Question For Smalls/Wille?

[just_somebody]

Had Carl stayed at ISU, I bet they would have won a few titles. He had David Taylor and others coming to ISU when he made the move. Do we think ISU had a slush fund going?

Honestly, if he hadn't left for Penn State, Iowa is very likely dominating the Big 10, ISU is for sure dominating the Big 12, and I doubt PSU fans spend much time in the cesspool at all.

 

[MVPFAN]

1. You say "PROVEN" - then your source/facts is a message board thread? Come on man.

2. Not sure where you're going here, but this isn't the first time Carl has gone 5 for 5. And his winning percentage in the semis and finals is absolutely incomprehensible. That's coaching. Tom has had multiple #1 recruiting classes and is no where close.

3. Stop comparing Pro Sports to NCAA wrestling. PSU still has to deal with 9.9 just like everyone else. When you consider everything Cael and Co have done as a stuff - for their athletes. It's pretty damn hard for guys to say no.

4. You're wrong. And there's nothing you can say about it that will change that. You know why they're worth it? Because someone is paying them that. Companies are not in the business of giving athletes money just so they can go broke. Your value is what your pay says it is.

5. Me too. lol

Recruiting class rankings are often trash. Multiple times teams with a number of guys signed but lower ranked were rated higher than say PSU with two top tens. What matters is can the guy score big points at Nationals or not. I don't believe for a second PSU has been limited to 9.9, that's a laugh.

 

[Random4598375]

Let's be clear. Sanderson is the best DI Head Coach there is and he was really good at ISU. But, let's not act like he was winning REMOTELY like he has done for PSU if he stayed at ISU. That is like saying Tom Brady would have won all those Super Bowls with the Detroit Lions.

Sanderson KNEW ISU was stuck quite a ways behind Iowa for local talent and national recognition. Even his name and abilities weren't going to change that. That and MONEY is why he left for PSU as soon as the opportunity presented itself.

He would have been good enough to be a perennial top 5 contender and maybe win a title here and there, but there is NO WAY he comes close to doing what he has at PSU. Hell, his 1st couple of title were won with heavy contributions from Molinaro, Wright and Ruth, all of whom were at PSU before he got there. None of them were ever considering Iowa State. Hell, Ruth even went on record as saying he didn't even know who Cael Sanderson was...

Oh, I 100% agree with you. It took a combination of Cael and PSU to create this perfect storm. I was questioning IB's assessment that Cael didn't do anything until he got access to PSU's shady money. That is simply not true.

 

[smalls103]

This is a good take Smalls, but to say money has nothing to do with it is far from the truth. We are witnessing it again with Ohio St now, right after the NIL hit look at what they did with their last recruiting class. If donation money and possible alumni funded NIL deals had nothing to do with this I would be extremely surprised!
Another example I would use is Michigan, they are extremely well funded and they went out bought in , sorry brought in Suriano,Brucki and KJ , not to mention their Extremely well funded RTC that brought in a 2x Olympic and 6x world champion! Money has nothing to do with this?

1) you just raised $25mil in private money for new facilities
2) without the injuries you were expected to vastly out point Michigan
3) Brucki and Suriano were 1 year grad student rentals. we're talking about (at least i thought we were) systematic issues; not one-off years
4) the Lubert money came in after the train already started rolling

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

I don't disagree with the first part that someone is willing to pay for it...however Companies just don't give money to something without a ROI, or a tax benefit...so if a company is willing to pay RBY 100k this year and next...what is the ROI to that company and is it worth it to that company? Does investing in RBY now, return that 100k down the road in some fashion for my company?

the new NIL thing that PSU just created...i'm curious if it is going to be some sort of tax-deductible business/charity that donors will get a tax benefit from it by donating.

It's a non-profit. It does not appear to be a charity. Nothing indicates to me that it ever will be.

 

[Grip220]

1) you just raised $25mil in private money for new facilities
2) without the injuries you were expected to vastly out point Michigan
3) Brucki and Suriano were 1 year grad student rentals. we're talking about (at least i thought we were) systematic issues; not one-off years
4) the Lubert money came in after the train already started rolling

There was Cleary money before Lubert and I am talking all money.

Yes you bring up a great point, We had to raised 25Mil for a new facility! Doing it the right way, if we had the donors of the PSU program it would have been built already.
I don’t want to get into the In and off-season private training that guys like Taylor , RBY and others were and are receiving and who pays for such things.

I ask you this, does Ohio St land their entire last recruitment class without their Brand New School funded facility or the NIL money? I understand if you cannot answer.

 

[smalls103]

"I ask you this, does Ohio St land their entire last recruitment class without their Brand New School funded facility or the NIL money?"

the answer is 'yes'. who wouldn't they have landed?

i talked to Anthony Ralph who, after landing a couple of the JR's joked to me 'i don't have to work for the next 3 years because we're totally out of money'.

penn state has certainly lost out on recruits in the last two years b/c they simply don't have the schollies to offer. i promise you; this is fact.

the 'they cheat with scholarships' thing is vastly overblown.

 

[Grip220]

"I ask you this, does Ohio St land their entire last recruitment class without their Brand New School funded facility or the NIL money?"

the answer is 'yes'. who wouldn't they have landed?

i talked to Anthony Ralph who, after landing a couple of the JR's joked to me 'i don't have to work for the next 3 years because we're totally out of money'.

penn state has certainly lost out on recruits in the last two years b/c they simply don't have the schollies to offer. i promise you; this is fact.

the 'they cheat with scholarships' thing is vastly overblown.

Alright, I will just disagree and leave it at that.
I appreciate your takes, if you run into that Mineo guy tell him I got a present for him.

 

[vhsalum]

"I ask you this, does Ohio St land their entire last recruitment class without their Brand New School funded facility or the NIL money?"

the answer is 'yes'. who wouldn't they have landed?

i talked to Anthony Ralph who, after landing a couple of the JR's joked to me 'i don't have to work for the next 3 years because we're totally out of money'.

penn state has certainly lost out on recruits in the last two years b/c they simply don't have the schollies to offer. i promise you; this is fact.

the 'they cheat with scholarships' thing is vastly overblown.

THANK YOU

 

[MVPFAN]

This is all about perspective. You’re looking at the last ten years, whereas I’m looking at the last 3. These past three years I believe that we’ve turned the corner and are now catching up to PSU. We still have a ways to go, but we’re moving in the right direction.

About next year, I’m not willing to write us off just yet. Looking at out current projected lineup I see 3 potential finalist (Lee, Big Cass, Warner) and 5 sure fire AA’s (Pk, Wyatt). I also see three others with the potential for a solid run and possible AA’s (Murin, Brands, Assad). So, I’m not writing off next year at all at this point. When you look at our JR class of recruits and factor in that we have a real shot at adding a fourth hammer, I’m not handing the next 3 years to PSU.

I believe too many people on this thread are looking at the past ten years, which were not good. I’m looking at the progress we’ve made to catch up. Much better view from my mountain top.

PK needs to be an AA based on his recruiting ranking. And 2 years in the room.

Henson had a nice rs season but there were no wins that tell me sure fire AA. To me he has to be in the possibility group.

Making AA might be nice for the individual but unless you are getting in the top 4 range the points are pretty insignificant. 5/6 can make a small difference, 7/8 is next to nothing. With RBY returning they have 4 guys who are probable finalists next year plus Kerk who will be right there, pretty untouchable. The year after it drops down to 3 which maybe gives other teams a shot depending on what other guys do in their lineup but still an uphill climb. We lose Spencer and Warner then though. I like what we have going on in the 2023 class so far but that level of recruiting is going to need to continue.

 

[82bordeaux]

PK needs to be an AA based on his recruiting ranking. And 2 years in the room.

Patrick Kennedy will at least be a semi-finalist next year. Maybe better. That kid is a 100% hammer.

 

[Grip220]

PK is going to be like letting a caged animal out to eat, just watch the match when he lost to the Bull, he was pissed.
165 is going to be a absolute meat grinder again 2023, I say PK is right at the top.

 

[smalls103]

Alright, I will just disagree and leave it at that.
I appreciate your takes, if you run into that Mineo guy tell him I got a present for him.

i'd be interested to hear why you disagree.

 

[24 so far]

Had Carl stayed at ISU, I bet they would have won a few titles. He had David Taylor and others coming to ISU when he made the move. Do we think ISU had a slush fund going?

Honestly, if he hadn't left Penn State, Iowa is very likely dominating the Big 10, ISU is for sure dominating the Big 12, and I doubt PSU fans spend much time in the cesspool at all.

And we would have had more "can't miss" duals in Ames and Iowa City.

 

[Grip220]

i'd be interested to hear why you disagree.

NIL money! I think that changed things for Tom who I happen to know. This is not first hand knowledge.

 

[smalls103]

well, Tom Ryan has recruited insanely good even prior to NIL, which of course, is now legal. so i'm not sure what you're saying. unless you're saying either TNT should get in the NIL game.

either way, i think those guys (Feldman/Mendez/Bouzakis/Kilkeary/Welsh/Geog) would have ended up at tOSU regardless.

 

[Grip220]

well, Tom Ryan has recruited insanely good even prior to NIL, which of course, is now legal. so i'm not sure what you're saying. unless you're saying either TNT should get in the NIL game.

either way, i think those guys (Feldman/Mendez/Bouzakis/Kilkeary/Welsh/Geog) would have ended up at tOSU regardless.

He has done well, this is the first time he has landed multiple top level out of state recruits.
Anyone not fully getting things going full steam with NIL will be left behind in a big way.
TNT are fully aware and that’s why multiple guys besides SL have some sort of sponsors, including non starters like Charles Mathews

 

[Media Fan]

UPenn’s recent commitment to their integrated RTC, in the heart of Pennsylvania/NJ wrestling community, will be interesting to watch. I can see it having a positive impact on Penn’s recruiting and potentially provide a viable alternative to PSU For wrestlers wanting to stay close to home.

Maybe, but as a Penn graduate and PSU fan I’ll take the under.
Likely to have a positive impact on Penn but not negative on PSU. Possible effect on Lehigh, which is in the same league as Penn.
Which league would you prefer to wrestle in, the EIWA or the Big Ten.

 

[Media Fan]

If Cael was so great and people only handed him money because he proved he was a great coach then he wouldn't have had to flee Iowa State to go to PSU.

Have you ever been to State College.
IMO, a beautiful area and great place to live.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

Patrick Kennedy will at least be a semi-finalist next year. Maybe better. That kid is a 100% hammer.

Might want to pump the brakes, he didn't even make the semis at the South Scuffle this past season.

 

[js8793]

Might want to pump the brakes, he didn't even make the semis at the South Scuffle this past season.

i agree, though that loss looks a little better since Hall ended up placing. but i would guess somewhere 7-r12 for kennedy right now, mostly because of how the weight clears out.

 

[Gobblin]

i agree, though that loss looks a little better since Hall ended up placing. but i would guess somewhere 7-r12 for kennedy right now, mostly because of how the weight clears out.

That was far from the best version of PK at the time as well…. He probably shouldn’t have even been wrestling.

 

[js8793]

That was far from the best version of PK at the time as well…. He probably shouldn’t have even been wrestling.

idk he's been here 2 years and has been beat every time he's wrestled someone AA level. hope you're right, but i'm going to err on the side of him just being more a r12 type guy right now. hope he gets some matches in this offseason. he hasn't had much mat time.

 

[Gobblin]

idk he's been here 2 years and has been beat every time he's wrestled someone AA level. hope you're right, but i'm going to err on the side of him just being more a r12 type guy right now. hope he gets some matches in this offseason. he hasn't had much mat time.

Fair enough but the fact remains.

 

[smalls103]

i'm a PK believer

 

[horraybeer]

Recruiting class rankings are often trash. Multiple times teams with a number of guys signed but lower ranked were rated higher than say PSU with two top tens. What matters is can the guy score big points at Nationals or not. I don't believe for a second PSU has been limited to 9.9, that's a laugh.

Like Gable and his 2 extra scholly 's per year for 8-10 years? I think Gable is the best Ncaa coach ever, but he did cheat. Period.... If Psu is cheating it will be found.

 

[82bordeaux]

i'm a PK believer

I'm a PSU Alum and I'm a PK believer. But I'm also an AF believer...

 

[smalls103]

American Farmer?

oh, Alex Facundo. yeah. me too. and Levi, and Paddy. i think they're all going to be in mix. i know alex lost to caleb fish. i know pk lost at scuffle. i really don't care. i like em.

 

[Exo]

Fair enough but the fact remains.

I'm also eagerly waiting for PK but we all need to remember what 165 is. Its f****ng stacked with O'Toole, Kharchla, Griffith, Hamititi, Amine. PK is going to have to be awesome next year. I think he's up for the challenge.

 

[NCHawk5]

I'm also eagerly waiting for PK but we all need to remember what 165 is. Its f****ng stacked with O'Toole, Kharchla, Griffith, Hamititi, Amine. PK is going to have to be awesome next year. I think he's up for the challenge.

He’s held up pretty well in the matches I’ve seen. Did he struggle this past season in opens?

 

[ac98]

I don't disagree with the first part that someone is willing to pay for it...however Companies just don't give money to something without a ROI, or a tax benefit...so if a company is willing to pay RBY 100k this year and next...what is the ROI to that company and is it worth it to that company? Does investing in RBY now, return that 100k down the road in some fashion for my company?

the new NIL thing that PSU just created...i'm curious if it is going to be some sort of tax-deductible business/charity that donors will get a tax benefit from it by donating.

How many instagram followers does RBY have? Whether you think social media is a waste of time or not, it has significant marketing value. Our company measure ‘impressions’ all the time, can basically determine how many new clients we’ll get over a period of time based on those impressions. RBY holding up a product to is followers has a measurable ROI

 

[Trapper85]

How many instagram followers does RBY have? Whether you think social media is a waste of time or not, it has significant marketing value. Our company measure ‘impressions’ all the time, can basically determine how many new clients we’ll get over a period of time based on those impressions. RBY holding up a product to is followers has a measurable ROI

Agree, and I'm one of those dudes that thinks social media is a waste of time. But get a shitload of teeny boppers buying some trinket their hero has, one can make some good money. They'll throw it away and move on next week with the next fad, but money already in the pocket.

 

[82bordeaux]

How many instagram followers does RBY have? Whether you think social media is a waste of time or not, it has significant marketing value. Our company measure ‘impressions’ all the time, can basically determine how many new clients we’ll get over a period of time based on those impressions. RBY holding up a product to is followers has a measurable ROI

He has 167,000 followers. David Taylor 371,000 followers, and get this…Yazdani has 2.5 million. And we think wrestling is popular in Iowa! BTW Spencer Lee has 130,000.

 

[lookleft goright]

He has 167,000 followers. David Taylor 371,000 followers, and get this…Yazdani has 2.5 million. And we think wrestling is popular in Iowa! BTW Spencer Lee has 130,000.

Wrestling is the national sport of Iran. I wrestled over there about 43 years ago and it was pretty cool.

 

[PSU Mike]

Wrestling is the national sport of Iran. I wrestled over there about 43 years ago and it was pretty cool.

Just before the hostage thing?

 

[Grip220]

He has 167,000 followers. David Taylor 371,000 followers, and get this…Yazdani has 2.5 million. And we think wrestling is popular in Iowa! BTW Spencer Lee has 130,000.

Sadulaev has 1.4 mil on Instagram they are like royalty in their countries between him and Yazdani.

 

[CowboyUp61]

Wrestling is the national sport of Iran. I wrestled over there about 43 years ago and it was pretty cool.

which team did you go with? I know several that did tours there in 78

 

[lookleft goright]

which team did you go with? I know several that did tours there in 78

Junior College national team.

 

[lookleft goright]

Just before the hostage thing?

Yep. (Summer of '78 actually) We actually skipped out one night and spent a night in the American embassy that was taken over in 1979. We did not know any better. We met a marine while touring the city and he invited us to spend the night.

We originally were in Isfanhan and there were bombs dropping. Our hotel was surrounded by soldiers and protected by the Shah. Tanks were protecting the hotel. We were then taken from the city and sent to Tehran.
Looking back, we were lucky not to get shot or stabbed or something.

One night we were wrestling outside, as they do often, and the lights went out. We were immediately surrounded by military with lights being shown on us - I am guessing so they knew where we were and could protect us. Looking back, many things happened where we could have been in danger and we were not.

For example, we got side swiped by a vehicle and the Iranian wrestlers with us quickly pulled all the curtains shut in the van and got out and surrounded it. Then we were quickly taken away by another vehicle that showed up.
We had no idea of the tensions over there and the sentiment towards us. Although the people sure respected us as wrestlers, I think there was a lot of Anti Shah sentiment and anti American sentiment.

As a glimpse into the type of people the wrestlers who protected us were, 1 day I gave one of them a small gift. He then left and took his shirt off, washed it, and gave it to me as a gift. I wore that shirt for years. It was a life changing experience for me.

 

[el dub]

Yep. (Summer of '78 actually) We actually skipped out one night and spent a night in the American embassy that was taken over in 1979. We did not know any better. We met a marine while touring the city and he invited us to spend the night.

We originally were in Isfanhan and there were bombs dropping. Our hotel was surrounded by soldiers and protected by the Shah. Tanks were protecting the hotel. We were then taken from the city and sent to Tehran.
Looking back, we were lucky not to get shot or stabbed or something.

One night we were wrestling outside, as they do often, and the lights went out. We were immediately surrounded by military with lights being shown on us - I am guessing so they knew where we were and could protect us. Looking back, many things happened where we could have been in danger and we were not.

For example, we got side swiped by a vehicle and the Iranian wrestlers with us quickly pulled all the curtains shut in the van and got out and surrounded it. Then we were quickly taken away by another vehicle that showed up.
We had no idea of the tensions over there and the sentiment towards us. Although the people sure respected us as wrestlers, I think there was a lot of Anti Shah sentiment and anti American sentiment.

As a glimpse into the type of people the wrestlers who protected us were, 1 day I gave one of them a small gift. He then left and took his shirt off, washed it, and gave it to me as a gift. I wore that shirt for years. It was a life changing experience for me.

Dang…..