Do you agree with Trump building a Wall ?

[The Tradition]

To summarize my too long and too redundant post:

We can choose whether or not to allow polygamy, the questions as it always really has been with SSM is whether we want to, based on things like safety, abuse, morality, etc. So far the tides aren't in the polygamists favor, although they seem to have strong (faux) support from the anti-SSM crowd. Polygamy and bestiality seem to be the issue of the last few years that conservatives want to push for ... which seems odd.

First of all, I've never been opposed to same sex marriage. My argument has always been against having to get a license from the government in the first place. Who you're married to should be between you, your spouse(s) and your church (if you're religious). The state has no business in it at all.

Secondly, there is nothing inherently unsafe or abusive about polygamous marriage. That sort of thought is as silly as the morality and "danger to the children" arguments against same-sex marriage.

Lastly, did any state anywhere issues a same-sex marriage certificate before DOMA laws were passed? No. DOMA was passed in the wake of a Hawaii supreme court case that opened the door to same sex marriage there. So, to claim that DOMA changed the definition of marriage is a grossly misleading take on the subject.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

are they projected as D1 prospects?

I'm sure they could be, and I wouldn't stand in the way. But I'm not motivated to give Rs voter ID in exchange for polygamy legalization as that's essentially two wins for their team for nothing. That was the original context.

Who are you, Rod Blagojevich? “I’ve got this thing and it’s f—ing golden, and, uh, uh, I’m just not giving it up for f—-in’ nothing. I’m not gonna do it. And, and I can always use it.

Democrats willing to bargain voting rights of immigrants for what? And somehow these idiots keep pulling the Donkeycrat lever. Never disparage a Trump voter vis-a-vis the minorities that keep the Democratic establishment in power.

 

[theIowaHawk]

First of all, I've never been opposed to same sex marriage. My argument has always been against having to get a license from the government in the first place. Who you're married to should be between you, your spouse(s) and your church (if you're religious). The state has no business in it at all.

Secondly, there is nothing inherently unsafe or abusive about polygamous marriage. That sort of thought is as silly as the morality and "danger to the children" arguments against same-sex marriage.

Lastly, did any state anywhere issues a same-sex marriage certificate before DOMA laws were passed? No. DOMA was passed in the wake of a Hawaii supreme court case that opened the door to same sex marriage there. So, to claim that DOMA changed the definition of marriage is a grossly misleading take on the subject.

How fraudulent. Because states didn't do something it must have been illegal? If so, why pass the law?

If your stance is that the state "has no business in marriage" it seems you should stop arguing that SSM changed anything, considering that runs counter to your own stance.

You saying there is nothing inherently unsafe or abuse about polygamous marriage doesn't make it true nor does it equate it to the danger to the children in SSM. It doesn't because that argument was discussed and debunked at length in SSM cases. The due diligence was completed. That same due diligence has not been done on polygamy, no matter how you personally claim it is.

If you have a stance go with it, stop trying to argue other people's positions to hurt your own.

 

[naturalmwa]

Who are you, Rod Blagojevich? “I’ve got this thing and it’s f—ing golden, and, uh, uh, I’m just not giving it up for f—-in’ nothing. I’m not gonna do it. And, and I can always use it.

Democrats willing to bargain voting rights of immigrants for what? And somehow these idiots keep pulling the Donkeycrat lever. Never disparage a Trump voter vis-a-vis the minorities that keep the Democratic establishment in power.

He did have nice hair.

 

[theIowaHawk]

And articles by NPR - but why worry about facts.

No, as you pointed out your NPR article (which I posted first, even if inaccurately) said nothing about Mormons, it certainly isn't proof that polygamy is a myth.

 

[ThorneStockton]

No, as you pointed out your NPR article (which I posted first, even if inaccurately) said nothing about Mormons, it certainly isn't proof that polygamy is a myth.

That would have made for an interesting article: "XX number of Muslims practice polygamy, we note: No Mormons do, that is a myth."

 

[dandh]

Please explain how each of those Christian "denominations and sects" count as Christian denominations and sects but that Mormon groups do not.

Protestantism is a denomination. Quakers, etc. are sects. Neither are offshoots of a sect.

 

[theIowaHawk]

Protestantism is a denomination. Quakers, etc. are sects. Neither are offshoots of a sect.

You keep trying to refuse to answer the question, and I can only surmise it is because you either a) can't answer it while supporting your contention or b) you can't actually figure out what I'm asking.

How is what you just posted different than Mormonism?

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

Better border security? Yes. A wall? Almost as stupid an idea as...

 

[Hawk_4shur]

Found a simple artists rendering of Trump's wall.

Looks like a GREAT idea.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

Better border security? Yes. A wall? Almost as stupid an idea as...

The Mexicans have Panzer tanks now? Well.....shazammmm.

 

[dandh]

No, as you pointed out your NPR article (which I posted first, even if inaccurately) said nothing about Mormons, it certainly isn't proof that polygamy is a myth.

Well, I never said polygamy is a myth. I said that the perception that Mormons engage in polygamy is pretty much a myth perpetuated by people who dislike their religion. In other words, it's way overstated, attributed to Mormons in general, and represented that they're the only ones doing it. At the same time, we know that many more Muslims do it than actual Mormons (members of the LDS church) and that polygamy is accepted doctrine in most (if not all?) branches of Islam. Mormons are being picked on here.

I don't agree with much of their doctrine, but I really bristle when people try to label a religious group as something they are not. Just like I bristled when Trump said of Mexicans, "they're rapists, and I'm sure that some of them are good people". Birds of a feather, IMO.

 

[dandh]

That would have made for an interesting article: "XX number of Muslims practice polygamy, we note: No Mormons do, that is a myth."

Please don't make up things. It's not nice.

 

[naturalmwa]

Well, I never said polygamy is a myth. I said that the perception that Mormons engage in polygamy is pretty much a myth perpetuated by people who dislike their religion. In other words, it's way overstated, attributed to Mormons in general, and represented that they're the only ones doing it. At the same time, we know that many more Muslims do it than actual Mormons (members of the LDS church) and that polygamy is accepted doctrine in most (if not all?) branches of Islam. Mormons are being picked on here.

I don't agree with much of their doctrine, but I really bristle when people try to label a religious group as something they are not. Just like I bristled when Trump said of Mexicans, "they're rapists, and I'm sure that some of them are good people". Birds of a feather, IMO.

In that case I don't know how you live with yourself as you are the one trying to tell Mormons who think Polygamy is great that they can't believe that and can't even be the faith they claim. Mormons certainly are being picked on here by you.

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

The Mexicans have Panzer tanks now? Well.....shazammmm.

That's not how the Maginot Line was breached. Let me expl.....ugh....nevermind. Google is your friend.

 

[HallofFame]

I see you are in favor of spending trillions in tax money, good for you.

It was to be my understanding Mexico was paying for the wall. Also I'd be happy to pay trillions in tax money to keep brown people at bay.

 

[ThorneStockton]

Please don't make up things. It's not nice.

You stated you posted an article in support of your notion that polygamy among Mormons is a myth, which was certainly not true, I poked fun at it.

 

[The Tradition]

How fraudulent. Because states didn't do something it must have been illegal? If so, why pass the law?

If your stance is that the state "has no business in marriage" it seems you should stop arguing that SSM changed anything, considering that runs counter to your own stance.

You saying there is nothing inherently unsafe or abuse about polygamous marriage doesn't make it true nor does it equate it to the danger to the children in SSM. It doesn't because that argument was discussed and debunked at length in SSM cases. The due diligence was completed. That same due diligence has not been done on polygamy, no matter how you personally claim it is.

If you have a stance go with it, stop trying to argue other people's positions to hurt your own.

What a bunch of blabber. There is absolutely no reason why three (or more) people shouldn't be able to enter into a marriage contract.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

That's not how the Maginot Line was breached. Let me expl.....ugh....nevermind. Google is your friend.

You do realize the Maginot Line was not a wall, right? A series of large and small bunkers and outposts, minefields and fortresses.

German Army Group B attacked through the Ardennes – such an attack was believed to be impossible by the French. One million men and 1,500 tanks crossed the seemingly impenetrable forests in the Ardennes. The Germans wanted to drive the Allies to the sea. Once the Maginot Line had been isolated it had little military importance and the Germans only turned their attention to it in early June 1940. Many of the ouvrages surrendered after the government signed its surrender with Germany – few had to be captured in battle, though some forts did fight the Germans. One in seven French divisions was a fortress division – so the Maginot Line took out 15% of the French Army. Though not a huge figure, these men may have had an impact on the advance of the Germans – or at least got evacuated at Dunkirk to fight another time.

Now you know the rest of the story. Update me on the Mexican indigent's access to tanks, 88's and Messerschmidts.

 

[ANYCHawk]

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

That sista' should have throat punched the elitist bitch, spilling hot coffee all over her burlap pantsuit.

You do realize the Maginot Line was not a wall, right? A series of large and small bunkers and outposts, minefields and fortresses.

German Army Group B attacked through the Ardennes – such an attack was believed to be impossible by the French. One million men and 1,500 tanks crossed the seemingly impenetrable forests in the Ardennes. The Germans wanted to drive the Allies to the sea. Once the Maginot Line had been isolated it had little military importance and the Germans only turned their attention to it in early June 1940. Many of the ouvrages surrendered after the government signed its surrender with Germany – few had to be captured in battle, though some forts did fight the Germans. One in seven French divisions was a fortress division – so the Maginot Line took out 15% of the French Army. Though not a huge figure, these men may have had an impact on the advance of the Germans – or at least got evacuated at Dunkirk to fight another time.

Now you know the rest of the story. Update me on the Mexican indigent's access to tanks, 88's and Messerschmidts.

This really isn't that hard. Ready for it?: they'll have boats to go around the wall, and they will have equipment to dig tunnels. You're right, the Maginot Line wasn't a wall, it was even BETTER than a wall because it was guarded militarily. The Germans simply violated the neutrality of the Belgians, Dutch, and Luxembourgish and went around it. Hence, it was a monumental waste of money in the same way this wall would be.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

Nonsense. Every country in the world has boats yet for over 200 years illegal invasion was not an issue, but the one country that we have a land border with invades at will. Hmmmm. Tunnels? I suppose an occasional tunnel can be dug. Time consuming, labor intensive, and there have to be seismic listening devices to detect such activity. We are not guarding the border from a military force, just indigents who have ready access to what? Picks & shovels.

 

[Menace Sockeyes]

Nonsense. Every country in the world has boats yet for over 200 years illegal invasion was not an issue, but the one country that we have a land border with invades at will. Hmmmm. Tunnels? I suppose an occasional tunnel can be dug. Time consuming, labor intensive, and there have to be seismic listening devices to detect such activity. We are not guarding the border from a military force, just indigents who have ready access to what? Picks & shovels.

You are incredibly clueless about the money involved in human trafficking. Do yourself a huge favor and get informed.

Oh, and people can't make it in the US illegally by boat? HA! Try telling that to the Cubans and Colombian drug lords.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

You are incredibly clueless about the money involved in human trafficking. Do yourself a huge favor and get informed.

Oh, and people can't make it in the US illegally by boat? HA! Try telling that to the Cubans and Colombian drug lords.

The world's greatest military is helpless against human traffickers? Got it. You could be right. Then let's build a 4 lane interstate from Mexico City to Minneapolis to facilitate the inevitable. I'm convinced.

 

[naturalmwa]

The world's greatest military is helpless against human traffickers? Got it. You could be right. Then let's build a 4 lane interstate from Mexico City to Minneapolis to facilitate the inevitable. I'm convinced.

In what universe are we deploying the military along the Mexican boarder?

 

[PCBHAWK]

So you could get locked in your house? They are the same. They are both used as detergent to keep people that may want to harm you at bay. So do you agree with the wall or are you a hipocrit? Because I haven't seen your address listed with pics of locks removed.

Detergent will certainly clean things up!

 

[sijoint]

Restricting voting rights by requiring government paperwork is an attack on rights. That should come with a high price. Polygamy is mainly a conservative religious thing and one of the few sexual issues still illegal. What did you have in mind?

Freedom, not free access to illegal Mexicans, others. Big difference.

 

[naturalmwa]

Freedom, not free access to illegal Mexicans, others. Big difference.

I don't see how this applies to my post.

 

[jamesvanderwulf]

In what universe are we deploying the military along the Mexican boarder?

Sockeyes was the one talking about human traffickers evidently smuggling human cargo in or out ( he didn't specify which ) of the USA via the sea. Last I heard was that the Coast Guard and Navy are charged with patrolling our territorial waters. In the Universe that is the left, using our military to protect our citizens from foreign, uncontrolled illegal invasion is somehow absurd. Why, it's the main job of the Federal Government?

 

[naturalmwa]

Sockeyes was the one talking about human traffickers evidently smuggling human cargo in or out ( he didn't specify which ) of the USA via the sea. Last I heard was that the Coast Guard and Navy are charged with patrolling our territorial waters. In the Universe that is the left, using our military to protect our citizens from foreign, uncontrolled illegal invasion is somehow absurd. Why, it's the main job of the Federal Government?

First because I think it's illegal, but second because I've not heard of a plan to militarize the boarder. If that is indeed the plan it's going to cost a lot more than 10-20 billion. And all to keep hotel maids out of the country. You cons really like to waste money.

 

[dbq hawk 32]

The state has no business in it at all.

Sure it does. The state has an interest in promoting stable familial relationships that result in raising children in the best possible environment. Find me a preponderance of studies that show single parent households are better for children than two parent households and I'll agree with you.

 

[dbq hawk 32]

First because I think it's illegal, but second because I've not heard of a plan to militarize the boarder. If that is indeed the plan it's going to cost a lot more than 10-20 billion. And all to keep hotel maids out of the country. You cons really like to waste money.

It has always amazed me that Democrats care more about illegal immigrants than the working poor simply because the immigrant's skin is usually a different color.

 

[cigaretteman]

It has always amazed me that Democrats care more about illegal immigrants than the working poor simply because the immigrant's skin is usually a different color.

Well, you can stop being amazed, because neither of those statements are true.

 

[naturalmwa]

It has always amazed me that Democrats care more about illegal immigrants than the working poor simply because the immigrant's skin is usually a different color.

This doesn't appear to have anything to do with my position, so I'll just deny its truth and roll my eyes in your general direction.

 

[dbq hawk 32]

This doesn't appear to have anything to do with my position, so I'll just deny its truth and roll my eyes in your general direction.

Was more of a general statement. It does, however, have quite a bit to do with your statement about "hotel maids".

 

[dbq hawk 32]

Well, you can stop being amazed, because neither of those statements are true.

Sure they are, and everyone knows it. You want a $15 minimum wage, and open borders. Explain to me what that will do to immigration and the working poor.

 

[naturalmwa]

Sure they are, and everyone knows it. You want a $15 minimum wage, and open borders. Explain to me what that will do to immigration and the working poor.

Ds don't want an open boarder. We want a real solution, not a symbolic one. That's why we have been pushing to hold employers to account if they hire illegals for decades. Cheap, easy, effective solution, but Rs fight that preferring symbolic action that they already know has a built in back door. Tell me more about this fiction of Rs caring about the working poor. Because that story is hilarious.

 

[dbq hawk 32]

Ds don't want an open boarder. We want a real solution, not a symbolic one. (1) That's why we have been pushing to hold employers to account if they hire illegals for decades. Cheap, easy, effective solution, but Rs fight that preferring symbolic action that they already know has a built in back door. (2)Tell me more about this fiction of Rs caring about the working poor. Because that story is hilarious.

(1) So the wall won't get rid of enough illegal immigrants. I see. That must be why all the democrats whine that republicans are anti-immigrant. You actually want more of them gone.

(2) You must have a reading comprehension issue.

 

[naturalmwa]

(1) So the wall won't get rid of enough illegal immigrants. I see. That must be why all the democrats whine that republicans are anti-immigrant. You actually want more of them gone.

(2) You must have a reading comprehension issue.

I got you dancing I see. Rs are called anti-immigrant because you tell us you are. It's not hard to figure out, you are proud and running on that platform. You must not listen to your leaders. Now let's get back to that story about how Rs care about the working poor. Because that's gold.

 

[dbq hawk 32]

I got you dancing I see. Rs are called anti-immigrant because you tell us you are. It's not hard to figure out, you are proud and running on that platform. You must not listen to your leaders. Now let's get back to that story about how Rs care about the working poor. Because that's gold.

It's cute that you keep trying to turn this conversation to the Republicans instead of answer any real questions. You should stop.