Could Sammy Brooks bump to 197?

[CradleKing26]

In my opinion 184 is the toughest weight in the country this year and 197 is the weakest. Since 197 is slated to be a weak weight for Iowa anyway, is there any chance Brooks could go up to 197?

While I feel Sammy is one of the top guys at 184, I don't think he is beating Dean and there are around a dozen guys at that weight who are legit and capable of beating him. If he moved up to 97, you still have a super hammer in Cox, but after that it is extremely thin.

I realize 13 pounds is nothing to scoff at, but there is a huge difference in talent between 184/197. In addition, most of the other top guys at 184 have someone on their team that is highly ranked at 197, thus blocking them from moving up. The only ones who are not blocked are Dean (2X returning champ), Martin (who is already moving up a weight), Nickal (same), Downey (dropping down a weight for some illogical reason), and Brooks(who I think would greatly benefit from moving up if at all possible).

*I have heard nothing indicating this is going to happen. Just trying to generate some discussion on a move I feel would maximize potential points at NCAA's for Iowa, if Sammy could add on the appropriate weight.*

 

[crablegs1]

I think he could and would AA at 197. But I don't see how it would help the team? Iowa still has a hole.

 

[CradleKing26]

I think he could and would AA at 197. But I don't see how it would help the team? Iowa still has a hole.

Its not out of the realm of possibility that he could DNP at 184. Its that good. If he could add on the weight to go at 97, I think he could be a surefire AA and have a much easier path to being a finalist.

And thats a big If.

 

[championhawk]

I think we would be better with Brooks at 97 and Wilke at 84 but I don't get paid to think or make lineups. I also think Kemdawg at 49 and BS at 57 will score more points than if they are flipped.

 

[AFHawk86]

I'm intrigued by the thought of Sammy at 197. I assume Wilcke would man 184 if Iowa chose to implement this strategy.

 

[GableEdge]

Why can't we have enough depth so everyone wrestles their own weight? We shouldn't have this controversy. It's like Sans planning on no flood... it's illogical.

 

[Azchief32]

Why can't we have enough depth so everyone wrestles their own weight? We shouldn't have this controversy. It's like Sans planning on no flood... it's illogical.

 

[SPOONER]

Such a move may be a wash. Or worse. He would have a horsepower disadvantage.

And you sure as heck don't decide to make the move a month before the season starts.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

Personally, I think Sammy is too small for 197. I know he had some success at the Junior level at 195, but Sammy relies on a bit of muscle and roughness with his game. Im not opposed to him giving it a go at say Midlands. But he could end up losing close matches to guys who are less talented but stronger. I've heard some encouraging things about Holloway. I've heard zero things positive about Wilcke's development. I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it.

Also, something about a hawk running from a tough fight doesn't sit right with me. I believe in Sammy. If he had even a little bit better NCAA tourney, we wouldn't be having this conversation. He was the B10 runner-up and seeded 2nd at NCAAs. He picked a bad time to have a bad tourney. I have faith in him to turn it around.

 

[moug]

Sammy was the B10 champ, thanks to his mullet, remember?

 

[AFHawk86]

And you sure as heck don't decide to make the move a month before the season starts.

In a 20/20 world, I 100% agree. These decisions should be made in March. That said, it will be interesting to see what the coaches decide for the lineup with Marinelli's redshirt and the 197/heavyweight situation early in the season.

 

[aintlifeordeath]

Sammy was the B10 champ, thanks to his mullet, remember?

But you can't grow a 197 pound mullet in a day. He stays at 84.

 

[edquinn06]

Am I in the minority that's thinks we should just forfeit heavy until Stoll is back? We need Wilcke to take over for Brooks next year. So he should probably be taking matches at that weight. He got 8th at university national, so the talent is there. Holloway is our only true 97. That's where he should be wrestling. I know there is a good chance we get Warner, and if we do he will probably RS so it gonna be Holloway for 2 years. Plus there is a chance that we don't get Warner and then we really need Holloway wrestling at his natural weight.

Guess what I'm saying is I know it's lame but forfeit heavy til Stoll is back.

 

[SPOONER]

Am I in the minority that's thinks we should just forfeit heavy until Stoll is back? We need Wilcke to take over for Brooks next year. So he should probably be taking matches at that weight. He got 8th at university national, so the talent is there. Holloway is our only true 97. That's where he should be wrestling. I know there is a good chance we get Warner, and if we do he will probably RS so it gonna be Holloway for 2 years. Plus there is a chance that we don't get Warner and then we really need Holloway wrestling at his natural weight.

Guess what I'm saying is I know it's lame but forfeit heavy til Stoll is back.

Yup. If you don't move them around a bit he won't be "taking matches" at any weight given we have Brooks at 184. He wrestled 184 all season last year and will for basically all of this year so that's hardly a concern. There is no short or long term harm in getting all these guys on the mat for the first few duals. Nothing Iowa and other teams haven't done before.

 

[24 so far]

Am I in the minority that's thinks we should just forfeit heavy until Stoll is back? We need Wilcke to take over for Brooks next year. So he should probably be taking matches at that weight. He got 8th at university national, so the talent is there. Holloway is our only true 97. That's where he should be wrestling. I know there is a good chance we get Warner, and if we do he will probably RS so it gonna be Holloway for 2 years. Plus there is a chance that we don't get Warner and then we really need Holloway wrestling at his natural weight.

Guess what I'm saying is I know it's lame but forfeit heavy til Stoll is back.

You probably are in the minority, and I'm with you in that minority. Wrestle the weight you belong at and do the best you can. This is fricking Iowa Wrestling, the thought of someone moving to a "weaker weight" because of "potential" fairy tale NCAA points is mind blowing to me.

Everyone knows the landscape, and guys have been moving up weights to avoid "monsters" for years, but that transformation doesn't happen overnight, you have to plan for it. Obviously our depth is not what we want it to be, and certainly Iowa isn't alone in that boat. It is what it is at this point and you deal with it the best you can.

 

[edquinn06]

Yup. If you don't move them around a bit he won't be "taking matches" at any weight given we have Brooks at 184. He wrestled 184 all season last year and will for basically all of this year so that's hardly a concern. There is no short or long term harm in getting all these guys on the mat for the first few duals. Nothing Iowa and other teams haven't done before.

Meyer did spot starts for Evans and Brooks did spot starts for Lofthouse. Why can't Wilcke do the same this year and go to Midlands? Seems to have worked out fine for those two and I'm sure others.

 

[SPOONER]

Meyer did spot starts for Evans and Brooks did spot starts for Lofthouse. Why can't Wilcke do the same this year and go to Midlands? Seems to have worked out fine for those two and I'm sure others.

Yup. He could. But why do that and leave a weight open?

 

[SPOONER]

You probably are in the minority, and I'm with you in that minority. Wrestle the weight you belong at and do the best you can. This is fricking Iowa Wrestling, the thought of someone moving to a "weaker weight" because of "potential" fairy tale NCAA points is mind blowing to me.

Everyone knows the landscape, and guys have been moving up weights to avoid "monsters" for years, but that transformation doesn't happen overnight, you have to plan for it. Obviously our depth is not what we want it to be, and certainly Iowa isn't alone in that boat. It is what it is at this point and you deal with it the best you can.

For the record, We don't agree on what to do if Stoll is out but we agree here. I don't see the benefit.

 

[Tcalumet]

We just need the Brooks that wrestled at big ten last year to show up at NCAA and he will be top 3-4

 

[Sandor45]

We just need the Brooks that wrestled at big ten last year to show up at NCAA and he will be top 3-4

Brooks has the ability to beat anyone at 84
He just hasn't been consistent at it.

 

[edquinn06]

Yup. He could. But why do that and leave a weight open?

Because if Holloway is going to be our starter at 97 come Big's and NCAA's it would be better for him and the team if he has wrestled there all year. Holloway is better then people think. Everyone thinks this Moore kid from tOSU is going to be really good and Holloway beat him 6-1 a few summers ago. I understand a lot can change from then.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

Many fans across the country went crazy on a couple of B1G teams for forfeiting weights specifically because they were B1G teams with the support necessary to run a successful program. I don't think Iowa should be a team forfeiting weights especially if you guys are saying Wilke beats Holloway. However edquin and 23 so far made good points

 

[minnhawkeye]

Don't like forfeit's either but heck sure don't need Stoll for Iowa duals. Now in a big ten match could see moving around if needed.
Same with at 149 why wait till Nov, should have been done last March who is going to beef up for 157 just my thoughts and I don't get paid to make the choice so it really don't matter.

 

[so cal hawkfan]

Many fans across the country went crazy on a couple of B1G teams for forfeiting weights specifically because they were B1G teams with the support necessary to run a successful program. I don't think Iowa should be a team forfeiting weights especially if you guys are saying Wilke beats Holloway. However edquin and 23 so far made good points

I haven't heard that Wilcke beats Holloway. I've heard quite the opposite. Have things changed?

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

I haven't heard that Wilcke beats Holloway. I've heard quite the opposite. Have things changed?

I might just have the names confused

 

[manmythlegend1]

I know this is an Iowa discussion but in my experience, you don't move a guy up that much weight unless the weight cut is hurting his potential or he is kicking the crap out of the guy you have at the upper weight and you have guy who can take over the lower weight who is not much of a drop off from the guy moving up. Is that the situation here...not sure, but Brooks will have trouble muscling anyone at 197.. you are talking 215 guys moving down> I don't see it working out well, but according to my wife I am wrong a lot

 

[SPOONER]

Because if Holloway is going to be our starter at 97 come Big's and NCAA's it would be better for him and the team if he has wrestled there all year. Holloway is better then people think. Everyone thinks this Moore kid from tOSU is going to be really good and Holloway beat him 6-1 a few summers ago. I understand a lot can change from then.

You really think a handful of matches at the start of the year is going to have a major effect on that? I get that we are in no danger of losing at the Iowa Duals but why not use it as an opportunity to get everyone on the mat? We're talking about the Iowa Duals here and maybe SD State. It might not make sense for such a move vs ISU with Downey at 184 and the brute they have at HWT.

 

[crapman]

Personally, I think Sammy is too small for 197. I know he had some success at the Junior level at 195, but Sammy relies on a bit of muscle and roughness with his game. Im not opposed to him giving it a go at say Midlands. But he could end up losing close matches to guys who are less talented but stronger. I've heard some encouraging things about Holloway. I've heard zero things positive about Wilcke's development. I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it.

Did you not listen to Morningstar's interview? Wilcke has been busting his ass all summer and fall to fill in at 197 and according to M* "It;s more of a natural fit." Word from the room is that Wilcke is taking it to Holloway so I'm not sure how you have heard zero positive things about Wilcke.

 

[championhawk]

Many fans across the country went crazy on a couple of B1G teams for forfeiting weights specifically because they were B1G teams with the support necessary to run a successful program. I don't think Iowa should be a team forfeiting weights especially if you guys are saying Wilke beats Holloway. However edquin and 23 so far made good points

I don't think a Tom Ryan/ OSU fan should say anything about forfeits. Your team oranges out of more big matches than any in recent memory.

 

[NYWRESTLER94]

I don't think a Tom Ryan/ OSU fan should say anything about forfeits. Your team pussies out of more big matches than any in recent memory.

This isn't about my team though nor was it a knock on yours. They usually do try to fill in weights when "unfortunate" things happen to a starter though

 

[championhawk]

This isn't about my team though nor was it a knock on yours. They usually do try to fill in weights when "unfortunate" things happen to a starter though

Ok and I agree with real injuries. Sam won't be in the lineup for quite awhile. I don't see any reason why they wouldn't want Wilke and Holloway in the lineup. It will also give Holloway a chance to see if HWT is a possible future for him.

 

[24 so far]

Many fans across the country went crazy on a couple of B1G teams for forfeiting weights specifically because they were B1G teams with the support necessary to run a successful program. I don't think Iowa should be a team forfeiting weights especially if you guys are saying Wilke beats Holloway. However edquin and 23 so far made good points

I wish you would have warned us that Bradley was going to quit, because I feel he was quite an adequate backup. That still leaves us in trouble with little depth at 197, but its a better situation overall.

 

[93hawkeye]

Brooks has the ability to beat anyone at 84
He just hasn't been consistent at it.

I hate to say it, but he has been consistently inconsistent.

 

[frontheadlock09]

Moving up would be counter productive Sammy was an All American at 184 and will be again. When I was watching Holloway handled Sammy to the point they switched Holloway out for Moody so Sam could have success as he was becoming very frustrated.

 

[crhawkwrestling]

I'll take that as a good sign for Holloway. Kid is strong as an ox. Shows what the weight difference means.

 

[el dub]

Moving up would be counter productive Sammy was an All American at 184 and will be again. When I was watching Holloway handled Sammy to the point they switched Holloway out for Moody so Sam could have success as he was becoming very frustrated.

LOL Are you saying Sammy had to be given a participation award (Moody) to avoid getting broke in practice by an underclassman?

 

[dicemen99]

Minimum weight to wrestle 285 in college is 183 I believe. I don't see why Iowa wouldn't just wrestle a backup 184 (Wilcke?) at 285 until Stoll is ready to avoid a forfeit. PSU did this more than once last year at 285 - Wes Phipps & Caleb Livingston after both Nevills and Jan Johnson were injured - and did a similar thing with Matt Brown wrestling 197 when we were injured there and he was a backup 174 to Ruth.

 

[PSU Mike]

Minimum weight to wrestle 285 in college is 183 I believe. I don't see why Iowa wouldn't just wrestle a backup 184 (Wilcke?) at 285 until Stoll is ready to avoid a forfeit. PSU did this more than once last year at 285 - Wes Phipps & Caleb Livingston after both Nevills and Jan Johnson were injured - and did a similar thing with Matt Brown wrestling 197 when we were injured there and he was a backup 174 to Ruth.

Kirby! Kirby! (Sorry, PSU inside reference that dice is probably too young to know)

 

[TarpHawk]

Moving up would be counter productive Sammy was an All American at 184 and will be again. When I was watching Holloway handled Sammy to the point they switched Holloway out for Moody so Sam could have success as he was becoming very frustrated.

If true, then:

Brooks stays at 184. Done. Over.

Holloway is starter at 197.

We shouldn't forfeit 285 in the fall. Wrestle either Wilcke or Holloway, with the criteria being getting the toughest opponent for Holloway to make him better faster.

 

[Azchief32]

Sammy thinks so: