Phil got outcoached

[jerbob36]

Right off the bat, yes, our offense is wretched and does zero to help our defense. Time and time again, the defense has had to bail out this team after bad field position, very little rest for lack of sustained drives, etc. etc. I agree wholeheartedly with this. But we have plenty of threads about the offense that I already agree with. Now for an unpopular post (ducking tomatoes as I type)...

My frustration with the defense is with the lack of adjustments/changes as Penn State continued to march down the field with 15-17 play drives all second half.

Bend-but-don't-break has been frustrating to watch at times, but because of the overall success (numbers don't lie), I have been really happy with defense. It's absolutely carried the water (with special teams) for this program for far too long. And yet, I don't know if we'll ever beat the great offensive teams we want to beat with our system.

What's hard to watch:

• huge cushions as teams run 7-8 hitches/stop routes whenever they want.
• safeties 10-12 yards deep on 3rd and 3
• asking 4 linemen to provide pressure against 5-6 blockers
• LBs tracking slot WRs (this problem has been fixed more lately with the CASH, but I will never forget Gonzalez from OSU killing us while LBs tried to manage a quicker guy in their zone)

All that being said, we get pretty tough to score a TD on inside the 20s, and our "eyes on the QB" teaching has resulted in an incredibly high number of interceptions. So even though I wish we'd blitz more, the success is exactly what it is. You usually don't complain about a Top 5/10 defense in PPG, YPG, etc.

But watching Penn State pick apart our DEF was frustrating. They knew exactly what they could get, exactly where they could get it, and exactly how to do it. Need 6 yards on first? They have a play. Need to spread us out and win the math game of 6 blocking 4 (at the LOS at least) to gain a few rushing yards? They got it. There's no way a great defense should give up multiple drives of 15 plays. They were taking candy from a baby and we did very little different in the second half.

Here's the bottom line: talented teams/staffs know how to scheme and beat our defense. How did David Bell go for 200+ a second time after everybody knew he was the best weapon? Outschemed. We will be very successful against teams not as talented or not willing to dink and dunk down the field. But the top tier teams know what they can get and do just that.

Circling back around: our offense needs our defense exactle jack to work with. I just feel like Phil is sometimes above criticism to many. And for this game, at least, I didn't see him do much to tweak what wasn't already working.

Go Hawks.

 

[littlez]

Right off the bat, yes, our offense is wretched and does zero to help our defense. Time and time again, the defense has had to bail out this team after bad field position, very little rest for lack of sustained drives, etc. etc. I agree wholeheartedly with this. But we have plenty of threads about the offense that I already agree with. Now for an unpopular post (ducking tomatoes as I type)...

My frustration with the defense is with the lack of adjustments/changes as Penn State continued to march down the field with 15-17 play drives all second half.

Bend-but-don't-break has been frustrating to watch at times, but because of the overall success (numbers don't lie), I have been really happy with defense. It's absolutely carried the water (with special teams) for this program for far too long. And yet, I don't know if we'll ever beat the great offensive teams we want to beat with our system.

What's hard to watch:

• huge cushions as teams run 7-8 hitches/stop routes whenever they want.
• safeties 10-12 yards deep on 3rd and 3
• asking 4 linemen to provide pressure against 5-6 blockers
• LBs tracking slot WRs (this problem has been fixed more lately with the CASH, but I will never forget Gonzalez from OSU killing us while LBs tried to manage a quicker guy in their zone)

All that being said, we get pretty tough to score a TD on inside the 20s, and our "eyes on the QB" teaching has resulted in an incredibly high number of interceptions. So even though I wish we'd blitz more, the success is exactly what it is. You usually don't complain about a Top 5/10 defense in PPG, YPG, etc.

But watching Penn State pick apart our DEF was frustrating. They knew exactly what they could get, exactly where they could get it, and exactly how to do it. Need 6 yards on first? They have a play. Need to spread us out and win the math game of 6 blocking 4 (at the LOS at least) to gain a few rushing yards? They got it. There's no way a great defense should give up multiple drives of 15 plays. They were taking candy from a baby and we did very little different in the second half.

Here's the bottom line: talented teams/staffs know how to scheme and beat our defense. How did David Bell go for 200+ a second time after everybody knew he was the best weapon? Outschemed. We will be very successful against teams not as talented or not willing to dink and dunk down the field. But the top tier teams know what they can get and do just that.

Circling back around: our offense needs our defense exactle jack to work with. I just feel like Phil is sometimes above criticism to many. And for this game, at least, I didn't see him do much to tweak what wasn't already working.

Go Hawks.

Can't disagree on Saturday night. Penn State took what was available the whole game and they were willing to go 15-16 plays to score. We were giving big cushions it seemed like on almost every 3rd down, which was extremely frustrating as it then let them work our defense more and more. Big part of them running almost 100 plays was our inability to get off the field on 3rd down.

 

[littlez]

9-20 on 3rd downs and 4-4 on 4th downs. We were of course 1-9 on 3rd downs. So 13-24 combined on 3rd and 4th downs. Ugh.

 

[OutbackBowl2017]

Iowa’s defense forced them into long drives with the hope of getting a turnover and possible field goal instead of touchdowns. Too bad Iowa’s offense isn’t capable of these same things.

97 plays to 34
397 yards to 74
46 minutes to 14

Clearly, Phil’s fault.

 

[millah_22]

Back-to-back 15 and 12 play drives to start the 2nd half absolutely ruined the hawks. gotta get off the field on 3rd and 4ths. Their O-line blew up Iowa's D line.

 

[HawkBall23]

Iowa's 4 lost fumbles + the punt going off the Iowa player's back and back to PSU - forcing his unit to spend all that much more time on the field - were clearly Phil's fault too.


SCORE MORE, Phil!!!!!!

Such a horrible coordinator.

 

[the24fan]

yeah the defense has been designed to not give up big plays, force teams into mistakes somewhere along the drive .
Problem is good teams rarely make mistakes. They take what the defense gives them and that’s exactly what PSU did..methodically drive it down our throats.
Phil’s reluctance to blitz at all was a big time mistake..Allar had all day to find guys open . Disappointing performance . But hard to do anything when you’re on the damn field for 45 damn minutes!
That’s pathetic .

 

[CarterHall]

Right off the bat, yes, our offense is wretched and does zero to help our defense. Time and time again, the defense has had to bail out this team after bad field position, very little rest for lack of sustained drives, etc. etc. I agree wholeheartedly with this. But we have plenty of threads about the offense that I already agree with. Now for an unpopular post (ducking tomatoes as I type)...

My frustration with the defense is with the lack of adjustments/changes as Penn State continued to march down the field with 15-17 play drives all second half.

Bend-but-don't-break has been frustrating to watch at times, but because of the overall success (numbers don't lie), I have been really happy with defense. It's absolutely carried the water (with special teams) for this program for far too long. And yet, I don't know if we'll ever beat the great offensive teams we want to beat with our system.

What's hard to watch:

• huge cushions as teams run 7-8 hitches/stop routes whenever they want.
• safeties 10-12 yards deep on 3rd and 3
• asking 4 linemen to provide pressure against 5-6 blockers
• LBs tracking slot WRs (this problem has been fixed more lately with the CASH, but I will never forget Gonzalez from OSU killing us while LBs tried to manage a quicker guy in their zone)

All that being said, we get pretty tough to score a TD on inside the 20s, and our "eyes on the QB" teaching has resulted in an incredibly high number of interceptions. So even though I wish we'd blitz more, the success is exactly what it is. You usually don't complain about a Top 5/10 defense in PPG, YPG, etc.

But watching Penn State pick apart our DEF was frustrating. They knew exactly what they could get, exactly where they could get it, and exactly how to do it. Need 6 yards on first? They have a play. Need to spread us out and win the math game of 6 blocking 4 (at the LOS at least) to gain a few rushing yards? They got it. There's no way a great defense should give up multiple drives of 15 plays. They were taking candy from a baby and we did very little different in the second half.

Here's the bottom line: talented teams/staffs know how to scheme and beat our defense. How did David Bell go for 200+ a second time after everybody knew he was the best weapon? Outschemed. We will be very successful against teams not as talented or not willing to dink and dunk down the field. But the top tier teams know what they can get and do just that.

Circling back around: our offense needs our defense exactle jack to work with. I just feel like Phil is sometimes above criticism to many. And for this game, at least, I didn't see him do much to tweak what wasn't already working.

Go Hawks.

You should of quit after your first two sentences.

 

[Dr.PhilSuess]

Right off the bat, yes, our offense is wretched and does zero to help our defense. Time and time again, the defense has had to bail out this team after bad field position, very little rest for lack of sustained drives, etc. etc. I agree wholeheartedly with this. But we have plenty of threads about the offense that I already agree with. Now for an unpopular post (ducking tomatoes as I type)...

My frustration with the defense is with the lack of adjustments/changes as Penn State continued to march down the field with 15-17 play drives all second half.

Bend-but-don't-break has been frustrating to watch at times, but because of the overall success (numbers don't lie), I have been really happy with defense. It's absolutely carried the water (with special teams) for this program for far too long. And yet, I don't know if we'll ever beat the great offensive teams we want to beat with our system.

What's hard to watch:

• huge cushions as teams run 7-8 hitches/stop routes whenever they want.
• safeties 10-12 yards deep on 3rd and 3
• asking 4 linemen to provide pressure against 5-6 blockers
• LBs tracking slot WRs (this problem has been fixed more lately with the CASH, but I will never forget Gonzalez from OSU killing us while LBs tried to manage a quicker guy in their zone)

All that being said, we get pretty tough to score a TD on inside the 20s, and our "eyes on the QB" teaching has resulted in an incredibly high number of interceptions. So even though I wish we'd blitz more, the success is exactly what it is. You usually don't complain about a Top 5/10 defense in PPG, YPG, etc.

But watching Penn State pick apart our DEF was frustrating. They knew exactly what they could get, exactly where they could get it, and exactly how to do it. Need 6 yards on first? They have a play. Need to spread us out and win the math game of 6 blocking 4 (at the LOS at least) to gain a few rushing yards? They got it. There's no way a great defense should give up multiple drives of 15 plays. They were taking candy from a baby and we did very little different in the second half.

Here's the bottom line: talented teams/staffs know how to scheme and beat our defense. How did David Bell go for 200+ a second time after everybody knew he was the best weapon? Outschemed. We will be very successful against teams not as talented or not willing to dink and dunk down the field. But the top tier teams know what they can get and do just that.

Circling back around: our offense needs our defense exactle jack to work with. I just feel like Phil is sometimes above criticism to many. And for this game, at least, I didn't see him do much to tweak what wasn't already working.

Go Hawks.

PennU as limited as that qb was ... is not South Dakota St, Illini, Minny or any of that other punchless crap Parker made his fake reputation on. Want receipts ‘Can’t cover’ says 3 win garbage Nebraska

 

[jonesy5960]

That outcoached defense gave up a grand total of 10 points in the first half to the number 6 team in the country with the only touchdown coming off a special teams miscue resulting in a short field. Given the complete collapse of the Iowa offense it was game over at that point.

But yeah, let's call out Phil and the defense. Makes sense.

 

[BHoppy]

Probably just me, but watching some of the defensive players, they really looked frustrated, pissed after some plays and really upset and pissed about how the game was playing out. I will say probably more frustrated than anything. It just seemed to show more in this game. Cooper just seemed out of place on some play and frustrated. It happens and on to next game. They blocked him well.

 

[uihawk82]

Right off the bat, yes, our offense is wretched and does zero to help our defense.

Go Hawks.

I think what you should be asking, and yes it is about BrianF, is why cant he scheme and get players open for very simple, very safe passes.

Did you see how many times, a lot, that they just threw a quick little pass behind the LOS to a TEnd who was in a wing position by a OTackle. The receiver/s on that side would go downfield a couple of steps and block our Dbacks and maybe a linebacker (and boy did they block well and it almost looked like our defenders were just trying to hem in the receiver).

But PSU made tons of yards and crucial firsts downs in the first half especially throwing very simple passes like that to TEnds and running backs behind the LOS, and they just kept doing it, they did it against us with great success in 2021 with Clifford at qb.

Why cant the hawks do that? Get the ball open receivers behind the line and outflank the other team crowding the LOS. I think running backs are called that because they are the best running with the ball.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

9-20 on 3rd downs and 4-4 on 4th downs. We were of course 1-9 on 3rd downs. So 13-24 combined on 3rd and 4th downs. Ugh.

Should've been 3 of 4 on 4th down...........

 

[Dr.PhilSuess]

Probably just me, but watching some of the defensive players, they really looked frustrated, pissed after some plays and really upset and pissed about how the game was playing out. I will say probably more frustrated than anything. It just seemed to show more in this game. Cooper just seemed out of place on some play and frustrated. It happens and on to next game. They blocked him well.

Out of place lol more like 15 yds off the receivers on 3rd and 9 ... just a shit scheme

 

[littlez]

I think what you should be asking, and yes it is about BrianF, is why cant he scheme and get players open for very simple, very safe passes.

Did you see how many times, a lot, that they just threw a quick little pass behind the LOS to a TEnd who was in a wing position by a OTackle. The receiver/s on that side would go downfield a couple of steps and block our Dbacks and maybe a linebacker (and boy did they block well and it almost looked like our defenders were just trying to hem in the receiver).

But PSU made tons of yards and crucial firsts downs in the first half especially throwing very simple passes like that to TEnds and running backs behind the LOS, and they just kept doing it, they did it against us with great success in 2021 with Clifford at qb.

Why cant the hawks do that? Get the ball open receivers behind the line and outflank the other team crowding the LOS. I think running backs are called that because they are the best running with the ball.

Million dollar question. We continued to line Cade up in nothing but shotgun after we got down 10-0 and Brian absolutely panicked. Looked like our entire game plan was get the ball to All in the first few possessions and once he fumbled we said F it, let’s line up shotgun and get sacked or pressured every play. It worked wonderfully.

 

[QChawks]

it wasn't his best game, that's for sure

although usually you get SOMETHING our of your offense to sustain a few drives and maybe score a couple points

 

[gojojo]

Iowa's 4 lost fumbles + the punt going off the Iowa player's back and back to PSU - forcing his unit to spend all that much more time on the field - were clearly Phil's fault too.


SCORE MORE, Phil!!!!!!

Such a horrible coordinator.

Yes, everyone is clearly damning coach P. 🙄

The D didn't play up to it's standards on Saturday, and they are allowed an off night with how well that side of the ball has played the last decade.

DLINE just doesn't seem to be as strong of unit as we have been used to and expecting this year and the DB'S had a tough night as well. Offesnse clearly didn't help, but ya gotta get off the field on third or fourth down.

 

[IANit]

PennU as limited as that qb was ... is not South Dakota St, Illini, Minny or any of that other punchless crap Parker made his fake reputation on. Want receipts ‘Can’t cover’ says 3 win garbage Nebraska

Limited as that qb was? Which QB are you referring to?

 

[Ronman]

I will never fault our defense until the offense quits putting them on the field all night and usually in bad field position. Even God needed to rest one day.

 

[HawkBall23]

"Gotta get off the field on 3rd and 4th downs."

True, but lol.

Why, so they can get - at best - a couple minute breather while the offense wows everyone with yet another glorious 3-&-out??

 

[ShonnDeereGreene]

This defense is not the same defense as 2022, that is for sure. I think we have 3 sacks in 4 games (and zero against PSU). We can’t get off the field when we need to. Not nearly as many forced turnovers. And there are holes in the secondary (Harris is a big drop off from Moss last year) and some big plays given up.

All that said, the defense is still quite strong imo. Clearly not why we lost at PSU. But there are some holes in the defensive armor this year that weren’t there last year.

 

[mikesright]

Penn State doesn’t score more than 17 points in that game if our offense has a pulse. PSU got a lot of possessions (6 in a row!!!) where they take over after a 3 and out. More rhythm for them and more tired legs for us. Seems like a winning position to be placed in as a coordinator

 

[joelbc1]

Iowa football fans LOVE them some misery!

Psssst……Iowa plays another game this Saturday evening…….

Don’t let the PSU game lose you two games. One is enough.

 

[Dr.PhilSuess]

Yes, everyone is clearly damning coach P. 🙄

The D didn't play up to it's standards on Saturday, and they are allowed an off night with how well that side of the ball has played the last decade.

DLINE just doesn't seem to be as strong of unit as we have been used to and expecting this year and the DB'S had a tough night as well. Offesnse clearly didn't help, but ya gotta get off the field on third or fourth down.

Maybe because they actually faced actual top D1 talent which always seems to be a problem for this can’t

Penn State doesn’t score more than 17 points in that game if our offense has a pulse. PSU got a lot of possessions (6 in a row!!!) where they take over after a 3 and out. More rhythm for them and more tired legs for us. Seems like a winning position to be placed in as a coordinator

Good Big 10 teams seem to do whatever they want vs the Hawks ... if they need more points, they will get them. The new conference comers don’t operate that way, they play modern football.

 

[ClarindaA's]

Should've been 3 of 4 on 4th down...........

He was ****ing short and Kirk should have asked for a review.

 

[WWDMHawkeye]

Yeah, the D wasn’t the problem.

 

[BrewHawk]

The main thing the three and outs do to a defense like Iowa's is not give any time at all for adjustments and in-game coaching/teaching. We get better as the game goes on (typically) because our staff has time to analyze and adjust to what the opponent is doing.

When you go three and out in a matter of 2-3 minutes of real time, that opportunity is nonexistent.

 

[mikesright]

Maybe because they actually faced actual top D1 talent which always seems to be a problem for this can’t

Good Big 10 teams seem to do whatever they want vs the Hawks ... if they need more points, they will get them. The new conference comers don’t operate that way, they play modern football.

Yeah no. That's a good way to keep Iowa in the game with incompletions (leading to stalled drives) and turnovers. The defense is built to stop that. However - no defense is built to survive endless 3 and outs and -4 turnovers.

 

[doughuddl2]

Million dollar question. We continued to line Cade up in nothing but shotgun after we got down 10-0 and Brian absolutely panicked. Looked like our entire game plan was get the ball to All in the first few possessions and once he fumbled we said F it, let’s line up shotgun and get sacked or pressured every play. It worked wonderfully.

Shot gun stance puts less pressure on his sore leg and knee than squatting under center.

 

[BubsFinn]

Phil's defense was on the field for 97 snaps. I can't put any blame on his shoulders. The offense went three quarters of the game without gaining a first down. The problems are not with the defense.

 

[BurgHawk87]

I'm not certain but I think the rain had a small factor in the cushions the defense was giving. Having to react vs knowing where you're going is much harder in sloppy conditions.

 

[BrewHawk]

The main thing the three and outs do to a defense like Iowa's is not give any time at all for adjustments and in-game coaching/teaching. We get better as the game goes on (typically) because our staff has time to analyze and adjust to what the opponent is doing.

When you go three and out in a matter of 2-3 minutes of real time, that opportunity is nonexistent.

Not to quote myself, but...

Of course this means BF had oodles of time to make adjustments and we all see how that went.

 

[pink shizzle]

I dont have a lot but for the sake of this thread I'll say that I wish we had more than three sacks on the year.

 

[Steamboat529529]

Our defense gave up 20 points. Our special teams gave up 11 points. Our offense is a joke. Even though the stats won’t say it our defense basically held Penn State below 30 points for the first time in like ten games.

 

[Libertylover]

That outcoached defense gave up a grand total of 10 points in the first half to the number 6 team in the country with the only touchdown coming off a special teams miscue resulting in a short field. Given the complete collapse of the Iowa offense it was game over at that point.

But yeah, let's call out Phil and the defense. Makes sense.

PSU online was much bigger than our D line and everyone could see the second half collapse coming when our offense can give them even a short break off the field. Our defense isn’t as good as last year, especially with losing our best D lineman for the season

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Phil's defense was on the field for 97 snaps. I can't put any blame on his shoulders. The offense went three quarters of the game without gaining a first down. The problems are not with the defense.

Let's all of you stop with the excuses now.

We can all admit this is not the 2022 defense. They have flaws and we can point them out. Therefore we also don't get to spend all our time blaming the offense like in 2022.

The defense was giving up multiple lengthy drives well before they should've been "getting tired".

 

[obfuscating]

Iowa’s defense forced them into long drives with the hope of getting a turnover and possible field goal instead of touchdowns. Too bad Iowa’s offense isn’t capable of these same things.

97 plays to 34
397 yards to 74
46 minutes to 14

Clearly, Phil’s fault.

There's blame to be laid all around, the vast majority is on the Offense (as usual).

 

[Libertylover]

Let's all of you stop with the excuses now.

We can all admit this is not the 2022 defense. They have flaws and we can point them out. Therefore we also don't get to spend all our time blaming the offense like in 2022.

The defense was giving up multiple lengthy drives well before they should've been "getting tired".

But they weren’t giving up many points when they were relatively fresh in first half. Points are what counts. Only bad thing about giving up long drives is the time of possession going to them, which eventually does wear out the defense. Our defense needs more help from offense than last year, but somehow the offense looks just as bad if not worse.

 

[Greenway4Prez]

This is a very good defense. But it isn’t elite, and it’s incredibly unfair that we are at a point where elite defense is required.

Very good, top 15/20-ish is MORE THAN ENOUGH for so, so, soooooo many teams.

 

[jonesy5960]

Let's all of you stop with the excuses now.

We can all admit this is not the 2022 defense. They have flaws and we can point them out. Therefore we also don't get to spend all our time blaming the offense like in 2022.

The defense was giving up multiple lengthy drives well before they should've been "getting tired".

We saw the exact same thing happen to last year's defense against Ohio State. This was basically a rerun of that game.