Texting while driving bans: Thoughts of cops and lawyers?

[lucas80]

Iowa is slowly moving towards making texting while driving a primary offense, meaning a law enforcement official can pull you over for observing you do it. In today's DI there is a quote from a defense attorney (Admittedly not a disinterested party), that said these charges will be very hard to prove? "I mean, they would have to prove the person was actually texting", said Adam Pollack. He added that prosecutor would need to subpoena phone records. Why? If an officer sees you with a device in your hand working at typing something out isn't that enough? If you get a ticket for jaywalking you don't need video evidence.
Could the cop immediately seize a phone as evidence if someone denied they were texting when stopped?
I'm highly in favor of the ban. I'm sick of seeing people texting while driving. Sick of people drifting into my lane coming from the opposite direction as they fight to drive and type at the same time. I almost got clipped by a kid on 4th Ave. this week after dropping off my oldest at City High. Kid driving a red minivan going around the corner with a phone in his hand and his thumb clearly trying to type.

 

[hawkeye54545]

As someone who generally dislikes more government intrusion of any kind I don't see how everyone but texting teenage girls can't get behind tougher penalties for texting and driving. I have heard it is more dangerous than drinking and driving so seems like a no brainer to me. Let the police confiscate the phones of a TWD perp.

 

[Funky Bunch]

Texting is just the tip of the iceberg. The ones I see look like they're mostly on FB.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Years ago I read about a German law (I think it was German) that requires drivers to have both hands on the wheel when sneezing. Seems weird and rather intrusive, but if you think about it, it makes sense.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Kid driving a red minivan going around the corner with a phone in his hand and his thumb clearly trying to type.

Clearly huh? He wasn't checking the weather? (Legal) He wasn't utilizing maps? (Legal) He wasn't finding a contact to call? (Legal).

Are you ok with a Law Enforcement Agency having immediate access to the following:
Bank Records
Personal Identification Records (Birth Cert, SS, Memberships, etc)
Personal Diary/Notes/whatever
Intimate conversations with a spouse
Family correspondence
Business records
Medical records
Sensitive-type records (work related, client info maybe)

I'm not. And "Texting while driving" shouldn't give them the pretense to have unfettered access. To me, this would be akin to an officer saying you were too noisy, disturbing the peace, therefore he is coming in to your home and gonna look around....but trust him, he won't go beyond that disturbing the peace issue...

 

[Thomas Barnes]

I think it should be illegal. They are as bad as drunks because they don't watch the road!!

 

[Derekd3408]

Clearly huh? He wasn't checking the weather? (Legal) He wasn't utilizing maps? (Legal) He wasn't finding a contact to call? (Legal).

Are you ok with a Law Enforcement Agency having immediate access to the following:
Bank Records
Personal Identification Records (Birth Cert, SS, Memberships, etc)
Personal Diary/Notes/whatever
Intimate conversations with a spouse
Family correspondence
Business records
Medical records
Sensitive-type records (work related, client info maybe)

I'm not. And "Texting while driving" shouldn't give them the pretense to have unfettered access. To me, this would be akin to an officer saying you were too noisy, disturbing the peace, therefore he is coming in to your home and gonna look around....but trust him, he won't go beyond that disturbing the peace issue...

I agree with you. You can't tell the difference between scrolling contacts and texting in a split second. I had a lady follow me into a gas station and chew my ass for texting and endangering her and her kids. I wasn't texting, simply swiping to answer a call. When I'm in my car I hold my phone with my right hand and use the cars Bluetooth.
If you're gonna pull people over for texting fine, however they need to ban any use of a cell phone that isn't hands free then.
If I have to give my phone up for swiping to make a call, I'm losing my shit.

 

[Wahawk56]

As someone who does text while driving, I'm turn as I usually use talk to text and an usually good at keeping my eyes on the road and of the screen, but I see people being horribly bad at it all the time.

 

[Old_wrestling_fan]

As someone who generally dislikes more government intrusion of any kind I don't see how everyone but texting teenage girls can't get behind tougher penalties for texting and driving. I have heard it is more dangerous than drinking and driving so seems like a no brainer to me. Let the police confiscate the phones of a TWD perp.

Agreed. Probably no less than once a week I see a close call accident, or sometimes an actual accident, related to the causal party focusing on their phone v. the road in front of them.

 

[KennyPowers_96]

As someone who does text while driving, I'm turn as I usually use talk to text and an usually good at keeping my eyes on the road and of the screen, but I see people being horribly bad at it all the time.

You're black and live in Iowa, so it probably won't be anything too different for you. The cops will pull you over if you're texting or not.

 

[Wahawk56]

You're black and live in Iowa, so it probably won't be anything too different for you. The cops will pull you over if you're texting or not.

Unless I'm in cr I don't worry about DWBs.

 

[theIowaHawk]

When I'm in my car I hold my phone with my right hand and use the cars Bluetooth.
If you're gonna pull people over for texting fine, however they need to ban any use of a cell phone that isn't hands free then.

In fact, studies are now showing that "hands-free" may be just as dangerous as texting. This simply isn't as easy as "OMG THAT GIRL IS TEXTING! MURDER!"

It is a $35 fine in Iowa right now.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Agreed. Probably no less than once a week I see a close call accident, or sometimes an actual accident, related to the causal party focusing on their phone v. the road in front of them.

You are claiming to see an accident (or just a "close" one) once a week? I'm thinking you might be the terrible driver.

 

[Derekd3408]

In fact, studies are now showing that "hands-free" may be just as dangerous as texting. This simply isn't as easy as "OMG THAT GIRL IS TEXTING! MURDER!"

It is a $35 fine in Iowa right now.

I'm not saying hands free is any safer. I'm simply pointing out that if texting becomes something they can pull you over for, and confiscate your phone as evidence, alot of people will be pulled over for simply making calls ect, and havebtheit phone taken for no reason. Make cell phone use illegal if you're going to go that far. That way if your seen on your phone it doesn't matter what you were doing. No need to confiscate your phone, if you're on it you're getting a ticket. Like wearing a seat belt.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Distracted driving is a scourge that is so dangerous that we spend, literally, millions of dollars to....equip officers with this:

While Law Enforcement Officers are on duty....should their cell phone records be available to the public?

 

[Wendy79]

As someone who does text while driving, I'm turn as I usually use talk to text and an usually good at keeping my eyes on the road and of the screen, but I see people being horribly bad at it all the time.

"I'm a really good driver when I'm buzzed...I pay more attention."

 

[Lone Clone]

Clearly huh? He wasn't checking the weather? (Legal) He wasn't utilizing maps? (Legal) He wasn't finding a contact to call? (Legal).

Are you ok with a Law Enforcement Agency having immediate access to the following:
Bank Records
Personal Identification Records (Birth Cert, SS, Memberships, etc)
Personal Diary/Notes/whatever
Intimate conversations with a spouse
Family correspondence
Business records
Medical records
Sensitive-type records (work related, client info maybe)

I'm not. And "Texting while driving" shouldn't give them the pretense to have unfettered access. To me, this would be akin to an officer saying you were too noisy, disturbing the peace, therefore he is coming in to your home and gonna look around....but trust him, he won't go beyond that disturbing the peace issue...

Maybe one of the lawyers or law enforcement officers here can answer the question I've always asked and never had answered: Why not just use the law against careless driving?

 

[linkshero]

I think we need to teach people how to do it better. It's not that hard. Also, I think it's making traffic worse, people tend to driver slower, leave more space between them and the car in front of them.

 

[MuscoHawk]

1. I use my phone for GPS directions all the time while driving -- should I be pulled over for that?

2. What about these activities while driving: Eating, reading, changing the radio station, shaving, dealing with kids, etc.

3. I see cops on their phones (and computers) while driving quite often.

 

[theVoicefromtheTomb]

1. I use my phone for GPS directions all the time while driving -- should I be pulled over for that?

2. What about these activities while driving: Eating, reading, changing the radio station, shaving, dealing with kids, etc.

3. I see cops on their phones (and computers) while driving quite often.

If you use your phone GPS while driving you should be pulled over. All GPs installed in a auto should only be able to be set when the car is in park.

I am tired of being in traffic behind someone who is obviously distracted. When I pull up beside them they are using their phone for talk or text. Here is a solution. Disable all phones when the car is in drive.

 

[torbee]

Unless I'm in cr I don't worry about DWBs.

You might want to avoid Bettendorf and LeClaire as well. Speaking from observing the experience of several of my darker-complexioned friends.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

I don't think it needs to be banned. I like the way it is set up right now. Harsher penalties often do not dissuade people from committing crimes. After all is there really a harsher penalty than getting killed in a car accident because you weren't paying attention? people text and drive because they don't think they will get caught.

Plus as the law stands right now can't a cop pull someone over for a primary offense of inattentive driving and tack the texting charge on top of it?

 

[lucas80]

Clearly huh? He wasn't checking the weather? (Legal) He wasn't utilizing maps? (Legal) He wasn't finding a contact to call? (Legal).

Are you ok with a Law Enforcement Agency having immediate access to the following:
Bank Records
Personal Identification Records (Birth Cert, SS, Memberships, etc)
Personal Diary/Notes/whatever
Intimate conversations with a spouse
Family correspondence
Business records
Medical records
Sensitive-type records (work related, client info maybe)

I'm not. And "Texting while driving" shouldn't give them the pretense to have unfettered access. To me, this would be akin to an officer saying you were too noisy, disturbing the peace, therefore he is coming in to your home and gonna look around....but trust him, he won't go beyond that disturbing the peace issue...

Yes, clearly. And, since he was in my f***** lane coming from the opposite direction and gave me a goofy smile when he did look up and realize he'd almost hit me I couldn't care less if in actuality he was doing something perfectly "safe" like checking the weather or checking his contacts.
There is nothing in the proposed law that says a cop can dip into anything you listed if you are pulled over for texting.

 

[Derekd3408]

If you use your phone GPS while driving you should be pulled over. All GPs installed in a auto should only be able to be set when the car is in park.

I am tired of being in traffic behind someone who is obviously distracted. When I pull up beside them they are using their phone for talk or text. Here is a solution. Disable all phones when the car is in drive.

Disable texting and internet, sure. Disable your entire phone, hell no. I spend 4-6 hrs a day in my car, what if an emergency comes up when I'm 20 min into a 4 hr drive?

 

[SoDakHawk]

Laws are already on the books to deal with this, no need to add more laws. Just pull the driver over for careless driving, problem solved.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Yes, clearly. And, since he was in my f***** lane coming from the opposite direction and gave me a goofy smile when he did look up and realize he'd almost hit me I couldn't care less if in actuality he was doing something perfectly "safe" like checking the weather or checking his contacts.
There is nothing in the proposed law that says a cop can dip into anything you listed if you are pulled over for texting.

You'd make great law enforcement. You could, without any doubt, say exactly what that guy was doing.

But, then you say it doesn't even matter if what he was doing was legal.

Nobody said it was safe, I said it was legal.

You are right, there is nothing in the proposed law that says an officer who takes your phone has authority to look at all of those private documents. Man, I wonder where I got the idea/fear that they might do it anyway...

 

[theIowaHawk]

Maybe one of the lawyers or law enforcement officers here can answer the question I've always asked and never had answered: Why not just use the law against careless driving?

321.277A CARELESS DRIVING.
A person commits careless driving if the person intentionally
operates a motor vehicle on a public road or highway in any one of
the following ways:
1. Creates or causes unnecessary tire squealing, skidding, or
sliding upon acceleration or stopping.
2. Simulates a temporary race.
3. Causes any wheel or wheels to unnecessarily lose contact with
the ground.
4. Causes the vehicle to unnecessarily turn abruptly or sway.

Let's say 2 is out for sure, but 1 and 4 are likely, and 3 is plausible.

This really isn't that different than OWI. An officer can't pull someone over for "being drunk", as they'd have no way to know that. They must have reasonable suspicion, something articulable for the reason for pulling over. If an absolute alcoholic, with a BAC of .403 is driving around in a perfectly legal manner ----- he can not legally be pulled over.

 

[stout1]

You are claiming to see an accident (or just a "close" one) once a week? I'm thinking you might be the terrible driver.

I have driven about 60 miles round trip commuting every day since 2003. Before that I was driving 4000 miles per month for 3 years as a contractor. I haven't seen 20 accidents or close calls in the last 15 years much less one evry week. Even if we lop half that for when texting became common place I'm still not averaging one per week.

 

[lucas80]

Maybe one of the lawyers or law enforcement officers here can answer the question I've always asked and never had answered: Why not just use the law against careless driving?

I guess to create specificity. To take any doubt out of the officers mind as to what to do. If the legislature passes the law, and the Branstad passes it then it's clear that the specific act of texting while driving is bad. Careless driving is nebulous and hard to prove.

 

[lucas80]

I always love the knee jerk reactions that nothing, absolutely nothing should interfere with how an American chooses to drive. Like it's in the Constitution you can text. Nothing except the thought of gun nuts losing their Uzi's upsets people more than being told how to drive.
If someone happens to die, well that kind of thing happens. They shouldn't have been operating their car at a safe speed in their lane, or have been standing on that sidewalk.

 

[theIowaHawk]

I always love the knee jerk reactions that nothing, absolutely nothing should interfere with how an American chooses to drive. Like it's in the Constitution you can text. Nothing except the thought of gun nuts losing their Uzi's upsets people more than being told how to drive.
If someone happens to die, well that kind of thing happens. They shouldn't have been operating their car at a safe speed in their lane, or have been standing on that sidewalk.

What a weird spewing of drivel. At no point in this thread has anybody brought up the Constitution, nor a right to text.

"Clearly" you can tell which people are and are not violating the law, therefore "clearly" we should just make you Driving Czar, and you can just summarily execute those whom you deem to be criminals.

 

[Lone Clone]

321.277A CARELESS DRIVING.
A person commits careless driving if the person intentionally
operates a motor vehicle on a public road or highway in any one of
the following ways:
1. Creates or causes unnecessary tire squealing, skidding, or
sliding upon acceleration or stopping.
2. Simulates a temporary race.
3. Causes any wheel or wheels to unnecessarily lose contact with
the ground.
4. Causes the vehicle to unnecessarily turn abruptly or sway.

Let's say 2 is out for sure, but 1 and 4 are likely, and 3 is plausible.

This really isn't that different than OWI. An officer can't pull someone over for "being drunk", as they'd have no way to know that. They must have reasonable suspicion, something articulable for the reason for pulling over. If an absolute alcoholic, with a BAC of .403 is driving around in a perfectly legal manner ----- he can not legally be pulled over.

Thanks. That is fascinating. I would have thought the definition quoted would be for reckless driving, rather than careless driving. Or maybe there is no distinction anymore. I think the last time I actually paid any attention to it was when I was studying for my test in 1962. It's possible things have changed since then.

An officer can pull over somebody for not looking where he/she is going. I would think all that would be necessary is for the cop to see the doing something other than driving the car - which would include turning into the back seat to admonish a child, or reaching down to pick up a spilled french fry, or fine-tuning the sound system, as well as playing with a cell phone.

I only use my phone with the bluetooth and the buttons on the steering wheel, and I don't initiate calls when the car is in motion. I still don't like doing it, because I firmly believe those studies are right when they say that hands-free telephone conversation is distracting.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Thanks. That is fascinating. I would have thought the definition quoted would be for reckless driving, rather than careless driving. Or maybe there is no distinction anymore. I think the last time I actually paid any attention to it was when I was studying for my test in 1962. It's possible things have changed since then.

An officer can pull over somebody for not looking where he/she is going. I would think all that would be necessary is for the cop to see the doing something other than driving the car - which would include turning into the back seat to admonish a child, or reaching down to pick up a spilled french fry, or fine-tuning the sound system, as well as playing with a cell phone.

I only use my phone with the bluetooth and the buttons on the steering wheel, and I don't initiate calls when the car is in motion. I still don't like doing it, because I firmly believe those studies are right when they say that hands-free telephone conversation is distracting.

321.277 RECKLESS DRIVING.
Any person who drives any vehicle in such manner as to indicate
either a willful or a wanton disregard for the safety of persons or
property is guilty of reckless driving.

Careless driving is a scheduled traffic fine, I think $25.
Reckless is a misdemeanor, so technically up to 30 days, over $600

One could convince a Judge that it is reckless driving, if Texting = disregard for safety of others. It appears that Lucas would convict.

Oh and, I'm glad you don't text LC, dangerous to us all.

 

[mstp1992]

As someone who does text while driving, I'm turn as I usually use talk to text and an usually good at keeping my eyes on the road and of the screen, but I see people being horribly bad at it all the time.

Given the horrible grammar displayed in your post I don't think you should be so confident about your texting and driving skills.

 

[Mike Zierath]

Man, I'm definitely guilty of this all day everyday.

Texting, answering email, Facebook, HR, Skype..................I'm guessing I'll die in my car.....

But since I'm in it most of the day, to the tune of 50,000 plus miles a year, doing my job behind the wheel is kind of second nature at this point. I do use talk to text most of the time......

yep, guilty!

Z

 

[Wahawk56]

Given the horrible grammar displayed in your post I don't think you should be so confident about your texting and driving skills.

God Damn, get the dick out of your ass long enough to lighten up Francis.

 

[mstp1992]

God Damn, get the dick out of your ass long enough to lighten up Francis.

You forget that I'm a serious individual. I'm quite adept at pointing out the errors others commit.

 

[Wahawk56]

You forget that I'm a serious individual. I'm quite adept at pointing out the errors others commit.

You on my jock more than a fat bitch chasing my food stamp card. I'm about to start a Steven Patrick file on you and see how much you follow me around.

 

[mstp1992]

You on my jock more than a fat bitch chasing my food stamp card. I'm about to start a Steven Patrick file on you and see how much you follow me around.

You're a funny guy. A bit paranoid, but funny nonetheless. The syntax with which you choose to express yourself I suspect belies your true linguistic abilities.

That's a compliment, by the way.

 

[Mike Zierath]

Easy boys..........

Z