It’s easier for me to think about who doesn’t deserve any significant minutes and then play the others as much as possible. Connor, Rebraca and JBo (if he misses his first 2 shots) are those fellas.
Kris deserves to start
- Thread starter Chicagoherky71
- Start date
Kris should start over PM. Can't have a guy starting that is 6'9" and long get 1 rebound and 4 points in 20 minutes of play.
Or instead of Rebraca. Either way.
The Murrays are the two best players and two best rebounders.
Can't afford to not have both in most of the time.
I agree with Kris starting over Patrick if inserted into the starting lineup. I think Rebraca needs to be on the floor in match ups against some of the more physical big men. Rebraca is not as tall as I would like, but I would rather see him having to body up some of the centers and allow Keegan to roam more on defense. His he’ll defense is superb and can help cover for deficiencies elsewhere.
I thought the Indiana press covering the game asked him some pretty snarky questions in the postgame. Iowa coaches don't realize what softballs the local media tosses at them.
Kris should be at the 3 IMO. He's too small to play the 5.
Yeah, I think Rebraca still starts. Iowa is usually going to Lose if Keegan gets into foul trouble. Refs will always call a lot of fouls to whoever is guarding the opposing Post player. Teams that have scoring post players, you have to start Rebraca and let him absorb the post defense fouls...Refs will give the foul to lesser known player over Keegan...PMAC refuses to mix it up inside and he doesn't get into foul trouble or absorb fouls for Keegan.
I would start Rebraca and bring in Mulvey/JoshO also in the post. and play both Keegan/Kris. Iowa can go with Keegan-Kris-Pmac for some minutes and play some zone. We need Keegan getting 34 min game, Kris 30 min game and those minutes will have to come out of PMAC and Rebraca, but more heavy out of PMAC because PMAC plays Kris' position.
Kris >>> PMAC....pretty obvious when you factor defense and rebounding.
More likely the reason is because those people recognize that starters inevitably do end up getting the most minutes at Iowa. Can you find a player under Fran that wasn't a starter and yet averaged even 24 minutes per game in a season?
Yeah. Kris is most effective from 2-4. He's obviously not replacing Keegan except for spot minutes. That leaves the 2 and 3 spots which are pretty much untouchable and Fran is unlikely to change the starting lineups. If Fran can get away from his hockey line changes and insistence on playing Connor 15+ per game, he could get Kris more minutes by moving him around between the 2-4 spots spelling all 3 of those positions. Still, I honestly can't see any path forward for Kris to get 25+ per game.
Keegan and Jordan are currently the only players on the team averaging more than 24 minutes per game in B10 play, while Patrick is at 24. Keegan leads the team in minutes with 126 even though he has only played in four of the five games. Jordan is next at 125 with Patrick third at 120, Filip next at 103 and then Kris at 102.
Kris and Jordan both led the team in minutes against Indiana with 29. Keegan was next with 22 minutes followed by Joe with 21 and then Filip, Patrick and Connor with 20. We will see what happens going forward. I think we all agree that Kris deserves to play more minutes, whether he starts or not.
Rebraca was what they got, but not what they needed. He still has to be on the floor to play D against the opposing post and rebound. He also needs to help protect Keegan from getting into foul trouble.
I'm still in favor of Josh and Riley getting some minutes as well to play D, give up fouls if needed and rebound.
Depending on the game, they may be able to do without Rebraca/Josh/Riley for extended periods. But I think more often than not they're still going to have to have a designated big man playing.
I'm still in favor of Josh and Riley getting some minutes as well to play D, give up fouls if needed and rebound.
Depending on the game, they may be able to do without Rebraca/Josh/Riley for extended periods. But I think more often than not they're still going to have to have a designated big man playing.
= Coaching Blunder
Ferentz started Tyrone Tracy, but others produced more, and Fer reduced his playing time accordingly, and now he’s left IOWA,
that is what professional coaches do, they adjust….
Fran coaches more like a stubborn contrararian, who always seems to know something everyone else can’t see…
Kris and Keegan are forwards and shooting guards,
they are NOT post players,
they should NOT be playing post
they should NOT be defending the post
they should on the court +30m a game, to provide elite scoring efficiency, and elite defense (on non post players)
IOWA has 3 guys that can play in post, score efficiency in the post, and provide 15 fouls in the post
Ogundele , Rebraca, Mulvey, 15 fouls in 40minutes. and probably 10 rebounds and 3 blocked shots.
PMac can play the 19mminutes/game that the Murray’s aren’t in
CMac playing in the big role is only in Uber disaster scenario or if up by 25.
This again should be obvious
So... You kinda missed the point. Foul trouble involving Keegan was the only reason that the minutes looked like they did against Indiana. In the 4 games prior, Kris played 20, 10, 13, 10. I don't care how many minutes anyone else has. The thread title is "Kris deserves to start" which led to a discussion by people like you suggesting that starting doesn't matter. The fact of the matter is that in most cases it does and Fran's history at Iowa demonstrates that. A bench player has never averaged more than 24 minutes under Fran. Kris won't either.
Anyone who argues with this is simply being deliberately obtuse. There are no arguable facts, metrics or otherwise to present in opposition to any of this with respect to what benefits the team the most. Of course, I know that there are those on here who will ignore all of this and will choose to argue anyway because that is what they do.
Oof I remember geniuses on here barking at me for saying this weeks ago
If Kris only played more minutes against Indiana because Keegan was in foul trouble, why did Patrick play four fewer minutes than normal? Wouldn’t Patrick have needed to play more minutes with Keegan in foul trouble and Kris taking Keegan’s minutes?
There are multiple factors that go into playing time and I do not believe it is as cut and dry as you make it out to be. I do agree though that Fran does not always sub as many of us think he should, which he has acknowledged.
I do think Keegan getting in foul trouble did contribute to more playing time for Kris, but I also think that Kris being more aggressive on both ends of the floor against Indiana kept him in the game. I hope that this game was a wake up call for Fran to play Kris more and for Kris to maintain that same aggressiveness with Keegan on the floor.
I do not believe that I missed your point. Kris is fifth on the team in playing time, so he is getting starters minutes. Also, there are currently only two players on the team averaging more than 24 minutes per game so starting does not guarantee that a player will get more than 24 minutes, just ask Joe T. I have said that I agree that Kris needs more minutes. I just do not care how he gets them.
I think Patrick is good at the point of the press that did get us back in this game.
Kris had a great offensive game but in the game thread fans were critical of his defense at times.
Clearly he needs more minutes but he has had very quiet games recently.
I am sure these are issues that Fran wrestles with.
Maybe it is not as simple as fans like to think.
Kris had a great offensive game but in the game thread fans were critical of his defense at times.
Clearly he needs more minutes but he has had very quiet games recently.
I am sure these are issues that Fran wrestles with.
Maybe it is not as simple as fans like to think.
He had 3 blocks, 3 steals and 11 rebounds. He is an excellent defender. He's quiet when he plays 11 minutes which is what he averaged over the 3 games prior to the Wisconsin game.
Patrick played fewer minutes because Connor was playing better.
Fran usually plays one or the other.
Pat plays the 3 pretty much exclusively.
Kris is usually the second unit 5 although he played both spots (4/5) against iu because both starters were in foul trouble.
More minutes today, Starter Pat or bench player Kris?
Trying to understand how a player that has a line of 29 points, 11 rebounds, 3 blocks, 3 steals in a Big 10 game is not a starter. That stat line is probably fairly rare for the a Big 10 starter with 14 teams in the conference when looking at many years of games
Interesting that Pat/Connor average minutes/game = 40
Trying to understand how a player that has a line of 29 points, 11 rebounds, 3 blocks, 3 steals in a Big 10 game is not a starter. That stat line is probably fairly rare for the a Big 10 starter with 14 teams in the conference when looking at many years of games
Interesting that Pat/Connor average minutes/game = 40
Fran rewarded Kris 29 point 11 rebounding dominat performance with 11 minutes vs bottom feeder MN
IOWA can beat a roster depleted bottom feeder without Kris, but we will see when IOWA faces too tier team s
IOWA can beat a roster depleted bottom feeder without Kris, but we will see when IOWA faces too tier team s
I can't recall ever seeing anything like the way Kris is being handled.
Closest thing I can think of is the way Fran handled Keegan last year.
Its just sad at this point because it's going to prevent Iowa from having the season they should.
Kris has a PER almost double anyone playing over him. Very few coaches in the nation would play him so few minutes
If Kris played the same minutes Keegan does he'd be showing up on draft boards similar to the way Keegan was the second half of last year.
I'm a long time Fran guy but I agree. This could lead to Kris leaving next year. I'm pretty sure he might start on 8 of the other Big Ten teams. It kind of reminds me of how Fran handles Jok his sophomore year. I hope it changes soon.
Part of me thinks Frans trying to prevent him from leaving this year.
Kris is better than Keegan was at the same point last year.
Yep, absolutely infuriating. Kris is the worst example, but if you look at conference PER the top 5 includes Kris, Perkins and Ulis. Three bench players. Toussaint is also top 5 and isn't allowed to finish games. Rebraca's PER has been near the bottom of the roster all season long, and PER tends to favor big guys.
No way to explain it, Fran simply doesn't have a clue. Same sort of lineup mismanagement we saw last season. Like last season, we will never get to see this team reach its full potential.
Maybe Kris was as good as Kegan last year but he only played 40 min hard to tell
Your answer is 32 for Pat and 11 for Kris. Entirety unsurprising given the history here. The only rotation player who played less than Kris was Sandfort by 2 minutes.
The word that popped into my head was absurd, but to each his own I guess.
Where are all the starting doesn’t matter clowns. This was extremely predictable that Fran would revert to convention. Going to blow another sweet sixteen shot fumbling roster mgmt.
I agree that Kris should have played more today and that Patrick received too much playing time. That being said, I thought Kris was less aggressive today while he was in and Patrick was more aggressive. Patrick took some bad shots today (particularly in the first half), but he was shooting and drove to the basket which was needed late in the game.
The Hawks were up 63-42 at the timeout at 11:11. Keegan, Kris, Arhon, Payton and Tony came in after that timeout. The lead shrunk to 13 points (68-55) by the timeout at 8:05. Fran brought Patrick, Jordan, Filip and Joe back in the game with Keegan to try and slow Minnesota down.
Unfortunately, this group did not do their job either and Minnesota continued to chip away until Keegan hit the big three point shot with 59 seconds remaining to put Iowa up by six and then Jordan made four free throws to seal the game. Fortunately, Iowa pulled out the win today.
The Hawks were up 63-42 at the timeout at 11:11. Keegan, Kris, Arhon, Payton and Tony came in after that timeout. The lead shrunk to 13 points (68-55) by the timeout at 8:05. Fran brought Patrick, Jordan, Filip and Joe back in the game with Keegan to try and slow Minnesota down.
Unfortunately, this group did not do their job either and Minnesota continued to chip away until Keegan hit the big three point shot with 59 seconds remaining to put Iowa up by six and then Jordan made four free throws to seal the game. Fortunately, Iowa pulled out the win today.
Boy, sometimes I wonder what game people are watching but then I remember a lot of fans just want their favorites to play more come hell or high water and they will justify it any way they can. Fran is obviously trying to bring on Kris slowly, he doesn't want to put too much pressure on Kris. I also think he likes bringing a scorer off the bench like him.
Kris has a ton of skill and talent but like most sophomores, he can be inconsistent. This game is a prime example, his stat line was 5 points, 2-4 FG, 0-2 3P, 1-3 FT, 2 REB, 1 AST, 1 BLK, 1 TO. That is a good line but it doesn't show that Kris was struggling a bit with his play, he had made several defensive mistakes, offensively he just couldn't seem to get going and his one TO was a bad one.
Kris is a thinker, he doesn't play instinctively like his twin Keegan but instead, he thinks. One of the problems thinkers can have is getting down on themselves for their mistakes or their perceived mistakes. Judging by his body language I think Kris was frustrated with himself and his play today.
Kris has a ton of skill and talent but like most sophomores, he can be inconsistent. This game is a prime example, his stat line was 5 points, 2-4 FG, 0-2 3P, 1-3 FT, 2 REB, 1 AST, 1 BLK, 1 TO. That is a good line but it doesn't show that Kris was struggling a bit with his play, he had made several defensive mistakes, offensively he just couldn't seem to get going and his one TO was a bad one.
Kris is a thinker, he doesn't play instinctively like his twin Keegan but instead, he thinks. One of the problems thinkers can have is getting down on themselves for their mistakes or their perceived mistakes. Judging by his body language I think Kris was frustrated with himself and his play today.
