Is it fair to say Spencer Lee is one of the best high school wrestlers ever? He only had one scholastic loss. Three state titles. Won a cadet and two junior world championships. Who compares to that? Is anyone better?
Where does Spencer rank among the greatest high school wrestlers?
- Thread starter Kinnick.At.Night
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I've been going to PA States for the last 30+ years. Even though he lost in the finals his Sr. year (obviously due, in heavy part, to having the guts to wrestle through a serious knee injury), I have him 2nd to Cary Kolat in my time of watching PA wrestling. He was absolutely phenomenal. We all saw what he can do when healthy at nationals last year. It was not the least bit surprising to me to see him dominate at the next level.
Lee was better than Kolat. Never saw a healthy Lee lose in high school...crazy his accomplishments in free but nobody was touching him in folk. Bono beat Kolat at the dapper dan...at least in my mind. Bono is someone who could (and should’ve) beat Kolat in high school. I can’t name one person who would’ve beaten Lee.
I do not think so, but that was a different time in terms of age level worlds. He did place at Midlands.
How about Daton Fix who did beat him?
I’m talking folk. But for arguments sake, Lee bumped up for that and IMO pissed away two leads trying to kill him. And Spencer has beaten him before too. Would you take daton in a folkstyle match against Spencer?
No, but I also wouldn’t take Rivera and wouldn’t take Bono over Kolat.
Honestly, it's just a matter of opinion. Freestyle wasn't big like it is today. Kolat beat college All-Americans at Midlands, taking third when he was a sophomore in college. It's really hard to compare, but, I just thought Kolat was more impressive in style. Again though, I have no issue with someone taking Lee over Kolat. They were both incredible. (Chance Marsteller was pretty damn impressive too!)
So Rivera against Spencer in high school? Absolute slaughter. I watched bono against Kolat in high school...if I watched Rivera against Lee at any point in high school...hmmm. I’m just saying I can name at least one person who gave it to Kolat while he was in high school and I love Kolat. He’s one of the greats and easily top 3 but not number 1 as far as I’m concerned. I watched a few beat fix in folk as well. Wasn’t one a PA boy? Karam? Either way, it took a shot knee and mono for Lee to lose (no offense Austin, nothing but love for you and your style. In the end, it’s just my opinion really. Kolat was great. There are a few who make the list.
This is exactly the type of thread that I come to this board for. Insightful dialogue amongst knowledgeable Iowa fans on wrestling history, without some knucklehead PSU fan interjecting their biased opinion turning it into a dumpster fire.
Mark Hall.
Mark Hall.
Hard to top Mark Hall. What he did was unbelievable including international competition. We're talking a 6 time State Champion. That said, if only talking folk, Lee is there despite the ACL. A true shame. Take that away and I seriously believe he would have decked Desanto. Yes, Spence is that good.
My opinion very difficult to say if these guys were the best all time. There were a few old time guys that could never be touched in HS or college. These guys have a much better opportunity to compete across the nation and world wide. Not being from PA I watch as much previous recorded matches online as Time allows and there is no doubt in my mind both Kolat and Lee would be in the conversations best HS wrestlers All time.
In the last 30 years There have been many 5 time state champions but You cannot compare Winning championships in any other state to PA the depth of talent is tremendous.
In the last 30 years There have been many 5 time state champions but You cannot compare Winning championships in any other state to PA the depth of talent is tremendous.
Didn’t Hall re-take a grade in junior high? If that’s right, I can only credit him with 5 as you shouldn’t be able to red-shirt in middle school.
I’d put an asterisk next to the last one, as he should have been in college.
Again, I don't think there is a wrong answer. Kolat tied Bono in an exhibition match. Honestly, I don't put as much into those matches, as different kids put in different training for those. I'm not making excuses, just saying no one came close to beating him in any other match. He was 4-time state champ AND 4-time O.W.
I keep coming back to the fact that Kolat took 3rd at Midlands in 10TH GRADE!!!!! That is is simply unheard of.
Somebody local with mentioning is Jeff McGinness. Undefeated, four time state champion at four weights. Won cadet and junior national titles. I'm pretty sure he won a world junior title in 1992 also, which puts him with very selective company. There's a strong argument that he's the best high schooler in Iowa history.
Some interesting stuff in here:
https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/5046117-the-legend-of-cary-kolat
https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/5046117-the-legend-of-cary-kolat
I found this on Kolat. After reading this, I think he's got to be #1 for high schoolers. He beat an NCAA champion as a high school junior! Unreal.
1. Cary Kolat (Pennsylvania)
While picking the top 20 among so many worthy contenders was difficult, picking No. 1 was actually quite easy. None have excelled so early as Cary Kolat. First, there is the fact that Kolat racked up a 137-0 ledger on his way to four state titles in wrestling-rich Pennsylvania. Moreover, Kolat placed at the Midlands as a sophomore and as a junior, back when that tournament was as tough as the NCAAs. Among his great achievements in that tournament were pinning NCAA All-American Shawn Charles -- and actually wrestling a 1-0 bout with Olympian Ken Chertow his junior year. Chertow, ironically enough, had a much easier time with NCAA champion Terry Brands in the finals that year than he did with the junior in high school from Rices Landing, Pennsylvania.
Kolat even showed he could compete at the very highest level by placing at the U.S. Open. Beating top senior level competition in high school was almost commonplace for Kolat. For example, as a junior in high school, in an open tournament, Kolat won easily over NCAA champion Sean O'Day.
Kolat had a mystique about him in high school that made it inconceivable that he would ever lose. Even other great wrestlers seemed to say his name with what might be described as reverence. Like Hahn, Kolat was so good coming out of high school that many would consider collegiate career -- two-time NCAA champion, four-time top-three finisher, and his international career -- Olympian, two time world medalist -- a disappointment. He was two upset losses away from being a four-time NCAA champion, and an entire article could be written about how he was robbed by FILA out of being a multiple-time world and Olympic champion. Clearly, however, in measuring the high school careers of all wrestlers, Kolat is my pick for best of the past 20 years.
http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/179/20-best-high-school-wrestlers-over-the-past-20-years
1. Cary Kolat (Pennsylvania)
While picking the top 20 among so many worthy contenders was difficult, picking No. 1 was actually quite easy. None have excelled so early as Cary Kolat. First, there is the fact that Kolat racked up a 137-0 ledger on his way to four state titles in wrestling-rich Pennsylvania. Moreover, Kolat placed at the Midlands as a sophomore and as a junior, back when that tournament was as tough as the NCAAs. Among his great achievements in that tournament were pinning NCAA All-American Shawn Charles -- and actually wrestling a 1-0 bout with Olympian Ken Chertow his junior year. Chertow, ironically enough, had a much easier time with NCAA champion Terry Brands in the finals that year than he did with the junior in high school from Rices Landing, Pennsylvania.
Kolat even showed he could compete at the very highest level by placing at the U.S. Open. Beating top senior level competition in high school was almost commonplace for Kolat. For example, as a junior in high school, in an open tournament, Kolat won easily over NCAA champion Sean O'Day.
Kolat had a mystique about him in high school that made it inconceivable that he would ever lose. Even other great wrestlers seemed to say his name with what might be described as reverence. Like Hahn, Kolat was so good coming out of high school that many would consider collegiate career -- two-time NCAA champion, four-time top-three finisher, and his international career -- Olympian, two time world medalist -- a disappointment. He was two upset losses away from being a four-time NCAA champion, and an entire article could be written about how he was robbed by FILA out of being a multiple-time world and Olympic champion. Clearly, however, in measuring the high school careers of all wrestlers, Kolat is my pick for best of the past 20 years.
http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/179/20-best-high-school-wrestlers-over-the-past-20-years
A little before my time but Jimmy Carr has to be at or near the top. Made the Olympics as a HS junior. Won Midlands while in HS as well.
I thought Bono got jobbed too. Bono rode him like a mule and didn't get any back points...when he should have.
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Wow that absolutely should have been back points. What were they looking at.
We all know Dan Gable would be in this conversation but only had I believe 64-0 record.
Buddy Arndt is a name I wish I knew more about but I have read that he would be in this conversation.
Dan Hodge was never taken down in college I don’t know much of his HS career but he must have been very good.
Jimmy Carr made the US world team at the age of 16 won the Midlands in HS beating an ncaa champ in the finals he was 17.
Where would guys like Metcalf,Mocco,Snyder fit in.
Buddy Arndt is a name I wish I knew more about but I have read that he would be in this conversation.
Dan Hodge was never taken down in college I don’t know much of his HS career but he must have been very good.
Jimmy Carr made the US world team at the age of 16 won the Midlands in HS beating an ncaa champ in the finals he was 17.
Where would guys like Metcalf,Mocco,Snyder fit in.
Bono had uncommon strength. He also played nose tackle on a state championship football team. Weighing about 150 pounds. In the state of Florida. He was a beast.
I'd have to put AC Slater up there! He did commit to Iowa ya know 
He was never taken down??? Wow, the wrestling in PA must not be very good
Theres an argument that can be made for several wrestlers but Id choose Cary Kolat. He was simply so dominant and the "flip" made his legend untouchable imo.
Aside from Lee's loss to Desanto, which should have an asterisk since his knee was an obvious mess, Lee is right up there. And you'd have to put Suriano in this conversation too since the 2 split their 2 matches. Dont know what other losses Suriano had but he went 159-0 in NJ
Id also throw in Mocco as the most intimidating
Bottom line.. Kolat #1, Lee #2 is ez to accept for me
Aside from Lee's loss to Desanto, which should have an asterisk since his knee was an obvious mess, Lee is right up there. And you'd have to put Suriano in this conversation too since the 2 split their 2 matches. Dont know what other losses Suriano had but he went 159-0 in NJ
Id also throw in Mocco as the most intimidating
Bottom line.. Kolat #1, Lee #2 is ez to accept for me
Mine is easy since I went against him in high school. Well got beat by him. Joey Gilbert out of Illinois. Holy God. That boy was an animal. He was an insane wrestler. So damn strong. Look sometime at the Big 10’s with he and Coach Brands. Difference was I couldn’t get off my back like Coach did!
