Joey McKenna Transferring possibility
- Thread starter IAROY
- Start date
When did Cael kick him to the curb? Why didn't Gavin commit first? Any chance Cael was less interested in Gavin than Gavin was in Cael? Maybe Cael actually did him a favor. Many recruits visit PSU yearly. Did Cael kick all of the non commits to the curb too? I'm simply asking you and others to take your comments to their logical conclusion, and then apply to Brands, because the same stuff happens in all programs.
Chance Marstellar, Gavin Hoffman and Thomas Haines say it has already played out. They just wonder who will be shit on next.
Marstellar? Haines? You do know it's Caels job to bring in guys that will help his team win championships right?
Btw, Brands made a commitment to JRent and Meija but then decided to bring Lee and Teasdale. He'd do the same type of things throughout the entire lineup like Cael does if he could. It just so happens Cael is currently en vogue while Brands ...not so much.
PSU was in on Hoffman until beard de-committed to northwestern and Cael saw something better. Not sure why Gavin didn't commit. Maybe he was listening to mark halls advice to go on all of his visits.
Marsteller: Obvious to everyone that the decision to pass was the right one. How could anyone fault a coach for steering away from a risky bet upon learning more about the circumstances?
Haines: Why was he entitled to be the top recruit at 285 for PSU? He chose to go elsewhere. Ironically, to the team where he had the least chance possible in all of D-I Wrestling the be "The Guy". Hard to see how he was wronged by the PSU coaching staff, unless there is hard evidence that they reneged on offered scholarship $$.
Hoffman: Neither side ever made a commitment. Kicking the tires doesn't obligate you to make a purchase.
To the original point by pablow, I'd be curious to know how many aggrieved families there are. It's just unsubstantiated speculation without a bona fide list to discuss.
Cael can do want he wants. And, I'm free to not to like it. It's not like he doesn't have a history. Am I required to respect George Steinbrenner and Jerry Jones because they do their job well?
Do you think Tom Brands agrees with your mentality that it's not that important to bring in the best guys you possibly can? If he does....I'm pleased by that...
Then I take it you don't respect Brands for taking a big dump on Meija and JRent
I don't think Cael passed, I think he recruited Nolf and wasn't willing to give Chance the money he needed. I agree on Haines. As to Hoffman, nobody knows what was said. Maybe Hoffman had made a verbal to PSU but they wanted to keep it quiet for a bit.
I respect Tom and Terry. I don't respect Cael. Sorry I didn't make that clear.
Yeah, there is less light on the Hoffman situation, and who knows what kind of private exchange there may have been.
There are multiple versions of what happened with the Marsteller situation, and different people have different sources. Info I heard, combined with what Marsteller did subsequently, leads me to believe Cael passed "off the record". I could be wrong in doing so, but boy did PSU dodge a bullet on that one.
EDIT: And yes, I'll concede that the "pass" may have occurred after Nolf was in the mix. I won't claim that was 100% coincidental, as I have no way of knowing.
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My point is this...there are just certain kids you don't recruit over. Others will assess the situation as a no loyalty thing. Gable had the chance to take one of the best all timers in Fried and took a pass because he had his guys. I know Brands has done the same thing.
So Cael, years before it happened, knew Chance was going to get in trouble. Ok then. You're not suggesting that Cael knew Chance didn't have the talent, correct?
And Haines, while Snyder was at 197, should have known that he was going to be an Olympic champ and a 3 time Heavyweight Champ. You should just stop. You make it more clear every time you post that you are clueless.
Hoffmans dad says you are full of sh&t.
I don't take issue with that point at all. I'm not sure he has recruited over the wrong guy just yet (or too many guys overall, right or wrong, to create that perception), but I would probably be uncomfortable to see it happen with a guy like Nick Lee who, by all accounts, has made a real commitment to the program. So I agree with you that he would be the wrong kind of guy to recruit over.
Re: Marsteller -- Cael knew the lifestyle and the risk involved. Too well.
Re: Haines -- Everyone knew Snyder was top-line and would likely be a multi-time champ. I'm not certain on the timeline and predictability of him moving up to HWT. Either way, it's ironic how it played out.
Re: Hoffman -- Do you have details about that situation you are not sharing? Did Cael break a promise or commitment? Enlighten me.
As the situation stands right now, Penn State is pretty much packed from end to end with blue chip recruits. It could be argued that they have a few too many kids as is. Bringing in a kid like McKenna would further complicate the matter. Haines, Hoffman, AJ Nevills, Manville, Joe Lee, Verkleeren, are all kids that were either recruited over or are currently on the outside looking in, IMO.
In every situation it is okay because they made the right choice with the people above them, but continuing to recruit when you're full is likely to cause one or more of the following to reconsider (Teasdale, RBY, Nick Lee, Berge), and that is when it truly becomes a problem, IMO. All 4 of those guys are dynamite and I'm not sure why you wouldn't be satisfied with their services, and feel the need to recruit over them.
They're getting close to the point where recruits will start questioning all the flattering phone calls telling them how special they are. I'll be interested to see how this plays out.
In every situation it is okay because they made the right choice with the people above them, but continuing to recruit when you're full is likely to cause one or more of the following to reconsider (Teasdale, RBY, Nick Lee, Berge), and that is when it truly becomes a problem, IMO. All 4 of those guys are dynamite and I'm not sure why you wouldn't be satisfied with their services, and feel the need to recruit over them.
They're getting close to the point where recruits will start questioning all the flattering phone calls telling them how special they are. I'll be interested to see how this plays out.
I think just every program in the country would try to fit in as much talent as they can wether it is Sanderson or Brands. Penn state is just loaded with talent and has talent waiting in the wings.
I just wonder as penn state continues to add talent if others are being asked to accept less money in order to make things work out. I can unserstand if a kid gets gets upset being asked to give up more money so they can add competition at his weight class. It may also start affecting kids mentally who envisioned themselves as the guy at their weight class wondering if the staff does not have enough confidence in them to continue to add competition for their spot in the lineup.
This is all just speculation and to be honest I dont see the kids waivering as much to attend penn state as some of us might think. There will always be some kids who feel if they are paying their own way that they want to be in the lineup getting their moneys worth.
I just wonder as penn state continues to add talent if others are being asked to accept less money in order to make things work out. I can unserstand if a kid gets gets upset being asked to give up more money so they can add competition at his weight class. It may also start affecting kids mentally who envisioned themselves as the guy at their weight class wondering if the staff does not have enough confidence in them to continue to add competition for their spot in the lineup.
This is all just speculation and to be honest I dont see the kids waivering as much to attend penn state as some of us might think. There will always be some kids who feel if they are paying their own way that they want to be in the lineup getting their moneys worth.
It's because they haven't reached critical mass yet. For all I know they might never reach that point, but I do think they are starting to flirt with that line. The amount of high level high school talent they have coming in combined with what is already on the roster is unique compared to anything else I have seen in this sport. The next 1-2 years will tell us a lot.
Can say what I think might be wrong but maybe you should ask Bobby D. how it all went down at ISU.
This forum is unfortunately starting to turn the direction of the fball board where every thread is either about ISU or Nebraska.
Or it turns into an 8-page thread where the last 5 pages have absolutely nothing to do with the original post.
I for one remember the Bobby Douglas situation! It was probably one of the worst betrayals from a student to their mentor that I have ever seen. It probably wouldnt have been as sour if sanderson had stayed at iowa state for a bit prior to leaving. I can only hope that sanderson has grown alot since then but im not close enough to anything to know if it was a one time deal or just the way sanderson is as a pesron. Sanderson has ended up being a heck of a good coach though.
To add a few things to the above:
Marsteller's problems began to become known his senior year. He was living outside of his home, there was a bunch of difficulty involving the mother. All this happened after his commitment to PSU (not that it had anything to do with that). Chance was going through a lot of change right then, I don't think his decommitment had anything at all to do with Nolf. It had everything to do with change. Cael still would have taken him - he went and visited his school the day the decommitment was announced - of course I imagine that a decreased level of commitment shown on July 1 by PSU was also what was being offered in light of what the risk that was being displayed. People who bring up Marsteller, generally don't have any a clue as to the specifics of the situation. It was a poor situation for all involved and nothing was going to change until it bottomed out - as John Smith found out.
In regards to Hoffman, people on here leave out that PSU was heavily recruiting Beard before he committed to Northwestern, as well as Hoffman. I'm sure they turned the heat up on Hoffman once Beard committed elsewhere early in his JR year. Hoffman never committed. Beard came back on the market and was ready to commit. Not sure how anyone else would play this any differently.
Couple of things to chew on above for those commenting on the thread. I'm sure it's not going to change many attitudes. But the fact of the matter is that situations like this will continue to pop up as long as PSU has more elite kids wanting to wrestle for them than other teams. Not unlike the lightweight situation that Iowa faced with Lee, Teasdale, Renteria and Mejia. More top kids ready to commit than resources available for THEIR needs (which vary). Not much you are going to do.
My outsiders take on ISU and Douglas. Douglas was not getting the job done and they wanted a young up and coming coach. He happened to be Cael. Would it have been worse if they had fired Douglas and hired an outsider? What should Cael have done, decline the offer after they fired Douglas?
This has me confused. I can see calling Cael unloyal for leaving ISU, but he did not have them fire Douglas. Or is that what some people are saying?
This has me confused. I can see calling Cael unloyal for leaving ISU, but he did not have them fire Douglas. Or is that what some people are saying?
They didn't fire Douglas because they wanted to get rid of him or because they wanted an up and coming coach. They were content for the most part with the job he was doing. Cael was starting to be considered a hot commodity in the coaching ranks and ISU didn't want to lose him like they did Gable years ago. So, they were in a bind. They felt the only way to keep Cael was to cut bait with Douglas and name him the HC. At the time, some people might not have been comfortable with how they treated Douglas but most seemed to think it was the best thing for the program for the long run. Unfortunately for ISU, it was a short run for Cael at ISU, which made the firing Douglas decision look even worse..
Just so you are clear on this. It isn't just Iowans that hate Penn State, the whole world hates Penn State and you will be known for 1 thing for decades to come.
http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireSt...als-face-sentencing-sandusky-scandal-47784228
If I am remembering right I remember hearing that a discussion between isu and sanderson interest taking place prior to Douglas being let go. Thats the way I heard it not saying that it is for certain the way it went down. It makes sense as why would isu gamble firing the head coach of a preseason ranked #2 team to try and hire a guy they had no clue would accept the job or not. Also that team was built by Douglas and was the best on paper that isu had in a long time. I surely dont know the absolute certain specifics but thats about the way I heard things went down in ames.
The whole world hates PSU?
Sweet!
Who will score more points against Iowa this year, the wrestling team or the FB team?
Should be close!
Sweet!
Who will score more points against Iowa this year, the wrestling team or the FB team?
Should be close!
