This might be a little tougher than Putin thought...

[Tenacious E]

"The surrender of Kherson is the largest geopolitical defeat of Russia since the collapse of the USSR," Sergei Markov, a pro-Kremlin political analyst and ex-advisor to Putin, said on Telegram."

Ex-Putin advisor compares Kherson retreat in Ukraine to the collapse of the Soviet Union, warning of 'really big' consequences

"The surrender of Kherson is the largest geopolitical defeat of Russia since the collapse of the USSR," an ex-Putin advisor said.

www.yahoo.com

But then, there is this...

Russia claims pullout from occupied city; Ukraine skeptical

Russia's military said Wednesday it will withdraw from the only Ukrainian regional capital it captured, but Kyiv was skeptical and an analyst warned this could be a ruse to lure the country's forces into a deadly trap. A forced pullout from the city of Kherson would mark one of Russia’s worst...

www.yahoo.com

 

[Joes Place]

Hypotheticals or not, the US is not fighting in this war, therefore we have no true objective to gain

Destroying the army of our geopolitical rival is "nothing to gain"?

In what universe?

 

[torbee]

"The surrender of Kherson is the largest geopolitical defeat of Russia since the collapse of the USSR," Sergei Markov, a pro-Kremlin political analyst and ex-advisor to Putin, said on Telegram."

Ex-Putin advisor compares Kherson retreat in Ukraine to the collapse of the Soviet Union, warning of 'really big' consequences

"The surrender of Kherson is the largest geopolitical defeat of Russia since the collapse of the USSR," an ex-Putin advisor said.

www.yahoo.com

Hell, just wait until they lose Crimea!!

 

[Tenacious E]

So I will take one for the team and admit I got confused by the "right bank" and "left bank" references to Dnieper River. Turns out I was right to be confused, as they are apparently inverted.

 

[seminole97]

Let’s try this as a hypothetical with you as President of the US.

In this hypothetical, somehow Canada is a major military power and the US is much weaker but has powerful friends.

Let’s say Canada invaded and took over Washington, Oregon, Montana, Maine, Vermont and New Hampshire.

Somehow, the outmatched but plucky American Army stops the initial invasion, saves NYC and Washington D.C. and - with help from weapons from its powerful allies - manages to take back Oregon, New Hampshire and Vermont in less than 10 months and is continuing to roll back the Canadians and inflict losses on them while you see the Canadian economy weaken and the globe turning against it.

If a general from, say Mexico, told you it’s time to be done and to just let the Canadians keep Washington, Montana and Maine to “end the bloodshed” despite the fact you are currently winning all the battles, what is your call as commander in chief?

How well can I do in this hypothetical war without Mexico’s flow of weapons and money? Am I dependent upon it for my success?

 

[WhiteSoxClone]

So I will take one for the team and admit I got confused by the "right bank" and "left bank" references to Dnieper River. Turns out I was right to be confused, as they are apparently inverted.

 

[seminole97]

So I will take one for the team and admit I got confused by the "right bank" and "left bank" references to Dnieper River. Turns out I was right to be confused, as they are apparently inverted.

Imagine you were going down it like the Mississippi, headed to New Orleans (Kherson)

 

[seminole97]

These past few months have seen the 'war of drones' play a decisive role on the Ukrainian battlefield. For the Russian side, drones were heavily utilized in the ramped up air campaign to degrade Ukrainian energy infrastructure following the bombing of Crimea's Kerch Strait Bridge. For Ukraine's army, Western-supplied drones have allowed them to strike increasingly behind Russian front lines. There's meanwhile been international condemnation over the prevalence of Iran-supplied suicide drones launched from the Russian side.

Ukraine is of course hoping to begin deploying drones with longer reach. But, one day after the Midterms election, the Biden administration has shut the door on Kiev obtaining more advanced and longer range UAVs from the US ahead of the likely political pressure from what will now be a GOP House with a narrow majority.

Is this is beginning of the end for the era of US blank check writing for Ukraine?

"The Biden administration won’t give Ukraine advanced drones despite pleas from Kyiv and a bipartisan group of members of Congress, a reflection of the limit of the kinds of weaponry Washington is willing to provide for Ukraine’s defense," The Wall Street Journalreported Wednesday.

The timing of this leak to the media is fascinating, given the Biden administration's relative hawkishness was a key differentiating talking point against Republicans in the lead-up to the Midterms (especially given the Ukraine-flag-waving virtues of much of the Democratic Party base).

Image: Gray Eagle MQ-1C, General Atomics Aeronautical
The Biden administration "won’t give Ukraine advanced drones despite pleas" from the Zelensky government as well as some and members of Congress.

In particular, the White House has nixed a proposal to hand the Gray Eagle MQ-1C drones over to Ukraineon fears that it could rapidly escalate confrontation with Russia. The question was reportedly under consideration for months.

The WSJ report, citing US officials, explains that US planners worry that doing such would "signal to Moscow that the US was providing weapons that could target positions inside Russia." The calculus likely includes wanting to avoid further direct attacks on Crimea, which President Zelensky has pledged to liberate.

The report also cited the further US intelligence concern that the MQ-1C Gray Eagle sensitive technology could be stolen, such as its ultra-advanced cameras, if it crashed and fell into enemy hands where it could be studied and potentially reverse engineered.

Starting in September, a bipartisan group of Congressmen began lobbying the Pentagon hard to move on advanced drone transfers to Ukraine, in hopes it would put pressure on the White House. The Congressional leaders sent a letter to Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin arguing it was vital to the Ukrainian counteroffensive.

 

[Joes Place]

So I will take one for the team and admit I got confused by the "right bank" and "left bank" references to Dnieper River. Turns out I was right to be confused, as they are apparently inverted.

Those ARE "right" and "left", if you're looking south from Moscow...

 

[Tenacious E]

Those ARE "right" and "left", if you're looking south from Moscow...

Or Kiev, which I get, but given the advances in cartography over the past 500 years, I assumed north would provide a touchstone for directions in Europe.

 

[notlongago]

So I will take one for the team and admit I got confused by the "right bank" and "left bank" references to Dnieper River. Turns out I was right to be confused, as they are apparently inverted.

Guess theyre going by flow of water?
Good info to know

 

[Tenacious E]

Guess theyre going by flow of water?
Good info to know

You are correct sir, "The Dnieper’s west bank is also called the right bank, because it is on the right side as the river flows southward toward the Black Sea."

Bad News Politically, Shrewd Move Militarily? What Russia's Kherson Retreat Means -- And What It Doesn't.

The announcement of Russia’s retreat from the Dnieper River’s west bank hit like a lightning bolt, seen instantaneously as another tactical victory for Ukraine, another embarrassing setback for Moscow, and a political problem for President Vladimir Putin. But it’s not clear what’s happening and why.

www.rferl.org

 

[Joes Place]

You are correct sir, "The Dnieper’s west bank is also called the right bank, because it is on the right side as the river flows southward toward the Black Sea."

Bad News Politically, Shrewd Move Militarily? What Russia's Kherson Retreat Means -- And What It Doesn't.

The announcement of Russia’s retreat from the Dnieper River’s west bank hit like a lightning bolt, seen instantaneously as another tactical victory for Ukraine, another embarrassing setback for Moscow, and a political problem for President Vladimir Putin. But it’s not clear what’s happening and why.

www.rferl.org

And here I thought they were just going by Australia's World Map....

 

[Tenacious E]

And here I thought they were just going by Australia's World Map....

Looking at that hurts my brain.

 

[torbee]

Or Kiev, which I get, but given the advances in cartography over the past 500 years, I assumed north would provide a touchstone for directions in Europe.

I think it has to do with which way the water flows. If flowing north to south, the west bank is the right bank.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

 

[seminole97]

Some US and Western officials believe this winter will provide an opportunity for diplomacy between Russia and Ukraine as they don’t think either side can fully achieve their goals in the war, NBC News reported on Wednesday, citing anonymous sources.

"In the winter everything slows down," one Western official said. "The potential for talks, we would like to see that happening." The report said Western military officials don’t believe that Ukraine can drive Russia out of all the territory it has captured.

Also on Wednesday, Russia announced that it was pulling out of the southern Ukrainian city of Kherson. US and Western officials told NBC that if Ukraine retakes Kherson, it could put the government of Volodymyr Zelensky in a "better position to negotiate."

The Italian newspaper La Repubblica reported this week that the US and NATO might think peace talks are possible if Ukraine retakes Kherson. The paper said the Western powers are considering diplomacy due to the threat of tactical nuclear weapons being used and the fact that if Russia is defeated in Ukraine, it may become closer to China.

The officials also told NBC that Russia losing Kherson could make Vladimir Putin’s government less likely to talk, but Moscow reaffirmed on Wednesday that it’s open to negotiations. "We are ready to negotiate, of course, taking into account the realities that are emerging at the moment," said Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova.

Throughout the war, the US has maintained that it won’t push Ukraine to the negotiating table. The US and its allies also discouraged peace talks with Russia when a deal was within reach after in-person negotiations between Ukraine and Russia were held in Istanbul at the end of March.

Former British Prime Minister Boris Johnson traveled to Kyiv after the Istanbul talks and urged Ukraine not to negotiate with Russia, and the negotiations ultimately failed. But now, there does appear to be a shift in the Western approach, with the US at least exploring the idea of diplomacy.

A Ukrainian official told NBC that when National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan visited Kyiv last week, he broached the idea of when the conflict will end with Zelensky and whether it could include a diplomatic solution. The report said Sullivan didn’t want to pressure Ukraine to negotiate but said Kyiv should change its stance on negotiations to maintain support from its Western backers.



President Biden on Wednesday reiterated the administration’s public stance that it’s up to Ukraine when to negotiate with Russia. "Nothing about Ukraine without Ukraine," he told reporters. Zelensky recently signed a decree ruling out peace talks with Russia as long as Putin is president but appeared to drop that demand this week after the suggestion from Sullivan. Zelensky said he was open to talks with Russia, but he maintained conditions that are non-starters for negotiations, including a full Russian withdrawal and Moscow paying for war damages.

While diplomacy is being discussed, the US and NATO are also making preparations to support Ukraine in its war for years to come, and Russia has been reinforcing its positions after mobilizing 300,000 fresh troops, signaling an offensive may be coming. According to NBC, Congress is planning to pass a fresh aid package for Ukraine worth somewhere between $40 billion and $60 billion.

 

[Phenomenally Frantastic]

Russia can threaten nukes at any time for any reason. This is not a solid rationale for which to concede to their imperialistic and genocidal aspirations.

 

[Joes Place]

Looking at that hurts my brain.

That's cuz you're not Aussie or Wiki.

 

[h-hawk]

These past few months have seen the 'war of drones' play a decisive role on the Ukrainian battlefield. For the Russian side, drones were heavily utilized in the ramped up air campaign to degrade Ukrainian energy infrastructure following the bombing of Crimea's Kerch Strait Bridge. For Ukraine's army, Western-supplied drones have allowed them to strike increasingly behind Russian front lines. There's meanwhile been international condemnation over the prevalence of Iran-supplied suicide drones launched from the Russian side.

Ukraine is of course hoping to begin deploying drones with longer reach. But, one day after the Midterms election, the Biden administration has shut the door on Kiev obtaining more advanced and longer range UAVs from the US ahead of the likely political pressure from what will now be a GOP House with a narrow majority.

Is this is beginning of the end for the era of US blank check writing for Ukraine?

The timing of this leak to the media is fascinating, given the Biden administration's relative hawkishness was a key differentiating talking point against Republicans in the lead-up to the Midterms (especially given the Ukraine-flag-waving virtues of much of the Democratic Party base).

Image: Gray Eagle MQ-1C, General Atomics Aeronautical
The Biden administration "won’t give Ukraine advanced drones despite pleas" from the Zelensky government as well as some and members of Congress.

In particular, the White House has nixed a proposal to hand the Gray Eagle MQ-1C drones over to Ukraineon fears that it could rapidly escalate confrontation with Russia. The question was reportedly under consideration for months.

The WSJ report, citing US officials, explains that US planners worry that doing such would "signal to Moscow that the US was providing weapons that could target positions inside Russia." The calculus likely includes wanting to avoid further direct attacks on Crimea, which President Zelensky has pledged to liberate.

The report also cited the further US intelligence concern that the MQ-1C Gray Eagle sensitive technology could be stolen, such as its ultra-advanced cameras, if it crashed and fell into enemy hands where it could be studied and potentially reverse engineered.

Starting in September, a bipartisan group of Congressmen began lobbying the Pentagon hard to move on advanced drone transfers to Ukraine, in hopes it would put pressure on the White House. The Congressional leaders sent a letter to Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin arguing it was vital to the Ukrainian counteroffensive.

This sounds like someone trying to make trouble as the US just considers these drones akin to aircraft and modern tanks which we also refuse to send for some reason.

"Controversial for their use in US counter-terror operations around the world, the MQ9-Reaper and MQ-1 Predator are some of the deadliest UAVs ever made.

Since the outbreak of the Ukraine war there has been speculation about if, and when, the hunter-killer drones would be donated to Kyiv, but thus far they have not been seen.

Lt Col Lushenko says there are a number of reasons why, including that many incorrectly see them as only useful for counter-terror.

There are also questions, he says, about how well Reapers and Predators would survive in high-intensity conflict, with the added worry of the high-tech drones being shot down and analysed by Russian forces.

Others are worried that sending in Reapers would be seen as an escalation by Russia, he said."

Ukraine war: What are Iranian kamikaze drones and will the US send the deadly MQ-9 Reaper?

From the famed Bayraktar TB2s to small UAVs you can buy in shops, thousands of drones are being flown in the war in Ukraine - to lethal effect.

news.sky.com

 

[Joes Place]

👀

 

[h-hawk]

FWIW-the great retreat.

 

[notlongago]

View embedded media

Everytime we see one of these, is it coming from that $40B thats already been approved, or is this additional?

 

[h-hawk]

 

[h-hawk]

Everytime we see one of these, is it coming from that $40B thats already been approved, or is this additional?

From the money already approved usually but they have other ways to send arms as well.

 

[h-hawk]

 

[Lindemann]

They keep trying to tie their invasion to The Great Patriotic War.

View embedded media

Russia is so ****ed up. I hope they're so badly damaged from this (Putin, oligarchy, military) that they have no choice but to fundamentally rebuild from the ground up. Hopefully they come up with something better than what they currently have. Maybe even a responsible government?

 

[h-hawk]

 

[lucas80]

Hmmm....Milley isn't a general from Mexico....he's the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the country that is the primary arms supplier and driver of NATO policy that supports Ukraine. Not really comparable...

In your scenario I'd tell Mexico to go F themselves....Ukraine ain't doing that to the US.

I never figured you as a soft on Canada guy.

 

[h-hawk]

Probably BS but fun.

 

[h-hawk]

 

[lucas80]

Now, don't get all overly worried about politics on this, bit WaPo is reporting that Putin held off on pulling back from the untenable situation in Kherson for a week to keep Biden from having a big win before the midterms.
Now, just think for a minute. Many of us were wondering last week why the Russians were throwing troops into a daily meat grinder for no gain in the region? Now they can't seem to pull back fast enough.
They are sacrificing Kherson with the goal of hunkering down at the line to protect Crimea in my view, and hope for a face saving move.

 

[h-hawk]

 

[Lindemann]

Ukraine has issues, too, but you gotta believe that if they win this thing there is going to a lot of f****** going on when the troops come home.

Yep. Ukraine's going to have a baby boomer generation.

 

[Tenacious E]

View embedded media

Hopefully uncle HIMARS and his rounds with 180,000 bits of tungsten buckshot are shredding them to pieces.

 

[h-hawk]

 

[h-hawk]

 

[h-hawk]

 

[h-hawk]

Another huge FWIW.

 

[h-hawk]

Do it!