The Republican Plan to Steal the 2024 Presidential Election
- Thread starter What Would Jesus Do?
- Start date
A group of former top government officials called the Transition Integrity Project actually gamed four possible scenarios, including one that doesn’t look that different from 2016: a big popular win for Mr. Biden, and a narrow electoral defeat… They cast John Podesta, who was Hillary Clinton’s campaign chairman, in the role of Mr. Biden. They expected him, when the votes came in, to concede... But Mr. Podesta… shocked the organizers… he persuaded the governors of Wisconsin and Michigan to send pro-Biden electors to the Electoral College. In that scenario, California, Oregon, and Washington then threatened to secede from the United States if Mr. Trump took office…
News that Hillary Clinton’s former campaign chief rejected a legal election result, even in a hypothetical simulation, was obvious catnip to conservative media, which took about ten minutes to repackage Smith’s story using the same alarmist headline format marking earlier TIP write-ups. Breitbart published “Democrats’ ‘War Game’ for Election Includes West Coast Secession, Possible Civil War,” and a cascade of further red-state freakouts seemed inevitable.
“At that point,” says Nils Gilman, COO and EVP of Programs at the Berggruen Institute think tank, who served alongside Brooks as TIP’s other co-founder, “we decided we needed to be out about having run this exercise, to prevent the allegation that this was a ‘shadowy cabal’ — not that that narrative didn’t take hold anyways.”
The final TIP report was released the next day, August 3rd, 2020. Titled “Preventing a Disrupted Presidential Election and Transition,” the full text was, as any person attempting an objective read will grasp, sensational.
The Podesta episode was worse than reported, with the secession proposal coming on “advice from President Obama,” used as leverage to a) secure statehood for Washington, DC and Puerto Rico b) divide California into five states to increase its Senate representation, and c) “eliminate the Electoral College,” among other things.
The GOP is a domestic terrorist organization
What do you think of this trial balloon?
Would you hit the streets to protest the Democrats threatening to secede if we don’t alter the Constitution if they lose next time in the manner described?
Or would you confine yourself to a sharply worded letter to the editor?
HORT post doesn’t count, we do that at the drop of a hat.
The GOP has proven itself incompetent and unable to govern. And many of them are extremely dishonest and compromised.
You make no sense. The OP specifically warned of constitutionally dubious, democracy-hating attempts to overturn the results of a free and fair election. How is "you're just looking for excuses" a meaningful response to this?
Do you put Podesta’s play for secession in the table top in that category?
Are you quoting someone else?
Gus is Dead:
Making excuses already? You guys must really be afraid of what is gonna happen in November.
Me:
Reading comprehension level zero.
You:
Oh yeah, what about Podesta?
More like, “what about Hillary’s campaign chair ‘war gaming’ a secession attempt to try and leverage changes to the Constitution if they lose the electoral vote again.”
Does that fit in the category of ‘Constitutionally dubious attempts to overturn a fair and free election’?
Not sure about any Republican plan, but the Democrat plan to steal the election appears to be operating in full public view as we speak...
Democrats should just ignore this and do nothing to prepare.
Again, this has nothing to do with whether or not any of us here are trying to "make excuses."
We are pointing out the lengths to which we believe Republicans will almost certainly go (no hypothetically, most almost certainly) to overturn the election results if they don't like them.
We're not being like Trump - claiming if he loses it can only be because of fraud. We're warning what will happen if Biden wins.
Pretending to be stupid is not a winning argument. Just vote for Trump and talk to you buddies about how despicable the pedophilia Democrats are.
Good thing I didn’t say that then.
Democrats have game planned a secession attempt in response to a 2016 type electoral loss.
Does that fit in the category of ‘Constitutionally dubious attempts to overturn a fair and free election’?
Would you support it, or oppose it?
You randomly jumped into my response with GusIsDead in which he DID say that.
As for "game planned a succession". Lol.
It is bizarre how trump and his partners in crime say exactly what they plan and hope to do, yet his base either ignores it or doesn't understand it.
Secession.
I guess the Lol means you’d oppose the Democrats responding to a 2016 style loss with threats of secession?
Would you consider it traitorous?
Yes, but do you understand the difference between strategists hypothesizing various scenarios to see where they lead - regardless of the reality of those scenarios - versus politicians seriously suggesting those kinds of activities? I think you do, but you think it plays out better for you to pretend otherwise.
Let me help you out buddy. Because old Nelly isn’t the sharpest obviously. Or fluent in English anyway.
This is the question in the original post…
The Republican Plan to Steal the 2024 Presidential Election
“How likely do you think this is? (Assume Biden would win without this trickery.)”
Nothing about this question is assuming Biden wins. In fact it says wins without trickery. Implying that the trickery caused Biden to lose.So my post stands…. as posted. You are already making excuses that Trump stole his election win. Before he even has.
I already explained how you are misunderstanding. Nobody is making excuses for Biden potentially losing. They are speculating as to how far Republicans will go to overturn the results should Biden win.
Why are all MAGA not only piece of shit humans, but the dumbest people on the planet?
Idiocracy is a documentary
Idiocracy is a documentary
I expect a huge amount of lawfare in this election.
I don’t think they’re ’hypothesizing’ how to try and overturn an electoral loss for shits and giggles.
I remember when Democratic lawyers flooded into FL in 2000 with the ingenious plan to invalidate as many military ballots as they could in the hopes of tipping the election to Gore.
Now the Democrats are fighting to ‘save Democracy’ by conniving to keep people off the ballot. And not just Trump, did you see the latest news from Nevada?
We’re headed for Russian/Iranian style elections where the powers that be decide who is allowed on the ballot.
Employ armed Black Panthers to polling stations in the reddest districts.
Sorry. Re-read the OP. You're wrong. And the one that can't understand English.
"Assume Biden would win without this trickery. "
That means he loses with it.
Wait. You're saying that the Dems are finally - after 25 years of ceding the field to Rs - starting to use R tactics in a few places?
It's OK when Rs do it; clearly evil when Ds do it. Amirite?
I don't approve either way, but the Rs have already stolen 2 presidential elections this millennium. Sometimes fighting fire with fire is all that's left.
Yes, it is EXACTLY what the OP says:
1. Assume Biden wins.
2. Republicans could then refuse to certify elections.
3. Neither candidate gets 270 electors
4. Congress chooses the President
THE PREMISE IS THAT BIDEN WINS THE ELECTION. JFC.
Wrong.
The giveaway is the word "this" in the poll question qualifier.
The poll question only matters if Biden would win without R trickery. If Trump can win more-or-less honestly, then the trickery isn't needed.
Hene the admonition to assume Biden would win absent trickery.
The strategy outlined in the OP is the "trickery." The Rs have set the laws and machinery in place to execute that trickery in many places. It's there if they need it.
So the question is "IF they need that trickery to win, will they use it?"
If I had thought anyone would have had trouble understanding the obvious, I would have stated it differently, but it never occurred to me that anyone would be confused.
And "trickery" is defined as some state legislatures refusing to certify the vote.
So, the assumption is that Biden wins the actual vote. But he loses because the Republicans overturn the results.
I’m worried about the timeframe between Election Day and Inauguration Day if Trump wins.
The protests were bad in 2016 but this will be much worse. Will people storm the capital like the idiots did on Jan 6th…no, security will be very strong.
The USA isn’t ready for another Trump term. He needs to be defeated
The protests were bad in 2016 but this will be much worse. Will people storm the capital like the idiots did on Jan 6th…no, security will be very strong.
The USA isn’t ready for another Trump term. He needs to be defeated
State legislatures don’t have that role; they can define process before election day, but not after. Per federal law (ECRA), the certification is by the governor or other official designated under state law; this clarification was specifically intended to negate a legislative possibility.
So turning back to WWJD's original poll question once again, I explained yesterday that, assuming biden wins, and the R's are going to steal the election by causing a local official to refuse to certify results in their state, that as a practical matter requires a 'state official' in a battleground state that biden won to 'refuse to certify' the election so as to bring biden's ev's below a majority of those to be cast. In my previous analysis, I noted that the Secretaries of State in the battleground states are either democrats or republicans who in the most recent election refused to play that game, or are in states that Trump is highly likely to win anyway.
But in the interest of completeness, let's assume that state laws would bump that responsibility up to the governor. In the core battleground states of GA, MI, NV, NM, PA, and WI, the only R governors are Kemp (GA) and Lombardo (NV). Kemp didn't play this game the last time around. In NV, per nrs 298.075, Lombardo is not the designated official in NV. It's the (D) secretary of state. But either way, the likelihood of a Biden victory turning solely on either Nevada or Georgia, or even the two in combination, is extremely narrow.
And as to my second tier states of AZ, CO, FL, NC, and OH, again, the only R governors are FL and OH (like the SoS analysis), and it's likely trump wins those states anyway, or at least that Biden doesn't win 'because of' those states.
So having reconsidered my analysis in light of the governor issue and the state legislature angle raised by some, I'm not changing my original vote that the probability of the scenario described by WWJD being employed to steal the election is negligible.
i think they tried that in philly, but they were'nt very red even in the best of times
Well ok since you are the OP you certainly know what you intended to say. But I will say that the first post is highly confusing, hence my reply.
However, I am also irritated, that given the opacity of meaning, that some poster(s) would choose to attempt to question one's intelligence when alternate interpretations are possible. But such is the nature of GIAOT these days, I guess. Which is a microcosm of society overall IMO.
But you are assuming everything follows legal procedures. There are absolutely state legislatures ready to invoke “Independent State Legislature” theory to claim none of that matters, they have full authority to dismiss election results. The only thing that could stop them is the SCOTUS. And while I would not bet on SCOTUS upholding this dubious claim, I don’t see the chances as “negligible.”
In addition, I read the OP not as stating this is going to happen and will succeed . It is saying this is what the GOP will try; this is the plan if Trump loses.
And I believe that is a certainty.
Trump will lose the popular vote for the third consecutive time. Sorry to break it to you.
