Gilman's Future
- Thread starter WesternPA
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Iowa has an open invitation to drive 90 minutes each way and spend a few hours in front of key high school coaches and wrestling fans but can't be bothered to even send a low level assistant or HWC member. And meanwhile the state's other two D1 programs will be taking advantage. We can certainly quibble about the impact or perception of the program but its pretty darn difficult for me to swallow the opinion that not going is actually the right move.
Discount stores not keeping up with Amazon= Iowa not going to Fight Night. Sound the alarm!
I totally agree. Which is why it is so weird that you would try to make that argument.
The whole thing is a small issue but it was your rationalization for not going was what I disagreed with and lead to presenting the examples you asked for.
P.S. Your sig is mesmerizing. Kudos.
Thank you, I just sit and watch it for hours sometimes
I really dont care that much about fight night honestly. I felt the need to play devil's advocate here a little bc I think ISU and UNI benefit far more than Iowa does. Gilman made an ass out of himself, but it was in response to ISU and UNI poking and prodding was it not? "You want to do that, we dont need to be here" kind of attitude doesnt really bother me.
Doesn't bother me that Iowa doesn't go, it seemed like it was more for the benefit of Milboy and Wartburg and Milboy retired so...
As long as that isnt pissing of some big Hawk donor in that neck of the woods.
Im way more worried about new facilities and the HWC than growing Iowas brand in the Wartburg area. Id rather the coaches focus on those type of events with big cash cows.
As long as that isnt pissing of some big Hawk donor in that neck of the woods.
Im way more worried about new facilities and the HWC than growing Iowas brand in the Wartburg area. Id rather the coaches focus on those type of events with big cash cows.
I prefer the coaches rub elbows in PA, Illinois, Ohio, and Minnesota. Keep the Young Guns happy. The NE Iowa coaches have done a good job developing NCAA qualifiers which is great for ISU. Missing fight night will have very little effect on Iowa as long as they keep recruiting guys like Kennedy, Sokul, Bull, Lee, Kemdawg, Cassioppi, Assad etc.
I think every opportunity to make positive impression in state for the Hawkeye wrestling is good. Gilman certainly didn't help himself at Fight Night, but ultimately it probably wasn't all that detrimental to the program in the long run.
Let’s cut to the chase. I grew up in Waverly and nothing good has ever happened at Joe’s Nighthawk.
I wasn't aware NE Iowa and Young Guns were mutually exclusive?
This is just a good event for wrestling as a whole in Iowa, recruiting aside. Iowa should be there.
So let me get this straight as I don’t really get the Fight Night thing. A bunch of coaches show up at a bar, where most people are probably imbibing, and talk shit. Gilman talked too much shit or the shit he talked was too mean-spirited (I guess) for a “fight night” which is held in a bar. I heard the recording...he really pushed the pace but needs to work on his set ups.
Would I also be correct in saying that since Iowa has been top dog in the state, Brands/Iowa has had to eat a lot of sh*t at these things because everybody is going Jan Brady on him? All in good f** I'm sure.
Now I enjoy a beer and would laugh at some of the smack talking but wouldn't go out of my way (a 1/2 hour or more distance) to see it and am a wrestling junkie. The first time we really discussed it in length was when Gilman was making power moves.
Iowa holds coaching clinics, camps, have a revolving door of teams and clubs coming through Carver, have had wrestles offs the past few years, worked to get the World Cup/Trials and the room is open on game days for practice so even Kevin Dresser himself can come in and plop his ass down in the front row and take notes...I am guess I am wondering how attending a Miss Congeniality contest for drunks makes a big difference to the Iowa program or statewide wrestling...except for those people that live around that area.
Would I also be correct in saying that since Iowa has been top dog in the state, Brands/Iowa has had to eat a lot of sh*t at these things because everybody is going Jan Brady on him? All in good f** I'm sure.
Now I enjoy a beer and would laugh at some of the smack talking but wouldn't go out of my way (a 1/2 hour or more distance) to see it and am a wrestling junkie. The first time we really discussed it in length was when Gilman was making power moves.
Iowa holds coaching clinics, camps, have a revolving door of teams and clubs coming through Carver, have had wrestles offs the past few years, worked to get the World Cup/Trials and the room is open on game days for practice so even Kevin Dresser himself can come in and plop his ass down in the front row and take notes...I am guess I am wondering how attending a Miss Congeniality contest for drunks makes a big difference to the Iowa program or statewide wrestling...except for those people that live around that area.
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Who gives a crap about Fight Night! It will not hurt Iowa’s in state recruiting at all. They will get the kids they want from Iowa, regardless.
If a substantial faction of the wrestling community (especially families of potential recruits) share this perspective, then I can see how it makes a lot of sense for Brands's program to go in another direction.
It's in Addendum C.15 of the 3" Binder, I believe.
Thats kinda how I felt.... but couldn’t express it as well.... bottom line I don’t think Iowa goes because its just an opportunity for the other programs to take shots at them.... almost wonder if that isn’t why they sent Gilman.....I’m confident they have well established relationships with programs all over NE Iowa and there’s nothing to really gain there
If anything Toys R Us stuck too much to their brand and didn’t adapt or change, Kmart pretty similar. Their demise would be the equivalent to keep going to fight night, doing the same thing while deriving no benefit from the activity. Great examples.
If you notice, throwing shade at Iowa is a sport. If you are winning titles, laughing it off is magnanimous, humble and king-like. But if you aren't, it's just shots you either have to take or give back. Tom does not give it back in the media because if he does, that becomes the story. See Dresser and UNI's constant yammering about getting a dual. Even the Tony Ramos deal.
I get Spooner's point about it being tradition and a place for the wrestling community to unwind a bit and its a small thing. However, they do a lot of small things (socials, golf outings, dinners with supporters,etc) and those things add up.
“If you are winning titles, laughing it off is magnanimous, humble and king-like“
In the current wrestling world this is not how the current kings handle shade.... and they will demonstrate that repeatedly.
Damn Chief. This is one of the best posts I've ever read on this forum.
Enjoyable elements but largely hyperbole.
No one was ever claiming any of this was a big deal. I just think thumbing your nose at this group is bad PR. I get there are other touch points but this one requires zero effort or cost. Small, small deal. No doubt.
May want to go with minimal effort and cost. People place value on their time and efforts. Going somewhere where people are going to throw shade at me? Not on the top of my list of things to do.
There might be good natured ribbing and laughs? Oh, the horror.
Speaking of hyperbole. In your last two posts you have said Iowa pulling out is a "huge" pr mistake. Normally a huge mistake would cause some serious issues.
Then you call Northeast Iowa the cradle of HS wrestling and a major opportunity to rub shoulders with coaches and fans. The coaches rub shoulders with these groups at ICLUB outings and have what is likely the most open door policy in the country. Acting like they are missing out on a major opportunity is pushing it.
Later in your post you backed off because you probably realized how wrong you were talking about this being such a major blow. More than 83% of the state don't know this event exists. That's after Gilman put those "big hitters" in their place.
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You hit on something there. I did say it once. Total overstatement. Definitely not huge in the grand scheme of things. Locally a bit of a big deal but not so much in the grand scheme.
IMO this is why our recruiting has struggled over the last decade. TNT appear to have an attitude if “we’re the best, if you want to wrestle for us great; if not, it’s your loss.” I could be wrong, but it looks that way to me. I find it hard to believe that our history and atmosphere isn’t enough for us to land one, sometimes two, top ten p4p guys in every class.
The first part of your post is busting balls over perceived (but uninformed) arrogance on the part of Brands. Second part is an actual example of Iowa fan arrogance (history, best fans, state loves wrestling) that opposing fans
speak of when pointing fingers at us. I agree with you, but just saying you are contradicting yourself.
After nearly ten years of getting his ass handed to him, I am guessing Tom is pretty humble. The last time we won a title, your avg high school kid was 6 to 9 years old. So while there may have been room for “recruit our kind of guy” mentality then, there is no room for it now. They took a big swing and a miss on 2010, probably didn’t open the scholly pocketbook enough on some key dudes since then, and here we are. They have adjusted but getting 2 or 3 top P4P guys every year is not as easy as you think.
I agree the first part is pure speculation, but I believe it’s realistic.
But I don’t know why it’s arrogant to think one of the consistently top four teams in the nation shouldn’t be able to consistently get one of the top ten wrestlers in the nation. And sometimes two. That’s not arrogance, it’s math.
Topic is Gilmans future
He bought a house a couple years ago also has been a paid HWC since graduation. Started off making more than your Good teacher. I suspect Thomas will be around for awhile. He was short on words at the Banquet but gladly signed my tee along with 28 influential Hawks. Thanks!
Next year will be interesting Olys come on. Spence is has already mentioned his commitment to Oly trials. Which is like what 10 days after Nattys? Lame.
Thomas has Great Leader an Work ethic I suspect him to be here 3-5 mo years.
I could see a Womens team in 2 years with him possibly Coaching.
Go Hawks!
He bought a house a couple years ago also has been a paid HWC since graduation. Started off making more than your Good teacher. I suspect Thomas will be around for awhile. He was short on words at the Banquet but gladly signed my tee along with 28 influential Hawks. Thanks!
Next year will be interesting Olys come on. Spence is has already mentioned his commitment to Oly trials. Which is like what 10 days after Nattys? Lame.
Thomas has Great Leader an Work ethic I suspect him to be here 3-5 mo years.
I could see a Womens team in 2 years with him possibly Coaching.
Go Hawks!
I haven’t lived there since the mid-90’s but it sounds like nothing has changed.
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