We Told You the Truth about Covid (and a Whole Lot More)
- Thread starter hawkland14
- Start date
Protection from infection
- Yep; vaccines do that
protection from transmission
- Yep; they do that, too
protection from hospitalization
- Yep; they are quite effective at this
protection from death
- Yep; very effective at this
superior protection vs natural transmission
- What is "natural transmission"? Vaccines have no impact on natural or (whatever you call) unnatural transmission.
- They do lower transmission rates, by shortening infectiousness periods, along with some viral shedding occuring with already attached antibodies
So, why are you bitching about them?
LOL!!! He is the Phucking President. It's Kind of like how you fixate on everything Trump has said (and for good reason) Just Amazing
They also appear to lower your risks for long-term sequelae....e.g. Long Covid
And, as this virus continues to mutate, it may well be necessary to get an updated booster every year or so; we do not yet know or understand how this will play out. Right now, my PCP is recommending the bi-valent boosters to all his patients who are eligible to get them.
The argument that "natural infection is superior" is silly, because you take on those higher risks for heart issues and long-covid (or other heart/kidney conditions that may arise); you'll get exposed to this virus whether you have been vaccinated, or not. And vaccination + infection will almost certainly convey better protection overall, while at the same time lowering your risks for these other health problems/conditions we KNOW the virus causes.
Scientists are already linking higher mortality rates to prior Covid infections, due to those sequelae. And, when vaccines might drop your risks of those sequelae in half or better, they are a pretty good hedge against future Covid-related health problems.
One question from these 4 reports is whether the excess in major cardiovascular outcomes is influenced by vaccination, since none of the studies above provided insight about that important matter. We have 2 recent studies that replicate, one from South Korea’s national database and the other from the United States NIH Consortium known as N3C (National COVID Cohort Collaborative, National Center for Advancing Translation Sciences), both showing approximate halving of heart attack and stroke for people vaccinated compared with matched unvaccinated controls.
So, you agree, he's neither a scientist, nor a physician.
I would never have gone with my own immune system as I HAVE pre-existing conditions.They also appear to lower your risks for long-term sequelae....e.g. Long Covid
And, as this virus continues to mutate, it may well be necessary to get an updated booster every year or so; we do not yet know or understand how this will play out. Right now, my PCP is recommending the bi-valent boosters to all his patients who are eligible to get them.
The argument that "natural infection is superior" is silly, because you take on those higher risks for heart issues and long-covid (or other heart/kidney conditions that may arise); you'll get exposed to this virus whether you have been vaccinated, or not. And vaccination + infection will almost certainly convey better protection overall, while at the same time lowering your risks for these other health problems/conditions we KNOW the virus causes.
Scientists are already linking higher mortality rates to prior Covid infections, due to those sequelae. And, when vaccines might drop your risks of those sequelae in half or better, they are a pretty good hedge against future Covid-related health problems.
One question from these 4 reports is whether the excess in major cardiovascular outcomes is influenced by vaccination, since none of the studies above provided insight about that important matter. We have 2 recent studies that replicate, one from South Korea’s national database and the other from the United States NIH Consortium known as N3C (National COVID Cohort Collaborative, National Center for Advancing Translation Sciences), both showing approximate halving of heart attack and stroke for people vaccinated compared with matched unvaccinated controls.
I don't believe I said he was either of those. But, when the President goes on National TV to tell me something about something so serious (knowing he has the best doctors and specialist behind him (Fauci)....then I do tend to take that seriously.
Long-term cardiovascular outcomes of COVID-19 - Nature Medicine
Individuals with COVID-19 are at increased long-term risk for a wide range of cardiovascular disorders, even for individuals who were not hospitalized during the acute phase of the infection.
www.nature.com
We show that, beyond the first 30 d after infection, individuals with COVID-19 are at increased risk of incident cardiovascular disease spanning several categories, including cerebrovascular disorders, dysrhythmias, ischemic and non-ischemic heart disease, pericarditis, myocarditis, heart failure and thromboembolic disease. These risks and burdens were evident even among individuals who were not hospitalized during the acute phase of the infection and increased in a graded fashion according to the care setting during the acute phase (non-hospitalized, hospitalized and admitted to intensive care). Our results provide evidence that the risk and 1-year burden of cardiovascular disease in survivors of acute COVID-19 are substantial. Care pathways of those surviving the acute episode of COVID-19 should include attention to cardiovascular health and disease.
Make sure you get regular/annual checkups; vaccines APPEAR to lower the risks of heart-related issues from Covid infection; but they still cannot protect entirely. This is one of the take-home messages from that Nature article & the analysis Eric Topol posted.
This is potentially shaping up to be a long-term problem, for many.
Irrespective of your vaccination status; you just may have better odds if you keep up to date on them.
Believe me, if I saw data that the vaccines were causing higher rates of heart problems than the virus, this would be a much different discussion, and much more complex decision equation. That is not what I have read, though; vaccines may increase your risks for myo/pericarditis. But if you get exposed, those risks are almost certainly lower. And it is doubtful any of us are going to escape exposure to this virus in our lifetimes, let alone the next few years.
I suspect I was exposed in January, as I had weird dry-mouth and inside-the-mouth sores almost like canker sores. That seems to be something that about 1-in-5 people who get Covid have. I had zero other symptoms, and that's mostly gone away over the past month. Never bothered to get a test; I just donned a mask when going out into stores to minimize the risk of spreading to someone else. And I had my bi-valent booster before the holidays.
I still can't believe we are in this situation. It is just so scary and I fear that our kids will deal with worse then us. I am very thankful for the vaccine.
It's why it is frustrating to hear people claim "Covid is over"
Certainly, the worst of our needed mitigations are "over" in shutting things down. But the virus is here to stay, and we still have many months, if not years, of learning what those long-term implications look like.
One of my concerns is all the anti-vax backlash, which only serves to heighten the risks for people for long-term problems.
And if that spills over to things like "measles vaccines", it's gonna be much much worse. Few people realize that measles, itself, is not terribly deadly; BUT, we now understand that a measles infection w/o a vaccine effectively "erases" your immune system memory. People who die after a measles infection die of some other bacterial or viral infection they were previously immune to/exposed to. Because measles makes your long term immune memory disappear.
This seems to rarely be talked about with regard to "measles vaccines", etc.
Measles and Immune Amnesia | ASM.org
Measles is much more serious than a rash and fever: it also causes immune amnesia and leaves patients especially vulnerable to secondary infection.
Measles: The race to understand 'immune amnesia'
Scientists have known for years that measles can alter the immune system – but the latest evidence suggests it's less of a mild tweaking, and more of a total reset.
www.bbc.com
Enter "immune amnesia", a mysterious phenomenon that's been with us for millennia, though it was only discovered in 2012. Essentially, when you're infected with measles, your immune system abruptly forgets every pathogen it's ever encountered before – every cold, every bout of flu, every exposure to bacteria or viruses in the environment, every vaccination. The loss is near-total and permanent. Once the measles infection is over, current evidence suggests that your body has to re-learn what's good and what's bad almost from scratch.
Measles Immune Suppression: Lessons from the Macaque Model
Author Summary Measles is associated with a transient immune suppression, resulting in increased susceptibility to opportunistic infections. Indeed, the main causes of measles mortality are secondary infections in the respiratory and digestive tract. Although measles is associated with...
Agreed.....It's why it is frustrating to hear people claim "Covid is over"
Certainly, the worst of our needed mitigations are "over" in shutting things down. But the virus is here to stay, and we still have many months, if not years, of learning what those long-term implications look like.
One of my concerns is all the anti-vax backlash, which only serves to heighten the risks for people for long-term problems.
And if that spills over to things like "measles vaccines", it's gonna be much much worse. Few people realize that measles, itself, is not terribly deadly; BUT, we now understand that a measles infection w/o a vaccine effectively "erases" your immune system memory. People who die after a measles infection die of some other bacterial or viral infection they were previously immune to/exposed to. Because measles makes your long term immune memory disappear.
This seems to rarely be talked about with regard to "measles vaccines", etc.
Measles and Immune Amnesia | ASM.org
Measles is much more serious than a rash and fever: it also causes immune amnesia and leaves patients especially vulnerable to secondary infection.asm.org
Measles: The race to understand 'immune amnesia'
Scientists have known for years that measles can alter the immune system – but the latest evidence suggests it's less of a mild tweaking, and more of a total reset.
Enter "immune amnesia", a mysterious phenomenon that's been with us for millennia, though it was only discovered in 2012. Essentially, when you're infected with measles, your immune system abruptly forgets every pathogen it's ever encountered before – every cold, every bout of flu, every exposure to bacteria or viruses in the environment, every vaccination. The loss is near-total and permanent. Once the measles infection is over, current evidence suggests that your body has to re-learn what's good and what's bad almost from scratch.
Measles Immune Suppression: Lessons from the Macaque Model
Author Summary Measles is associated with a transient immune suppression, resulting in increased susceptibility to opportunistic infections. Indeed, the main causes of measles mortality are secondary infections in the respiratory and digestive tract. Although measles is associated with...journals.plos.org
There is NO flu data in the link you provided, idiot. No flu data, no flu data, no flu data, keep repeating. You got it from Faust, own it.
COVID-19 Provisional Counts - Weekly Updates by Select Demographic and Geographic Characteristics
Tabulated data on provisional COVID-19 deaths by age, sex, race and Hispanic origin, and comorbidities. Also includes an index of state-level and county-level mortality data available for download.
www.cdc.gov
It's right there in the table, Cletus.
Do you not realize that "influenza" = "flu" or something?
Table 1. Deaths involving coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19), pneumonia, and influenza reported to NCHS by time-period, jurisdiction of occurence, sex and age-group.
Are kinds likely to die from either? NOPE. But we're just going to keep the panic alive for some dumb reason.
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What does the person who is okay with killing them in the womb care what anyone feels after the fact?
I gave you the specifics in the post lol. Thanks for posting it again and proving the number YOU are using are incorrect. YOU DID THE SAME THING FAUST DID! Hahahaha you're so stupid!This is utter comedy here.
The screencaps you used are from 2022. The data I'd posted is from January 2023.
Here is the actual thread to posted this BS from:
Here are 3 posts I made in January, 2023, from the link I'd provided to you, with the provisional deaths numbers at the time (they have updated since then)
January 6, 2023:
Is COVID a Common Cold Yet?
In multivariable analysis,the bivalent vaccinated state was independently associated with lower risk of COVID-19 (HR, .70; 95%C.I., .61-.80), leading to an estimated vaccine effectiveness (VE) of 30% (95% CI, 20-39%). Compared to last exposure to SARS-CoV-2 within 90 days, last exposure 6-9...iowa.forums.rivals.com
January 7, 2023:
Study Finds Inflammatory Heart Condition Myocarditis in 37 of 1,597 (2.3%) B1G Athletes After They Tested Positive for Covid
Or you’re a hyper-partisan nut job who has been radicalized by right-wing propaganda. MAGA = mental illness Not sure why you try to debate with someone who has a mental illness
January 8, 2023:
The coronavirus is speaking. It’s saying it’s not done with us.
Eric Topol is a professor of molecular medicine at Scripps Research. There’s no sugar-coating it: The world has let its guard down on covid-19. And the virus’s latest dominant form, XBB.1.5, makes clear that we’re doing so just as the virus finds new ways to hurt us. The new dominant strain...
So, specifically, HOW did I "copy" something from Faust, when he clearly did not have any of the 2022 full-year data in May of 2022 when your anti-vaxx Covidiot made those twitter posts.
I've reposted the data from that same CDC site since January, and used the updated numbers, since the data come in sporadically and often delayed by months. And this is due to county coroners passing the deaths information on to state systems, which then report them to CDC. And that process can take many weeks for final numbers to be recorded. Some states get that info to CDC within a week or so; others are much slower.
As you can clearly see, I've posted this Covid vs influenza data on this board as of nearly 2 months ago. So, if your claim is "I got it from Faust", then go find where Faust has posted the EXACT numbers I provided to you, before I did it.
And, your earlier claims (and this twitter troll's claims) that covid is tested more than flu are complete BS. If a child dies from flu or Covid, they've been tested for it, because when they get THAT sick, antivirals targeting the specific disease are used to keep them alive. They do not "guess" that a very sick child has influenza, they TEST for it, and they give that kid the best antiviral meds they can find.
Idiot.
Q.E.D.
Except one you might get if you contract the virus by chance, the other is russian roulette with a forced poisonous injection.
Yet Covid remains around the #5 killer of children. And #1 for respiratory diseases.
Chance? No
If you interact with people in public places, you will be exposed to Covid.
Which aren't remotely related to the data I'd posted OR the link I'd provided. That you STILL cannot seem to identify where the "influenza" data are located.
fixed it, but you obviously deciphered the code because you responded to it. So well done.
What did I "decipher"? I asked you to try again in a complete English sentence.
None of the policies(mask mandates,lockdowns,school closures) you are talking about did nothing to stop the spread of Covid or prevent anyone from getting it. They did ruin an entire generation of kids and closed businesses permanently.
They did not "stop"the spread. Nothing did.
They "slowed" the spread.
They DID prevent people from getting it.
They bought time until kids could be vaccinated, preventing them from the long term risks presented by the virus, which are only now becoming apparent.
Joe is either mentally ill or he is a propagandist. He cannot believe the things he is pushing here still unless he is one or the other. Maybe both
No Joe.... as much as you wish you were the smartest guy in the room here there are Many well educated people who have come out and said our handling of covid and our over reaction to covid actually hurt us.
What you are well versed in is the material that confirms the beliefs you already hold. Much like why the science community lost credibility you don't seem to be able to adapt with new information.
The dorks that though they were going to save the world from the big bad virus, save grandma and the babies with face diapers, were found to not actually know what the **** they were talking about when they needed to.
You yourself have already retreated to accepting they needed to tell everyone partial truths, that's propaganda.
You fell for it bro, and you don't seem to have the ego or confidence to admit you were wrong.
Keep crying about those .0001% babies that die though, meanwhile 3 years later we are still slitting our own wrist to avoid the scary sniffles.
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Please dear baby Jesus, make the next pandemic be super deadly so that gullible, sheeple, anti-mask/antivaxxers like Whiskey, Finance, et. al will die off first thusly removing their stupid DNA from our gene pool. Idiocracy is actually happening folks and it is them. I'm not asking for much folks.....just something akin to the Spanish Flu, except instead of 50+ million people around the world, we need at least that amount just in this country alone, because for whatever reason (*cough* MAGA *cough*) , unlike the rest of the civilized world this country if full of complete moros.
As George Carlin once said - "Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that."
Scary Stuff.
Covid being cheered on by the outcast, rejects, and social losers was its greatest ally. It gave the people passed over by society a chance to stay indoors, cover up with mask, and shame people with the ability to think for themselves under the name of science.
Science where only a portion of the information was being released.
You claim the "sheeple" are people who have wanted to be able to fly without showing vaccination status. That makes sense to you?
Your savior against the big bad bully or the kid you always wanted to be but couldn't is now a virus to, in your head, make things right. Think about that.
Change your pants.
You are really becoming pathetic. I'm not sure of the cause, but it's really sad.
It's more likely that people will die because they trust a government who misleads them, or now distrust a government that has lied to them.
You be you. It's easy to be miserable on a message board.
FWIW, I got 2 jabs as soon as I was eligible. My personal physician advised not get another one. I dutifully wore masks, and probably have around 50 in my collection.
Like the folks YOU voted for who pushed HCQ and ivermectin? And bashed vaccines?
You seem to be totally 'ok' with those folks...
The amount of covid corruption was insane; will only get worse with incoming ‘bird flu’ stupidity.
www.dw.com
dailysceptic.org
Thus, in a highly unusual arrangement, the PEI (Germany’s version of our FDA) allowed BioNTech to initiate clinical (i.e., human) testing of COVID-19 vaccine candidates before a preclinical toxicology study on animals had even been completed, based merely on “interim results”. The details of this arrangement are documented in my article here. As likewise discussed in that article, other categories of more systematic preclinical testing, so-called safety pharmacological studies, were simply skipped altogether.
COVID: BioNTech to pay $1.2 billion over vaccine royalties – DW – 12/28/2024
German pharmaceutical company BioNTech has agreed to pay a combined sum of more than $1.2 billion to resolve separate disputes over royalty payments related to its COVID-19 vaccine.
www.dw.com
Vaccine Safety Concerns Sparked by Cosy Relationship Between BioNTech and German Regulator – The Daily Sceptic
Safety concerns with the Pfizer-BioNTech Covid vaccine have been sparked by revelations of the cosy relationship between BioNTech and the German regulator which approved it for release.
dailysceptic.org
Thus, in a highly unusual arrangement, the PEI (Germany’s version of our FDA) allowed BioNTech to initiate clinical (i.e., human) testing of COVID-19 vaccine candidates before a preclinical toxicology study on animals had even been completed, based merely on “interim results”. The details of this arrangement are documented in my article here. As likewise discussed in that article, other categories of more systematic preclinical testing, so-called safety pharmacological studies, were simply skipped altogether.
