***Official Caitlin/Fever/Kate/Meg Games Mega Thread***
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In 12 minutes, Dantas was a perfect 2-2 from three for 6 points and 3 rebounds
Something to keep an eye on..
If Aces go 2-0 and Sun go 0-2
It’ll be Fever vs Aces round 1
If Aces go 2-0 and Sun go 0-2
It’ll be Fever vs Aces round 1
Pretty interesting article.
Jealousy, fear, respect: How Caitlin Clark's been treated by WNBA players is complicated
Rebecca Lobo is adamant. WNBA players aren’t jealous of Clark. Other athletes and experts say she’s been “targeted” and there’s "petty jealousy.”
www.indystar.com
Stupid paywall. You wanna run us a summery?Pretty interesting article.
Jealousy, fear, respect: How Caitlin Clark's been treated by WNBA players is complicated
Rebecca Lobo is adamant. WNBA players aren’t jealous of Clark. Other athletes and experts say she’s been “targeted” and there’s "petty jealousy.”www.indystar.com
INDIANAPOLIS — Rebecca Lobo did the research. She did extensive research. She went back and watched tape of WNBA rookies for the past 27 seasons just to make sure she wasn't missing something or forgetting something. She watched film of Kelsey Plum as a rookie, of Sabrina Ionescu as a rookie, of Sue Bird as a rookie, of all the great guards as rookies.
There is no question — Lobo is adamant about this — that the Indiana Fever's Caitlin Clark is being played differently, defended differently, than any other rookie who's ever stepped onto a WNBA court.
But she is adamant about something else, too. Clark is not being singled out by other WNBA players because of jealousy. That's not what has caused them to commit more flagrant fouls against her than any other player in the league and to guard her so closely and aggressively that the bruises on her arms and legs have been posted to social media.
They are playing her differently, being more aggressive because Clark plays "a game the league has never seen before," Lobo told IndyStar.
"And that is a tribute to how dangerous she is with the ball in her hands," said Lobo, one of the stars of the WNBA's original roster in 1997 and a league analyst for ESPN. "I don't buy into the narrative that there's jealousy by other players in the league. That being said, I've never seen a rookie defended the way she's defended."
Lobo has never seen a rookie picked up 94 feet from the basket when she doesn't have the ball in her hands. She's never seen a rookie face-guarded 35 feet from the basket when the ball is not in her hands and she's on the complete opposite corner of the floor.
"I've never seen that," Lobo said. "And that has happened with Caitlin."
Of course, the way opponents have treated Clark isn't as cut and dry as Lobo makes it out to be. Not according to other prominent athletes, coaches and sports equity experts who used terms like "targeted," "petty jealousy," "unacceptable behavior" and "non-basketball plays."
The Clark phenomenon is a complex one of a player who's singlehandedly catapulted an entire league while proving she's as good in her first season against the pros as she was in college. A player who can be a bit of a hothead, has racked up her own share of technical fouls and who will not back down, clapping in the faces of opponents and sometimes having to be calmed down on the bench.
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There are also racial undertones that cannot be denied when it comes to the coverage and the treatment Clark has received, said Ellen Staurowsky, a professor of sports media in the Park School of Communications at Ithaca College in New York.
More than 70% of WNBA players are Black, according to the league. On this season’s All-Star team, Clark was the lone white player on the 12-woman roster.
“Research has shown that A'ja Wilson, one of the best WNBA players in history getting MVP and she's getting half the coverage of Sabrina Ionescu who is coming off the bench a lot of times," said Staurowsky. "There's no doubt and there's no question that there is a racial dynamic in all of this. And that cannot be discounted. At the same time, though, that is clearly not the only issue that is going on here."
There is definitely a variety of factors playing into the dynamic, said Lobo.
"Does (race) play a part in it? It might, but we've also had some great white players, including Breanna Stewart and Sabrina Ionescu and Kelsey Plum, who did not get this kind of attention," she said. "So, it's not solely that. It has to be something else."
After the Chicago Sky's Chennedy Carter’s flagrant foul against Clark in June, those racial and political conversations blew up.
"Carter’s foul was inappropriate (and) premeditated (in my opinion). A non-basketball play is inciting a non-basketball conversation," Ros Gold-Onwude, who played at Stanford, on the Nigeria national team and is a sports broadcaster covering NBA basketball for ESPN, posted to X. "The wildest part of the attention around Clark is how she’s been used to serve political agendas. There are people who don’t watch the W, using WNBA as a tool for division."
To put it in the simplest of terms, the way Clark has been treated by players in the WNBA is complicated.
"There could be some possible resentment that would have nothing to with anything Caitlin Clark has control of, which is her being perceived as a sort of savior figure for the league," said Susan K. Cahn, professor emerita of history at the University at Buffalo, an expert on women’s and LGBTQ history who focuses on sports.
"Mostly to her benefit but in this case, maybe not to her benefit, she has been singled out."
Caitlin Clark 'being targeted.' 'It's 'petty jealousy'
Beyond her flashy triple-doubles and the skyrocketing popularity of women's basketball brought on, at least in part, by Clark, much of the conversation this season has focused on the intense physicality she has encountered, with many big names in basketball weighing in."The treatment that Caitlin Clark has been getting is not basketball. Those guilty must be suspended (and) fined heavily (and) that would put a stop to it," longtime basketball analyst Dick Vitale posted to Facebook in June. "So absurd the petty jealousy. She is a money machine for all involved with the WNBA. Enough already with the absurd antics (and) comments. Caitlin should be welcome by all with open arms."
Former NBA star Charles Barkley went on The Bill Simmons Podcast in September and harshly criticized the players of the WNBA and their treatment of Clark.
"These ladies, and I'm a WNBA fan, they cannot have f----- this Caitlin Clark thing up any worse if they tried," Barkley said. "If you got a bunch of dudes in a room and said, 'Let's f--- up the WNBA,' we couldn't have come up with a massive plan (better than) what these women have done."
"For these women to have this petty jealousness," Barkley said. "You say to yourself, 'Damn, what is going on here?'"
What is going on, longtime Connecticut women's coach Geno Auriemma says, is that Clark is getting unfair treatment from her league counterparts.
"Is she facing the rookie challenge, the rookie hardships that are inherent with being a rookie? Yes," Auriemma said in June according to ESPN's Michael Voepel. "She's also being targeted."
Auriemma compared Clark's situation to those of NBA stars in their rookie seasons.
"I don't remember when (Michael) Jordan came into the (NBA), guys looking to go out and beat him up," he said. "I don't remember when (Larry) Bird and Magic (Johnson) came in the league and elevated the NBA, them getting targeted and getting beat up just because of who they were and the attention they were getting."
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One of the most telling stats to come out of Clark's rookie season was revealed this month — a staggering 17% of the WNBA’s flagrant fouls have been committed against Clark.
In Sunday's game against Dallas, another flagrant foul against Clark was added to that stat. As Clark was driving on a fast break to the basket for a layup, Kalani Brown made contact with the ball but then in the follow through hit Clark across the neck. The play was called a common foul on the floor against Brown but was then upgraded to a flagrant 1.
While Brown's foul appeared to be a basketball play, Carter's flagrant foul against Clark earlier this season, according to the Fever, had no place in a basketball game.
Clark was waiting for an inbound pass from teammate Aliyah Boston, who still had the ball in her hands, when Carter shoulder-checked her and Clark fell to the ground. An away from ball foul was called, which prompted outrage from the Fever. The league later upgraded it to flagrant 1.
"There's a difference between tough defense and unnecessary — targeting actions! It needs to stop! The league needs to 'cleanup' the crap!" Fever general manager Lin Dunn posted to X at the time. "That's NOT who this league is!!"
Fever coach Christie Sides also called for change on X, saying the Carter move was "unacceptable" and pleading with the WNBA to do something about it. "When will the consistent complaints be heard?"
Clark has stayed, considering all things, fairly quiet about the on-court treatment she endures. Early in the season, she did say she felt opponents were getting away with actions against her that they wouldn't get away with against other players.
As the season has progressed, Clark has tried to downplay much of her own buzz, saying that she doesn't get on social media to avoid the naysayers and controversy that seems to swirl around her.
Lobo does not blame her. She said whenever she makes a post about Clark or the Sky's Angel Reese on X, she purposely does not tag them.
"And I restrict who can respond because I don't know if there's an algorithm or what it is where, all of a sudden, there's hate," Lobo said. "You tweet something positive about someone, there's hate in your mentions. And I refuse to believe that those are all actually really people. That they can really hate that much."
"Metrics prove that no one sells tickets like Caitlin Clark, period. Metrics, ratings prove that no one comes close to driving viewership like Caitlin Clark," Lobo said, "but it feels like we consistently have to pretend like that's not the case, and I'm curious, 'Why is that?'"
Cahn suspects there is some ire toward Clark from players of the WNBA, greater than a typical rookie, which has to do with the sudden focus on the league.
"There is a feeling among the players, you know, 'We've been doing this since 1997,'" said Cahn. "Suddenly there's all this media attention, often from male journalists who never covered the league before. And I think there's probably resentment about that, that this one player is being touted as so much better than everybody else, when the rest of the league is fantastic."
The rest of the league can be fantastic and at the same time embrace what Clark is bringing to the WNBA, said former tennis star Martina Navratilova.
"The players in the WNBA need to realize that Caitlin Clark is helping all of them, now and in the long run. Caitlin is the tide that will raise all boats," she posted to X.
No one is claiming that, as a rookie, Clark is the best player in the league, said Lobo.
"Caitlin is not. A'ja Wilson is the best player in the league. But is Caitlin the most popular? Without question," said Lobo. "Does she have an opportunity someday, as her game continues to grow, to be the best player in the league? She does."
Chris Evert understands the situation Clark finds herself in. When Evert came onto the tennis scene making her grand slam debut in 1971 at 16 years old, "there was jealousy towards me ... It didn't feel good. I was just a teenager," she recently posted to X in response to a message about the way Clark is being treated.
Evert went on to say that Billie Jean King stood up for her, telling players to embrace Evert instead of criticizing her. "I hope women's basketball follows suit. (Caitlin Clark) is making the sport better," she posted.
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In Sunday's game against Dallas, another flagrant foul against Clark was added to that stat. As Clark was driving on a fast break to the basket for a layup, Kalani Brown made contact with the ball but then in the follow through hit Clark across the neck. The play was called a common foul on the floor against Brown but was then upgraded to a flagrant 1.
While Brown's foul appeared to be a basketball play, Carter's flagrant foul against Clark earlier this season, according to the Fever, had no place in a basketball game.
Clark was waiting for an inbound pass from teammate Aliyah Boston, who still had the ball in her hands, when Carter shoulder-checked her and Clark fell to the ground. An away from ball foul was called, which prompted outrage from the Fever. The league later upgraded it to flagrant 1.
"There's a difference between tough defense and unnecessary — targeting actions! It needs to stop! The league needs to 'cleanup' the crap!" Fever general manager Lin Dunn posted to X at the time. "That's NOT who this league is!!"
Fever coach Christie Sides also called for change on X, saying the Carter move was "unacceptable" and pleading with the WNBA to do something about it. "When will the consistent complaints be heard?"
Clark has stayed, considering all things, fairly quiet about the on-court treatment she endures. Early in the season, she did say she felt opponents were getting away with actions against her that they wouldn't get away with against other players.
As the season has progressed, Clark has tried to downplay much of her own buzz, saying that she doesn't get on social media to avoid the naysayers and controversy that seems to swirl around her.
Lobo does not blame her. She said whenever she makes a post about Clark or the Sky's Angel Reese on X, she purposely does not tag them.
"And I restrict who can respond because I don't know if there's an algorithm or what it is where, all of a sudden, there's hate," Lobo said. "You tweet something positive about someone, there's hate in your mentions. And I refuse to believe that those are all actually really people. That they can really hate that much."
Why are people scared to say it out loud?
It is odd, Lobo said. It seems as if everyone is scared to say out loud what Clark really is: A rising tide lifting all boats."Metrics prove that no one sells tickets like Caitlin Clark, period. Metrics, ratings prove that no one comes close to driving viewership like Caitlin Clark," Lobo said, "but it feels like we consistently have to pretend like that's not the case, and I'm curious, 'Why is that?'"
Cahn suspects there is some ire toward Clark from players of the WNBA, greater than a typical rookie, which has to do with the sudden focus on the league.
"There is a feeling among the players, you know, 'We've been doing this since 1997,'" said Cahn. "Suddenly there's all this media attention, often from male journalists who never covered the league before. And I think there's probably resentment about that, that this one player is being touted as so much better than everybody else, when the rest of the league is fantastic."
The rest of the league can be fantastic and at the same time embrace what Clark is bringing to the WNBA, said former tennis star Martina Navratilova.
"The players in the WNBA need to realize that Caitlin Clark is helping all of them, now and in the long run. Caitlin is the tide that will raise all boats," she posted to X.
No one is claiming that, as a rookie, Clark is the best player in the league, said Lobo.
"Caitlin is not. A'ja Wilson is the best player in the league. But is Caitlin the most popular? Without question," said Lobo. "Does she have an opportunity someday, as her game continues to grow, to be the best player in the league? She does."
Chris Evert understands the situation Clark finds herself in. When Evert came onto the tennis scene making her grand slam debut in 1971 at 16 years old, "there was jealousy towards me ... It didn't feel good. I was just a teenager," she recently posted to X in response to a message about the way Clark is being treated.
Evert went on to say that Billie Jean King stood up for her, telling players to embrace Evert instead of criticizing her. "I hope women's basketball follows suit. (Caitlin Clark) is making the sport better," she posted.
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Whether that happens for Clark remains to be seen. Tennis star Serena Williams recently suggested she believes the negativity toward Clark stems from jealousy.
"And no matter what other people do, if people are negative then it's because they can't do what you do … basically," Williams told The Associated Press on the red carpet in New York City where her docuseries "In the Arena: Serena Williams" premiered at the Tribeca Festival. "And hopefully (Clark will) continue to do what she's doing."
Because, when it comes down to the simplest of terms, Clark is making history, driving attendance, TV ratings and viewership and WNBA merchandise sales to never before seen levels.
"When you turn a game on and she's playing, you want to watch because the way she plays is somewhat intoxicating," Lobo said. "And that's good for everyone in the league."
When Clark lost control of the ball and her balance in the opening minutes of a game in July against the Las Vegas Aces, Jackie Young, Indiana high school basketball's career leading scorer and a national champion with Notre Dame, took an extra moment to make sure Clark was OK.
After stumbling, Clark re-tied her shoes. Young joined her and gave her a few encouraging words.
"Jackie Young made sure Caitlin Clark was okay," ESPN posted to X, "intentionally tying her shoe to give Clark time to get up."
"You always are going to have to fight adversity, and I think that's part of everyone's journey is being able to kind of weather that storm and figure out what makes you you," said New York's Ionescu, picked No. 1 by the Liberty in 2020 after a standout career at Oregon. "And she's so young, she's going be able to learn and grow. Times like this are kind of when you figure out what you're really made of and how you can continue to improve as a teammate, as a basketball player, as a person."
Lobo doesn't see the stardom wearing off on the Clark effect anytime soon.
"I do not see a time, if she stays healthy in the near future, and I'm talking about the next five to ten years, where she's not the most popular player," said Lobo. "And that's OK, and that's a great thing because it's bringing different levels of attention to the WNBA than we have ever, ever seen."
Overall, that is a positive for the league and for Clark.
"There might be individuals who are saying nasty things to her, but I think on the whole, there's an appreciation for this moment," said Cahn, "an appreciation that Caitlin Clark helped bring it about, but also that they all together helped bring it about. In the end, it can't just be one person."
"And no matter what other people do, if people are negative then it's because they can't do what you do … basically," Williams told The Associated Press on the red carpet in New York City where her docuseries "In the Arena: Serena Williams" premiered at the Tribeca Festival. "And hopefully (Clark will) continue to do what she's doing."
Because, when it comes down to the simplest of terms, Clark is making history, driving attendance, TV ratings and viewership and WNBA merchandise sales to never before seen levels.
"When you turn a game on and she's playing, you want to watch because the way she plays is somewhat intoxicating," Lobo said. "And that's good for everyone in the league."
'Always going to have to fight adversity'
There have been some cool moments throughout the season where Clark's opponents have gone out of their way to embrace her.When Clark lost control of the ball and her balance in the opening minutes of a game in July against the Las Vegas Aces, Jackie Young, Indiana high school basketball's career leading scorer and a national champion with Notre Dame, took an extra moment to make sure Clark was OK.
After stumbling, Clark re-tied her shoes. Young joined her and gave her a few encouraging words.
"Jackie Young made sure Caitlin Clark was okay," ESPN posted to X, "intentionally tying her shoe to give Clark time to get up."
"You always are going to have to fight adversity, and I think that's part of everyone's journey is being able to kind of weather that storm and figure out what makes you you," said New York's Ionescu, picked No. 1 by the Liberty in 2020 after a standout career at Oregon. "And she's so young, she's going be able to learn and grow. Times like this are kind of when you figure out what you're really made of and how you can continue to improve as a teammate, as a basketball player, as a person."
Lobo doesn't see the stardom wearing off on the Clark effect anytime soon.
"I do not see a time, if she stays healthy in the near future, and I'm talking about the next five to ten years, where she's not the most popular player," said Lobo. "And that's OK, and that's a great thing because it's bringing different levels of attention to the WNBA than we have ever, ever seen."
Overall, that is a positive for the league and for Clark.
"There might be individuals who are saying nasty things to her, but I think on the whole, there's an appreciation for this moment," said Cahn, "an appreciation that Caitlin Clark helped bring it about, but also that they all together helped bring it about. In the end, it can't just be one person."
Thanks for posting, that was a good read.Pretty interesting article.
Jealousy, fear, respect: How Caitlin Clark's been treated by WNBA players is complicated
Rebecca Lobo is adamant. WNBA players aren’t jealous of Clark. Other athletes and experts say she’s been “targeted” and there’s "petty jealousy.”www.indystar.com
I'm guessing she had a lot more open looks. and got fouled less. Playing in less games is legit. There should be new records rather than breaking records IMO.
I wonder what time slot the TV execs will want Caitlin in for Game 1 on Sunday....
WNBA Playoffs
Sunday, September 22| Time CT | Game | Nat'l TV | Local TV |
|---|---|---|---|
| 12:00 pm | First round, Game 1 | ESPN | |
| 2:00 pm | First round, Game 1 | ABC | |
| 4:00 pm | First round, Game 1 | ESPN | |
| 9:00 pm | First round, Game 1 | ESPN, ESPN Deportes |
The biggest thing I notice w CC press conferences, every single night she is calling out a teammate for complements.
always positive and focuses on those around her.
always positive and focuses on those around her.
I predict ABC at 2 pm is the CC slot.
Going against the NFL in all slots so can't win .
Going against the NFL in all slots so can't win .
I'd say 4 pm. Not competing against the biggest slate of games and not going head to head with Mahomes in prime time.
"There is a feeling among the players, you know, 'We've been doing this since 1997,'" said Cahn. "Suddenly there's all this media attention, often from male journalists who never covered the league before. And I think there's probably resentment about that, that this one player is being touted as so much better than everybody else, when the rest of the league is fantastic."
Agree with the first statement. A lot of good players have and still are playing the game and not getting much coverage. But disagree with the "rest of the league is fantastic". Having seen games all season, there's not always on the court what I would call 10 really good players. Sometimes I feel I've been in better pick up games than what I'm watching. And expanding the league will further dilute the top tier players. There's still a big talent gap
Agree with the first statement. A lot of good players have and still are playing the game and not getting much coverage. But disagree with the "rest of the league is fantastic". Having seen games all season, there's not always on the court what I would call 10 really good players. Sometimes I feel I've been in better pick up games than what I'm watching. And expanding the league will further dilute the top tier players. There's still a big talent gap
Well this is just false.
I've heard and seen Wilson a ton this year, they talk about her all the time.
Ionescu? Never heard of her.
Yeah these expansion teams are going to suck for a long time. There are 10 to 20 top players, and they seem to be consolidating to super teams. Hopefully, the fever become one of them during upcoming free agency.
Either Seattle or Las Vegas will be hosting. If they aren't the 9PM game, whoever is will (justifiably) complain. I am traveling that day and 2PM is the most challenging for me, but I am guessing Ryan, Rebecca, and CC on ABC.
there is no chance sabrina is mentioned more than wilson. might she make more in endorsements...idk.
I think the author of that comment is cherry picking. Sabrina got a lot of short term attention with that amazing three point competition performance. Other than that, A'ja gets way more media coverage. Just more lies for the cause.
Gimme a "Hell Ya!!!"
