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This might be a little tougher than Putin thought...

I'll believe it when he's dead.
Doesn't he have cancer or some other junk?
 
Why would they need to shoot instead of apprehend, unless the invader presented imminent threat to their lives or someone else’s?

But let’s assume your position, that the only enforcement is opening fire.
If you advertised a paid position to shoot people illegally entering the country, do you really think no one would sign up?
You’re the one who made the reference to eastern Europeans knowing how a wall works. Shooting is how it worked. You may be used to the where you’re from, but I’m not.
 
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You’re the one who made the reference to eastern Europeans knowing how a wall works. Shooting is how it worked. You may be used to the where you’re from, but I’m not.
Lived in West Germany from ‘83-‘85.
Saw the wall, minefield, tank traps, barbed wire and guard towers with my own eyes. They had these stands you could go up on to see over the wall into the worker’s paradise.
I still have my passport with the Checkpoint Charlie stamp, which has definitely become the coolest souvenir from that trip.
 
"Consider that this proposed provision could bring total congressional assistance to Ukraine to a staggering $116 billion since the beginning of the current Russo-Ukrainian War. Outside of the U.S. and China, this figure is more than any country’s annual defense budget. That alone should require substantial debate and a standalone vote."
 
"Consider that this proposed provision could bring total congressional assistance to Ukraine to a staggering $116 billion since the beginning of the current Russo-Ukrainian War. Outside of the U.S. and China, this figure is more than any country’s annual defense budget. That alone should require substantial debate and a standalone vote."
I do think debate is a good idea, as is accountability. I see no reason the lame duck congress can't do it though. Ukraine has had overwhelming bipartisan support throughout and and they should be able to work it out.
 
I do think debate is a good idea, as is accountability. I see no reason the lame duck congress can't do it though. Ukraine has had overwhelming bipartisan support throughout and and they should be able to work it out.
I think the funding is critical. It would be a major "oh f*ck" for Russia: (1) increased weapons for Ukraine; (2) dashes their hopes that we would lose interest and the will to stop them; (3) would buoy Ukraine's morale to know if they keep fighting like they have they will have the right resources; (4) would continue to serve as a bell cow for other western countries to keep on giving. It might result in them giving up earlier, because it guarantees a continued grinding of their army to dust and rust. Shit, it might completely obliterate it, to the extent it is not in Russia itself.
 
I think the funding is critical. It would be a major "oh f*ck" for Russia: (1) increased weapons for Ukraine; (2) dashes their hopes that we would lose interest and the will to stop them; (3) would buoy Ukraine's morale to know if they keep fighting like they have they will have the right resources; (4) would continue to serve as a bell cow for other western countries to keep on giving. It might result in them giving up earlier, because it guarantees a continued grinding of their army to dust and rust. Shit, it might completely obliterate it, to the extent it is not in Russia itself.
Agreed. This is very good military spending IMO. Grinding a major enemy down without putting American soldiers in harms way. Not only that, Ukraine and their soldiers WANT this. We aren't sending them to die for our selfish causes.
 
So, shooting any person who tries to cross the wall is how we would make it work on the southern border? That’s something that may work in an active war zone, but who will man that wall and shoot any man, woman or child trying to cross?

Republicans.
And they won't even think twice about it.
 
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This may be the missile landing in Poland-the description is worthless anti Ukraine propaganda.

 
"Consider that this proposed provision could bring total congressional assistance to Ukraine to a staggering $116 billion since the beginning of the current Russo-Ukrainian War. Outside of the U.S. and China, this figure is more than any country’s annual defense budget. That alone should require substantial debate and a standalone vote."
Man, that's crazy, according to some on the board we were only at 15% of that in late October. It must be inflation I guess.

You didn't address me, but as of October 20th, the US aid sits at $18.2B
 
"Consider that this proposed provision could bring total congressional assistance to Ukraine to a staggering $116 billion since the beginning of the current Russo-Ukrainian War. Outside of the U.S. and China, this figure is more than any country’s annual defense budget. That alone should require substantial debate and a standalone vote."
This is closer to the 54 billion I have read elsewhere.

"From January 24 to October 3, 2022, the United States provided around 52.3 billion euros in bilateral financial, humanitarian, and military aid to Ukraine in view of the Russian invasion that started in February 2022. The second-highest value of commitments was recorded from the European Union (EU) institutions, such as the Commission and the EU Council, at approximately 16.2 billion euros. "

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1303432/total-bilateral-aid-to-ukraine/

 
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What are you babbling about...Ukraine is still being funded.
Hopefully you are still posting this on 2/1/2023 assuming Putin isn't dead, and that the Russians haven't fully withdrawn. If neither of those things have happened, and we are counting on the steely spine of Kevin McCarthy to get funding through the House, then Ukrainian aid will be in doubt.
 
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Hopefully you are still posting this on 2/1/2023 assuming Putin isn't dead, and that the Russians haven't fully withdrawn. If neither of those things have happened, and we are counting on the steely spine of Kevin McCarthy to get funding through the House, then Ukrainian aid will be in doubt.
We’ll see…IMO there’s still enough R support to get aid through….if progressive D’s stay on board.

If I’m wrong I’ll admit as much.

I think Ukraine support is going to slowly erode across NATO if economies start to tank.
 
Hopefully you are still posting this on 2/1/2023 assuming Putin isn't dead, and that the Russians haven't fully withdrawn. If neither of those things have happened, and we are counting on the steely spine of Kevin McCarthy to get funding through the House, then Ukrainian aid will be in doubt.
The longer it goes, the worse economies get, the more support is going to erode regardless of political affiliation.
 
Agreed. This is very good military spending IMO. Grinding a major enemy down without putting American soldiers in harms way. Not only that, Ukraine and their soldiers WANT this. We aren't sending them to die for our selfish causes.
Further, you get to see how a lot of your equipment (and Russian equipment) operates in war-time conditions. That additional intel and training is valuable I'd imagine.
 
Hopefully you are still posting this on 2/1/2023 assuming Putin isn't dead, and that the Russians haven't fully withdrawn. If neither of those things have happened, and we are counting on the steely spine of Kevin McCarthy to get funding through the House, then Ukrainian aid will be in doubt.
Republicans own stock in Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Gurmman and Raytheon just like Democrat lawmakers. The funding will continue.
 
I'll believe it when he's dead.
Doesn't he have cancer or some other junk?
When you rule by fear and financial rewards you just gotta pay them a little more, or scare them a little more. You are right, Putin has insulated himself very, very well, but in the end everyone is vulnerable. Especially if he upsets the norms. He rules by deal making and arrangements to pillage by oligarchs. By changing the rules he makes himself vulnerable.
 
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