Trump told by Bill Barr and Pat Cipollone he cannot pardon himself.

[lucas80]

Interesting. Also, since Trump has bypassed the normal DoJ group for pardons, and Cipollone has done some work on them, who would draw one up if Cipollone refuses to?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/homenews/administration/533755-barr-white-house-counsel-told-trump-not-to-self-pardon-report?amp

 

[dgordo]

so unfair!

 

[Hawk and Awe]

I’d be willing to ignore all charges in exchange for him completely removing himself from the public eye. If we could also somehow require him to live in Mexico - even better

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

I’d be willing to ignore all charges in exchange for him completely removing himself from the public eye. If we could also somehow require him to live in Mexico - even better

I am Not sure about this - there are many wonderful places in Mexico.

Maybe if he lost his security detail and had to live in Juarez?

 

[LesClaypool]

Let’s not kid ourselves. There are plenty of Looneys on the Left. If you take away Trump’s security detail, that would almost certainly get him assassinated.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

Let’s not kid ourselves. There are plenty of Looneys on the Left. If you take away Trump’s security detail, that would almost certainly get him assassinated.

I don’t actually want the man to die. I want him to live a very long time, preferably in an inhospitable places where he pays for his many crimes - like Sing Sing. But I will accept Juarez as a viable alternative.

 

[tarheelbybirth]

Let’s not kid ourselves. There are plenty of Looneys on the Left. If you take away Trump’s security detail, that would almost certainly get him assassinated.

Probably a narrative you should put in your back pocket for a while.

 

[hawkdave007]

The more I've thought about this, the more I think the biggest barrier to the self pardon will be the fact that no one will write it up for him to sign.

So I also imagine he might scrawl something out on a note card in his Winnie the Pooh handwriting the day before leaving office.

 

[tarheelbybirth]

I’d be willing to ignore all charges in exchange for him completely removing himself from the public eye. If we could also somehow require him to live in Mexico - even better

Not a chance. It says, "If you're reprehensible enough, we'll let your crimes slide if you just go away".

 

[Hawk It Up]

Let’s not kid ourselves. There are plenty of Looneys on the Left. If you take away Trump’s security detail, that would almost certainly get him assassinated.

He watched as people were chanting they were going to hang his Veep. And still hasn’t, according to Pence himself, asked how Pence and his family are doing after they were sheltered.

And he has plenty of money to pay for a security detail.

 

[tarheelbybirth]

The more I've thought about this, the more I think the biggest barrier to the self pardon will be the fact that no one will write it up for him to sign.

So I also imagine he might scrawl something out on a note card in his Winnie the Pooh handwriting the day before leaving office.

View embedded media

Gonna have to take all his Sharpies away from him.

 

[SoFla-Hawkeye]

No way tRump is smart enough to understand a pardon does not protect him from state charges. I say pardon away as it will only make the look of horror better for television ratings when he is arrested.

 

[Hawk It Up]

John Karl (ABC), who typically has pretty solid sources, has been reporting that Cipollone told him, correctly, that accepting a pardon would open him up to civil litigation. Litigation that he would lose and cost him bigly.

And after he heard that he decided that he wouldn’t issue a self pardon. And since he couldn’t be pardoned, nobody else is gonna get one either. Which, in turn, is going to make a lot of people who crimed for him turn on him and rat him out. They aren’t going to prison for him after being told he was going to take care of them.

is it true? Dunno. But we’re gonna find out in the next 6-7 days.

I still think SCOTUS will defer to the DOJ memo of 1974 that POTUS can’t self pardon, because no individual can judge their own case. The know the gravity and impact of that memo. After all, they recuse themselves on a regular basis.

 

[win4jj]

Gonna have to take all his Sharpies away from him.

Better take his crayons away also.

 

[LesClaypool]

Probably a narrative you should put in your back pocket for a while.

I don’t get your point.

All I stated was a fact.

What’s your beef?

 

[ping72]

I’d be willing to ignore all charges in exchange for him completely removing himself from the public eye. If we could also somehow require him to live in Mexico - even better

I would not. I’m less worried about Trump than the more competent fascist potentially coming in the future.

We need to show everyone his crimes cannot and will not be tolerated or go unpunished. Otherwise there is basically zero risk for the next person to consider becoming a fascist.

And he has plenty of money to pay for a security detail.

I think you overestimate his available cash to spend.

 

[artradley]

John Karl (ABC), who typically has pretty solid sources, has been reporting that Cipollone told him, correctly, that accepting a pardon would open him up to civil litigation. Litigation that he would lose and cost him bigly.

And after he heard that he decided that he wouldn’t issue a self pardon. And since he couldn’t be pardoned, nobody else is gonna get one either. Which, in turn, is going to make a lot of people who crimed for him turn on him and rat him out. They aren’t going to prison for him after being told he was going to take care of them.

I read that, as well, and it makes sense.

OTOH, Trump is stupid enough, and delusional enough, to think he can issue a pardon for himself and stipulate it also frees him from civil and state charges. And if he does it, you can bet the GOP will be filled with people agreeing with him.

 

[Hawk It Up]

I would not. I’m less worried about Trump than the more competent fascist potentially coming in the future.

We need to show everyone his crimes cannot and will not be tolerated or go unpunished. Otherwise there is basically zero risk for the next person to consider becoming a fascist.



I think you overestimate his available cash to spend.

He’s grifted millions, perhaps as much as 100 million, from his idiot base since Election Day.

When the RNC was begging people for money for Loeffler and Perdue (who are 2 of the richest Senators, BTW) he was scraping 75 cents of every incoming dollar for himself.

 

[millah_22]

Demanding the ability to pardon yourself is something innocent people do.

 

[millah_22]

I’d be willing to ignore all charges in exchange for him completely removing himself from the public eye. If we could also somehow require him to live in Mexico - even better

Pass. Lock him up.

 

[lucas80]

I would not. I’m less worried about Trump than the more competent fascist potentially coming in the future.

We need to show everyone his crimes cannot and will not be tolerated or go unpunished. Otherwise there is basically zero risk for the next person to consider becoming a fascist.



I think you overestimate his available cash to spend.

I don't know about the cash, he seems like a guy who burns through cash really fast. Like guy with a big fancy jet with your name on it fast.
The other comment deserves a response. I too fear a more competent fascist in waiting. A smooth talker like Cruz or Hawley who will be more palatable to the monied folks, and corporations. What Trump has is an innate ability to find the words people want to hear, and an incredible feral like ability to sense opportunity, and to move away without emotion. That level of mental deformity will hopefully be hard do replicate.

 

[lucas80]

The more I've thought about this, the more I think the biggest barrier to the self pardon will be the fact that no one will write it up for him to sign.

So I also imagine he might scrawl something out on a note card in his Winnie the Pooh handwriting the day before leaving office.

View embedded media

I doubt a pardon is 100 percent original for each one that is issued. There are a few lawyers around Trump who can do some research (If they haven't already), and produce something that would work. But, I do think there are cultists left who will produce what he asks for, assuming he does ask.

 

[Hawk It Up]

I don't know about the cash, he seems like a guy who burns through cash really fast. Like guy with a big fancy jet with your name on it fast.
The other comment deserves a response. I too fear a more competent fascist in waiting. A smooth talker like Cruz or Hawley who will be more palatable to the monied folks, and corporations. What Trump has is an innate ability to find the words people want to hear, and an incredible feral like ability to sense opportunity, and to move away without emotion. That level of mental deformity will hopefully be hard do replicate.

Someone equally as evil with an IQ larger than a chimp can do a hell of a lot more damage than this shitstain.

 

[BABiscuit]

Not a chance. It says, "If you're reprehensible enough, we'll let your crimes slide if you just go away".

It also will solidify to his base that everything was a witch hunt if you just drop it once he's out of power. Everything needs to come out. I'm not saying he has to go to prison, but the Dems need to make it clear that their outrage and investigations were righteous. If they just its time to move on for the sake of unity I will be so pissed off. Because it won't unify. It will just harden his base. And you know Trump won't just shut his mouth and consider himself luck Dems are spineless. He'll be the one shouting to his base that the Dems were lying the entire time from the Russian hoax to impeachment to stealing the election.

 

[HawkRugged17]

 

[Hawk and Awe]

Not a chance. It says, "If you're reprehensible enough, we'll let your crimes slide if you just go away".

It’s never going to happen - so no worries. People will try to charge him. And of course I was kidding by suggesting we should just let him walk away.

However.... the biggest penalty he personally could suffer and what would be the best for the country is if he lost his support. The PGA pulling out of having a tournament at his club was awesome. We need more of that

 

[tumorboy]

If he pardons himself or anyone related to the riot. It is an admission of guilt. Civil lawsuits will absolutely crush people who accept them.

 

[Obviously Oblivious]

He’s grifted millions, perhaps as much as 100 million, from his idiot base since Election Day.

When the RNC was begging people for money for Loeffler and Perdue (who are 2 of the richest Senators, BTW) he was scraping 75 cents of every incoming dollar for himself.

Forbes estimates that Trump and his various business holdings and properties have debt obligations that will come due over the next 4 years that total nearly 1 BILLION USD. He better grift harder!

 

[Hawk It Up]

Forbes estimates that Trump and his various business holdings and properties have debt obligations that will come due over the next 4 years that total nearly 1 BILLION USD. He better grift harder!

Deutsch Bank and another bank shut him off yesterday.

And stripe, who he has been using to handle donations ended their services as well.

 

[lucas80]

Forbes estimates that Trump and his various business holdings and properties have debt obligations that will come due over the next 4 years that total nearly 1 BILLION USD. He better grift harder!

He cannot pay off the loans, so what happens? Who buys that poisonous debt?

 

[Obviously Oblivious]

He cannot pay off the loans, so what happens? Who buys that poisonous debt?

If it comes down to that, they'll likely move to acquire his highly leveraged assets. He technically owns many of his properties outright and I'd guess most of those are pledged as collateral in his various debt arrangements.

 

[lucas80]

If it comes down to that, they'll likely move to acquire his highly leveraged assets. He technically owns many of his properties outright and I'd guess most of those are pledged as collateral in his various debt arrangements.

That doesn't happen to alphas.
I hope some day we learn who he owes money to. Everyone that he owes money to. Who his partners are in some of those golf courses. It's just deplorable.