Gable/Sanderson - Recruiting Comparison
- Thread starter pablow
- Start date
gable recruited t.
Obliterated? Pablow left off 4 dream team members only ammitted to 2. Tj Williams and Zadick were recuited by Gable.
I used Wrestling USA magazine as my source. Look it up, its on this thing called the interwebs. The list of High School AA that attended Iowa is a lot higher then Pablow posted.
Gable was the greatest coach period, but to say he didnt get a fair share of high level wrestlers coming out of High School is just plain dumb.
ISU vs Iowa = equal footing, rotflmao. Just when I think I can't find anyone more self delusional to argue with on a message board than the old guy on BWI who thinks that Joe told the grand jury in 2010 that the incident was "sexual in nature" because he couldn't remember and McQueary told him to say that, I come over here and find rossel trying to tell us that ISU and Iowa are on equal footing here.
That's some serious cherry picking.
For the past 6 years it isn't all that close.
TJ Williams was not a Gable recruit. TJ William did not wrestle for Gable. TJ Williams was not on Wrestling USA Magazine's dream team as you insist. I looked it up! But hey, maybe you have a better "interwebs" plan than me.
I didn't count recruits [Mike Zadick] that did not contribute to Gable's success. What's the logic in doing otherwise?
BTW, add one more to Cael's column - Cyler Sanderson.
Well -- sort of.
Kurdelmeier was an excellent coach, and really started Iowa on its path toward championships, but Gable was Kurdelmeier's key assistant -- so yes, Gable took over a defending national champ, but it's not like he wasn't already a critical part of those Hawkeye teams.
On the other hand, I think you're overstating Penn State's woes. They were top ten every year in the 90's, top 5 in 8 of those seasons. Certainly the success level slipped in Sunderland's later years, and Cael has taken them to heights never before achieved.
I still consider Dan Gable the greatest coach in college wrestling history but it would not surprise me if in 10 - 15 yrs Cael's accomplishments will be similar to Coach Gable. Although coach Gable did not always's have the top/elite recruits he certainly had his share of good/very good recruits that he was able to take to the next level. Some of my favorite Gable wrestlers were Chris Campbell who was Gable's 1st NCAA champion (and one of my all-time favorite Hawk wrestler's), Ed/Lou Banach, Barry Davis, Jimmy Zalesky, Marty Kistler, Jim Heffernan, Duane Goldman, Jeff McGuiness....and the list goes on and on....these guys might not have been #1 ranked recruits coming out of HS but they certainly came to the Hawks with high credentials. I still believe one of the best coaching jobs that Gable did with a wrestler was specific to Travis Fiser. Travis came to the Hawks as an average to slightly above average wrestler and by the time Gable worked his magic on him there was no one in the country that Travis could not compete with and beat.
Raising myself by lowering others can be an unfortunate human characteristic. As someone noted above, great is great. Does it matter if Ruth is better than Gehrig.
Add Cyler Sanderson to the list, as I'm not comparing the 2. I'm just pointing out you missed some guys. TJ Williams was a 1996 recruit of Dan Gable and was a High School All-American. I never said he was on a Dream Team. Mike Zadick was a 1997 recruit that was on a Dream Team.
The Steiner brothers were also High School All-Americans. the list goes on and on.....
http://www.wrestlingusa.com/high-school/ewExternalFiles/1996 High School All-Americans1.pdf
I would highlight All-American TJ Williams Mt. Carmel H.S. Ill.. But no need you can find him.
I would highlight All-American TJ Williams Mt. Carmel H.S. Ill.. But no need you can find him.
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TJ Williams went to in JUCO in CA for 1997. He transferred to U of Iowa in 1998 but redshirted. His first season wrestling for Iowa saw him winning the ncaa title in 1999.
Gable retired immediately after the 1997 ncaa.
Given that TJ's first season at Iowa was 2 seasons after Gable's retirement, don't you think it's a little disingenuous to cite TJ as a quality recruit that Gable somehow benefitted from?
Look, no one is saying Gable didn't attract some top tier recruits. Pointing out a few examples where Gable brought in a top recruit (McIravy or Joe Williams) doesn't prove much of anything. Where was Jesse Wittmer ranked coming out of HS? Fullhart? Ironside?
By contrast, it's hard to deny that Cael is in a league of his own as far as getting top 10 p4p guys. Almost across the board, Cael has been getting a #1 ranked guy at their HS weight class.
Third. Once. The year prior to the 17th place finish that lead the administration to say enough.
Coach Lorenzo did IMO an amazing job while coaching the program. Penn State under under Lorenzo became an annual top 5 program and possibly the biggest threat to Gable's dominance. Coach Fritz wasn't bad either. It was Fritz's team that threatened Iowa enough to have Gable drop Steiner to 34 to wrestle Kolat and insert McIlravy at 142.
That team in 99 (Sunderland's first) that had 3 finalists, 1 champion and finished 4th in the team race (this ironically enough was the NCAA tournament with Penn State's future coaching staff in the finals) were all Fritz recruited and taught.
After spending 20 years almost always in top 5, Sunderland had a couple good years and did recruit and develop 1 national champion. Of course my opinion is if Phil Davis wrestled for Cael, Casey and Cody he would have won 3.
So yeah Penn State has some history, but when Cael showed up it had been a decade since Penn State competed annually with the top tier teams. Nothing disingenuous about painting Penn State as mid level program prior to Cael. That is exactly what we had become.
Ummm....
Lorenzo's program certainly did become noteworthy during his years, commonly finishing in the top 5. But he never got higher than 3rd, so I think it would be more accurate to describe OSU as the "biggest threat to Gable's dominance." From 1979 - 1992 (Lorenzo's years at PSU), Oklahoma State finished ahead of Penn State every year except 1987 when PSU finished 3rd and OSU 4th.
Cael is making his own mark. From what I know of him, he is doing his own legacy.
To do what gable did may not be seen again.
Cael, tom, smith....they have their own goals.
PSU's current run is good for the sport. We have lots of good competition coming. Let's just enjoy.
Fullhart had a 140 and 7 record as a wrestler at Decorah High School. He was a three-time state champion and a fourth-team all-American by AWN as a senior.
Ironside
High School: Cedar Rapids Jefferson
Record: 106-5-1
1991 125 lb. Third at state 32-3
1992 130 lb. State Champion, 32-1-1
1993 135 lb. State Champion, 41-1
Whittmer
Nothing to say but he is the strongest man in the world
Gable was the best coach of all time so I'm not really sure whether or not his recruiting class rankings were relevant.
