"amazing" isn't the word I would use.
The cynical side of me half wishes they land Fix and Stevenson. That might turn more heads and maybe even an inquiry.
Berge
- Thread starter edquinn06
- Start date
The cynical side of me half wishes they land Fix and Stevenson. That might turn more heads and maybe even an inquiry.
Yet another swing and a miss from Hawkeye Reports self proclaimed insider.
Let's not go too far...Hall has quite a ways to go. Might put undo expectations on Cael.
Seriously...I am in the camp that we just got outrecruited. I don't know if it's TnT needing to spend more time on the road to get what they want because I know that Cael does. For example, I know that he was at Fredy Stroker's house on July 4th and Suriano's the day recruiting opened up. I think Ryan Morningstar does an excellent job connecting with the kids and it has worked with some but us (and the rest of the wrestling world) are just getting worked. As for the slush fund, prove it. Sandor, some of these parents pay a crapload of money to send their kids all over the country and the world to wrestle in tournaments. Doesn't it make sense that a difference of 20% or 30% wouldn't be a big deal if they thought their kid might have better success at PSU rather than Iowa, Minne, or OSU? Tell you what though...Berge had better be spot on at 149 or he will not be starting until maybe his redshirt sophomore year...even then, might have to battle it out with Manville.
As someone who put myself through college, I will gladly pay my future kids' college tuitions
Lol... Have your fun while you can. Your like always do.
Regarding the money and parents, yea I guess that makes sense. Saw a doc on netflix the other day where some guy spent about $200,000 on private coaches and basketball camps for his kid, so I guess they are out there. That's just an alien world for me. It's hard to wrap my head around a parent spending that kind of money on their kids hobby.
My parents once paid for me to attend a 3 day mini camp at UNI, and that was a big deal. I had to do a lot of chores around the house and be extra nice to the siblings, not easy.
Bottom line for me is that these scholarship limits are partially in place to disperse the talent. Berge would have been huge for Minnesota. Again, it's about what other programs didn't get.
So your kids are going to PSU too?
Knowing today's costs for College tuition and the almost mandatory need for a degree, I don't understand why every single parent wouldn't be starting a 529 or some sort of an equivalent. To each there own, but I am in the camp that if you decide to be a parent, food, clothing, a roof over their head and education are MANDATORY requirements. Who knows how it will shape up for me in roughly 16 years, but I have every intention of paying for my daughter's school and would set up the money I will be investing for her in an escrow till she graduates if she earned a scholarship.
But, consider this....getting Berge will possibly lower PSU's class recruiting ranking.
By FLO logic, with Nolf, Vincenzo, Manville and now Berge packed in ~149/157, someone may not get to wrestle right away. Willie has taught us that this lowers their ranking. For example, PSU getting #1 Hall, #2 Suriano and #5 Manville were deemed 2nd best behind NC State #4 Reenan, #6 Hidlay, and #42 Bullard, because there was no room for Manville right away.
Yes... this definitely hurts PSU. How will they recover? Cael will have to work miracles now that his recruiting rankings are taking a hit.
By FLO logic, with Nolf, Vincenzo, Manville and now Berge packed in ~149/157, someone may not get to wrestle right away. Willie has taught us that this lowers their ranking. For example, PSU getting #1 Hall, #2 Suriano and #5 Manville were deemed 2nd best behind NC State #4 Reenan, #6 Hidlay, and #42 Bullard, because there was no room for Manville right away.
Yes... this definitely hurts PSU. How will they recover? Cael will have to work miracles now that his recruiting rankings are taking a hit.
If they inherit my wrestling ability, they won't be anywhere near good enough to go there
Getting top 10 overall Kemerer 2015, top 5 overall Marinelli 2016, #1 overall Lee 2017 and top 5 overall Teasdale 2018 is certainly an improvement. However, missing on both Berge and Warner would leave us still way behind and frankly with the number of top 10 overall recruits PSU is somehow able to stockpile on their 9.9 I don't see anyone ever matching. In addition to the absurd amount of top 10 overall guys they currently have they now have two more from the 2017 class at the moment and 3 currently committed for the 2018 class with guys like Nevills and Steveson still available. They had three top 5 guys in 2016 class. They either have a lot of people willing to go there for cheap and free or they are being "creative" in getting people funds.
FIFY. You trying to say you are down in the dumps for Minne?
Would you have said the same if we had got Berge?I am with you...it was foreign to me as well growing up. Give you an example: I worked all summer long between my junior and senior year. A guy near my weight went to camps...We were even before that and he came back beating me and ended up being a state champ. Another guy had a Dad who had an airplane that flew him around to tourneys and he wrestled all summer long. Them's the breaks I guess.
To be in contention with the future psu recruits, we needed a Berge or at the least needed psu not get a Berge.FIFY. You trying to say you are down in the dumps for Minne?
I am with you...it was foreign to me as well growing up. Give you an example: I worked all summer long between my junior and senior year. A guy near my weight went to camps...We were even before that and he came back beating me and ended up being a state champ. Another guy had a Dad who had an airplane that flew him around to tourneys and he wrestled all summer long. Them's the breaks I guess.
I honestly would have been ok with Minny getting Berge. I miss that rivalry with them. He would have a been a big turn in the right direction for that program.
Hypothetically if we missed on Warner, who else could we go after in the class of 2018 to fill a need weight. Steveson is one of the only I can see, and I don't think theres many other good options. And I don't think theres any interest from Steveson unfortunately. To win a title we would need 141 Happel/Murin to become a high AA, and Kaleb Young a mid to high AA at 174. Who replaces Sorensen after he graduates? Happel? Are there any big recruits left out there that could fill 149 in 2019?
Cael is persistent with his traveling for recruiting. He made 2 trips to New York after marsteller decommitted to go after Rasheed. He was just here last week sitting in on a practice looking at Teemer. That kind of stuff can makes a lasting impression with a kid. I don't know if Ryan's tactics have changed at tOSU but when he was at Hofstra there were some funny recruiting stories. Best ones were challenging Noel Thompson to a contest of who could bench more. Other was when he went after Lou Ruggirello he walked into a restaurant with 2 bags. Pulling out a heavy coat goggles and snow boots from one and swim shorts and t-shirts from another asking which do you prefer.
I've been skeptical that he can make 149 in 2 years...let alone the next 6. Between him, Nick Lee and Manville, someone never sees the mat at PSU. Or he can go up to 165, sit behind Joseph for 2 years, then compete for the spot with Wittlake for his jr and sr seasons.
I think lee and Teasdale will still help greatly with that
All kidding aside if you read the article he mentioned the word fun more than once in regards to PSU. I know it drives people crazy and take it as a joke but these are still kids. They may be trained assassins on the mat but they are still trying to have a life also. Obviously Cael and his style is connecting with these elite recruits. Plain and simple they like him and the program and are obviously willing to take less money for a variety of reasons. As Chief said he's putting in the work on the road and developing the relationships.
Even though he currently is not a big time recruit it would not surprise me at all if Nelson Brands adequately fills the Hawks need for a 149 lbr in a few years. Really think Nelson is just starting to scratch the surface of his potential and believe he will develop into a dominant collegiate wrestler.
Nevills - who was the #5 overall recruit at a weight which is hard to recruit - is on record as saying he got 60%. Right now there are only 10 or 11 wrestlers on PSU's roster that look to have significant money invested in them. I think PSU has a lot of money available for these two classes (2017 & 2018). In two years I count 15 wrestlers with significant money invested scheduled to be on the roster. And that includes Manville, so I guess it's only 14.
I don't think PSU is giving up much anything for kids that aren't in the lineup. Kid from our HS was 2x medalist and 2nd best kid in his weight (195 - a valued weight in recruiting) in PA AAA SR year. Nearly a full ride offered at a lower level D1 school. Passed it up to go to PSU for book money (didn't work out for him). Aside from PSU, we have a 2x state champ from our school who went to B1G school for a 50% ride. I've posted this on other boards, but I have a family member in the middle of (actually the end of) the recruiting process. Two finalists were a B1G school (not PSU) offering him a partial which would likely leave him with about 100K due over 5 years and a lower level school on a full ride. And to my and his mother's consternation it has been a very difficult decision for him. Thank sweet baby Jesus that it looks as if he is taking the money (although another school has entered the mix). But the point is, the other offer was seriously in play.
Kids go to PSU for less. They do the same thing at Iowa, tOSU, OK State. Not all kids, but some do.
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I think the Brands probably need to get into the homes of kids more and do more of the recruiting. M* may be a great recruiter, but he is still a representative of the program and not the head coach.
I know Zeke Jones was in Warners practice room about 2 weeks ago. That shows interest and makes a kid want to give the coach and team an honest look and a fair chance.
To be honest, Cael's success seems to be similar to Gable's in the recruiting department. Gable got who he wanted and most of the time he started late. I heard that he did not contact Joe Williams until after the state tourney his senior year. He did not go after Mena or make contact until after the state tourney his senior year. He got both of them.
Cael seems to work harder at getting the kids than Gable did, but he still ends up with them.
I know Zeke Jones was in Warners practice room about 2 weeks ago. That shows interest and makes a kid want to give the coach and team an honest look and a fair chance.
To be honest, Cael's success seems to be similar to Gable's in the recruiting department. Gable got who he wanted and most of the time he started late. I heard that he did not contact Joe Williams until after the state tourney his senior year. He did not go after Mena or make contact until after the state tourney his senior year. He got both of them.
Cael seems to work harder at getting the kids than Gable did, but he still ends up with them.
I too feel a Nelson Brands manning 149 would not be the end of the world. Take part of what you were going to give Berge and give Warner a full ride. 197lber talent is hard to find and landing him would be huge. Then go out and win a team title and 2 or 4 individual titles this year and that will be all the recruiting ammo we will need to get this ship righted quickly. Iowa is not a hard place to get kids to come to when we are winning.
See my post above. It's hard for you to believe (and me) but that is the reality. I am close friends with the family of the 50% kid above and the Mom has been pretty vocal - and critical - of his decision at times, saying he's paying to wrestle. But at the end of the day, it's their life and, as long as they get the degree, and many are looking at their wrestling goals as priority. And really, at the end of the day, it has worked out all right for this kid. He's a starter and a captain, going to end up with a degree from a great school and will forever have his experiences as a B1G D1 wrestler to take with him. How much is that worth?
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Thanks for the insight. Every kid is different and money means different things to many
I'll be chastised for this by some saying I'm over reacting. That the sky isn't falling. That we got Lee. To preface this with a reason is the slight chance it might help Iowa get the next kid (Warner). Iowa needs to adjust some things. Not a single coach paid a home visit to the man we heard from at 4 today. No personal attention was paid to him. No plan was given. He was herded in on a visit with 8 other recruits. Much more to the story as well. Iowa will say they are who they are. Not saying I disagree, but saying it doesn't always work. That Iowa can get more of the kids they are going after if they adjust to today's day & age. A good offer isn't all that is needed anymore. Iowa is still stuck on we are Iowa, and that's all it takes. Well how many kids are they going to miss out on with that strategy. If we continue to rest on that it worked with so & so. Well it can work with more and will need to in order to win titles.
Agreed, Tom and Terry may not like it, but they need to be knocking on more doors. Morningstar is a good recruiter, but receiving a call or visit from him isn't the same thing as receiving one from Tom and/or Terry. I know they would rather be with the team, but they need to play a bigger role in the recruitment of athletes.
I don't have anything to share "with you". I didn't say I knew why he didn't come to Iowa. I said, think about it. Maybe that's to difficult for you to do and if I had some crayolas I would color you a picture.
Yep, Cael has revolutionized the sport by caring for his athletes and doing his job coaching 365 days a year. Why didn't anyone else think of this.
I agree. If they want a guy like Warner they need to earn it. If Warner is wrestling in Indochina, I want Tom or Terry ready to pop out of a bowl of rice ready to pitch him on Iowa.
This is where I have contended that Cael is a better coach than pretty much all of them...in the recruiting department. He's Cael flipping Sanderson...why should he go door to door? But he does and it means something.
Well, I hope one of the Brands or both make it to the home of Nelson Brands........
But, consider this....getting Berge will possibly lower PSU's class recruiting ranking.
By FLO logic, with Nolf, Vincenzo, Manville and now Berge packed in ~149/157, someone may not get to wrestle right away. Willie has taught us that this lowers their ranking. For example, PSU getting #1 Hall, #2 Suriano and #5 Manville were deemed 2nd best behind NC State #4 Reenan, #6 Hidlay, and #42 Bullard, because there was no room for Manville right away.
Yes... this definitely hurts PSU. How will they recover? Cael will have to work miracles now that his recruiting rankings are taking a hit.
You could do a little homework on what weight classes the kids are wrestling before you post, but that might take the fun out of it for you.
This is not a new phenomenon either. Royce Alger was one of the top recruits in his class. He had multiple full-ride offers from various schools but accepted a 50-percent ride at Iowa because he wanted to wrestle for Gable. Seems like a legendary coach leading the most successful program going is as much of a draw today as it was in 1983.
http://www.hawkeyesports.com/news/2012/9/16/mom_s_blessing_allows_alger_to_become_a_hawkeye.aspx
