Very happy about this one. Zain's been the guy at 3 big tournaments and laid an egg each time. Medal chances just went way up imo.
Just lost our best chance at Gold
- Thread starter mizzoufan90
- Start date
Did you have to wait 4 years until you could bid on another project? I agree with your point but the olympic qualifer is a unique and rare tournament and difficult to compare to everyday life. I guess i would hope common sense would prevail when he makes weight one minute after the weigh ins closed. Strange he was allowed to weigh in if they were closed. I agree with someone who said let him wrestle and arbitrate after. If he wins and you can just qualify 2nd place if that is the final decision. Just an unfortunate situation
This weight has been rotating mediocrity in the US for over a decade.
Why do we think that is, just circumstance? Jamill Kelly’s surprise Olympic silver is like the only success I can remember us having at this weight. And I guess Bill Zadick’s world title out of nowhere too. But both of those felt like unrepeatable aberrations.
One reason is I think it’s the deepest weight internationally. There are 15 legit medal threats at this weight. You can’t say that about any other weight.
True, but you'd expect competitiveness across weights to even out over time, and as you've mentioned we have been mediocre at the weight for what seems like 2 decades.
I also think recently we've had guys dominate the spot domestically who aren't great style match ups internationally in Metcalf and Zain. Steiber had success, but down a weight and wasn't the same up at 65. Molinaro was pretty good in 2016 almost beating Chamizo for bronze. Best performance since Zadick, but other than that it's been a lot of 0-1/1-1 performances. Hoping JO gets by McKenna because I think he's the better bet, though the best would have been Yianni.
I don't know which thing is more inexcusable. Cox's reason for not making weight on time, or your decision to use that horrible analogy.
Huh?? You actually think that Russia, with its 2,000 gold medals in wrestling, is a joke?! (though confusingly you then say that they will "get their best guys on the team").
What's laughable is the USA Wrestling system of choosing an Olympic/World team. How about the national coaching staff chooses who they KNOW are the best at each weight, with the best chance of winning a medal? Hands down that's how it should happen, rather than risking that the top wrestler at a weight risk injury, upset or an off-day at a trial tournament.
Actually... if it were Russia, Snyder would have been awarded the spot, and J’Den and his coaches (and probably trainers too) would have ended up in a landfill for embarrassing the country by not knowing what time weigh-ins were.
And in America the coach that doesn’t know what time weigh ins are at has one of the top freestyle coaching jobs in the country.
KJ showed some integrity at ISU with things like the Long situation but was clearly inept in most of the wrestling related duties and here you have it.
Except it was 15 minutes late and Cael wasnt even at the scales but tell yourself what you need to.
Because USA Wrestling is beholden to NBC sports preference. I wish I was kidding.
With good governance, USA wrestling would have a final x to determine the winners and draw more attention to the sport. But they signed their soul away so every 4 years we get a crappy feed that doesn’t even show the best matches on TV.
It is astounding that for this to happen it took at least two people to not know the schedule. One said the wrong time, and the other never bothered to check the schedule himself just to be sure. And, he still showed up over weight. We do not select an Olympic Team. We have a level playing field with clear procedures and rules. The playing field is not fair or level if concessions are made for one who is treated "special." USA Wrestling did not screw up or cause Cox to be late (the moronic heart example for instance-that would be a USA Wrestling delay due to extenuating circumstances). Cox was a contender for a Gold but he screwed up. It is a shame. However, you can't give special treatment to an athlete to undo their stupid behavior, regardless of their resume'. The best person to win Gold in Tokyo at 97kg is the guy who wins the tournament bst of 3 finals. That is how we do it here in the USA.
If it was Metcalf that did this in 2012 or 2016, whiners would still be whiners. Yet, the actual results from 2012 and 2016 are clear.... Metcalf seems like a lock. He dominated his weight for World Teams leading up to the trials. Yet Frayer wins, and Molinaro wins. You can't take away someone else's opportunity because you deem another to be the better prospect, especially when the screw up is 100% on them or their camp. This isn't Iran or Russia. Even so, saying he is the best chance of gold is ridiculous to use as a means to bolster your argument. The guy and his coach did not know when weigh-ins were. who knows what disaster happens in Tokyo? The dope didn't know the scoring rules in 2016 either. Give it up Mizzou fans. You're defending the indefensible. One appeal/lawsuit by Team Cox, is ok, but not the 12 more that follow if they make special considerations for a star? Laws, rules, etc. they are only meaningful and complied with when it suits your emotional perspective on it?
And F-you, for bringing in NAZI references on this. That's your m.o.? Hear something you disagree with and your response is to call someone a racist or NAZI? That is absolutely shameful. -- It also demonstrates an inability to articulate a valid response.
Simply stating the rules and procedures are there for a reason and are equal for all participants may upset you, but jeez..
Sounds like the argument is going to be that Kevin Jackson, a USA Wrestling coach, gave him incorrect information (i.e., interfered). Can easily make the argument that it is a USA Wrestling screw up.
I don't doubt it, but I don't read his drivel, but you apparently don't read your shit either, cause you're a definite canidate for dumbest shit of the day club, every day. You and Morley will be on the Dbag/Ignore list soon. This cat is done playing with his food.
This. The people saying the world is black and white and "deal with it, bc life isn't fair" are hypocritically delusional.
He made the weight, did he not? Just not on time. Absolutely no advantage gained by weighing in late. This is a trials tournament anyway where the entire ****ing point is to ensure the best American represents each weight at the olympics. If y'all wanna cry about unfairness, maybe cry that wrestlers can get byes to the best of three finals.
No he didn’t. He was over during the allotted weigh in time. He did not make weight this is a silly argument.
I am disappointed Cox wasn't prepared. I think Cox is better than the Snyder we have seen. But let's be honest, Snyder will be a better wrestler training with NLWC (feels dirty typing this) because they have some of the best upper weights to train with. Their room is better than tOSU, so maybe Kyle would have won. At this level, there is no excuse to not make weight, that is on J'Den and his team. How do you let a 4 year opportunity slip by on the most basic rule of wrestling. You never know what the next 4 years can do to your body/mindset/family, make the most of every chance and they blew it.
As a country? Yes Russia is pretty laughable. No I don’t think there wrestling is a joke. I just said they would make sure their best guys got to wrestle no matter if he was a minute late or a month late.
I kinda think a national governing body has a duty to create a system where truly the best of the best qualify so that we have the strongest team possible. I think you can do that while still running a fair system.
As I wrote above, one of the problems in the USA is that we structure our "trials" as a way to create media hype and generate money. That leads us to having a situation where a clear top guy can have an off day or an injury or be 10 minutes late weighing in and he's done. It's really a suboptimal way to pick a team.
A great example of this was Michael Johnson in the 2000 Olympics. In 1996 he won gold medals in the 200m and 400m sprints, obliterating the competition. In 2000, at the Olympic trials, he easily won the 400m and qualified, but suffered a hamstring injury while running the 200m final and pulled up lame, thus missing the team in the 200. At the Olympics he went on to win the 400m, while the winner of the 200m ran a time that was like three-quarters of a second slower than Johnson's winning time in 1996, an eternity in the 200m. Now, not saying Johnson would have run a 19.32 again, but we 100% left a guy off the team who at a minimum would have medaled and likely would have won gold, all because of the way we run the olympic trials in this country.
Is that fair? Is that optimal? I personally think it's pretty ridiculous, and would be far more in favor of some type of points system where you have to do well over multiple events rather than just win one of them.
I'm guessing KJ is just taking the sword for Cox's bad decision making, but lets pretend he isn't... why the hell does this dude still have anything to do with coaching? Being a great wrestler doesn't make you a great or good coach.
USA Freestyle head coach = one of, if not the worst era of USA wrestling
ISU head coach = I mean they are still digging out of that hole.
USA Developmental/J'den Cox's personal coach = can't figure out weigh in time when literally everyone else did
Or we can put the blame on the grown adult who wasn't going to his first wrestling tournament, and should have taken the extra 30 secs to look up the schedule of events. But I know putting the blame on everyone but the actual appropriate individuals isn't exactly what we do anymore. So carry on with rooting for Iran and Russia I guess.
USA Freestyle head coach = one of, if not the worst era of USA wrestling
ISU head coach = I mean they are still digging out of that hole.
USA Developmental/J'den Cox's personal coach = can't figure out weigh in time when literally everyone else did
Or we can put the blame on the grown adult who wasn't going to his first wrestling tournament, and should have taken the extra 30 secs to look up the schedule of events. But I know putting the blame on everyone but the actual appropriate individuals isn't exactly what we do anymore. So carry on with rooting for Iran and Russia I guess.
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