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If we can’t agree on…

Tell me one person that shouldn’t have been prosecuted but was.
There are literally hundreds of people that should have been given a fine for trespassing ($500?) and a few months probation. Period.

The only ones that should have faced any jail were the ones found guilty of vandalism, B&E and/or assault. A small minority.
 
Kamala Harris received over 75 million votes. Does that mean that she was the most popular vice president of all time? Let me answer that for you: No. Trump drives up the vote, both for and against him. Classic divisive authoritarian.
2016
Trump 62.98M
Clinton 65.85M

2020
Trump 74.22M
Biden 81.28M

2024
Trump 77.30
Harris 75.02

One of these vote totals stands out. Then factoring in that an unprecedented amount of the vote was by mail for an overwhelmingly old & uninspiring candidate...and you have a recipe for skepticism.
 
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Sure. The most popular president of our time received, what, 68 million votes in 2012? Then Biden (who was running 4th in his own primary, until Obama told everyone to line up) gets over 81M? Now, maybe the answer is that the relaxed (Covid) voting rules get the credit for that...but it makes it easy for people to be skeptical. Add to that the 2020 election running counter to the "Bellwether county" predictor...and again, there's a statistical reason to dive deeper. At the end of the day, I trust that most of these issues were fairly litigated, and I wish hadn't behaved the way that they did...but to some extent, I understand the skepticism.

No doubt people are easily manipulated, it didn't help that a lot of the misinformation and nonsense was coming from Trump even though he knew it was all BS, and it turns out he has devoted followers who believe him. Which of course is another reason why there's so much opposition to Trump. People are used to politicians twisting the truth, playing word games, even some occasional outright falsehoods. But no one has taken it to Trump's level. And what do you know, we wound up with what someone like you calls a tiny fraction of people throwing a fit, but what people who are more attached to reality know is something much greater than that characterization.
 
There are literally hundreds of people that should have been given a fine for trespassing ($500?) and a few months probation. Period.

The only ones that should have faced any jail were the ones found guilty of vandalism, B&E and/or assault. A small minority.
We’re talking about the Capitol.

Imagine if the crowd were Hispanic or Muslim.
 
2016
Trump 62.98M
Clinton 65.85M

2020
Trump 74.22M
Biden 81.28M

2024
Trump 77.30
Harris 75.02

One of these vote totals stands out. Then factoring in that an unprecedented amount of the vote was by mail for an overwhelmingly old & uninspiring candidate...and you have a recipe for skepticism.
Yeah, to think that 3 million more people voted for Trump in 2024 than they did in 2020 is insane.
 
There are literally hundreds of people that should have been given a fine for trespassing ($500?) and a few months probation. Period.

The only ones that should have faced any jail were the ones found guilty of vandalism, B&E and/or assault. A small minority.
Still didn't provide an example.
 
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Sure. The most popular president of our time received, what, 68 million votes in 2012? Then Biden (who was running 4th in his own primary, until Obama told everyone to line up) gets over 81M? Now, maybe the answer is that the relaxed (Covid) voting rules get the credit for that...but it makes it easy for people to be skeptical. Add to that the 2020 election running counter to the "Bellwether county" predictor...and again, there's a statistical reason to dive deeper. At the end of the day, I trust that most of these issues were fairly litigated, and I wish hadn't behaved the way that they did...but to some extent, I understand the skepticism.
I don't know why when it is made easier to vote it should be surprising that more people vote. There is no rational reason to be skeptical other than you didn't like that your guy lost. The fact that so many Republicans work so hard limit the number of people voting shows how even they know they want a tyranny of the minority running the country.
 
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All the whining of the J6 anarchy supporters means nothing. Thousands of people broke the law and are now convicted felons and serving time in prison. Right where they ought to be. Everybody on this website can b**** and moan about it, but it doesn't matter. They're in jail serving time for their crimes. Doesn't matter if bone spurs ends up pardoning every one of them, they're all convicted felons. That ain't changing, no matter how much bone spurs tries to change the truth with pardons.
 
You don’t believe people’s perspectives change through the lens of tribalism?
If you phrase it that way, of course. Perspective changes in most of us as we go through life and evolves along the way. Age and experience along with exposure to different things play a huge part of that.
 
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If you phrase it that way, of course. Perspective changes in most of us as we go through life and evolves along the way. Age and experience along with exposure to different things play a huge part of that.
Oh, c’mon now. Aren’t we being a bit pedantic here?
 
I don't know why when it is made easier to vote it should be surprising that more people vote. There is no rational reason to be skeptical other than you didn't like that your guy lost. The fact that so many Republicans work so hard limit the number of people voting shows how even they know they want a tyranny of the minority running the country.

When you make it easier to vote, it should be fully expected that there will be a trade-off between the increased vote and fraud. Is there an implication that Democrats are more susceptible to not bothering to vote, unless we make it so that they don't have to leave the couch? Is there a fully rational reason that mail-in ballots broke so dramatically for Biden? Should it give anyone pause that the timing of the mail-in count, caused the vote count to turn on a dime at 3AM?

In the end, I do think that most of these questions were asked & answered -- often in the courts. So, it's disappointing that Trump & those 1500 supporters threw a fit. Just don't act like there weren't valid grounds to question how the election was conducted.
 
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When you make it easier to vote, it should be fully expected that there will be a trade-off between the increased vote and fraud. Is there an implication that Democrats are more susceptible to not bothering to vote, unless we make it so that they don't have to leave the couch? Is there a fully rational reason that mail-in ballots broke so dramatically for Biden? Should it give anyone pause that the timing of the mail-in count, caused the vote count to turn on a dime at 3AM?

In the end, I do think that most of these questions were asked & answered -- often in the courts. So, it's disappointing that Trump & those 1500 supporters threw a fit. Just don't act like there weren't valid grounds to question how the election was conducted.
Making something easier to do does not automatically make it easier to cheat. That is an assumption they are hoping to be true because it makes them feel better that he was cheated out of a win rather than having to acknowledge that their guy sucks. So, without any evidence, they can't make that claim. And that's the thing, they have no evidence. In fact, whatever so-called evidence they all claimed existed was always found out to be complete bullshit. But here they are, still trying to perpetuate this myth based on nothing but their own feelings and wishes.
 
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2016
Trump 62.98M
Clinton 65.85M

2020
Trump 74.22M
Biden 81.28M

2024
Trump 77.30
Harris 75.02

One of these vote totals stands out. Then factoring in that an unprecedented amount of the vote was by mail for an overwhelmingly old & uninspiring candidate...and you have a recipe for skepticism.

That doesn't mean it's justified.
 
People who stormed the Capitol on 1/6 breaking shit and being violent deserve to be prosecuted and punished accordingly or that people here illegally who commit violent acts shouldn’t be summarily deported, then there really is no hope for the future of our country.
I take no issue here on the whole, now for the J6ers... it's more nuanced as people who committed actual crimes should be tried and receive sentencing based on those crimes. But I don't agree that anyone who happened to be at the Capitol on J6 2021 was automatically committing a crime. People who were caught destroying property or assaulting cops 100% lock them up... Millers, paraders, non-violent, non-destructive protesters should be treated as such. Simply being there, on the property doesn't automatically make you a criminal beyond a potential trespass misdemeanor.
 
I take no issue here on the whole, now for the J6ers... it's more nuanced as people who committed actual crimes should be tried and receive sentencing based on those crimes. But I don't agree that anyone who happened to be at the Capitol on J6 2021 was automatically committing a crime. People who were caught destroying property or assaulting cops 100% lock them up... Millers, paraders, non-violent, non-destructive protesters should be treated as such. Simply being there, on the property doesn't automatically make you a criminal beyond a potential trespass misdemeanor.

Link to anyone who has a plea deal or guilty verdict where they were charged above trespassing or similar crime based on simply being inside the Capitol?
 
People who stormed the Capitol on 1/6 breaking shit and being violent deserve to be prosecuted and punished accordingly or that people here illegally who commit violent acts shouldn’t be summarily deported, then there really is no hope for the future of our country.
I agree with the first.

I disagree with the second. Everyone here illegally should be deported, whether or not they commit a crime after arriving.
 
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I agree with the first.

I disagree with the second. Everyone here illegally should be deported, whether or not they commit a crime after arriving.
Right.

I’m saying the bare minimum agreement should be that people here illegally who commit violent crimes should absolutely be deported immediately.
 
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Depending on the crime, locked up in U.S. prisons. We are going to need more prisons.
Not if we send them back home. OTOH I hear Guantanamo has some spaces opening up.

Truly, though, I see no need for the US taxpayer to pay for three hots and a cot for foreign illegals, do you?
 
I agree with the first.

I disagree with the second. Everyone here illegally should be deported, whether or not they commit an additional crime after arriving, the first being crossing an international border sans permission.
FIFY
 
2016
Trump 62.98M
Clinton 65.85M

2020
Trump 74.22M
Biden 81.28M

2024
Trump 77.30
Harris 75.02

One of these vote totals stands out. Then factoring in that an unprecedented amount of the vote was by mail for an overwhelmingly old & uninspiring candidate...and you have a recipe for skepticism.
You're skeptical because in an unprecedented pandemic year where voters were given much easier paths to vote that the turnout was high against the most unpopular and divisive incumbent POTUS in our country's history? Even with all of the evidence that the vote was legitimate and accurate after countless lawsuits that produced not a shred of evidence that voter fraud occurred? You cannot be serious.

Your opinion on Biden's age and ability to inspire in the 2020 cycle is merely that, an opinion. And it's my opinion that the Fraudster was worse in both of those aspects, we're seeing it now in abundance. Regardless, it's not a valid basis to be skeptical of the voting process itself, it's just more bullshit.
 
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