Who Knew, Grape Juice Could Yield Similar Results Of Hydroxychloroquine

[ThorneStockton]

The OP compares hydroxychloroquine to grape juice and you want me to act like I don't know what that means. I'm suppose to play stupid for you?

Last night on MSNBC I watched a 10 minute segment belittling Trump's hydroxychloroquine remarks.

I think the chips are on the table and the bets have been made. The left in invested in making a fool out of Trump on this issue. Very sick IMO.

That may be the underlying problem, you don't know what that means. The point of using grape juice as an example is to demonstrate the concept of a "placebo" and the importance of studies/trials before touting drugs as effective treatments. It's scientific caution/reality versus unrestrained optimism.

I don't doubt you think the chips are on the table and the bets have been made, I am sure you think it is that simple. However, it's important to note that it's not a black and white world out there, just something to keep in mind, don't have to be a scientist to realize that either.

 

[royhobbs2]

Yes because trump said it we must reject it

who is acting like the brainwashed fool ?

 

[bdcolt45er]

The OP compares hydroxychloroquine to grape juice and you want me to act like I don't know what that means. I'm suppose to play stupid for you?

Last night on MSNBC I watched a 10 minute segment belittling Trump's hydroxychloroquine remarks.

I think the chips are on the table and the bets have been made. The left in invested in making a fool out of Trump on this issue. Very sick IMO.

There's a perfectly reasonable way for Trump to tackle this issue. The medical community is currently conducting a bunch of studies. He could have said something I don't know honest.
"At this time we have no known drug treatments, but we have an unprecedented effort by our medical professionals evaluating a number of potential treatments. They are actively studying anti-virals, anti-milarials, azithromycin and other drugs. We continue to support and encourage scientific trials and will keep the public informed as information becomes available. If an effective treatment is found we will make every effort to make it wisely available to all Americans."

 

[SB_SB]

Well said. Doctors all across the country are prescribing this drug Are they all fools ?

the partisan hatred shown here by the dems and the media is just sickening. Extremely dishonest

Well said? That's right, you think everything trump says is "well said". Right now the drug is in an experimental stage. Sure some people can get it and it's worth trying. But for the President to go on TV and act like it's a miracle drug that everyone should be getting, that's wrong. And you've fallen for it. You think it's a miracle drug because you'll believe anything that comes out of trump's mouth.

 

[ihhawk]

its amazing to think that about 6 months ago a person who had lupus could go to their doctor and have it prescribed off label... no one was fuking freaking out about that.

we are in the middle of a global pandemic and now liberals want to act like the fuking FDA on a casual Tuesday in 1997.

the biggest part of all of this is that you literally can’t get the fuking drug unless a doctor prescribes it. So why all this talk about self medication?

liberals have completely lost their marbles.

 

[DFSNOLE]

The OP compares hydroxychloroquine to grape juice and you want me to act like I don't know what that means. I'm suppose to play stupid for you?

Last night on MSNBC I watched a 10 minute segment belittling Trump's hydroxychloroquine remarks.

I think the chips are on the table and the bets have been made. The left in invested in making a fool out of Trump on this issue. Very sick IMO.

Dr. Fauci, Trump's own expert, has told him to slow down on the promoting of the drug. Does that mean anything to you? Is he a partisan hack hoping it doesn't work just to make sure Trump is not reelected?

 

[SB_SB]

Yes because trump said it we must reject it

who is acting like the brainwashed fool ?

No one is rejecting the drug. We're rejecting trump's statement that it's a cure. Until there are more test results, we have to cautious.

This needs to be handled like any new drug situation. Testing and then move to general usage. If there are side affects of a drug we need to know. We don't need to save people just to kill them a different way.

 

[DFSNOLE]

I attached a link so you could learn more about what is actually happening. I have direct knowledge of this. Here is an article that discusses the use of this drug. They have several other studies going as well.

https://labblog.uofmhealth.org/roun...ss-latest-treatments-and-treatment-rumors-for

Thank you for posting that?

 

[Wendy79]

 

[Joes Place]

its amazing to think that about 6 months ago a person who had lupus could go to their doctor and have it prescribed off label... no one was fuking freaking out about that.

That's because it was TESTED FOR and APPROVED FOR that use.

 

[Wendy79]

 

[pablow]

Dr. Fauci, Trump's own expert, has told him to slow down on the promoting of the drug. Does that mean anything to you? Is he a partisan hack hoping it doesn't work just to make sure Trump is not reelected?

No, I don't think Fauci is trying to embarrass the president. I do think the leftist political hacks are though. I'm not willing to assume that MSNBC and Fauci have the same motive on this issue.

 

[ihhawk]

View embedded media

Oh now we get some conspiracy theory. I but Russia was involved too

 

[SB_SB]

its amazing to think that about 6 months ago a person who had lupus could go to their doctor and have it prescribed off label... no one was fuking freaking out about that.

we are in the middle of a global pandemic and now liberals want to act like the fuking FDA on a casual Tuesday in 1997.

the biggest part of all of this is that you literally can’t get the fuking drug unless a doctor prescribes it. So why all this talk about self medication?

liberals have completely lost their marbles.

When someone is majorly ill, you don't just start giving them random medication hoping something works. It actually has to make sense. Also the dosage for lupus might be different than the dosage for C-19. Some of you people really need to think before you post. You come off as "fuking stupid".

 

[Flie]

View embedded media

Awesome. We should start seeing a flood of similar stories and this crisis should be behind us soon. Looking forward to it.

 

[DFSNOLE]

No, I don't think Fauci is trying to embarrass the president. I do think the leftist political hacks are though. I'm not willing to assume that MSNBC and Fauci have the same motive on this issue.

What do you think Trump's motive is in not heeding Dr. Fauci's advice? Do you concede that it might be dangerous given that all of the evidence we have right now is anecdotal?

 

[pablow]

When someone is majorly ill, you don't just start giving them random medication hoping something works. It actually has to make sense. Also the dosage for lupus might be different than the dosage for C-19. Some of you people really need to think before you post. You come off as "fuking stupid".

Tell that to the FDA. They approved the drug for emergency use.

Sometimes called “compassionate use”, expanded access is a potential pathway for a patient with an immediately life-threatening condition or serious disease or condition to gain access to an investigational medical product (drug, biologic, or medical device) for treatment outside of clinical trials when no comparable or satisfactory alternative therapy options are available.

Expanded access may be appropriate when all the following apply:

• Patient has a serious disease or condition, or whose life is immediately threatened by their disease or condition.
• There is no comparable or satisfactory alternative therapy to diagnose, monitor, or treat the disease or condition.
• Patient enrollment in a clinical trial is not possible.
• Potential patient benefit justifies the potential risks of treatment.
• Providing the investigational medical product will not interfere with investigational trials that could support a medical product’s development or marketing approval for the treatment indication.https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/expanded-access

 

[pablow]

What do you think Trump's motive is in not heeding Dr. Fauci's advice? Do you concede that it might be dangerous given that all of the evidence we have right now is anecdotal?

Trump took the matter to the FDA and it approved it for "compassionate use."

 

[DFSNOLE]

Trump took the matter to the FDA and it approved it for "compassionate use."

By definition, compassionate use is not a known cure.

Compassionate drug use (or sometimes just compassionate use) is the use of a new, unapproved drug to treat a seriously ill patient when no other treatments are available. Drugs that are being tested but have not yet been approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) are called investigational drugs.

Don't you think that America would be better served if Trump would treat the drug as defined?

 

[royhobbs2]

I guess liberal hacks know more about the drug than the FDA

Lol

 

[BigDelHawk]

Scientists want full controlled studies, all the time. We do not have time for that in this instance. Those take months and even years.

People who understand how this drug works have deduced that it will work against Covid 19. It has also been observed in uncontrolled studies that this drug works. AIso, knowing how ventilators can cause permanent lung damage, I would roll the dice.

 

[pablow]

By definition, compassionate use is not a known cure.

Compassionate drug use (or sometimes just compassionate use) is the use of a new, unapproved drug to treat a seriously ill patient when no other treatments are available. Drugs that are being tested but have not yet been approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) are called investigational drugs.

Don't you think that America would be better served if Trump would treat the drug as defined?

Trump has been touting it, that's for sure. But has he said it's a cure? I'm not aware that he's gone that far. And, by the way, I think everyone knows it's simply a "might help" drug at this point. The doctors are using it because at this point because it might help.

 

[St. Louis Hawk]

Scientists want full controlled studies, all the time. We do not have time for that in this instance. Those take months and even years.

People who understand how this drug works have deduced that it will work against Covid 19. It has also been observed in uncontrolled studies that this drug works. AIso, knowing how ventilators can cause permanent lung damage, I would roll the dice.

The drug has been observed to cure COVID patients in the same manner as aspirin, pain killers, and anti-biotics - the patient received them and then the patient got better. Simply because B followed A doesn’t mean A caused B.

I’m saying study this drug and let the FDA exception continue to apply and see. But don’t go on national TV and tell the world this is working and is “one of the biggest game changers in medical history” until we can prove that.

 

[JWolf74]

in the context we are discussing here today, for covid 19-she would not let anyone prescribe it...………..so you shut your partisan yap

Again, that's a flat out lie. Be better.

 

[Flie]

The drug has been observed to cure COVID patients in the same manner as aspirin, pain killers, and anti-biotics - the patient received them and then the patient got better. Simply because B followed A doesn’t mean A caused B.

I’m saying study this drug and let the FDA exception continue to apply and see. But don’t go on national TV and tell the world this is working and is “one of the biggest game changers in medical history” until we can prove that.

Exactly.

 

[unIowa]

Scientists want full controlled studies, all the time. We do not have time for that in this instance. Those take months and even years.

People who understand how this drug works have deduced that it MIGHT work against Covid 19. It has also been observed in uncontrolled studies that this drug MIGHT HELP. AIso, knowing how ventilators can cause permanent lung damage, I would roll the dice.

FIFY

 

[GOHOX69]

I am a liberal and Ted Lieu is a giant ahole. Been so even before Covid-19.

 

[DFSNOLE]

Trump has been touting it, that's for sure. But has he said it's a cure? I'm not aware that he's gone that far. And, by the way, I think everyone knows it's simply a "might help" drug at this point. The doctors are using it because at this point because it might help.

I have not heard might help come out of Trump. If that is what he means to say, I don't think that Dr. Fauci would feel the constant need to intervene and correct him.

 

[unIowa]

The drug has been observed to cure COVID patients in the same manner as aspirin, pain killers, and anti-biotics - the patient received them and then the patient got better. Simply because B followed A doesn’t mean A caused B.

I’m saying study this drug and let the FDA exception continue to apply and see. But don’t go on national TV and tell the world this is working and is “one of the biggest game changers in medical history” until we can prove that.

This

 

[royhobbs2]

Again, that's a flat out lie. Be better.

No it is not. I can repost her letter

 

[SB_SB]

Trump has been touting it, that's for sure. But has he said it's a cure? I'm not aware that he's gone that far. And, by the way, I think everyone knows it's simply a "might help" drug at this point. The doctors are using it because at this point because it might help.

FINALLY you admit that it's a "might help" drug. Trump has been talking about this drug over and over. There are many on this board (and you until your last post) have been treating the drug as a cure. The rest of us have been saying the drug needs to be tested to know whether it actually works for C-19.

 

[theVoicefromtheTomb]

I would like to know mortality rates in hospitals that are using it regularly against those that are not.

So would everyone else, that’s why they run tests

 

[pablow]

FINALLY you admit that it's a "might help" drug. Trump has been talking about this drug over and over. There are many on this board (and you until your last post) have been treating the drug as a cure. The rest of us have been saying the drug needs to be tested to know whether it actually works for C-19.

Find one post in which I said it was a cure. I never can close to saying that.

 

[SB_SB]

Find one post in which I said it was a cure. I never can close to saying that.

So then what do you disagree with. That fact that people want to do testing to see if the drug can be changed from "might help" to "actually helps" or "doesn't help"? Maybe you don't want to know if it helps or not.

 

[dandh]

[QUOTE="Joes Place, post: 7579266, member: 478!!] No. It is not.

That's why there are "studies" ongoing. Were it "proven", there would be limited need for any new studies.[/QUOTE]

The CDC disagrees with you regarding in test tube. It also notes a Chinese study with demonstrated efficacy:

Both drugs have in-vitro activity against SARS-CoV, SARS-CoV-2, and other coronaviruses, with hydroxychloroquine having relatively higher potency against SARS-CoV-2 [1,4,5]. A study in China reported that chloroquine treatment of COVID-19 patients had clinical and virologic benefit versus a comparison group, and chloroquine was added as a recommended antiviral for treatment of COVID-19 in China [6]. Based upon limited in-vitro and anecdotal data, chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine are currently recommended for treatment of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in several countries. Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine have known safety profiles with the main concerns being cardiotoxicity (prolonged QT syndrome) with prolonged use in patients with hepatic or renal dysfunction and immunosuppression but have been reportedly well-tolerated in COVID-19 patients.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/therapeutic-options.html

 

[Joes Place]

By definition, compassionate use is not a known cure.

Compassionate drug use (or sometimes just compassionate use) is the use of a new, unapproved drug to treat a seriously ill patient when no other treatments are available. Drugs that are being tested but have not yet been approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) are called investigational drugs.

Don't you think that America would be better served if Trump would treat the drug as defined?

The only "new, unapproved drug" is remdesivir.

Hydroxychloroquine can be administered by any doctor, IF they believe it will help their patient. It is called "off label use", and has nothing to do with "compassionate use" laws.

@pablow is really reaching for Trump excuses here. It's like tossing Trump's salad is a delicious hobby for him.

 

[Joes Place]

The CDC disagrees with you regarding in test tube. It also notes a Chinese study with demonstrated efficacy:

Both drugs have in-vitro activity against SARS-CoV, SARS-CoV-2, and other coronaviruses, with hydroxychloroquine having relatively higher potency against SARS-CoV-2 [1,4,5]. A study in China reported that chloroquine treatment of COVID-19 patients had clinical and virologic benefit versus a comparison group, and chloroquine was added as a recommended antiviral for treatment of COVID-19 in China [6]. Based upon limited in-vitro and anecdotal data, chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine are currently recommended for treatment of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in several countries. Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine have known safety profiles with the main concerns being cardiotoxicity (prolonged QT syndrome) with prolonged use in patients with hepatic or renal dysfunction and immunosuppression but have been reportedly well-tolerated in COVID-19 patients.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/therapeutic-options.html

Now, go back and READ the qualifications.

It's being used to calm the cytokine cascade, not to necessarily "kill the virus". Calm the symptoms so they can keep people stabilized.

 

[dandh]

The CDC disagrees with you regarding in test tube. It also notes a Chinese study with demonstrated efficacy:

Both drugs have in-vitro activity against SARS-CoV, SARS-CoV-2, and other coronaviruses, with hydroxychloroquine having relatively higher potency against SARS-CoV-2 [1,4,5]. A study in China reported that chloroquine treatment of COVID-19 patients had clinical and virologic benefit versus a comparison group, and chloroquine was added as a recommended antiviral for treatment of COVID-19 in China [6]. Based upon limited in-vitro and anecdotal data, chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine are currently recommended for treatment of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in several countries. Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine have known safety profiles with the main concerns being cardiotoxicity (prolonged QT syndrome) with prolonged use in patients with hepatic or renal dysfunction and immunosuppression but have been reportedly well-tolerated in COVID-19 patients.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/therapeutic-options.html

Now, go back and READ the qualifications.

It's being used to calm the cytokine cascade, not to necessarily "kill the virus". Calm the symptoms so they can keep people stabilized.[/QUOTE]


The in vitro activity is against the virus; there is no cytokine cascade in vitro. And the cytokine cascade is what is causing peop!e to die. So while this has not been proven effective in humans, we can see why it is promising. We can see why thousands of doctors are prescribing it along with other treatments and providing testimony to successful results.

I agree no one should self-prescribe. It is not safe for some with certain medical conditions. However, if I get the virus I will ask my doctor to prescribe it along with a z-pack and zinc sulfate if it's safe for me.

 

[pablow]

So then what do you disagree with. That fact that people want to do testing to see if the drug can be changed from "might help" to "actually helps" or "doesn't help"? Maybe you don't want to know if it helps or not.

I'm only arguing the left seems overly eager to bash Trump for touting this drug.

The only "new, unapproved drug" is remdesivir.

Hydroxychloroquine can be administered by any doctor, IF they believe it will help their patient. It is called "off label use", and has nothing to do with "compassionate use" laws.

@pablow is really reaching for Trump excuses here. It's like tossing Trump's salad is a delicious hobby for him.

On March 28th, the FDA issued a letter approving the use of these drugs for COVID-19. Unfortunately, if they had just talked to you before hand, they'd have realized that the approval letter was not needed. You're an idiot.

 

[Big Hawk D-Port]

Big Hawk D-Port:

BREAKING NEWS!!!!

Household Bleach will kill coronavirus in a test tube. Run on down to the local D-port WalMart and pick some up. Slam down the whole gallon and rest in bed for 24 hours; Absolute Guarantee you WILL NOT DIE of coronavirus!!!

Win-Win!!!!

You can save your venom for other posters who are interested in a pi$$ing match.