us if we try to train through it, like we do for many meets.
 
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Jay on HR said:
Looking forward to this dual since it's probably one of the best teams Iowa will face this season. Thanks Big Ten. IA Wrestle preview had Clark listed so I am going with that being a positive sign that he is okay. Here is that preview: http://iawrestle.com/2016/01/06/iowa-resumes-dual-action-on-the-road-against-illinois/

Based off of that I am going
Gilman TF - he is killing it this year
Clark DEC
Ervin DEC
Sorensen DEC
IMAR MAJ
Rodrigues DEC
Brunson DEC - really down on Meyer at the moment
Brooks DEC
Burak DEC
Stoll DEC

I have Iowa winning 20-13 so I REALLY hope Clark is back for this dual.We all know IMAR can rack up a TF and a loss by just DEC at 133 would probably give Illinois the win.
Click to expand...
If Carton goes, I have him over Ervin.
 
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gablefan73 said:
What are you talking about? I guarantee Illinois has this meet circled on their calendar. In fact, Iowa is the one meet of the season that teams give their best shot. Illinois will be out for blood on Friday. They might beat us if we try to train through it, like we do for many meets.
Click to expand...

I don't know. I'm guessing Ohio St and Penn St get a pretty good look as well. But yes, Iowa better be ready to go.
 
125: Gilman Tech Edelen 5-0
133: Clark Dec. Richards 8-0
141: Carton Dec Ervin 11-0
149: Sorenson Maj Langenderfer 15-0
157: Martinez Pin Cooper 15-6
165: Rodriguez Dec Rhoads 15-9
174: Brunson Dec Meyer 15-12
184: Brooks Dec Koepke 18-12
197: Burak Maj Lee 22-12
Hwt: Stoll Dec Black 25-12

This dual will come down to 133, 141 and 174
 
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We are not going to lose this dual. IMAR will tech or pin. This rest will be fine.
 
gablefan73,

They may be MORE motivated for this dual than others, BUT I still stand by my comment that very few teams come as MOTIVATED and VALUE dual meet wins as much as Iowa does. When the time comes, see if they put out their absolute best lineup and more importantly how hard they wrestle in the 3rd period.

The reason I point to the above is the dual meet loss to tOSU in 2012 was the only time I can remember a team looking more ready to go and blood hungry top to bottom(at least in the Brands era). Again, I am not saying teams don't really want to beat Iowa. I am simply pointing out that duals simply don't have the value in DI wrestling for many teams to eat, sleep, breathe and bleed for that dual meet. This is different in Iowa because they have the fanbase and actual monetary value to be motivated to win every dual meet..........
 
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Illinois is always fired up vs Iowa, especially with Perry in the mix. Things were a bit chippy last year. We better be 100% ready to roll in this one. Honestly Illinois is capable of winning at 133, 141, 157, 165, 174, 184, and 285.
 
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goiahawkeyes said:
I don't know. I'm guessing Ohio St and Penn St get a pretty good look as well. But yes, Iowa better be ready to go.
Click to expand...

Yes only recently though.

MVPFAN said:
Illinois is always fired up vs Iowa, especially with Perry in the mix. Things were a bit chippy last year. We better be 100% ready to roll in this one. Honestly Illinois is capable of winning at 133, 141, 157, 165, 174, 184, and 285.
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Exactly. MSU doesn't warrant a response since he doesn't realize just how bad Illinois wants this meet. There is some bad blood between the programs.
 
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gablefan73,

You may very well be right, we will see. Still, I think you give too much value to the "We really want to beat Iowa" philosophy in regards to dual meets. In the Gable era and MAYBE the beginning of the Brands era, winning the dual meet may have actually benefited another team. It may have actually been something you could point to when recruiting. Watching tOSU the past couple seasons has only reinforced my point. More and more teams are gearing themselves SOLELY for the postseason.

Again, Illinois may really want this dual win. I am well aware of the chippy nature of last season's dual. I remember being surprised by Richards winning after his losing to Clark at Midlands. I remember being even more surprised after match watching Perry and Brands heated exchange(is it bad of me I sorta wanted to see a throwdown?) But I remember MOST, that most of the Illinois wrestlers didn't look that good in the 3rd period. That is my main point. They want to win, but aren't specifically training for this dual. Iowa, for the most part, trains to be ready for EVERY dual.
 
MSU158 said:
gablefan73,

You may very well be right, we will see. Still, I think you give too much value to the "We really want to beat Iowa" philosophy in regards to dual meets. In the Gable era and MAYBE the beginning of the Brands era, winning the dual meet may have actually benefited another team. It may have actually been something you could point to when recruiting. Watching tOSU the past couple seasons has only reinforced my point. More and more teams are gearing themselves SOLELY for the postseason.

Again, Illinois may really want this dual win. I am well aware of the chippy nature of last season's dual. I remember being surprised by Richards winning after his losing to Clark at Midlands. I remember being even more surprised after match watching Perry and Brands heated exchange(is it bad of me I sorta wanted to see a throwdown?) But I remember MOST, that most of the Illinois wrestlers didn't look that good in the 3rd period. That is my main point. They want to win, but aren't specifically training for this dual. Iowa, for the most part, trains to be ready for EVERY dual.
Click to expand...
Iowa trains to be ready for the next competition date on the schedule, not just duals. Personally I am not a fan of the excuse most programs use "Oh, only March matters." While that is true, currently only March does matter. Why would you not want to put the best team out on the mat every time you can and provide the best product for your fans? This is probably the reason Iowa has the best fan base in the country, they support the product, because the product is consistently great.
 
125 - Gilman by tech - 5-0 Iowa - not even a contended match
133 - Zain by dec. 5-3 Iowa - Richards looks tough and is really good on his feet. Clark is great on the mat, but I don't put him ahead of Schopp last year who was also unable to ride a healthy Richards. I think this will be one of the top 2 matches of the event - it can certainly go either way
141 - Carton by dec. 8-3 Iowa - A swing match potential, not overly impressed by either guy
149 - Sorenson by major 12-3 Iowa - hopefully Brandon gets after it and gets bonus
157 - iMar by tech 12-8 Iowa - Another match which will be awfully one-sided
165 - Rodriguez by dec 12-11 Iowa - not much exciting to say at 165
174 - Brunson by dec. 14-12 Illinois - The 2nd best match of the evening, IMO - hope it delivers. Meyer will need to be ready to wrestle in the first if he wants to beat Brunson
184 - Brooks by dec. 15-14 Iowa - controlled win, maybe Brooks can get back to form on top and put up some bonus with some tilts
197 - Burak by dec. 18-14 Iowa - controlled win for Burak. See above.
285 - Stoll by dec. 21-14 Iowa. Black has to be a disappointment to the Illinois coaching staff considering he was the number 1 guy coming out of HS at his weight. I know he's been plagued by some injuries, but even when he's wrestled he hasn't seem to improved his game significantly from his HS days.

Overall it should be a fun dual with good match up potential for both teams. I don't see Iowa losing this, but it will at least be semi-competitive.
 
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I agree with Gablefan on this one. Heck yes Illini circle this Iowa meet on their calander.

1. Mark Perry went to iowa.
2. Its a boarder war which i never understood how big it was until i went to iowa and realized how many illinios kids go to Iowa. There is an underlying rivalry going on that isnt advertised like say ISU vs Iowa is. But trust me MSU its there for the students and the student athletes. which leads me to..

3. Its huge for recruiting Illinios kids. We make a good living in Iowa City poaching Illinios kids in all sports. From Joe Williams to Ramos to Bryan Bulaga to Chuck Long. Illinios is a major pipeline that Perry absolutly knows he needs to shut down the boarder. Perry needs to be able to walk into a Isiah Whites living room and say we beat them, we are on the rise and our future is better. I dont tOSU and PSU poaching to many Illinios kids given their own states homegrown talent, but Cortez is one. But that the exception, not the norm. Likewise beating them is big for us for all the same reasons. We need the Sammy Brooks to keep coming. Really I think IL is the 3rd best recruiting state. NJ and CA are right there in that convo too. Id say OK and MN and IA are in the next tier below.

So in summery, heck yes this is a big rivalry in all sports. Why would a MSU fan even know this? or worse argue with us about our backyard?
 
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I agree with everything said above with the exception of PSU poaching Cortez. Cortez has always been a nomad. He was part of multiple youth clubs in different states (last youth year in Ohio), two different high profile high schools in IL, and now his second college. I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't finish his career at PSU and I don't really consider him an Illinois based recruit as he hasn't been anywhere long enough to establish any firm roots.
 
I am not arguing ANYTHING regarding Iowa. In fact, I am not really arguing at all. I simply gave my viewpoint on how OTHER teams perceive duals compared to Iowa. Also, I was basically giving Iowa a compliment.

Also, I take umbrage with the MSU fan comment. I am considerably more than a simple minded "MSU fan". I wrestled and I follow the sport very closely and have stayed close with quite a few former DI wrestlers. I have a decent feel for most of the B1G teams. I am by no means tied to any one program, but I would say I have a decent perception of what goes on. I obviously wouldn't argue the "inner workings" at Iowa with many that post on here. But, I still hold to my original point that no other team comes into a dual as prepared as Iowa and as a result I almost always expect Iowa to pull it off, unless they are overwhelming underdogs, which doesn't happen very often..................
 
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OL119 said:
I agree with everything said above with the exception of PSU poaching Cortez. Cortez has always been a nomad. He was part of multiple youth clubs in different states (last youth year in Ohio), two different high profile high schools in IL, and now his second college. I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't finish his career at PSU and I don't really consider him an Illinois based recruit as he hasn't been anywhere long enough to establish any firm roots.
Click to expand...
Agree!
 
MSU158 said:
gablefan73,

You may very well be right, we will see. Still, I think you give too much value to the "We really want to beat Iowa" philosophy in regards to dual meets. In the Gable era and MAYBE the beginning of the Brands era, winning the dual meet may have actually benefited another team. It may have actually been something you could point to when recruiting. Watching tOSU the past couple seasons has only reinforced my point. More and more teams are gearing themselves SOLELY for the postseason.

Again, Illinois may really want this dual win. I am well aware of the chippy nature of last season's dual. I remember being surprised by Richards winning after his losing to Clark at Midlands. I remember being even more surprised after match watching Perry and Brands heated exchange(is it bad of me I sorta wanted to see a throwdown?) But I remember MOST, that most of the Illinois wrestlers didn't look that good in the 3rd period. That is my main point. They want to win, but aren't specifically training for this dual. Iowa, for the most part, trains to be ready for EVERY dual.
Click to expand...
You should just sit this one out. Iowa trains for the post season and right through several duals. You can make an argument for how well they have peaked recently but you are just wrong in pretty much everything you have said in this thread.
 
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Kind of stunned by all the comments about Illinois being fired up because Mark Perry went to Iowa.

That is true, but apparently the average age of posters is to young to remember the Illini head coach.

He is or was one of the greatest (argueably top 10 best) ever at a certain school!
 
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ginormous.headed.circus.midget said:
Kind of stunned by all the comments about Illinois being fired up because Mark Perry went to Iowa.

That is true, but apparently the average age of posters is to young to remember the Illini head coach.

He is or was one of the greatest (argueably top 10 best) ever at a certain school!
Click to expand...
While Jim was certainly a great wrestler for the Hawkeyes, I don't think he would crack into my top 10. In all honesty, I'm not sure he would be any higher on the list than Perry.
 
MSU158 said:
With the exception of tOSU a couple years ago, Iowa simply seems more motivated and prepared to win each and every dual meet. Other than PSU(which seems to be following the blueprint that has made Iowa wrestling profitable) DI teams just don't seem nearly as interested/motivated to put out their maximum lineup and go at it 110%.
Click to expand...

Mizzou's dual winning streak is at 33 (only top teams missing in the streak are PSU and Minny) so they must be interested.
 
XiXITiger,

I like that you brought up Missouri. They are one of the main reasons I believe a National Dual Championship would be a better way to decide a "Team Champion". Having a strong guy at EVERY weight is more impressive to me than having the best guy at 4 or 5 weights and maybe a couple more AA's. Over the past couple seasons their roster has been set up with a ton of fringe AA talent and a couple studs(Cox, Houdashelt and Waters). Not wrestling in the B1G definitely helped keep their dual winning streak alive, but as long as they put all their starters in, they matched up exceptionally well with anyone.
 
XiXiTiger said:
Mizzou's dual winning streak is at 33 (only top teams missing in the streak are PSU and Minny) so they must be interested.
Click to expand...
Your band of punks acted like they won the olympics last year. Embarrassing display by those idiots.
 
Jcchawk said:
People saying this are too young to remember how good and dominant Jim Heffernan was. Perry wasn't close to dominating the way Heffernan did and the comparison isn't close in my opinion.
Click to expand...

Jim Heffernan NCAA champion in 1986... ninth wrestler in Big Ten history to win four conference titles... career record was 131-18-2... national runner-up as sophomore and senior… ranks seventh in career wins (131) in school history.
NCAA Year W‑L‑D
4th-----1983 23-7-1
2nd----1985 40-5-0
1st-----1986 32-3-1
2nd----1987 36-3-0

Mark Perry NCAA champion in 2007 and 2008... four time Big Ten conference finalist, winning two titles...career record was 96-16... national runner up as a sophomore.....scored 25 team points at 2008 NCAA Championships, which lead the tournament field.
NCAA Year W-L-D
3rd-----2005 27-5-0
2nd----2006 21-4-0
1st-----2007 28-4-0
1st-----2008 20-3-0

I think you are definitely selling Perry short. The fact he scored the most team points in 2008 shows considerable dominance. Also, both guys took several losses each season so I see it hard to point to dominance putting either guy on top of the other over the course of their entire career. They were both great and worthy of consideration as Top 10 Hawkeyes!
 
MSU158 said:
Jim Heffernan NCAA champion in 1986... ninth wrestler in Big Ten history to win four conference titles... career record was 131-18-2... national runner-up as sophomore and senior… ranks seventh in career wins (131) in school history.
NCAA Year W‑L‑D
4th-----1983 23-7-1
2nd----1985 40-5-0
1st-----1986 32-3-1
2nd----1987 36-3-0

Mark Perry NCAA champion in 2007 and 2008... four time Big Ten conference finalist, winning two titles...career record was 96-16... national runner up as a sophomore.....scored 25 team points at 2008 NCAA Championships, which lead the tournament field.
NCAA Year W-L-D
3rd-----2005 27-5-0
2nd----2006 21-4-0
1st-----2007 28-4-0
1st-----2008 20-3-0

I think you are definitely selling Perry short. The fact he scored the most team points in 2008 shows considerable dominance. Also, both guys took several losses each season so I see it hard to point to dominance putting either guy on top of the other over the course of their entire career. They were both great and worthy of consideration as Top 10 Hawkeyes!
Click to expand...

This might be one of the first intelligent things you've posted. I doubt if anybody would trade Perry's college resume for Heffernan's. The 2 NCAA titles trump everything.
 
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Gutt15 said:
This might be one of the first intelligent things you've posted. I doubt if anybody would trade Perry's college resume for Heffernan's. The 2 NCAA titles trump everything.
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Jcchawk is right, I am too young to have much of an opinion on Heffernan. All I can do is look back at results. The 2 of them are definitely in the same discussion with very similar careers. I'll take Perry, though. The guy was the definition of 'gamer' and always showed up when the lights were on.
 
bnicolls said:
Ervin forfeits. Just the sight of Brody warming up causes him to s__t his pants. No extra singlets are available and IL has to forfeit.
Click to expand...

They are going to have Brody working out live from Dubuque on a big screen at the Illinois match for psychological warfare purposes: Ervin still forfeits cause he's almost in the state of Illinois
 
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MSU158 said:
XiXITiger,

I like that you brought up Missouri. They are one of the main reasons I believe a National Dual Championship would be a better way to decide a "Team Champion". Having a strong guy at EVERY weight is more impressive to me than having the best guy at 4 or 5 weights and maybe a couple more AA's. Over the past couple seasons their roster has been set up with a ton of fringe AA talent and a couple studs(Cox, Houdashelt and Waters). Not wrestling in the B1G definitely helped keep their dual winning streak alive, but as long as they put all their starters in, they matched up exceptionally well with anyone.
Click to expand...

I like the dual championship. Have to admit though that I was really hoping Mizzou could win the Tourney last year.

Mizzou wrestled three of the best teams in the B10 last year but didn't have the grind of a full B10 schedule. They did take out Cornell, Lehigh, OU and OkSt in non-con though.
 
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