Attaboy, Sammy. Keep climbing, son!
Insert a ranked Grothus at 141 and throw in an improving Cooper, and we're talkin'!
Rankings 12/8
- Thread starter Spicolli
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Attaboy, Sammy. Keep climbing, son!
Insert a ranked Grothus at 141 and throw in an improving Cooper, and we're talkin'!
He may very well beat Clark. I had no problem with your argument. My response was more to IF Clark is on the other side he gets 5th, yada, yada, yada.
As stated, I haven't looked at any rankings. I may have read it wrong, but my understanding was that Clark was 2nd, hasn't lost, then #1 gets beat and Clark drops to 3rd? If that's true, you might imagine I'd have some trepidation about "rankers" and their purported "ability". Somebody has to do it, and somebody gets paid to do it. Doesn't mean they're good at it, like every other occupation on the planet.
To me rankings are interesting but often aren't even close to predicting where guys will finish in March and sometimes passionate fans get worked up when a guy is ranked lower than we predict they will finish. It does suck that Clark hasn't lost and yet he got bumped from #2 to #3, but I understand why. Clark got beat in the finals last year to Brewer (who lost once all year BTW). The final score was not as close as the match appeared to me. Garrett has been impressive at 133 this year and the fact that he beat Brewer (maybe not mauled him) convincingly, I don't see how the rankings go any other way. Clark can't bump Brewer because the last time they wrestled he lost. Garrett has to move past Brewer, because he beat him head to head. It certainly doesn't help Cory that thus far he has wrestled some unranked guys and has been held to a decision win. He can help himself out tomorrow night with a big win against Rutgers.
At the beginning of the season when I saw all the guys listed at 133, I had Garrett and Cory wrestling on Saturday night and I still see it playing out like that.
At the beginning of the season when I saw all the guys listed at 133, I had Garrett and Cory wrestling on Saturday night and I still see it playing out like that.
Come on dude this is so untrue that it woke me up without coffee.
It is always interesting how two people see things differently, and I'm not saying i'm right and your wrong, just that we saw the same match and came away with a different conclusion. Garrett was pushing the pace and taking ALL the shots pretty much the entire match. The only reason the match was close was on a shot by Garrett, he was stopped by Brewer and on the way up Brewer hit a nice lat drop for 6. Put him up 7-2 i believe. Brewer was called for stalling also if i recall (geez getting old sucks. I watched the match a few days ago and already can't remember everything). Garrett put on a takedown clinic on him after that, plus some back points and missed a lat drop of his own. I'd take Garrett in a rematch after what I saw.
Was just about to say the same thing. Where is it written that an undefeated wrestler can't be ranked ahead of another guy who beat him last year but has a loss this year? At some point, you have to start acknowledging results from this season.
You know, Clark had a pretty solid freshman year, too. For that matter, he was a 4x Iowa state champ. That has to count for something.
I'm voting Gilman number 1 at 133 on the strength of his two wins over Garrett last year. I got Matt McDonough at a close No. 2 based on his two victories over Nashon at World University trials. I slotted in Clark at No. 3 in light of his head-to-head results over Gilman in the room. That's how I see it.
Fair enough. I should probably watch the match again too. I attributed the last two Garrett takedowns to general Brewer sloppiness trying to pull out the victory, but maybe I am not giving Garrett enough credit for pushing the pace the whole way through. In any event, Clark should study the Garrett game plan if and when Clark meets up with Brewer again.
What look left said or me or both. And which part? There was a lotta stuff said.
I would temper your opinion of Garrett if you are basing it solely on Gilman vs. Garrett results last season. I know it is the Iowa mantra to not use any "excuses" but there is little doubt that Garrett's performance last season was affected by the weight cut. Gilman wrestled very well last season, and I don't mean it to sound like he couldn't have beaten Garrett regardless. Still, I don't think those results are a good measuring stick for where you rate Garrett THIS season..................
Flo's rationale:
We eventually landed on Nahshon at #1. Him doing what Clark couldn't (beat Brewer at his best) is ultimately what tipped the scales. We get more into the details in the podcast. Ultimately Nahshon beating Brewer isn't really grounds for Clark to pass Brewer.
Fair enough. At least it's a rationale, and not unreasonable. I'd prefer Clark be seeded #1 at NCAAs, but whoever is #1 will have a tough SF match-up as well (maybe Taylor of he's back and at full-speed). So I think the answer is simply for Clark to beat everybody at the weight, and it's a non-issue whether he's ranked/seeded 1, 2, 3, or 13.
We eventually landed on Nahshon at #1. Him doing what Clark couldn't (beat Brewer at his best) is ultimately what tipped the scales. We get more into the details in the podcast. Ultimately Nahshon beating Brewer isn't really grounds for Clark to pass Brewer.
Fair enough. At least it's a rationale, and not unreasonable. I'd prefer Clark be seeded #1 at NCAAs, but whoever is #1 will have a tough SF match-up as well (maybe Taylor of he's back and at full-speed). So I think the answer is simply for Clark to beat everybody at the weight, and it's a non-issue whether he's ranked/seeded 1, 2, 3, or 13.
You don't know Brewer was at his best(although he sure didn't remind me of Marstellar in any way during the match 
). Still, they are results from this season at the current weight influencing this season's rankings. It really doesn't matter now anyway. Clark will have a chance to probably build his RPI higher than both simply by wrestling the B1G schedule along with Midlands, National Duals and the B1G tournament. If he stays undefeated, with a similar match count to Garrett's, he may still very well get the top seed over Garrett come NCAA time........
). Still, they are results from this season at the current weight influencing this season's rankings. It really doesn't matter now anyway. Clark will have a chance to probably build his RPI higher than both simply by wrestling the B1G schedule along with Midlands, National Duals and the B1G tournament. If he stays undefeated, with a similar match count to Garrett's, he may still very well get the top seed over Garrett come NCAA time........Yup. That doesn't work. Not only was that last season but what if Brewer loses several more matches while Clark remains undefeated? Brewer is still ranked higher? And what if Clark beats someone that Brewer didn't? Then you have the whole transitive property issue. I don't think you can have any kind of respectable ranking using that as your criteria.
I guess it is fun to talk about but at the end of the day, rankings really don't matter.
I can also buy this rationale by Flo. Especially if they apply it as a rule in their rankings. Too early in the season to refute their decision, IMHO.
Again rankings lol you should know by now how I feel about them.
Just makes talk is all. Dam wish I could get paid to do something that I really have no control over. Win the matches when you wrestle that is how it is done.
Just makes talk is all. Dam wish I could get paid to do something that I really have no control over. Win the matches when you wrestle that is how it is done.
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