80% support voter ID

[Hawkman34]

It's a claim that poorer people will not have readily available access, and that it will be difficult for them to obtain one. Particularly if they do not have internet or regular transportation, because now you're requiring them to take a half a day or more to go get a photo ID.

Will they send trucks out to retirement homes to allow those folks to apply for one?

So, these same people in the groups you speak of, whom some claim it would be tough to near impossible to obtain a voter ID card (which they would have the next 4 years in which to do so and which a national drive could be put together to get them the cards), will at that same time, magically have no trouble actually casting a vote without a voter ID card in the next election?

Look, everyone says how much our elections mean to us and how important they are. EVERY freaking major democracy in Europe uses voter ID's and they get along just fine. It is harder for the poor in this country to obtain the ID then it would be for a poor person in Europe? Is it somehow more expensive and difficult for the greatest power the world has ever known to somehow figure out voter ID then it was for the other countries who have set it up?

I do agree that in some areas of the country (like Atlanta) people had to wait (IN SOME POLLING SPOTS) a ridiculous amount of time and that needs to be fixed for sure. But for the majority of the nation wait times were not excessive........

 

[Tom Paris]

So is the premise here that poor whites can easily obtain ID but poor people of color can’t?

How does that work?

I read the articles...thanks for providing them. Didn’t listen to the NPR piece but I’ll give it a listen on the way into work tomorrow. Thanks.

I didn’t listen to that but read the article. I didn’t even know there was audio until it linked. I would bet poor whites aren’t congregated in the middle of major urban areas like black Americans are. Poor whites aren’t living in the inner cities and still need cars to get around. Just take it as fact. It’s harder for many to get ID than you and I. It’s not as simple as just get an ID. There are thousands of stories out there why people can’t.

Republicans know this, which is why they want IDs…because then these people won’t vote. Even though voter fraud is a made up thing by a conman…and now pushed by the minority party to have power. I used to think like you, even recently, until I read.

 

[Rudolph]

I have always felt like those who claim Voter ID was a way to keep minorities from voting have never actually asked that segment of the populous how they really feel....to claim that a group, based on the color of their skin, is unable to get an ID card is ridiculous........

Except that it is statistically relevant, and absolutely related to why this whole “issue” is even an issue.

I live and work in he type of community described by you. This has nothing to do with who is “capable” to do what. That’s another made up “argument” to soothe people on what is really going on. It’s an argument that “justifies” a wholly unjustifiable, completely disingenuous effort.

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

Dems have to drop the “voter ID is voter suppression” BS.

80% Of Americans Support Voter ID Rules—But Fewer Worried About Fraud, Poll Finds

Americans are divided on whether to make voting easier or more restrictive as state lawmakers and the Senate weigh new voting legislation.

www.google.com

Concentrate on getting rid of gerrymandering, increase early voting and ensuring enough polling places. Those are the main issues IMO.

Manchins plan is the way to go

Joe Manchin’s sweeping new voting rights proposal, explained

The pivotal senator has released a potentially transformative plan to promote fair elections.

www.google.com

If Democrats want to put ro rest the concerns of election fraud, they'd be 100% behind voter ID laws. Of course they don't because it would prevent them from making the same claims when they lose.

See below....

If Republicans actually wanted to address election fraud, they would accept Manchin's proposal.
https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/thre...blicans-and-they-slap-him-in-the-face.360233/
It's almost as if their evidence-free claims about election fraud are just a guise to suppress turnout among the "wrong" people.

Manchin and Obama are showing their political genius here. The Dems are going to give the Repubbers everything they say they need to support this voting bill....and then they (the Repubbers) will not support it. Then all America...including Republicans, will understand that the GOP opposes everything that is beneficial to America.

Democrats are the adults willing to compromise right now. Republicans are obstructing for the sake of holding on to power.

And you know another way you can tell this voter ID thing was never about “election integrity” for them? EBT or SNAP cards are never valid forms of ID in these voter laws. It was ALWAYS about suppressing the urban poor, and therefore black and brown, voter turnout.

 

[Hawkman34]

Except that it is statistically relevant, and absolutely related to why this whole “issue” is even an issue.

I live and work in he type of community described by you. This has nothing to do with who is “capable” to do what. That’s another made up “argument” to soothe people on what is really going on. It’s an argument that “justifies” a wholly unjustifiable, completely disingenuous effort.

From what I have seen.....many in the community would simply disagree with you.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

Republican lies work well, unfortunately.

 

[Rudolph]

From what I have seen.....many in the community would simply disagree with you.

Disagree with me on what? This is a statistically relevant fact, and very much has to do with why this (made up) "issue" is even a thing in today's discourse.

 

[Joes Place]

EVERY freaking major democracy in Europe uses voter ID's and they get along just fine. It is harder for the poor in this country to obtain the ID then it would be for a poor person in Europe?

Now, compare the public transit systems in Europe vs. the US, and the social safety nets in Europe vs. the US.

Not.Even.Close
Particularly in the US cities these tactics are targeting.

 

[Joes Place]

I do agree that in some areas of the country (like Atlanta) people had to wait (IN SOME POLLING SPOTS) a ridiculous amount of time and that needs to be fixed for sure. But for the majority of the nation wait times were not excessive........

• How would you explain the issue that the ONLY places the wait times were "unacceptable", were in minority areas?

• Do you think making those precincts spend a fraction of their voting budgets on IDs will do anything to fix this?

 

[JRHawk2003]

Hell most days, the President is too.

and he is still a 1000% improvement from a year ago

 

[Joes Place]

I had to show my drivers license to get my covid vaccine. Where's the rage for that?

I didn't need my DL. They just asked me for my health insurance card.

And to include that info on the consent form, along with my PCP info so that they could link the vaccination directly to my health records.

They required no form of "Photo ID" whatsoever.

There was a place on the form for DL info, if you did not have insurance; there was a box for the provider to check if they refused to provide the information (meaning they'll still vaccinate you, but must identify you did not provide the info). Again: only if you do not have insurance or Medicare.

 

[Hawkman34]

Disagree with me on what? This is a statistically relevant fact, and very much has to do with why this (made up) "issue" is even a thing in today's discourse.

You said it was a made up argument......many people would disagree. You may not like that answer, but it is true.

 

[Hawkman34]

Now, compare the public transit systems in Europe vs. the US, and the social safety nets in Europe vs. the US.

Not.Even.Close
Particularly in the US cities these tactics are targeting.

Why compare those? We are talking specifically about this one issue. There will always be disagreement on safety nets and how money should be spent on things like public transportation. But, on this one issue the fact remains that everyone saying "It is impossible to implement that" is just wrong.

 

[86Hawkeye]

Des Moines and Ankeny

In the same election

Impossible!

 

[Jan Itor]

Impossible!

Not the same election, but I was never asked for an ID. Period.

 

[Joes Place]

Why compare those? We are talking specifically about this one issue.

You just asserted that people in Europe can "easily get IDs".

That's because they have robust public transit to get to where you procure one. And they have work laws that enable people the time for things like this.

Most US cities/states do not. So, if you want to avoid that distinction, carry on. But stop claiming "Europe is equivalent", because it is not.

 

[notlongago]

You're displaying the soft bigotry of low expectations.

This video shows how liberals think and how minorities feel about about it.

View embedded media

Soft bigotry? That's very kind of you. It's flat out demeaning and degrading to make those insinuations.

 

[Hawkman34]

You just asserted that people in Europe can "easily get IDs".

That's because they have robust public transit to get to where you procure one. And they have work laws that enable people the time for things like this.

Most US cities/states do not. So, if you want to avoid that distinction, carry on. But stop claiming "Europe is equivalent", because it is not.

Not ALL European counties have the same type of transport system or work laws. Again, if you want to assert that, if given 4 years time to obtain an ID card, the population you speak of would find it impossible, then your assertion will fall on many, many deaf ears. Good grief, how many pushes were there in the last two elections to get some of those same groups you speak of visited and signed up to vote? It can be done.

 

[Joes Place]

Not ALL European counties have the same type of transport system or work laws.

Most do.

And most are much better than the American South, where many of the new laws are being implemented.

You brought up Europe, bud. Now you're floundering as you recognize that wasn't really helping your arguments.

 

[doughuddl2]

I didn't need my DL. They just asked me for my health insurance card.

And to include that info on the consent form, along with my PCP info so that they could link the vaccination directly to my health records.

They required no form of "Photo ID" whatsoever.

There was a place on the form for DL info, if you did not have insurance; there was a box for the provider to check if they refused to provide the information (meaning they'll still vaccinate you, but must identify you did not provide the info). Again: only if you do not have insurance or Medicare.

So you provided them an id. CSB.

 

[Joes Place]

So you provided them an id.

Nope.

No photo ID. And the insurance card wasn't necessary, either. My choice to ensure that my vaccination was linked to my health database.

 

[Hawkman34]

Most do.

And most are much better than the American South, where many of the new laws are being implemented.

You brought up Europe, bud. Now you're floundering as you recognize that wasn't really helping your arguments.

LOL!! I didn't bring up Europe "Bud", another poster did. I simply repeated what that poster so rightly pointed out. And, you have not given one shred of evidence to change my mind or anyone else mind on why we should not or can not realistically have a voter ID in place. Too funny.

 

[Joes Place]

LOL!! I didn't bring up Europe "Bud", another poster did. I simply repeated what that poster so rightly pointed out

TRANSLATION:
"I doubled down. Now, you've pointed out that they really do have better social safety nets/support, which make obtaining IDs a lot easier for them"

 

[Hawkman34]

TRANSLATION:
"I doubled down. Now, you've pointed out that they really do have better social safety nets/support, which make obtaining IDs a lot easier for them"

LOL!! They are not all better. Translation from you. "Your right, there is no reason this country can't easily get ID's implemented....but I can't stop myself"

 

[Joes Place]

LOL!! They are not all better.

Most are.
As I've already noted for you: public transit for people to get "downtown" where you would obtain an ID is mostly good to excellent in Europe. It is mostly non-existent in many US cities, particularly southern ones. Arguing like they are "comparable" shows me you are either ignorant of this, or a total idiot.

 

[Hawkman34]

Most are.
As I've already noted for you: public transit for people to get "downtown" where you would obtain an ID is mostly good to excellent in Europe. It is mostly non-existent in many US cities, particularly southern ones. Arguing like they are "comparable" shows me you are either ignorant of this, or a total idiot.

Please. Your whole argument is based on the premise that the same folks that you have said were able to make it to a polling place, including some who had to wait up to 8 hours to stand in line to vote this last election (and your ONLY example of that was some polling sites in Atlanta), would somehow have NO WAY in the next 4 years to find a way to get to a place (if needed) to get an ID? Good grief, at least come up with a better argument. You cannot have it both ways....but you are obviously trying to (and failing). Talk about idiocy.

 

[Joes Place]

Please. Your whole argument is based on the premise that the same folks that you have said were able to make it to a polling place, including some who had to wait up to 8 hours to stand in line to vote this last election (and your ONLY example of that was some polling sites in Atlanta)

PROTIP: It ain't just Atlanta.

Looks like you've given up on the claim that "all Americans have easy transportation to get an ID" now.

 

[Hawkman34]

PROTIP: It ain't just Atlanta.

Looks like you've given up on the claim that "all Americans have easy transportation to get an ID" now.

You are too funny. You can't even provide any substance to the point I clearly made so you deflect. Too easy.

 

[joelbc1]

Again, a Voter ID solves nothing! There are all kinds of rules in place now but very few of the voter issues would be affected one way or the other by a Voter ID. For every “problem” an ID would solve, it would create another. These issues have been fully discussed here. There are those who can see the problems as they exist as very minor..and there are some here who believe Trump’s re-election was stolen from him by illegal voters.

 

[joelbc1]

So, these same people in the groups you speak of, whom some claim it would be tough to near impossible to obtain a voter ID card (which they would have the next 4 years in which to do so and which a national drive could be put together to get them the cards), will at that same time, magically have no trouble actually casting a vote without a voter ID card in the next election?

Look, everyone says how much our elections mean to us and how important they are. EVERY freaking major democracy in Europe uses voter ID's and they get along just fine. It is harder for the poor in this country to obtain the ID then it would be for a poor person in Europe? Is it somehow more expensive and difficult for the greatest power the world has ever known to somehow figure out voter ID then it was for the other countries who have set it up?

I do agree that in some areas of the country (like Atlanta) people had to wait (IN SOME POLLING SPOTS) a ridiculous amount of time and that needs to be fixed for sure. But for the majority of the nation wait times were not excessive........

Do they use voter ID in Russia...Putin gets more than 90% of the vote, so yep, Voter ID sure does work!
Atlanta by the way is in Georgia..which coincidently was a key “ swing state”...and there is a well documented history of voting day skullduggery in rural Georgia that directly affects the poor, rural black voter...and it has been going on for decades. Switching polling places at the last minute and eliminating voters from eligible voter rolls without informing them are but two of many ways this suppression takes place.

 

[haw-key]

Easily attainable being the key here.

Lots of minorities and poor don't have the time to go to some single location in a major city and wait in line for a photo ID. And if they change address and their new address doesn't match what's on the ID you can bet that will be used to invalidate their vote. Meanwhile, today, they can simply mail in an updated registration form, and do not need any "new ID".

This is simply another tool in the toolbox to deny voting rights to minorities and poor; there have been practically zero instances of in-person voter fraud, which means IDs are a complete waste of money, and the motivations for pushing them are not what you think they are.

Most AA are for voter ID.

 

[haw-key]

See below....




Democrats are the adults willing to compromise right now. Republicans are obstructing for the sake of holding on to power.

And you know another way you can tell this voter ID thing was never about “election integrity” for them? EBT or SNAP cards are never valid forms of ID in these voter laws. It was ALWAYS about suppressing the urban poor, and therefore black and brown, voter turnout.

Can you fly with your SNAP card? Can you buy beer with your SNAP card? Can you buy a firearm with your SNAP card? I think you get the point.

Good lord. Look at yourself. Did you come in last in debate class?

 

[Hawkman34]

Do they use voter ID in Russia...Putin gets more than 90% of the vote, so yep, Voter ID sure does work!
Atlanta by the way is in Georgia..which coincidently was a key “ swing state”...and there is a well documented history of voting day skullduggery in rural Georgia that directly affects the poor, rural black voter...and it has been going on for decades. Switching polling places at the last minute and eliminating voters from eligible voter rolls without informing them are but two of many ways this suppression takes place.

LOL! Yes, lets use RUSSIA as an example of FREE elections. Come on. As far as your point to Georgia. This skullduggery you speak of is EXACTLY the reason to make voting more secure....not less. And I am sure you would agree that the examples you mentioned should be addressed. If they are happening, then yes, lets address them and make sure EVERYONE's vote counts correctly.

 

[Hawkeye_311]

Easily attainable being the key here.

Lots of minorities and poor don't have the time to go to some single location in a major city and wait in line for a photo ID. And if they change address and their new address doesn't match what's on the ID you can bet that will be used to invalidate their vote. Meanwhile, today, they can simply mail in an updated registration form, and do not need any "new ID".

This is simply another tool in the toolbox to deny voting rights to minorities and poor; there have been practically zero instances of in-person voter fraud, which means IDs are a complete waste of money, and the motivations for pushing them are not what you think they are.

It's funny these same people seem to have zero problems signing up for welfare, getting EBT cards and using them at the grocery store. How come Democrats always think poor minorities are hapless pieces of shit who are incapable of anything?

 

[Joes Place]

You are too funny. You can't even provide any substance to the point I clearly made

You didn't make a point.

You've Gish Galloped away from the point that IDs in places like GA, TX, etc will be MUCH more difficult to obtain than in the European countries.

 

[Joes Place]

It's funny these same people seem to have zero problems signing up for welfare

Then hand them a photo ID that goes with any of those.

Have you seen any of the legislation providing automatic ID with any of that? Nope.

 

[Joes Place]

This skullduggery you speak of is EXACTLY the reason to make voting more secure....not less.

Meanwhile....the Ohio (?) GOP guy voted for his dead dad by forging a signature.

And was caught.
And no "Photo ID" would have caught that. Ever.

 

[Hawkeye_311]

Then hand them a photo ID that goes with any of those.

Have you seen any of the legislation providing automatic ID with any of that? Nope.

Democrats control all the systems. Get off your ass and make it happen then.

 

[Hawkman34]

Meanwhile....the Ohio (?) GOP guy voted for his dead dad by forging a signature.

And was caught.
And no "Photo ID" would have caught that. Ever.

Show proof that a photo ID would NOT have caught that? LOL!!

 

[Joes Place]

Show proof that a photo ID would NOT have caught that? LOL!!

It was an absentee ballot, bro.
No IDs are required for those. If one was, he'd have mailed it in.

They caught it because of the forged signature. Many of these new laws are doing away with signatures. Maybe that's because that is how so many of the GOPers are getting caught, including the Colorado Republican chair, who claimed "a diabetic episode" in court.