Tom needs to control the Iowa Bench
- Thread starter HawkCharlotte
- Start date
Terry was the one who got the point deducted for chewing out an official, but go off I guess.
The Iowa bench is fine it's the Iowa coaches that need to be reeled in a bit! I really can't understand how you could hurt your team like this. Even my daughter asked if the coaches were always this crazy! I equate it to being on the field by football coaches and getting your team penalized for it! Just not smart. Before you all go off on me I am very glad that TNT are our coaches but I feel like their actions start our wrestlers off in a hole,because the refs start every dual knowing they are going to screamed at and berated for the entire dual. Just my two cents.
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If Terry was chewing out the refs because RBY may have pulled an illegal move, then I don’t know why anyone is upset. As an athlete, I want a coach that has my back. That’s all Terry was doing.
I was at the Kaufman-Brand wrestling tournament at UNO in 2003 or 2004. Tom was at VaTech at the time. Tyler Eustace was wrestling Metcalf who was a freshman wrestling unattached. I was mat side for this awesome match that Eustace pulled out by a point or two at the very end. Tom Brands was 10 feet behind me on a chair watching and yelling. He must have screamed 20-30 F bombs during and right after the match, and then went after the referee at the conclusion of the match and had to be restrained by several people. I love intensity but he was totally psycho that day!
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I’m 100% ok if we lose a match because a team point was deducted for a coach defending an athlete. That’s their job.
Well Tom’s “chilling out” and being “more political” lasted a week. In all seriousness, I have no issue with what happened last night. A coach thought his wrestler was hurt with an illegal move. I do wish the refs would realize that before deducting a point but there are rules and sometimes a reputation results in a quick trigger. Hell if I recall Carl threw a brick at a ref but because he comes off as calm, cool and collected it was ignored.
These guys literally “go to war” for their guys. Whenever there is an injury or a position that could have caused one, they let the refs hear it. I see nothing wrong with that.
It may have resulted in a team point deduction, but their message was heard loud and clear.
If the deduction was due to arguing regular match progression, THEN I would be all over their lack of self control. However, this is NOT that.
It may have resulted in a team point deduction, but their message was heard loud and clear.
If the deduction was due to arguing regular match progression, THEN I would be all over their lack of self control. However, this is NOT that.
carl tried to qualify for the Olympics once in the chair toss too.
Tom so much admitted once again in his press conference they need to be better-so I think he agrees!
That's kind of my point. Carl gets away with stuff because he usually comes off as calm, cool and collected so he gets calls to go his way in crucial times. Also I'm totally fine with them having an injured wrestlers back, it's the other nine matches I am talking about. The constant signal to the ref that he's stalling, not the wrestler but the the ref, gets tiresome for me watching it so I can imagine how every ref feels about it. Do we really think that helps us in any way? Again I am glad they are our coaches but I think it's okay to change and adapt in life.
Not embarrassing, IMHO. Tom has done too many stand up things for this program to bother listing them off here. A minor blip on the radar.
Starting a thread trying to shame the man? Feeble and ineffective.
Starting a thread trying to shame the man? Feeble and ineffective.
If you're embarrassed go root for someone else.
Totally agree Tiger. Therein lies the short leash. Refs are waiting for it. Maybe a poor comparison but like Bobby Knight vs Roy Williams. Or closer to home Dr Tom vs Fran. And sometimes like crying wolf too often. If the refs are badgered on stalling too often it gets to be white noise to them.
OTOH
There was nothing the ref could do to stop that. It wasn’t like a PD situation that he let go too far; RBY just reached down and yanked the leg in a split second - and to his credit the official stopped it immediately.
If anything, Brands completely threw ADS under the bus after the meet. I don’t know what it accomplishes to tell the world your guy is mentally weak.
We are too. But we’re Iowa fans, so we know who Terry is.
He can preach to AD about control but then he and his twin go off. Been like that they're entire career at Iowa...Dont know how many times Gable was called to straighten them up.
i agree with you but I am not sure being mentally weak is the same as not handling adversity well. Tom alluded to this in the interview that ADS hasn’t really dealt with an injury before, and I think that is all Tom was saying. I agree with you however that it probably should have not been said.
That was not an illegal move. An illegal move results in a 1 pt penalty. What RBY did could have and should have been considered potentially dangerous. That results in a stoppage. Admittedly, I don't like the toe grab. A ref needs to be in position to see that. With two refs at Big Tens or Nationals, it may be easier. Because it happens so quick, though, I question whether a ref will call it. Desantos will need to improve on the efficiency of his secondary finishes on a single because you better believe catching Desantos in that twice, it will be the first thing he looks to go for the next time they face one another.
Art - totally agree on Tom’s comments. I am a fan of Tom and have gotten to know him fairly well through the years. But that doesn’t mean I agree with everything he says and does. I saw no point for his comments on ADS. Should have left it at “he felt something and we don’t know the extent.” I understand what he was trying to convey but it is now being construed (by some) as ADS “broke” because he was cradled which I know Tom wasn’t intending to convey. We have all been there and it is scary when something “pops” and not knowing WTH. I think (hope and assume) Coach was meaning to say that had ADS had something in the similar in the past maybe he would have realized it wasn’t as serious as his mind was telling him it was in the moment.
Great logic. Because it wasn’t called an illegal move automatically means it wasn’t? You do realize that refs miss calls all the time, right?
The toe turn, along with how deliberate and forceful it was executed, absolutely could have been called illegal. Did it have to be? I don’t know. But, saying it wasn’t because it wasn’t called is a laughable assertion at best.
lol.....Man, relax. I actually edited my post before seeing your response. I agree with part of what you are saying. I don't like the toe grab at all and that could be considered malicious. The refs will need to be on top of the toe grab.
I think Brands overly cryptic nature about injuries backfired a bit on him here. He seems to have some belief that you can “mind over matter” an injury. As such, he made a comment he believed in that just won’t be received correctly. However, the guy is as open as any coach when talking to the press and just let his feelings show in a spot he would have been better of not going there.
Sorry, that is just the type of argument that always gets me. To me, that is like saying it isn’t drunk driving if you didn’t get arrested.
I get where you were going. It just came off as the type of argument I had to respond to. Have a good one.
i never said it WAS an illegal move, I said it could have been. It is a coaches job to advocate on behalf of his athletes in those grey areas of the rules. If that means telling a ref “you missed that ****ing call”, I’m all for it as an athlete.
What we often forget is that it is not the coaches job to appease the fans, it is to protect his athletes.
I like the Brands intensity. I’ve seen Gable literally chewing on a piece of the mat when Ryan and Smith wrestled for the NCAA title
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Anybody see Gable going off on the official last nigh after the Marinelli match? I wish I could have heard what he was saying. He was definitely pissed!
I don't know but my suspicion would be that the PD calls weren't correct. Personally I didn't see why action was stopped.
Tell us more..........someone please!
Who sits near Gable and heard it? Go ahead and make it "safe for work" if you have to.
MSU - I know that. Like I said know Coach well. And he doesn’t care about the trolls who will take his comments that ADS quit. He was simply stating his thoughts that if ADS had an injury like this before he may have reacted different. Jesus checked out a couple boards and the worst is CF who has no dog in the fight. A troll there who never wrestled going on and on about it. That is why I wish Coach explained his comments. But whatever. Will see in March.
P. 51 of the rules talks about the illegality of a "twisting knee lock." What else was it but that? He pulled up on the toes making it a lever on the tibia which twisted the knee.
But, the ref has to both see the hold that causes it and ACTUALLY determine it being a “twisting knee lock”. Now if the actual description of the specific sequence and “toe turn” was in the rules, there would be no debate. However, in this case it becomes a judgement call and the angle he had and the speed in which it happened in real time makes that very hard for a ref to make that decision.
Even with my watching it, I am torn on how I would call it. The immediate stop was ABSOLUTELY correct. Anyone going on about the stoppage during the cradle is clueless. However, calling it an illegal move is not cut and dry.
RE: Desanto injury comments by Brands: Kemerer had a scare a few years ago, maybe Edinboro, where it looked really bad. He came back and wrestled well. Maybe it affected him some but it wasn’t season ending. He made a comment that Kemerer may have never really felt that injury before. All I think Brands was saying was that sometimes guys feel something and it seems worse than it is. I think it was his way of saying Desantos reaction might not be indicative of the severity of the injury. I’m completely putting words in Brands mouth, just seems similar to the Kemerer scare mentioned earlier.
Why do you need "toe turn" in there? What does it matter what part of the body is used to twist the knee? What are you expecting? That the rules need to specify not twisting the knee with the shin, ankle, arch of the of foot, ball of the foot, and toes? If it is twisting the knee, it is a twisting knee lock.
