The West is Wisconsin then everyone else

[BigDelHawk]

So money was the only reason? Personnel had nothing to do with it? We heard from one of our own players (a ND transfer) that they had crappy facilities back then, yet they were pretty good at that time.

We had a reputation as being the bad boys if the Big Ten. Gangs started wearing our jerseys because we hit so hard, buried helmets in the numbers, wrapped and drove through, we were well coached in that technique and intimidated teams. Helmet to helmet contact was often the result. Current tackling techniques/rules preclude the ability to become known for that. Lots of arm tackles these days. Like it or not, current rules brings lots of parity.

 

[BigDelHawk]

Wisky’s success comes down to one thing IMHO...recruiting!
They’ve just done better than KF and staff . The gap is closing I believe and hopefully it translates to more success on the field .

Again, they do have a deeper recruiting area than we do, and less competition in state. Their line does not rebuild, it re-loads. Lots of big, small town Germans, Swedes and Norwegian kids in Wisconsin. Good work ethic and they respect authority.

 

[the24fan]

Again, they do have a deeper recruiting area than we do, and less competition in state. Their line does not rebuild, it re-loads. Lots of big, small town Germans, Swedes and Norwegian kids in Wisconsin. Good work ethic and they respect authority.

Very true. The brats and cheese grow them some big boys alright

 

[Goldteam]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

Fleck to the rescue here.

Just give it a little time.

 

[LaQuintaHawkeye]

Fleck to the rescue here.

Just give it a little time.

What about Frost?

 

[icantfindausernamethatisntused]

There is one main difference between Wisconsin and Iowa in the last 10 years: rushing offense.

Wisconsin has finished in the top 3 in the Big 10 in rushing offense in 9 out of the last 10 seasons. In that same time, Iowa's highest finish was 4th in 2008.

When Iowa runs the ball well, we win. In the last 3 years, Iowa is 28-1 when we rush for over 100 yards. Conversely, they are 0-11 when rushing for less than 100 yards.

 

[BigDelHawk]

There is one main difference between Wisconsin and Iowa in the last 10 years: rushing offense.

Wisconsin has finished in the top 3 in the Big 10 in rushing offense in 9 out of the last 10 seasons. In that same time, Iowa's highest finish was 4th in 2008.

When Iowa runs the ball well, we win. In the last 3 years, Iowa is 28-1 when we rush for over 100 yards. Conversely, they are 0-11 when rushing for less than 100 yards.

We played two true freshmen this year at tackle, and lost two Seniors. Of course we did not open holes like in the past, we had baby fat leaning against solid muscle, comparatively speaking.

 

[icantfindausernamethatisntused]

We played two true freshmen this year at tackle, and lost two Seniors. Of course we did not open holes like in the past, we had baby fat leaning against solid muscle, comparatively speaking.

Yes, losing our two tackles hurt us this year, but the point is that Iowa hasn't been near Wisconsin's level in running the ball for the past decade - it's not just a one year issue.

 

[bojihawk44]

Fleck to the rescue here.

Just give it a little time.

Minnesota would need a 10-15 year stretch of sustained success to even be mentioned in the same breath as Iowa, much less Wisconsin. Not gonna happen, obviously.

 

[Johnsoda123]

NW has an incredible new practice facility being built. Thank god they have such high academic requirements.

Saw a piece on their new facility. On the lake. Very impressive.

 

[Goldteam]

What about Frost?

It's possible. One thing we do know is Ferentz and Fitz won't do it.

 

[BigDelHawk]

Minnesota would need a 10-15 year stretch of sustained success to even be mentioned in the same breath as Iowa, much less Wisconsin. Not gonna happen, obviously.

Minnesota has an advantage, much like Wisconsin, lack of other P5 schools in the area, and a large population (6 million people) of big boys for the line. I fear them what with their new investments In facilities. Additionally, they can offer an Urban environment and a career path in large corporations due to placement in companies like IBM, 3M and Honeywell having heavy presence there (amongst others). They are going to be fierce competition.

 

[EpenesaEpenesa]

It's possible. One thing we do know is Ferentz and Fitz won't do it.

Ferentz been there done that. Does Minnesota have a program?

 

[pacnorthhawkeye]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

Are you actually Brian griese? Cuz you sound just like him.

 

[bojihawk44]

Minnesota has an advantage, much like Wisconsin, lack of other P5 schools in the area, and a large population (6 million people) of big boys for the line. I fear them what with their new investments In facilities. Additionally, they can offer an Urban environment and a career path in large corporations due to placement in companies like IBM, 3M and Honeywell having heavy presence there (amongst others). They are going to be fierce competition.

Yeah, I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

Wisconsin has been rock solid since Barry rebuilt the program. His steadying hand at AD keeps that program on that continued path. However, all the same, the margins between the 2 programs (Iowa and Wisconsin) aren't quite as you see them.

Wisconsin's '17 season is much like Iowa's '15 season. While Wisconsin has pulled away in the second half of the last few match-ups ... the Iowa vs Wisconsin games have been pretty close games (certainly closer than the scores indicate).

Unless you've forgotten ... part of what swayed Iowa's loss this past year was Iowa's anemic O AND no fewer than 2 unforced errors by the Hawk O.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

We’ve gone full insane on this board

A number of the trolls have all their lures out .... and many Hawk fans are biting.

 

[JoelBittner]

A number of the trolls have all their lures out .... and many Hawk fans are biting.

The tools are upset with the trolls? C'mon, it's a discussion board. And as a master debater you know better than most that labels were invented for lousy debaters in search of safe spaces.

 

[gregg75]

I’m a Wisconsin fan. After reading this conversation;
1. Wisconsin is not elite. We are on the doorstep of being elite, but until we make the playoffs a few times, we are not elite. Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Clemson, and Ohio State are the schools who can currently claim to be elite. Notre Dame, Penn State, Florida State, Michigan, USC, Auburn, and LSU probably make up the next tier of programs who can be elite. Texas, Miami, Florida, UCLA and Texas A&M are formerly elite programs with the potential to be elite again. Wisconsin is Stanford. Better than most of those programs when they are average or down, but not when they are good.
2. We may have a better team next year, but have a worse record. Our offense is going to be flat out good. Our WR’s are young and getting better. Add an off-season and get Cephus back, and we’ll be loaded. Our offensive line will return probably everyone, so should be better. We’ll have a drop off at TE and FB, but we should be good. As long as Hornibrook doesn’t take a few steps backward, we’ll be really good. We lose guys on defense, but have depth and playmakers behind the guys we lose. CB will be our biggest question mark.
3. We probably won’t be elite again next year.
4. I think Nebraska with Scott Frost has the potential to be the class of the West in 2 years.
5. Stanley is better than Hornibrook. We wish we were able to flip him.
6. Alvarez wins. He knows nothing about hockey, but has turned out hockey program around. He knows a lot about football. I can’t imagine mediocrity will be tolerated.
7. Wisconsin does have an advantage over Iowa. Wisconsin has a bunch of D3 schools who compete for the d3 championship every year. UW Whitewater is an elite d3 program. There are a ton of underrated kids in Wisconsin. Every year we have 2-3 kids who walked on because no one else wanted them who become stars for us. Next year Ryan Connelly might get All American consideration.
8. It might be time for Iowa to change coaches. Just saying, maybe time for a change. Honestly, we were pissed when Bielema left. But even Gary Anderson (a bad hire) brought Dave Aranda and the 3-4 defense. Now, we wouldn’t take Bielema as a linebacker coach. Sometimes change is good.
9. I don’t think Wisconsin will fear Iowa under the current regime. You guys just seem to be built to win 8 games a year and dumb luck your way to really good seasons every so often.
10. Your basketball program is heading in the right direction while ours might be falling by the wayside. This year’s team wasn’t very good before we lost 2 guys to injury. And our recruiting has fallen apart this year.

 

[Johnsoda123]

The tools are upset with the trolls? C'mon, it's a discussion board. And as a master debater you know better than most that labels were invented for lousy debaters in search of safe spaces.

As a master bater you know the term tool is also a label.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

The tools are upset with the trolls? C'mon, it's a discussion board. And as a master debater you know better than most that labels were invented for lousy debaters in search of safe spaces.

A board like this is effectively a Hawkeye "community" ... what I'm noticing is a bunch of "unknown" posters are all of a sudden posting bunch of stuff (many posts and topics are more of the flaming variety). If that's not trolling ... I don't know what is. Of course, as you said, part of the fun of these boards can sometimes be the conversations that get struck up from this sort of dissonance. That can certainly be true ... but it can also be tiresome too.

 

[i closed wolski.s]

In fairness over the last 4 years probably 3-4 schools can can equal Wisconsin’s win total. I’d also add that other than Ohio State they’ve out preformed everyone in the Big 10 over the last 2 season by a ways.

They have twice the population of Iowa and there is no other P5 school in the state. Whether you’re willing to admit it or not, they have an advantage over us.

Wisconsin is a below average state for recruiting. No 4 stars in 2018 or so far in 2019. They get a stud o-lineman or rb every couple of years but that's about it. They constantly hover in the 30s nationally in recruiting. They also have a huge hurdle to overcome with their admission standards. They lose out on a lot of elite talent because their admission standards are so high. Their ability to develop 2 and 3 star kids as well as walk ons is crazy. In 2016 their best defensive and offensive players were both walk ons. Also, their strength and conditioning program is second to none.

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Wisky’s success comes down to one thing IMHO...recruiting!
They’ve just done better than KF and staff . The gap is closing I believe and hopefully it translates to more success on the field .

Wisconsin has landed some fine skill talent of late ... namely AJ Taylor, Jonathan Taylor, and Danny Davis (Iowa was after at least 2 of the 3 ... if not all 3) ... and also landed under-recruited talents like Cephus and Pryor.

However, apart from the aforementioned skill players ... if you really break down the recruits ... the level of recruiting has been more comparable than you might think.

Part of the wisdom that Barry has imparted is to encourage the coaches to focus first and foremost on landing guys who FIT THE PROGRAM. How well a guy fits the program has very little to do with the number of "stars" by his name.

 

[Ladell-hawk]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

Well, that will just make it that much more exciting when we knock them off at Kinnick next Sept. in a night game!

 

[Ladell-hawk]

Minnesota has an advantage, much like Wisconsin, lack of other P5 schools in the area, and a large population (6 million people) of big boys for the line. I fear them what with their new investments In facilities. Additionally, they can offer an Urban environment and a career path in large corporations due to placement in companies like IBM, 3M and Honeywell having heavy presence there (amongst others). They are going to be fierce competition.

not.

 

[johnnashhawk]

That's certainly a fair assessment. Hornibrook played great tonight I must say, but he also made some throws where his receivers bailed him out. Granted, he could develop well during the off season but I don't see him as ever being better than mediocre. I try to be objective and not wear black and gold glasses but I would much rather have Stanley at QB than Hornibrook, and QB is the most important position on the field.
I also think our OL has the potential to be better next year than they were this year unless Daniels goes pro. To echo what you said about our run game if we could consistently do that it would be great, since as we all know our offense is at its best when we field a consistent running game.

Agree. Their receivers were very good. And their oline.

 

[LaQuintaHawkeye]

It's possible. One thing we do know is Ferentz and Fitz won't do it.

 

[phildickert]

I also think that Wisconsin stands to lose a lot and the west may be anyone's for the taking next season. If we can sufficiently replace our LB crew we could be up to the task.

You’re dreaming

 

[TheGuy9]

It’s one of the main reasons why I hate Wisconsin so much. They shouldn’t have any real advantage over Iowa, but here they are making our program look amateurish and atrocious.

It’s time for a major change in Iowa City.

I don't know how you could say UW doesn't have an advantage over Iowa. Population is almost double that of Iowa and the Metro area of Milwaukee is 50% of the entire population of Iowa. This year, Iowa had 9 total 3 and 4 stars while Wisconsin had 13. Iowa had one skill position player while Wisconsin had 3.
As far as educationally, outside the state of Iowa and the med-school, Wisconsin has a much better reputation. I live on the north shore of Chicago, and Iowa is generally considered a fall back University. Wisconsin is a primary University.
Plus Madison is just so much more cool than Iowa City.

 

[UNIHAWK88]

You’re dreaming

Read the post again, I said the west MAY be anyone's for the taking, and IF we can sufficiently replace our LB crew we COULD BE up to the task. A lot of speculation. Are you a Wisconsin fan? Do you suggest the teams in the west just hand them the title?

 

[ghostOfHomer777]

Any given season ... nearly anything can happen. A lot depends on what the players end up doing ... how they develop ... how well they execute their responsibilities within the offensive and defensive systems. If the players aren't buying into what the coaches want ... the program will suffer accordingly. Iowa got hurt in '14 by having lethargy on the side of the coaches ... but also having players not fully "invested" into what the coaches were implementing.

A few years ago ... Wisconsin was pretty dinged up at running back ... and they had to ride a beast-mode defense to have success.

Years even before that ... Northwestern was picked to be near or at the top of the division. However, Cain Colter and a RB got "too big for their britches" .... and seemingly put themselves, as individuals, ahead of the team. Consequently, that talented Northwestern squad imploded ... quite a surprisingly development given the expectations that were laden upon them.

 

[DewHawk]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

Unfortunately this is probably true. They are a very well coached team on both sides of the ball. Jim L (DC) will be a head coach somewhere very soon IMO.

 

[Wasnt-drunk-didnt-troll]

I’m a Wisconsin fan. After reading this conversation;
1. Wisconsin is not elite. We are on the doorstep of being elite, but until we make the playoffs a few times, we are not elite. Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Clemson, and Ohio State are the schools who can currently claim to be elite. Notre Dame, Penn State, Florida State, Michigan, USC, Auburn, and LSU probably make up the next tier of programs who can be elite. Texas, Miami, Florida, UCLA and Texas A&M are formerly elite programs with the potential to be elite again. Wisconsin is Stanford. Better than most of those programs when they are average or down, but not when they are good.
2. We may have a better team next year, but have a worse record. Our offense is going to be flat out good. Our WR’s are young and getting better. Add an off-season and get Cephus back, and we’ll be loaded. Our offensive line will return probably everyone, so should be better. We’ll have a drop off at TE and FB, but we should be good. As long as Hornibrook doesn’t take a few steps backward, we’ll be really good. We lose guys on defense, but have depth and playmakers behind the guys we lose. CB will be our biggest question mark.
3. We probably won’t be elite again next year.
4. I think Nebraska with Scott Frost has the potential to be the class of the West in 2 years.
5. Stanley is better than Hornibrook. We wish we were able to flip him.
6. Alvarez wins. He knows nothing about hockey, but has turned out hockey program around. He knows a lot about football. I can’t imagine mediocrity will be tolerated.
7. Wisconsin does have an advantage over Iowa. Wisconsin has a bunch of D3 schools who compete for the d3 championship every year. UW Whitewater is an elite d3 program. There are a ton of underrated kids in Wisconsin. Every year we have 2-3 kids who walked on because no one else wanted them who become stars for us. Next year Ryan Connelly might get All American consideration.
8. It might be time for Iowa to change coaches. Just saying, maybe time for a change. Honestly, we were pissed when Bielema left. But even Gary Anderson (a bad hire) brought Dave Aranda and the 3-4 defense. Now, we wouldn’t take Bielema as a linebacker coach. Sometimes change is good.
9. I don’t think Wisconsin will fear Iowa under the current regime. You guys just seem to be built to win 8 games a year and dumb luck your way to really good seasons every so often.
10. Your basketball program is heading in the right direction while ours might be falling by the wayside. This year’s team wasn’t very good before we lost 2 guys to injury. And our recruiting has fallen apart this year.

This may be the best post from an outsider I have ever seen written on this board. Unfourtuanly you are going to lose 50% of the readers right here
"8. It might be time for Iowa to change coaches. Just saying, maybe time for a change. Honestly, we were pissed when Bielema left. But even Gary Anderson (a bad hire) brought Dave Aranda and the 3-4 defense. Now, we wouldn’t take Bielema as a linebacker coach. Sometimes change is good."

Thank you, and f Wisconsin, sorry mate.

 

[biggreydogs]

by a long shot. We've fallen so far behind that program this decade, it's just silly. Their last two seasons would be top 4 seasons at Iowa over the last 20 years.

That’s football

 

[LeftyLarry]

Wisconsin has been rock solid since Barry rebuilt the program. His steadying hand at AD keeps that program on that continued path. However, all the same, the margins between the 2 programs (Iowa and Wisconsin) aren't quite as you see them.

Wisconsin's '17 season is much like Iowa's '15 season. While Wisconsin has pulled away in the second half of the last few match-ups ... the Iowa vs Wisconsin games have been pretty close games (certainly closer than the scores indicate).

Unless you've forgotten ... part of what swayed Iowa's loss this past year was Iowa's anemic O AND no fewer than 2 unforced errors by the Hawk O.

What you forget is Wisconsin manhandled you in 2015 and you got very lucky.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Barry Alvarez has built, and manages, a better program than Iowa with similar resources. I am jealous of them.

Similar resources, you say?........

Please list for reference.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

What you forget is Wisconsin manhandled you in 2015 and you got very lucky.

No.

Wisconsin was held to 86 yds rushing, they had 4 turnovers, they only had more total yards because they had to pass at the end of the game, and they trailed the rest of the game after the 1st qtr.......


Wisconsin needs to do that more often against everyone they play. You're welcome.

 

[hawkeyeinmo]

The Badgers have the least in state competition for High School players than any Power 5 team in the country.

What you forget is Wisconsin manhandled you in 2015 and you got very lucky.

TOP Iowa 29.14 Wisconsin 30.86. 34 rush attempts for 86 yards 2.5 YARDS PER RUSH=manhandled? Uh okay Larry

 

[EpenesaEpenesa]

What you forget is Wisconsin manhandled you in 2015 and you got very lucky.

Manhandled? Really? Lol

 

[EpenesaEpenesa]

I’m a Wisconsin fan. After reading this conversation;
1. Wisconsin is not elite. We are on the doorstep of being elite, but until we make the playoffs a few times, we are not elite. Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Clemson, and Ohio State are the schools who can currently claim to be elite. Notre Dame, Penn State, Florida State, Michigan, USC, Auburn, and LSU probably make up the next tier of programs who can be elite. Texas, Miami, Florida, UCLA and Texas A&M are formerly elite programs with the potential to be elite again. Wisconsin is Stanford. Better than most of those programs when they are average or down, but not when they are good.
2. We may have a better team next year, but have a worse record. Our offense is going to be flat out good. Our WR’s are young and getting better. Add an off-season and get Cephus back, and we’ll be loaded. Our offensive line will return probably everyone, so should be better. We’ll have a drop off at TE and FB, but we should be good. As long as Hornibrook doesn’t take a few steps backward, we’ll be really good. We lose guys on defense, but have depth and playmakers behind the guys we lose. CB will be our biggest question mark.
3. We probably won’t be elite again next year.
4. I think Nebraska with Scott Frost has the potential to be the class of the West in 2 years.
5. Stanley is better than Hornibrook. We wish we were able to flip him.
6. Alvarez wins. He knows nothing about hockey, but has turned out hockey program around. He knows a lot about football. I can’t imagine mediocrity will be tolerated.
7. Wisconsin does have an advantage over Iowa. Wisconsin has a bunch of D3 schools who compete for the d3 championship every year. UW Whitewater is an elite d3 program. There are a ton of underrated kids in Wisconsin. Every year we have 2-3 kids who walked on because no one else wanted them who become stars for us. Next year Ryan Connelly might get All American consideration.
8. It might be time for Iowa to change coaches. Just saying, maybe time for a change. Honestly, we were pissed when Bielema left. But even Gary Anderson (a bad hire) brought Dave Aranda and the 3-4 defense. Now, we wouldn’t take Bielema as a linebacker coach. Sometimes change is good.
9. I don’t think Wisconsin will fear Iowa under the current regime. You guys just seem to be built to win 8 games a year and dumb luck your way to really good seasons every so often.
10. Your basketball program is heading in the right direction while ours might be falling by the wayside. This year’s team wasn’t very good before we lost 2 guys to injury. And our recruiting has fallen apart this year.

Gregg post more often