Who won the Walz v Vance debate?

[alaskanseminole]

My God, we're still on the Border Czar BS? Good grief.

FWIW, Kamala Harris was appointed as the point person for addressing the border crisis by President Joe Biden in March 2021. Who frack'n cares what the role/position is called?

Here are some exact quotes:

1. March 24, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I’ve asked the Vice President to lead our diplomatic efforts and our efforts to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
2. March 31, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I have asked the Vice President to lead this effort to build a coalition of countries to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
3. April 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President is going to lead this effort in terms of addressing the root causes of migration from Central America.”
4. June 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President’s focus will be on diplomacy and working with countries in the region to address the issues driving people to leave their homes and come to the U.S.”
5. July 19, 2021:
   • President Biden: “Kamala Harris is in charge of managing the diplomatic efforts to address the root causes of migration. She’s working with leaders in the region to address the economic and social issues that lead to migration.”

 

[gohawks50]

My God, we're still on the Border Czar BS? Good grief.

FWIW, Kamala Harris was appointed as the point person for addressing the border crisis by President Joe Biden in March 2021. Who frack'n cares what the role/position is called?

Here are some exact quotes:

1. March 24, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I’ve asked the Vice President to lead our diplomatic efforts and our efforts to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
2. March 31, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I have asked the Vice President to lead this effort to build a coalition of countries to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
3. April 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President is going to lead this effort in terms of addressing the root causes of migration from Central America.”
4. June 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President’s focus will be on diplomacy and working with countries in the region to address the issues driving people to leave their homes and come to the U.S.”
5. July 19, 2021:
   • President Biden: “Kamala Harris is in charge of managing the diplomatic efforts to address the root causes of migration. She’s working with leaders in the region to address the economic and social issues that lead to migration.”

Border Czar was created by the right wing to imply that all immigration issues were to be dealt with by Harris. In reality she assigned to work with Central American counties on the root cause of migration. Now I'm not sure what was accomplished by her assignment, but I do know she wasn't in charge of border crossings.

Republicans have the right to criticize the Biden/Harris administration on immigration, but do so without creating titles and assignments that don't exist.

 

[alaskanseminole]

Border Czar was created by the right wing to imply that all immigration issues were to be dealt with by Harris. In reality she assigned to work with Central American counties on the root cause of migration. Now I'm not sure what was accomplished by her assignment, but I do know she wasn't in charge of border crossings.

Republicans have the right to criticize the Biden/Harris administration on immigration, but do so without creating titles and assignments that don't exist.

That's fair...just seems to me the argument has mostly centered around semantics, rather than the actual problem.

 

[Whiskeydeltadeltatango]

That's fair...just seems to me the argument has mostly centered around semantics, rather than the actual problem.

Kamala.

 

[Rifler]

That's fair...just seems to me the argument has mostly centered around semantics, rather than the actual problem.

That's because you are fairly astute...

 

[binsfeldcyhawk2]

Yeah, it couldn’t possibly have to do with it being a complex issue, and Biden attempted to work with Congress for genuine reform…

The actions Biden took in June 2024 could have been taken in Feb 2021.

Only reason he took action last June is that it was an election year and it was a major issue.

Pretty obvious...

 

[Franisdaman]

Border Czar was created by the right wing to imply that all immigration issues were to be dealt with by Harris. In reality she assigned to work with Central American counties on the root cause of migration. Now I'm not sure what was accomplished by her assignment, but I do know she wasn't in charge of border crossings.

Republicans have the right to criticize the Biden/Harris administration on immigration, but do so without creating titles and assignments that don't exist.

And what about the left wing who recognized Kamala Harris as the border czar?

Again, the FACTS: 6 Democrats, in early August of this year, voted for the resolution that said in writing that Kamala Harris was the border czar.

The exact words in that resolution: “strongly condemning the Biden administration and its border czar, Kamala Harris’s, failure to secure the United States border....”

https://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/4813704-kamala-harris-border-czar-denial/

 

[Franisdaman]

The actions Biden took in June 2024 could have been taken in Feb 2021.

Only reason he took action last June is that it was an election year and it was a major issue.

Pretty obvious...

bingo.

but the echo chamber on here (some would call it a cult) ignores the facts

 

[sober_teacher]

The actions Biden took in June 2024 could have been taken in Feb 2021.

Only reason he took action last June is that it was an election year and it was a major issue.

Pretty obvious...

Be honest. There’s no action that Biden could have taken, short of doing exactly what Trump wanted, that wouldn’t have been blasted by the right.

And if you’ll recall, there actions tried the first couple of years in office that ended up getting blocked by the courts.

I’d also argue that he also clearly placed a higher priority on getting his legislative agenda passed while he still held both houses of congress. Not saying I think that was the right move, but I think that might have been part of the reasoning.

Perhaps the great weakness - tactically speaking, of the Biden administration is that imo they haven’t been good at pivoting when plan doesn’t work out, or be able to tackle multiple major objectives at once.

 

[littlez]

That riot was packed to the gils with feds lol

Sure Harvard.

 

[Scruddy]

Sure Harvard.

Who do you think Ray Epps was being paid by? Why do you think he was magically scrubbed from the most wanted database despite being on multiple videos over multiple days encouraging violence in the capitol? He was called a fed in multiple videos and immediately buzzed off the like cockroach he is. Chris wray had dozens more there. They also planted the pipe bombs.

 

[OrlandNole]

And what about the left wing who recognized Kamala Harris as the border czar?

Again, the FACTS: 6 Democrats, in early August of this year, voted for the resolution that said in writing that Kamala Harris was the border czar.

...out of 212. Sick burn.

 

[Gus is dead]

Facts. On. His. Side……and Vance don’t seem to have much in common. The Senator LIED all night long Gus…Walz chose not to call him out is all. Remember, Vance and Trump gave America Springfield, Ohio….a place the folks living there do not recognize.

Please lay out the lies. Vance isnt a liar.

Thats all your side has. "They lied!"

Id like to see a listing of his lies juxtaposed with those of Walz. By an unbiased source. You can try to lay them out if you wish.

You dont get to have your own version of the facts Joel.

lie noun (2)
ˈlī
1
a
: an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker or writer to be untrue with intent to deceive

b
: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer

 

[Gus is dead]

For the Dems being slick is a compliment.

Like 'Slick Willy'?

 

[goldmom]

Be honest. There’s no action that Biden could have taken, short of doing exactly what Trump wanted, that wouldn’t have been blasted by the right.

And if you’ll recall, there actions tried the first couple of years in office that ended up getting blocked by the courts.

I’d also argue that he also clearly placed a higher priority on getting his legislative agenda passed while he still held both houses of congress. Not saying I think that was the right move, but I think that might have been part of the reasoning.

Perhaps the great weakness - tactically speaking, of the Biden administration is that imo they haven’t been good at pivoting when plan doesn’t work out, or be able to tackle multiple major objectives at once.

Oh is THAT what you call it? A pivot? 😂😂😂😂😂

 

[sober_teacher]

Oh is THAT what you call it? A pivot? 😂😂😂😂😂

Not at all. I was referring to their general approach to things. I always felt they struggled to adjust tactically if their first option didn’t work.

 

[binsfeldcyhawk2]

Be honest. There’s no action that Biden could have taken, short of doing exactly what Trump wanted, that wouldn’t have been blasted by the right.

And if you’ll recall, there actions tried the first couple of years in office that ended up getting blocked by the courts.

I’d also argue that he also clearly placed a higher priority on getting his legislative agenda passed while he still held both houses of congress. Not saying I think that was the right move, but I think that might have been part of the reasoning.

Perhaps the great weakness - tactically speaking, of the Biden administration is that imo they haven’t been good at pivoting when plan doesn’t work out, or be able to tackle multiple major objectives at once.

Sorry but that's pretty disingenuous. First thing Joe did when he entered office was rescind MOST of Trumps border policies (remain in Mexico etc) https://www.voanews.com/a/usa_biden...rsing-trump-immigration-policies/6201520.html

Illegal immigration exploded and he finally did something about it in June 2024 because the election was coming up.

 

[sober_teacher]

Sorry but that's pretty disingenuous. First thing Joe did when he entered office was rescind MOST of Trumps border policies (remain in Mexico etc) https://www.voanews.com/a/usa_biden...rsing-trump-immigration-policies/6201520.html

Illegal immigration exploded and he finally did something about it in June 2024 because the election was coming up.

Well, part of the reason for the explosion was that the worst came when Covid concerns were fading and people more free to move around again.

I found much of what Trump did regarding immigration to be abhorrent so I don’t have an issue with rescinding much of that. And no, biden didn’t simply ignore it for close to 4 years.

 

[gohawks50]

Well, part of the reason for the explosion was that the worst came when Covid concerns were fading and people more free to move around again.

I found much of what Trump did regarding immigration to be abhorrent so I don’t have an issue with rescinding much of that. And no, biden didn’t simply ignore it for close to 4 years.

Everyone seems to forget the Trump administration separated children from their families and didn't keep track of where they ended up. It was an intentional cruel policy to punish immigrants, but MAGA loves that stuff.

'Like a kidnapping': Migrant family separated under Trump reunited after four years

Campaigners say the Trump-era policy has caused irreparable harm for migrant families years later.

www.bbc.com

 

[binsfeldcyhawk2]

Well, part of the reason for the explosion was that the worst came when Covid concerns were fading and people more free to move around again.

I found much of what Trump did regarding immigration to be abhorrent so I don’t have an issue with rescinding much of that. And no, biden didn’t simply ignore it for close to 4 years.

https://www.wsj.com/us-news/illegal-immigration-record-border-6db29cad

 

[littlez]

bingo.

but the echo chamber on here (some would call it a cult) ignores the facts

You might want to look in the mirror regarding that echo chamber my man. Now back to posting 25 items from Twitter about Caitlin.

 

[Jcchawk]

My God, we're still on the Border Czar BS? Good grief.

FWIW, Kamala Harris was appointed as the point person for addressing the border crisis by President Joe Biden in March 2021. Who frack'n cares what the role/position is called?

Here are some exact quotes:

1. March 24, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I’ve asked the Vice President to lead our diplomatic efforts and our efforts to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
2. March 31, 2021:
   • President Biden: “I have asked the Vice President to lead this effort to build a coalition of countries to address the root causes of migration from Central America.”
3. April 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President is going to lead this effort in terms of addressing the root causes of migration from Central America.”
4. June 8, 2021:
   • President Biden: “The Vice President’s focus will be on diplomacy and working with countries in the region to address the issues driving people to leave their homes and come to the U.S.”
5. July 19, 2021:
   • President Biden: “Kamala Harris is in charge of managing the diplomatic efforts to address the root causes of migration. She’s working with leaders in the region to address the economic and social issues that lead to migration.”

Nah... Riley and Joel say she wasn't given this assignment so there is no way these are true.

 

[littlez]

Please lay out the lies. Vance isnt a liar.

Thats all your side has. "They lied!"

Id like to see a listing of his lies juxtaposed with those of Walz. By an unbiased source. You can try to lay them out if you wish.

You dont get to have your own version of the facts Joel.

lie noun (2)
ˈlī
1
a
: an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker or writer to be untrue with intent to deceive

b
: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer

Well I guess he didn't really lie about the election because he just didn't answer the question as to who really won. Because that would of course take away their big talking point to 10% of the morons including guys like you who believe it was stolen. Not that the 10% would change their mind either way.

 

[RileyHawk]

Please lay out the lies. Vance isnt a liar.

Thats all your side has. "They lied!"

Id like to see a listing of his lies juxtaposed with those of Walz. By an unbiased source. You can try to lay them out if you wish.

You dont get to have your own version of the facts Joel.

lie noun (2)
ˈlī
1
a
: an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker or writer to be untrue with intent to deceive

b
: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer

Was Vance lying when he called Trump "America's Hitler" and said he was a "Never Trumper"?

Was he lying when he said Trump won the 2020 election?

Was he lying when he said “If I have to create stories so that the American media actually pays attention to the suffering of the American people, then that’s what I’m going to do.”?

Was he lying when he said Trump "salvaged" Obamacare?

There's just a few you can start with.

 

[Franisdaman]

...out of 212. Sick burn.

the mental gymnastics in this echo chamber are fascinating......

 

[Franisdaman]

You might want to look in the mirror regarding that echo chamber my man. Now back to posting 25 items from Twitter about Caitlin.

Is this all you echo chamber members have left?

Sad.

 

[joelbc1]

Please lay out the lies. Vance isnt a liar.

Thats all your side has. "They lied!"

Id like to see a listing of his lies juxtaposed with those of Walz. By an unbiased source. You can try to lay them out if you wish.

You dont get to have your own version of the facts Joel.

lie noun (2)
ˈlī
1
a
: an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker or writer to be untrue with intent to deceive

b
: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer

How about starting with “Springfield, Ohio….

 

[joelbc1]

I bet your grandparents came to America legally, right?

So did mine. I have never met or spoken to anyone who denies that people like them are what built this country. And I agree we need immigration and people who come here legally to work hard and take advantage of opportunities they’d never have elsewhere.
The enormous influx streaming across now are overwhelming the current immigration system and the absolutely frightening number of people with serious criminal backgrounds bringing in drugs, sex crime convictions and gang affiliations who are filtering in with the majority of folks who just want a better life is not safe for the rest of us. If you cannot see that then I am afraid for you. And afraid for America 🇺🇸

There is an EASY solution to this problem, mom….Have Congress write and pass new immigration laws. What we have are greatly outdated and clearly unworkable rules. They have been so for 30 years or more. It is the President’s obligation to see immigration laws are enforced….it is not his obligation to write the laws. That is Congress’ job. Congress needs to do its job and write and pass a workable solution. Presidents will just play politics with “the border” because they are politicians.

 

[gohawks50]

Please lay out the lies. Vance isnt a liar.

Thats all your side has. "They lied!"

Id like to see a listing of his lies juxtaposed with those of Walz. By an unbiased source. You can try to lay them out if you wish.

You dont get to have your own version of the facts Joel.

lie noun (2)
ˈlī
1
a
: an assertion of something known or believed by the speaker or writer to be untrue with intent to deceive

b
: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer

Here you go:

The CBS News Confirmed team fact checked the biggest claims made by Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz and Ohio Sen. JD Vance in tonight's 2024 vice presidential debate in New York City.

CBS News hosted the only planned vice presidential debate between Vance and Walz on Tuesday, Oct. 1, on CBS and CBS News 24/7. Download the free CBS News app for live coverage, post-debate analysis and more.

The debate moderators were "CBS Evening News" anchor and managing editor Norah O'Donnell and "Face the Nation" moderator and chief foreign affairs correspondent Margaret Brennan.

Misleading: Vance claims Trump "peacefully gave over power on Jan. 20"​

Vance: "It's really rich for Democratic leaders to say that Donald Trump is a unique threat to democracy when he peacefully gave over power on Jan. 20."

False, needs context: Vance says Iran received over $100 billion in unfrozen assets thanks to Harris​

Vance: "Iran, which launched this attack, has received over $100 billion in unfrozen assets thanks to the Kamala Harris administration."

False: Vance says Trump could have destroyed Obamacare​

Vance: "Of course, you don't have to agree with everything that President Trump has ever said or ever done, but when Obamacare was crushing under the weight of its own regulatory burden and healthcare costs, Donald Trump could have destroyed the program. Instead, he worked in a bipartisan way to ensure that Americans had access to affordable care."

Misleading: Vance claims DHS "has effectively lost" 320,000 children​

Vance: "Right now in this country, Margaret, we have 320,000 children that the Department of Homeland Security has effectively lost. Some of them have been sex trafficked, some of them, hopefully, are at homes with their families. Some of them have been used as drug trafficking mules. The real family separation policy in this country is unfortunately Kamala Harris' wide open southern border."

True, needs context: Walz claims border "crossings down, compared to when Donald Trump left office"​

Walz: "Look, crossings are down compared to when Donald Trump left office."

False: Vance says Vice President Harris "became the appointed border czar"​

Partially true, needs context: Vance claims housing unaffordable because "millions of illegal immigrants ... compete with Americans for scarce homes."​

Vance: "You've got housing that is totally unaffordable, because we have brought in millions of illegal immigrants to compete with Americans for scarce homes."

Mostly true: Walz claims when Iranian missiles "did fall near U.S. troops and they received traumatic brain injuries, Donald Trump wrote it off as 'headaches'"​

Walz: "And when Iranian missiles did fall near U.S. troops, and they received traumatic brain injuries, Donald Trump wrote it off as headaches."

False: Walz claimed he was in China during the Tiananmen Square protests​

Walz: "All I said on this was, I got there that summer and misspoke on this. That is what I have said. So, I was in Hong Kong and China during the democracy protests, went in and from that I learned a lot of what needed to be in governance."

True: Walz claims former Trump White House chief of staff John Kelly called Trump "the most flawed human being he ever met."​

Walz: "It's those that were closest to Donald Trump that understand how dangerous he is when the world is this dangerous. His chief of staff, John Kelly, said that he was the most flawed human being he ever met."

True: Walz claims Vance has in the past said "there's a climate problem" and that Trump called climate change "a hoax"​

Walz: "Sen. Vance said there's a climate problem in the past. Donald Trump called it a hoax and then joked that these things would make more beachfront property to be able to invest in."

Partially true: Walz claims patients had to pay $800 for insulin before passage of Inflation Reduction Act during Biden administration​

Walz: "The $35 insulin is a good thing, but it costs $5 to make insulin. They were charging $800 to make it before that law went into effect."

Needs context: Walz claims Project 2025 makes it hard to get contraception and access to fertility treatments​

Walz: "Their Project 2025 is going to have a registry of pregnancies. It's going to make it more difficult, if not impossible, to get contraception, and limit access, if not eliminate access, to infertility treatments."

False: Walz claims Trump hasn't paid taxes in 15 years​

False: Vance claims prescription drugs are up about 7% under Biden, but under Trump, they went up just 1.5% over four years​

Vance: "When Donald Trump was actually president, and again he has a record to be proud of, prescription drugs fell in 2018 for the first time in a very long time. Under Kamala Harris' leadership, prescription drugs are up about 7%. Under Donald Trump's entire four years, they were up about 1.5%."

False: Vance claims Harris has not invested in clean air, clean water or climate policy​

Vance: "If we actually care about getting cleaner air and cleaner water, the best thing to do is to double down and invest in American workers and the American people. And unfortunately, Kamala Harris has done exactly the opposite."

Partially true: Walz claims "the last 12 months saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's history — 30% decrease in Ohio."​

Walz: "This is a crisis is — the opioid crisis. And the good news on this is the last 12 months saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's history. 30% decrease in Ohio."

Misleading: Vance says Minnesota law Walz signed says "a doctor that presides over an abortion where the baby survives, the doctor is under no obligation to provide life-saving care to a baby who survives a botched, late-term abortion."​

Vance: "The Minnesota law you signed into law, the statute that you signed into law, it says that a doctor that presides over an abortion where the baby survives, the doctor is under no obligation to provide life-saving care to a baby who survives a botched, late-term abortion."

You can read the rest of the details here:

Fact checking VP debate claims from Walz and Vance's 2024 showdown

CBS News fact checked the biggest claims made by Tim Walz and JD Vance during the vice presidential debate.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[joelbc1]

That's fair...just seems to me the argument has mostly centered around semantics, rather than the actual problem.

That’s why there is no solutions coming forth from Trump and Republicans. They do Not want a solution! They need the noise !

 

[Gus is dead]

Here you go:

The CBS News Confirmed team fact checked the biggest claims made by Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz and Ohio Sen. JD Vance in tonight's 2024 vice presidential debate in New York City.

CBS News hosted the only planned vice presidential debate between Vance and Walz on Tuesday, Oct. 1, on CBS and CBS News 24/7. Download the free CBS News app for live coverage, post-debate analysis and more.

The debate moderators were "CBS Evening News" anchor and managing editor Norah O'Donnell and "Face the Nation" moderator and chief foreign affairs correspondent Margaret Brennan.

Misleading: Vance claims Trump "peacefully gave over power on Jan. 20"​

Vance: "It's really rich for Democratic leaders to say that Donald Trump is a unique threat to democracy when he peacefully gave over power on Jan. 20."

False, needs context: Vance says Iran received over $100 billion in unfrozen assets thanks to Harris​

Vance: "Iran, which launched this attack, has received over $100 billion in unfrozen assets thanks to the Kamala Harris administration."

False: Vance says Trump could have destroyed Obamacare​

Vance: "Of course, you don't have to agree with everything that President Trump has ever said or ever done, but when Obamacare was crushing under the weight of its own regulatory burden and healthcare costs, Donald Trump could have destroyed the program. Instead, he worked in a bipartisan way to ensure that Americans had access to affordable care."

Misleading: Vance claims DHS "has effectively lost" 320,000 children​

Vance: "Right now in this country, Margaret, we have 320,000 children that the Department of Homeland Security has effectively lost. Some of them have been sex trafficked, some of them, hopefully, are at homes with their families. Some of them have been used as drug trafficking mules. The real family separation policy in this country is unfortunately Kamala Harris' wide open southern border."

True, needs context: Walz claims border "crossings down, compared to when Donald Trump left office"​

Walz: "Look, crossings are down compared to when Donald Trump left office."

False: Vance says Vice President Harris "became the appointed border czar"​

Partially true, needs context: Vance claims housing unaffordable because "millions of illegal immigrants ... compete with Americans for scarce homes."​

Vance: "You've got housing that is totally unaffordable, because we have brought in millions of illegal immigrants to compete with Americans for scarce homes."

Mostly true: Walz claims when Iranian missiles "did fall near U.S. troops and they received traumatic brain injuries, Donald Trump wrote it off as 'headaches'"​

Walz: "And when Iranian missiles did fall near U.S. troops, and they received traumatic brain injuries, Donald Trump wrote it off as headaches."

False: Walz claimed he was in China during the Tiananmen Square protests​

Walz: "All I said on this was, I got there that summer and misspoke on this. That is what I have said. So, I was in Hong Kong and China during the democracy protests, went in and from that I learned a lot of what needed to be in governance."

True: Walz claims former Trump White House chief of staff John Kelly called Trump "the most flawed human being he ever met."​

Walz: "It's those that were closest to Donald Trump that understand how dangerous he is when the world is this dangerous. His chief of staff, John Kelly, said that he was the most flawed human being he ever met."

True: Walz claims Vance has in the past said "there's a climate problem" and that Trump called climate change "a hoax"​

Walz: "Sen. Vance said there's a climate problem in the past. Donald Trump called it a hoax and then joked that these things would make more beachfront property to be able to invest in."

Partially true: Walz claims patients had to pay $800 for insulin before passage of Inflation Reduction Act during Biden administration​

Walz: "The $35 insulin is a good thing, but it costs $5 to make insulin. They were charging $800 to make it before that law went into effect."

Needs context: Walz claims Project 2025 makes it hard to get contraception and access to fertility treatments​

Walz: "Their Project 2025 is going to have a registry of pregnancies. It's going to make it more difficult, if not impossible, to get contraception, and limit access, if not eliminate access, to infertility treatments."

False: Walz claims Trump hasn't paid taxes in 15 years​

False: Vance claims prescription drugs are up about 7% under Biden, but under Trump, they went up just 1.5% over four years​

Vance: "When Donald Trump was actually president, and again he has a record to be proud of, prescription drugs fell in 2018 for the first time in a very long time. Under Kamala Harris' leadership, prescription drugs are up about 7%. Under Donald Trump's entire four years, they were up about 1.5%."

False: Vance claims Harris has not invested in clean air, clean water or climate policy​

Vance: "If we actually care about getting cleaner air and cleaner water, the best thing to do is to double down and invest in American workers and the American people. And unfortunately, Kamala Harris has done exactly the opposite."

Partially true: Walz claims "the last 12 months saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's history — 30% decrease in Ohio."​

Walz: "This is a crisis is — the opioid crisis. And the good news on this is the last 12 months saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's history. 30% decrease in Ohio."

Misleading: Vance says Minnesota law Walz signed says "a doctor that presides over an abortion where the baby survives, the doctor is under no obligation to provide life-saving care to a baby who survives a botched, late-term abortion."​

Vance: "The Minnesota law you signed into law, the statute that you signed into law, it says that a doctor that presides over an abortion where the baby survives, the doctor is under no obligation to provide life-saving care to a baby who survives a botched, late-term abortion."

You can read the rest of the details here:

Fact checking VP debate claims from Walz and Vance's 2024 showdown

CBS News fact checked the biggest claims made by Tim Walz and JD Vance during the vice presidential debate.

www.cbsnews.com

None of these actually discuss why what they assert is false or misleading is. Where are the facts that refute the statements? because as is, they are merely making assertions as well. Just like Vance.

Bottom line. Vance isnt a liar. Claiming he is is a weak ass attempt to turn the most decisive beat down of a Democrat VP choice in a generation into a 'mistake' because Vance said stuff they claimed was a lie thereby invalidating the beatdown. . Claiming Trump is a liar is one thing. Claiming Vance is, under the same playbook, is dishonest.

 

[gohawks50]

None of these actually discuss why what they assert is false or misleading is. Where are the facts that refute the statements? because as is, they are merely making assertions as well. Just like Vance.

Bottom line. Vance isnt a liar. Claiming he is is a weak ass attempt to turn the most decisive beat down of a Democrat VP choice in a generation into a 'mistake' because Vance said stuff they claimed was a lie thereby invalidating the beatdown. . Claiming Trump is a liar is one thing. Claiming Vance is, under the same playbook, is dishonest.

They do if you click on the link. I just copied the headlines because the entire article had too many characters to fit in one post.

 

[Gus is dead]

What about Springfield?

He owned the moderators on this and made them look petty and biased. Ive grown tired of the media and I think we have found a candidate that isnt going to allow himself to be manipulated or defined by them. And that has to scare the crap out of them.

They know he's smarter than they are and it showed.

You have a candidate for President that is dumb AF and and VP who's awe shucks demeanor make him seem like he is.

We have a President in waiting now in Vance that will define the party for generations if this goes how I see it. Hell, right now, I kinda hope Trump loses to clear the way for a far better candidate in 2028. Problem is, in the meantime the world burns under a Kamala/Walz admin and we cant afford that.

 

[Gus is dead]

Well I guess he didn't really lie about the election because he just didn't answer the question as to who really won. Because that would of course take away their big talking point to 10% of the morons including guys like you who believe it was stolen. Not that the 10% would change their mind either way.

I dont think it was stolen. So I guess youre the moron for thinking I did without actually knowing huh?

 

[Gus is dead]

They do if you click on the link. I just copied the headlines because the entire article had too many characters to fit in one post.

Ok Ill check it out.

 

[joelbc1]

What about Springfield?

He owned the moderators on this and made them look petty and biased. Ive grown tired of the media and I think we have found a candidate that isnt going to allow himself to be manipulated or defined by them. And that has to scare the crap out of them.

They know he's smarter than they are and it showed.

You have a candidate for President that is dumb AF and and VP who's awe shucks demeanor make him seem like he is.

We have a President in waiting now in Vance that will define the party for generations if this goes how I see it. Hell, right now, I kinda hope Trump loses to clear the way for a far better candidate in 2028. Problem is, in the meantime the world burns under a Kamala/Walz admin and we cant afford that.

“He owned the moderators on this…..”….He phuquin’ lied about Springfield…and admitted he lied about Springfield, you dolt! Yet you say ‘e “owned” the moderators on this subject? What part of “the phuquer lied about Springfield” dont you understand Gus? Are you as stupid as so many other of the MAGAts are around here?

 

[gohawks50]

What about Springfield?

He owned the moderators on this and made them look petty and biased. Ive grown tired of the media and I think we have found a candidate that isnt going to allow himself to be manipulated or defined by them. And that has to scare the crap out of them.

They know he's smarter than they are and it showed.

You have a candidate for President that is dumb AF and and VP who's awe shucks demeanor make him seem like he is.

We have a President in waiting now in Vance that will define the party for generations if this goes how I see it. Hell, right now, I kinda hope Trump loses to clear the way for a far better candidate in 2028. Problem is, in the meantime the world burns under a Kamala/Walz admin and we cant afford that.

Can you explain how he owned the moderators on Springfield?

 

[Gus is dead]

Ok Ill check it out.

Sorry. I don't think one's viewing of certain events or statistics under a certain lens qualifies as a lie. These fact checks are simply not persuasive that any of this meets the LIE threshold.

But saying one was in Tiananmen Square when they werent, or in combat when they werent, does.

 

[Morrison71]

Nobodygivesashit/end thread.

 

[Roncuba55]

This thread feels wrong w/o chis.