I wasn't overwhelmed, just saddened but not surprised. Atheism has no moral code whatsoever.
Which philosophy should I have studied that would have addressed this issue?
Carl Sagan on the Existence of God
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I wasn't overwhelmed, just saddened but not surprised. Atheism has no moral code whatsoever.
Which philosophy should I have studied that would have addressed this issue?
Actually, I don't believe that to be true. But, that's just me.
Who determines what is right?
Ironically most atheists have a moral code based on the Bible and might not even realize it. It’s practically unavoidable in western civilization culture. I think some of them have a problem with a sort of religious dogma.
Matthew 6:5 And when you may pray, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
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Again, this demonstrates you’ve never had a philosophical thought in your life.
I would argue that to the extent the Bible has a moral code, it is based predominantly on things men already knew on their own: codes that predated the Old Testament by quite some time.
And quite on our own mankind has improved upon our morality far beyond the scope of the Bible. Deciding that slavery is wrong was a pretty decent improvement, for example.
People have used Scripture to justify all kinds of behavior that we now consider to be immoral. Chattel Slavery, interracial marriage, same sex relationships, women not being allowed to hold public office and vote, and so on, were all justified by using Scripture. It goes even further than that.
LOL. How so?
I wrote the list of philosophers I studied. I'm currently reading Aquinas after I've read Pascal and Augustine.
I've read this twice in the past year. It's a classic. Highly recommended.
You need someone to tell you ... not to kill someone? Not to steal? Not to lie? Not to root for the Cardinals?
How do you determine who to listen to?
You can claim anything you want. But when you immediately call the notion that our lives are no more “valuable” than those of other animal’s “insane” it is proof for all that you’ve never thought deeply about philosophy in your life. If you had, you could easily disagree with that idea, but you would understand how an intelligent and ethical person could legitimately hold the view.
You are simply dumbfounded by anything that doesn’t match your Christian mythology, which is how the rest of us know you are completely ignorant on these subjects.
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That is not a work of philosophy, it is a Christian Apology. Really, just some random ramblings of what was supposed to be a Christian Apology but was never assembled and completed.
"The Fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.'" Psalm 14:1
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your
own understanding." Proverbs 3:5
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your
own understanding." Proverbs 3:5
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You need someone to tell you ... not to kill someone? Not to steal? Not to lie? Not to root for the Cardinals?
How do you determine who to listen to?
Jesus.
The nice thing about atheism is that there's no higher authority.
So atheists can do whatever they want as long as they don't get caught by the law.
That's not really true. I can easily see how an intelligent person would hold that view but not ethical one. It's odd how you would judge someone based on that one position.
If person claims human life is as valuable as ants, then they're clearly not ethical.
I can understand from the atheist viewpoint the claim that human lives are no more important than ants. It makes perfect sense from the atheist view since we're all just reduced to atoms.
I spent years reading atheist philosophy. Existentialism from Camus to Sartre. I'm not claiming I am a PhD but I totally understand the atheist view point.
Which philosophers have you studied? Can you recommend any to me?
It's a mix of both. Blaise Pascal was one of the forerunners of existentialism. Nietszche was highly influenced by him.
He shows in "Pensees" what the human condition is and how hopeless humans are without God.
Believers - There is a God.
Non-believers - There is no god.
Undecided - Show me proof there is god.
18-pages and none of the above has convinced anyone else to move to their "side" of the discussion. Personally, I believe in God. Period.
Non-believers - There is no god.
Undecided - Show me proof there is god.
18-pages and none of the above has convinced anyone else to move to their "side" of the discussion. Personally, I believe in God. Period.
The 10 Commandments are still valid today, they are not
obsolete. God is the ONE who says "Honor your parents,
Do not murder, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal,
Do not tell lies about your neighbor, Do not covet your
neighbor's property or possessions.
Those commandments have also become part of the
civil law which governs our lives. They help to keep
order in our society.
obsolete. God is the ONE who says "Honor your parents,
Do not murder, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal,
Do not tell lies about your neighbor, Do not covet your
neighbor's property or possessions.
Those commandments have also become part of the
civil law which governs our lives. They help to keep
order in our society.
Well, that’s not a good summary, at all.
Non-believers usually do not claim there is no god. I don’t believe the Cubs are going to win the World Series this year. But I don’t know it for a fact, and won’t deny it happened if it does.
And yet, you can pronounce someone as unethical based on a single view without a hint of irony.
You did not characterize this viewpoint as merely unethical, You called it insane.
Right. It's both, IMO. It's the logical conclusion of a Godless worldview. Humans are reduced to atoms.
Not everyone agrees with your value system. It doesn't necessarily make them completely ignorant of philosophy, as you claim without evidence.
Meh...it's close enough, but that wasn't the point...but you (also) know that.
Yeah...about that...those principles pre-date Christianity, you know. Name a pre-Christian civilization that condoned murder or robbery? In what society were parents not honored? "No other god before me" could just as easily be "no other gods before us" and still carry the same weight. There is nothing remotely unique to that list.
BTW, there are no "10 Commandments" in the Bible.
It's not "IF" we believe in God... it's "HOW" we believe in God. Everyone believes in God. But, not everyone uses that word- GOD. When people hear the word "God", it instantly conjures a religious connotation/association. And, a lot of people have outgrown, or moved beyond, the need for organized religion. Most religious people worship their religions. God is sort of a little trophy or ribbon (@Rudolph ) that goes with the religion for added validation.
Now, you've done it. Now, you're really gone and done it!
The Jews, at least the funny Jews, have a great sense of humor about their religion. You can't get the same kind of humor out of Christians and Muslims. It's as if the Jews have seniority and wisdom from that seniority. "You guys will learn one day! God is really just playing a joke on us! Mazel Tov!"
So, you hear someone say that humans have no more value than other animals, and you believe the logical conclusion is that they are insane.
That is such an ignorant attitude, and attitude so simplistic and naive, it cannot possibly come from anybody who has thought deeply about it, ever.
You are flat out wrong. I do not believe in god. Any god, or any interpretation of the word god.
So a sane person holds insane ideas? Either way, this still represents a highly undeveloped reasoning process. And suggests the person has never been exposed to any substantial conversation about "life, the universe, and everything."
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You've basically eliminated any meaning to the word "god" if you constantly bend it to say everyone believes in "it."
See? You proved my point! "God", in any form, makes a lot of people recoil... and for obvious reasons.
Thank you!
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