Historical Rankings college Wrestling
- Thread starter sunshinedynomite
- Start date
How would a 5 timer with 2 losses be behind a 4 timer with 6 losses??
The 3 Hodge Trophies to 0 would be a good indicator. And Spencer doesn’t have 6 losses
Because that's not the only determining factor.
If Yianni, Spencer, and Carter all win out, presmuing minor leaps for Carter but not a major leap in dominance, I would rank them:
1. Cael
2. Dake
3. Spencer
4. Pat Smith
5. Starocci
6. Yianni
7. Logan Stieber
Still a lot of work left to do to get to this place, though.
If Spencer wins 4, why does Spencer automatically fall behind Kyle Dake? Just based on the number of losses? Or because Dake won in 4 different weight classes? I mean I really like Dake and was very VERY impressed when he went up to 165 and beat DT that year (what a match). I know Lee's had some losses, but like Dake, he won when it mattered. And if Dake was wrestling in the B10 vice the EIWA - and wrestled Okie State every year - perhaps his loss count would be a tad higher? I'm not saying Dake isn't all that and then some; I'm just saying that if SL wins it all this year, I think he's every bit as good of a college wrestler as anyone not called Cael.
If you knew anything about wrestling and what you were watching, you wouldn't have to ask this question lol.
No one should be allowed to go for 5.
Just more bs.
Just let them keep wrestling, maybe they can each get 10. 🤪
Dake is 1. True Freshman going up in weight each year and winning a National Title each year. Probably will never see it again
My only thing with ranking Dake is the lack of bonus points. There have been four 4x champs and in all-time NCAA tournament points, there are 1 (Cael), 2 (Steiber), 6 (Smith) and 12 (Dake).
For those wondering, Lee should end up 2nd on that list.
That said, moving up three weight classes and beating Taylor? Wowza.
I would say Dake, Spencer and Carl would be my top 3. But Spencer is without a doubt the most exciting to watch.
I’ll go on record here and say that Starocci doesn’t win NCAAs this year. His good luck runs out. Let’s not forget that he needed OT in both finals so far and has come out on top. Lewis will get him this year.
Dake going up to take out Taylor is next level stuff, plus the 4 different weight classes thing. Some people try to downplay that one. The Taylor thing, though, was some gladiator stuff, and it separates him from the rest of the 4 timers, for me.
Not disagreeing, but why do people think going up weight classes automatically makes a title more significant? Every year is a bit of a crap shoot in terms of whether that weight class is particularly tough. Going up...or down...does not guarantee a harder path. And is there a difference if a guy goes from 125 to 149 vs going from 165 to 197? Or is this point just specific to Dake and who he had to wrestle by going up those years?
The 4 guys that Dake beat in the finals had 15 AAs among them. They made the finals a combined 10 times and won 4 combined titles. 3 of the guys Dake beat went on to win titles at the same weight the next year.
I don't think it's necessarily impressive to go up a weight class each year, but in Dake's case, looking at who he had to beat each year, I think it is
I may be mistaken and I'm sure I'll get blasted if I am... This should account for something in the all-time rankings.. But don't forget Spencer won the Sullivan award. He is only one of 5 wrestlers to ever win it. A feat not even Dan Gable, Cael Sanderson or the great Dan Hodge ever accomplished..
Good point! Kyle Snyder won it, as did John Smith, and a couple Olympians. Could be a good tie-breaker.
Homer. 5 losses compared to zero. Easy competition for last two titles. There is no world in which Spencer is ahead of Cael. Not even on this forum.
Not disagreeing, but in his freshman year alone the guys Spencer would beat in the semis and finals who have 3 NCAA championships and 4 NCAA finals between them (Suriano, Nato). If not for going up to 165 to beat DT, the argument for Dake is significantly less strong and takes away four of those NCAA finals and 2 of those NCAA championships. Again, not downplaying Dake (he's a badass and REALLY impressed me when he went to 165 and took out DT), but if Spencer wins this year there's definitely a good argument of his college career being every bit as impressive as Dake's. And if he captures his third Hodge Trophy along the way that clearly adds to the discussion. Regardless, it's nice that we have an Iowa alum in the conversation.
Hard to disagree with that. Cael is definitely in a class of his own. During his college career there were no chinks in that armor.
Agreed, going up in weight classes means little. Winning as a true freshman, and beating Taylor multiple times do give him an argument for the top spot.
I'm curious - but aren't you leaving a certain someone off of this list? Dan Gable perhaps?
I get the losses position you have but easy competition? Courtney with 0 ACLs and Mueller who just majored Sebastian Rivera in the Semis.
Beating Suriano in the finals is as big of an accomplishment as any of the men Cael, Dake, Stieber beat, no?
Gable is the greatest wrestler of all time. I don't care about the no loss to one loss conversation. The manner in which Gable dominated and punished his opponents puts him ahead of everyone. Even with a loss his last collegiate match Gable will always be the GOAT.
I was ranking the 4 timers. I don't think I'm equipped to place Gable in a ranking, because all I know are the results, I have only seen a couple of his collegiate matches.
Fair enough - but the rules (Freshman not allowed to compete) were different for him, just like being a possible 5 timer for Starocci.
And two of them became olympians. One a champ, the other lost in the bronze medal match.
Not every great folkstyle wrestlers is on Olympic teams. Pat Smith and Logan Striebler are the first that come to mind.
No. Dake beating Taylor (the returning Hodge Trophy winner) is much bigger. Taylor won the Hodge the year before losing to Dake, and won it again the next year. Taylor was 134-3, with two of those losses to Dake.
Beating Taylor seems to be given a lot more credence than anything else. In that case, Bubba Jenkins is now in my top 5 because he PINNED Taylor.
Although Spencer Lee is a great wrestler, putting him in the list of all time greats is unfair to him and a disservice to the true all time greats. Cael is first followed by in no particular order: Dake, Gable, Hodge, Kemp, Uetake, Stieber and Pat Smith. Spencer falls somewhere in the next group with Snyder, Schultz and the various Penn Staters over the last 10 years. The Nick Piccininni loss by a pin solidifies the argument. I’ll just enjoy watching his last run for a 4th title.
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