I wasn't in this camp but I am now. We got guys that either don't get it, don't want it, or don't have it. Why not give Glynn a shot now and pull some shirts.
Illinois Grades (BELDEEN need not waste his time :P)
- Thread starter UndercoverHawk
- Start date
That's really perhaps the worst part. This wasn't necessarily a bad effort on anybody's part. Several of the guys did a very nice job. Stick, Bow, Wilcke, Gunther, and Stoll all did a nice job based on their current level.
This wasn't guys not wrestling well. This is our team.
Turk got taken down 3 times because he was flat footed, way too high, and did not move his feet like he did during the IC dual. Next man in..
For me it wasn't necessarily the result, but the effort. That's why I wasn't critical of Young...at least he gave an effort that I didn't see throughout most of the lineup.
Not sure exactly but it felt pretty empty. If I had to guess, <5k? Closer to 1/3 full than 1/2
A little over 8,000. I gave away 89 tickets to kids and chaperones. I'm not sure last night got any of them fired up about wrestling.
I guess that's what I'm challenging. I didn't really see a lack of effort; I saw a lack of talent. BS and Kem didn't have great matches, but we know who they are and there's no reason to worry. Five other guys definitely had good efforts based on their talents. Young was understandably outclassed. I just don't see many guys to criticize.
Frankly, I was happy to see Stoll show complete confidence in his body.
Stick, Laux, and Turk on bottom with heads down on the mat for extended periods of time
Turk has had cement for shoes the last couple of matches. Guys blow past his hand positioning from neutral as well. Not impressive performances from a “practice room legend”
BS has no shot at Zain. He’s way to conservative from every position, see last 2 yrs results. Should’ve been multiple stalls on both guys.
Kem got caught up in a collar tie tug of war
Young went down shooting. Hey, it’s freaking IMar
Bowman, realty starting to set in
Cash wrestled a fun match. IL, kid was athletic and able to match Cash’s speed. These kind of guys will be tough to score on for him. His duck was smooth and fast.
Glad Stoll was able to get pin. Expected nothing less from him.
Turk has had cement for shoes the last couple of matches. Guys blow past his hand positioning from neutral as well. Not impressive performances from a “practice room legend”
BS has no shot at Zain. He’s way to conservative from every position, see last 2 yrs results. Should’ve been multiple stalls on both guys.
Kem got caught up in a collar tie tug of war
Young went down shooting. Hey, it’s freaking IMar
Bowman, realty starting to set in
Cash wrestled a fun match. IL, kid was athletic and able to match Cash’s speed. These kind of guys will be tough to score on for him. His duck was smooth and fast.
Glad Stoll was able to get pin. Expected nothing less from him.
I repsectfully disagree. As long as you can score, or allow your opponent to score 3,4,5 or 6 team points based on the outcome of your individual match, there is lots of room to differentiate between "ok" and "not ok"
Anybody else shaking their head when Stickley choose down in the 3rd? That didn’t make any sense to me, after how easily he was ridden out to finish the 1st period.
Add me to the list of people that thought that was the worst wrestling by an Iowa team at Carver that I’ve seen in the past 10 years.
I thought Young gave good effort, but was clearly overwhelmed by a superior opponent. I also thought Gunther worked hard against an opponent that didn’t want to wrestle.
Add me to the list of people that thought that was the worst wrestling by an Iowa team at Carver that I’ve seen in the past 10 years.
I thought Young gave good effort, but was clearly overwhelmed by a superior opponent. I also thought Gunther worked hard against an opponent that didn’t want to wrestle.
Bring your pitchforks, but I don't care...
We should have never flirted with the Downey situation. We have a stud freshman (who majored #2) shirting because we have a top 10 wrestler there now, when that top 10 guy should be manning 184. I'm assuming WIlke didn't go 184 because of Downey wanting to go at that weight. Now there's talk of PD doing either weight. I'm sure that's having an awesome effect on the dynamic of the team. With that said, if PD actually does the things he needed to do to make the team, then we must honor our word and let him on the team.Brands is going to have to deal with any fence mending that may occur.
I think Turk is a victim of over expectations. We kept hearing how awesome he was in the room, and now people are bailing on him. Maybe he just wasn't what we needed from the beginning. WIth that said, let's give Murin and Happel a shot.
Didn't Sorenson actually do 1 point better than what he did at B1Gs last year against this guy? He is what he is, a damn good wrestler who doesn't always open it up.
Some talk about there not being much separation between Young and Marinelli, that's not good. IMAR is an all timer, but our P4P recruit needs to be able to keep it closer than a tech. Maybe he does, but that would have to be a big improvement over Young. BTW, did someone say Young looked small against IMAR? Jesus, what weight should Young be at? He's a pretty quality wrestler who should probably transfer out. Not that I want him to, but he's too good to ride the bench.
-My favorite lineup
Lee
Laux
Murin/Happel
Sorenson
Kem
Marinelli
Gunther
Downey/Wilcke
Warner
Stoll
We should have never flirted with the Downey situation. We have a stud freshman (who majored #2) shirting because we have a top 10 wrestler there now, when that top 10 guy should be manning 184. I'm assuming WIlke didn't go 184 because of Downey wanting to go at that weight. Now there's talk of PD doing either weight. I'm sure that's having an awesome effect on the dynamic of the team. With that said, if PD actually does the things he needed to do to make the team, then we must honor our word and let him on the team.Brands is going to have to deal with any fence mending that may occur.
I think Turk is a victim of over expectations. We kept hearing how awesome he was in the room, and now people are bailing on him. Maybe he just wasn't what we needed from the beginning. WIth that said, let's give Murin and Happel a shot.
Didn't Sorenson actually do 1 point better than what he did at B1Gs last year against this guy? He is what he is, a damn good wrestler who doesn't always open it up.
Some talk about there not being much separation between Young and Marinelli, that's not good. IMAR is an all timer, but our P4P recruit needs to be able to keep it closer than a tech. Maybe he does, but that would have to be a big improvement over Young. BTW, did someone say Young looked small against IMAR? Jesus, what weight should Young be at? He's a pretty quality wrestler who should probably transfer out. Not that I want him to, but he's too good to ride the bench.
-My favorite lineup
Lee
Laux
Murin/Happel
Sorenson
Kem
Marinelli
Gunther
Downey/Wilcke
Warner
Stoll
Told my son the same thing with Stickley choosing down. That said we looked awful on the bottom all evening.
As boring and disappointing as that meet was, not a big change from where I thought we were at the beginning of the season. Last night showed a lack of effort, but overall,
125 - was hoping Stick was better than expected and made great strides since HS. Not so. No real change in expected NCAA points though.
133 - similar to above. Hoping the light came on but not going to happen. Let’s see what Glynn has.
141 - similar to above. Was hoping he made great strides. Still am. Hopefully he has more than a blast double and will improve. Still not a big change in expected NCAA points though.
149 - what I expected.
157 - what I expected to maybe a little better. Looked bulked up and very good (not so much last night though).
165 - hoping the Bull is healed up and hits the ground running. Hopefully he is who we think he is.
174 - disappointed Young hasn’t bulked up. Glad that Joey has bulked up and is at or a little better than expected.
184 - appreciate Bowman’s desire to step in where needed and give his best effort (while still knowing he is a temporary replacement for eventual starter). He is a real hero in my eyes. Hopefully PD3 is doing everything he needs to and there for us next semester.
197 - similar to 174. Wilcke looks better this year. Happy with both of their progress and increased activity this year.
285 - happy with Stoll as he seems to be recovering well and becoming more comfortable out there.
So really, the guys are about how they are expected for those not drinking the cool aid (me included as a cool aid drinker).
I was hoping for the best at 125-141. Maybe I was hoping for too much.
149-165 - as expected if the Bull is 100%.
174 - 285 - overall, slightly better than expected.
Rebuilding year.
125 - was hoping Stick was better than expected and made great strides since HS. Not so. No real change in expected NCAA points though.
133 - similar to above. Hoping the light came on but not going to happen. Let’s see what Glynn has.
141 - similar to above. Was hoping he made great strides. Still am. Hopefully he has more than a blast double and will improve. Still not a big change in expected NCAA points though.
149 - what I expected.
157 - what I expected to maybe a little better. Looked bulked up and very good (not so much last night though).
165 - hoping the Bull is healed up and hits the ground running. Hopefully he is who we think he is.
174 - disappointed Young hasn’t bulked up. Glad that Joey has bulked up and is at or a little better than expected.
184 - appreciate Bowman’s desire to step in where needed and give his best effort (while still knowing he is a temporary replacement for eventual starter). He is a real hero in my eyes. Hopefully PD3 is doing everything he needs to and there for us next semester.
197 - similar to 174. Wilcke looks better this year. Happy with both of their progress and increased activity this year.
285 - happy with Stoll as he seems to be recovering well and becoming more comfortable out there.
So really, the guys are about how they are expected for those not drinking the cool aid (me included as a cool aid drinker).
I was hoping for the best at 125-141. Maybe I was hoping for too much.
149-165 - as expected if the Bull is 100%.
174 - 285 - overall, slightly better than expected.
Rebuilding year.
Level-headed assessment, Jack. Can't disagree with any of that. Of course, guys do improve as seasons progress, and we certainly can hope for that from some of our less heralded guys as we also hope for a shot in the arm from a couple of studs waiting in the wings to be plugged in after Midlands.
I would agree. I think there are a few that will definitely improve as the year progresses.
Stick and Turk definitely have room to improve as the year goes on. I don't know about Laux - I think Glynn has improved since he got here and will continue to improve. He had a good summer and would like to see what he does under the big lights.
Would like to see the Bull in action ASAP as he will likely significantly improve with the more action he gets. Hopefully Gunther and Wilke gain more and more confidence and open up more. I think they have AA potential if they believe in themselves.
Good post. It's easier to accept that reality in theory than to actually watch a meet unfold.
Bottom line is there are no surprises thus far.
I'm a pretty big Hawkeye optimist but last night wasn't pretty.
125: Stickley looked alright he faced a tough kid and was in the match going into the third, pretty much what I expected.
133/141: Was not happy or real impressed with 133 or 141. It's early in the season but both guys weren't moving their hands and feet real well and didn't look like they had any real good chances to score from their feet.
149: I wasn't real surprised with Sorensen because he got the win and was in control the entire time. He's never been one to put on a huge show offensively. I wish he could put up points like Nolf or other high scorers but Sorenson just doesn't have that ability so might as well just be happy with his 3-2 wins and another NCAA finals appearance.
157: I was a little disappointed with Kem because I was looking for him to open up a bit more and to get the Hawks going but his opponent looked pretty defensive and Kemerer looked pretty tired (they might've been training through this dual a little too much).
165: We battled here but were just over matched. IMart is a stud and fun to watch.
174: I liked Gunther's aggressiveness and pace a lot. It would have been nice to see a little more leg attacks but I'm just being picky. Nice win for him.
184: I was really impressed with Bowman. Wrestled tough, was aggressive and put himself in position to win. One of my favorite hawks right now. Would've been nice to win that one but hey he will only get better with his fight and attitude.
197: Wilcke looked solid, had a pretty good pace, kept us in the dual. I do wanna see Warner at 197 at the end of the year though.
285: Great job to Stoll for winning us a dual we didn't deserve to win. I knew once the match started that Sammy would get that 6 for us though.
Overall, not a good dual for us but we will get better. I do really hope to see Lee, Warner, Marinelli, and (potentially) Downey in the lineup at the end of the year. I think Iowa really needs some fire power. Oh, and I'm no expert and don't have half the talent of anyone out there, just a big fan who loves this team.
125: Stickley looked alright he faced a tough kid and was in the match going into the third, pretty much what I expected.
133/141: Was not happy or real impressed with 133 or 141. It's early in the season but both guys weren't moving their hands and feet real well and didn't look like they had any real good chances to score from their feet.
149: I wasn't real surprised with Sorensen because he got the win and was in control the entire time. He's never been one to put on a huge show offensively. I wish he could put up points like Nolf or other high scorers but Sorenson just doesn't have that ability so might as well just be happy with his 3-2 wins and another NCAA finals appearance.
157: I was a little disappointed with Kem because I was looking for him to open up a bit more and to get the Hawks going but his opponent looked pretty defensive and Kemerer looked pretty tired (they might've been training through this dual a little too much).
165: We battled here but were just over matched. IMart is a stud and fun to watch.
174: I liked Gunther's aggressiveness and pace a lot. It would have been nice to see a little more leg attacks but I'm just being picky. Nice win for him.
184: I was really impressed with Bowman. Wrestled tough, was aggressive and put himself in position to win. One of my favorite hawks right now. Would've been nice to win that one but hey he will only get better with his fight and attitude.
197: Wilcke looked solid, had a pretty good pace, kept us in the dual. I do wanna see Warner at 197 at the end of the year though.
285: Great job to Stoll for winning us a dual we didn't deserve to win. I knew once the match started that Sammy would get that 6 for us though.
Overall, not a good dual for us but we will get better. I do really hope to see Lee, Warner, Marinelli, and (potentially) Downey in the lineup at the end of the year. I think Iowa really needs some fire power. Oh, and I'm no expert and don't have half the talent of anyone out there, just a big fan who loves this team.
Agree 100% about Bowman. He's been under the radar and doesn't get a lot of recognition, but this kid is tough as nails and competes hard. You gotta respect his desire and competitiveness. Was pretty darn close to a huge win over a very tough opponent. Hats off to Mitch!
Disagree GG - kids will always remember the Sam Stoll walk off. Great job!
I am not drinking the kool aide 
but I am a TnT fan. I just cant let it go that we were not on the attack, looked tired and took few shots. The boys gave me the impression that many of them would rather be somewhere else than on that mat. I wonder if they are reading blogs and press clippings---- that stuff gets in kids heads and makes for self fulfilling prophecies.
Or maybe they were just sick with a bug-- That is wishful thinking but it happens.
but I am a TnT fan. I just cant let it go that we were not on the attack, looked tired and took few shots. The boys gave me the impression that many of them would rather be somewhere else than on that mat. I wonder if they are reading blogs and press clippings---- that stuff gets in kids heads and makes for self fulfilling prophecies. Or maybe they were just sick with a bug-- That is wishful thinking but it happens.
I took two 10 yos. They were pretty jacked, even talking about it today.
My son thought the best thing about last night was watching IMar do his head bounce flips. I’ve never seen anyone do that.
Standing on his feet does a half flip landing on his head and then continues through the motion to land on his feet. All with no hands. Actually pretty impressive. Lol
Standing on his feet does a half flip landing on his head and then continues through the motion to land on his feet. All with no hands. Actually pretty impressive. Lol
Having a hard time visualizing that. Lands on his head, with no hands? That sounds like a spinal cord injury waiting to happen. Don't think I'm understanding correctly, but it sounds pretty cool. I look forward to watching him do that after winning Worlds for the HWC and the USA.
Having a hard time visualizing that. Lands on his head, with no hands? That sounds like a spinal cord injury waiting to happen. Don't think I'm understanding correctly, but it sounds pretty cool. I look forward to watching him do that after winning Worlds for the HWC and the USA.
He was doing a front flip where he was pivoting off his head.
Brother: I'm thinking that if we don't pull the shirts and at least finish in the top 4 our 5, we won't have to worry about 4 or 5 years from now as we won't be able to draw to the studs to a top 12 or 15 program. If I'm a young wrestler and am looking to be on a winning team, I know at least three schools I'm considering before Iowa...and if we finish lower than 10th at NCAAs, the number of schools I'm considering before Iowa probably goes to five or six. We need to show that we are competitive even during our rebuilding years. Also, we have the number 2, 3, and 7 wrestlers in the nation in Soren, Kem and Sammy, and two other potential top 5s and a poss top 10 riding the pine. And while I don't want to pull shirts on injured wrestlers, I'm all about pulling shirts on wrestlers who can bring this school back to perhaps a top 3 or 4 school, and then hope that will inspire a couple more studs to come to Iowa. In 2018 we have two 2 100 recruits coming our way (17 and 80)...that just aint gonna make it going forward...
I'm with you regarding Stoll. While I love watching him work those pins, I think he's too slow for the top 3 or 4 guys, and will be very surprised to see him in the top 5 by the end of the year. That said, I love that he's looking healthy and back on the mat!
We have been a top 3 or 4 school. 2016 when we were 5th by 1 point was I believe the only time since Brands 1st year we were not in the top 4. Since out last title that 5th place was our lowest. fosu (2x) and psu have been 6th in that time and osu was 7th. We just drew two of the best guys in the last class. One "rebuild" year is not the end of the world. Yes they dropped the ball for a bit in recruiting but it is getting better will we will need to continue to get better.
True. I'm all for placing as highly as possible at Nationals, but one relatively low placement isn't going to cost us recruits. They know who's waiting in the wings and all of the positive things happening around the HWC and Iowa wrestling. Not only are recruits more prepared than ever where technique, conditioning, etc., are concerned, but they're also more informed than ever before. We certainly don't want to make a habit of placing out of the top 4 at Nationals, and 1st is obviously always the goal, but I'm really not concerned about any impact on recruiting by one rebuilding year. That said, I still want to see us as close to 1st as possible -- I just don't think we need to do anything rash in the process.
Missouri, Nebraska, Cornell, and Michigan land studs almost every year, yet those team rarely compete for a national title. How in the hell does this happen?
Are you about pulling shirts if the wrestler prefers to red shirt and we have a potential AA at that weight? How would thaat effect recruiting if an athlete thought he would be sacrificed? You think that recruits aren’t knowlegable enough to see that if red shirted, there are two potential national champs that will be wrestling with them for the next 3 or 4 years and that doesn’t make a difference? One of the problems is that young wrestlers, without rich uncles, are looking at how much they can make doing clinics and after they graduate. Major reason we have a hole at 33. Have to have scholraships to offer to get the “studs” you talk about and that’s hard to do with a TRUE 9.9 scholarship limit.
Remember the Rider dual was a week ago and posters were so excited about Iowa constantly attacking? This last dual was an aberration imo. Obviously 25-41 is a hole and that is on tnt, but I think there will be vast improvements throughout the year. Hopefully there are improvements by posters as well, so we are less bipolar in reactions to this team throughout the year, because everyone and their mother new this is a rebuilding year.
If PD3 slides into 84, 149-hwt can make some hay at nationals.
Finally, #freepaulglynn.
If PD3 slides into 84, 149-hwt can make some hay at nationals.
Finally, #freepaulglynn.
Yeah, it's a rebuilding year, that doesn't mean that some of the unknowns such as 125 to 141 can't pleasantly surprise us. So far that hasn't come close to happening, but the possibility existed not that long ago. Especially at 141, where we thought whomever emerged might take us out of our far too long 141 drought. That dream is fading fast.
Stickley is keeping Lee's seat warm, but what about if he comes out and does really well and gives us a warm fuzzy for moving to 133 at some point? Was hoping for some lightning in a bottle somehere is all.
So I guess getting beat up by Gilman and Clark in practice is not the answer for our current 125, 133, or 141 # guys.
It seems over the past few years that some wrestlers seem to have a lot of trouble pulling the trigger and taking shots. I know T&T preach go, go, go. Keep going. But some guys seem to have a mental block at times to actually doing what might win the match for them. Seems like a big disconnect between what is being taught and what actually happens on the mat during a match.
I assume the team has access to a Sports Psychologist. If not, perhaps one should be contacted.
It seems over the past few years that some wrestlers seem to have a lot of trouble pulling the trigger and taking shots. I know T&T preach go, go, go. Keep going. But some guys seem to have a mental block at times to actually doing what might win the match for them. Seems like a big disconnect between what is being taught and what actually happens on the mat during a match.
I assume the team has access to a Sports Psychologist. If not, perhaps one should be contacted.
I don't have the answers, but wish I did.So I guess getting beat up by Gilman and Clark in practice is not the answer for our current 125, 133, or 141 # guys.
It seems over the past few years that some wrestlers seem to have a lot of trouble pulling the trigger and taking shots. I know T&T preach go, go, go. Keep going. But some guys seem to have a mental block at times to actually doing what might win the match for them. Seems like a big disconnect between what is being taught and what actually happens on the mat during a match.
I assume the team has access to a Sports Psychologist. If not, perhaps one should be contacted.
The young men of the opposition are working hard and giving their all too. Just wish ours were doing it better every time! 
So I guess getting beat up by Gilman and Clark in practice is not the answer for our current 125, 133, or 141 # guys.
It seems over the past few years that some wrestlers seem to have a lot of trouble pulling the trigger and taking shots. I know T&T preach go, go, go. Keep going. But some guys seem to have a mental block at times to actually doing what might win the match for them. Seems like a big disconnect between what is being taught and what actually happens on the mat during a match.
I assume the team has access to a Sports Psychologist. If not, perhaps one should be contacted.
As an amateur sport psychologist, I'd say we recruit only two types of wrestlers - 1) really good ones and 2) ones that are too stupid to realize they aren't good.
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