Well stated. Lots of solid points & great perspective.
Kueter or Hill?
- Thread starter Inspiteofourselves
- Start date
I mean, I have no idea what’s going on in the Iowa room. If Kennedy is beating Gabe in the room next year, then obviously, he wins the spot (and I would assume Gabe would be more amenable to 184 next year since he wouldn’t be able to preserve eligibility any more). I’m just going on what I’ve seen from these guys in the matches I’ve seen, but Gabe has looked like the better wrestler to my eyes in the matches I’ve seen this year. Gabe to me has looked like the best recruit Iowa has gotten since Spencer with the potential to be a multiple time champ. PK should be an AA this year, so he’s really good in his own right, but I don’t see his ceiling nearly as high as Gabe’s. Again, I could be wrong and have no idea what’s happening in the room, but that’s my informed opinion.
Tough call to make but I would like to see Ben go from here. I think his upside is a little higher and he is only scratching the surface of his potential. I would like to see Ben pull the trigger with his offense more than he has so far. He is lean and quick so I don't like to see him stand toe-to-toe and tie up with other opponents that are quite a bit bigger... He should be able to get lower and attacks off and would like to see him shoot more - but like others have said, he may not do 2 sports for the next 4 years so see what you have with him...
I’ve been one of the charter members of the Hill fan club but it’s obvious that Ben is just better. Hill is a guy who’s good enough to make the podium in another 2 years or so. Will be interesting to see if he ever gets that shot at Iowa or ends up elsewhere.
You wrestle Keuter now and get the next 3(if he goes NFL)/4 years out of him, in order to get the next great HWT Ross out of Fort Dodge to come here after. Ross may be better than Keuter by the time he get to college.
A lot of LBs play at 230-250. At that weight with Ben's athleticism, HWT shouldn't be a problem. Just playing football at all regardless of position or weight is more likely to be a hinderance because of the time away from the room in the early season, but it is what it is if his dream is playing in the NFL.
Ben was 237 during football. He was 226.5 for the Oklahoma st dual. Doucet was 247. Yonger is about 235-238 depending on the day. So Ben is and will be big enough. Kerk is about 243-247 depending on the day. And all these #s are what they've weighed in at for duals recently
The simple truth is Ben will never be close to as good as he can be without football. The question really is, how good can he be still playing football? To me, mid level AA is probably the reasonable ceiling…
Ben isn’t wired like most. He different. I think it is still reasonable for him to win a title wrestling part time. To me, high AA and NCAA champ is still his ceiling.
Not if the top 285's stay like they have been. I agree that he is special, but DI is simply different. With football he will almost certainly be spending most of his offseason time focused on just football. No matter how good you are you aren't going to get near what you need focusing on wrestling maybe 1/3 of the year.
If he were wrestling full time, I would 100% be on board with him being a multiple NCAA Champ. But, that just isn't the case....
I don’t think Caliendo would make a good 57 if he has to cut off his leg. I would think Kennedy would have a better shot at making 57. But I’m not very confident that’s possible either.
And is Siebrecht beating Rathjen? I would guess it’s probably pretty close.
Ben is just too skilled even wrestling part time to think his best is mid level AA. He’s going to show up on the mat next January 15-20 lbs heavier, stronger, and it’s going to be a problem for the field.
I don’t think we are very far from each other here, to be honest.
When it comes to Ben's work ethic and talent level, I am sure we are aligned. I just can't downplay the fact that it is RIDCULOUSLY hard to win a DI title. This is true when you are 100% dedicated year round. With how demanding football will be with his time, for most of the year, I just can't ignore that hindrance.
If he does manage to win a title, it will be something special, because I am confident in saying it will be at a level considerably less than what he is capable of reaching...
It is pretty hard. But we are talking about his ceiling here. There’s a difference between a title and a “mid level AA.”
Again, it depends on the level of wrestlers at 285. His ceiling will NOT be a title next year either as long as Kerkvliet comes back. If 285 continues to have guys at that level(I believe Kueter could be if he was JUST wrestling), his ceiling is right where I said it is
I say all this because 285 has been ridiculously top heavy going all the way back to Gwiz. With it going so long with so many different guys(Gwiz, Snyder, Gable, Parris, Kerk) it is possible that 285 is starting to trend that way. Simply put, Kueter is NOT beating a guy like that focusing on football 2/3 of the year...
I consider Arnold a blue chip recruit no matter what his final ranking was out of HS.
It’s being reported that Hill will represent at heavy. I’m really surprised for the reasons that many espoused on this thread.
I’m in the camp of, why does anybody think he will not be at Iowa for five years?
There is nothing to suggest he is a guy who will be leaving early for the NFL draft. We don’t even know if he’s on track to start at Iowa.
When the next batch of LBers get mentioned, his name usually doesn’t come up unless they are talking about his rating coming out of high school. He might get there, but you have to squint at this point. At a minimum, you have him for three more years either way. I’d put more than my lunch on having him for four more years after this one.
If that has nothing do with your reasons, then I’m not talking to you, AF.
I don't think he will end up at LB anyway, I think he'll get the Aaron Kampman/Matt Roth treatment where he ends up at D-end after a couple years to put him in his best spot to get on the field and to have a pro future. But besides that even if he doesn't go pro early, you do risk that you'd miss out on the fifth year wrestling season if he's doing pro days or combines in spring 2028. I think he could still do both as difficult as that may be just like Josh Hokit did a couple years back it certainly wouldn't be unprecedented. But having him go now probably would have been more risk-averse to ensure you get four tournaments, as well as setting up the roster construction in advance for future potential recuits ie Ross at HWT. But I trust TNT and Kirk are on the same page for Ben's best interest too. At least Hill will get a chance to wrestle at Nationals which might be something he never expected. Would love for Riggins to steal that 8th spot too somehow for the same reason.
He’s got 2-3 years after next year. Not seeing many guys on the mat today who are going to be better than him in the coming seasons.
Even if he’s here for five years, he won’t be competing at wrestling his fifth year if he’s prepping for NFL draft, imo. So, if he doesn’t compete this year or his last year, that means he’ll only use 3 years of wrestling eligibility when smoke clears.
I think all of you that are doubting Keuter’s ceiling, this year, are nuts. He’s been playing multiple sports his whole life, winning world championships in wrestling. I’m surprised he’s not already destroying the top guys now but chalk that up to not being conditioned yet. A peaking Kueter at Nationals is not to be trifled with, and that includes the PSU guy. He performs under the lights and I think Gabe has that too. But you have to go grab it like Spencer did. You get what you earn. But it helps when you’re an athlete with the skills to support it and the heart to put it all together at crunch time.
So, you’ve got him penciled in higher than mid AA if he goes this year? Against THIS field, little mat time and underweight?
Good on you! I hope you’re right.
Some posters must stay up all night to come up with some of this crap.
lets put Ben on UBER lifting program and the FULL FEED BAG and then after he moves on in a couple years to the NFL We have Dreshaun Ross waiting in the wings and he steps onto the mat and gives us another 3 to 4 solid years of a Hammer at Heavyweight
What's your ideal weight for him to be at for football? Because once he hits wrestling, the pounds will shed off. It's just a different conditioning. I'm more under the theory he will only become a title challenger at HWT if he moves to DE. I just don't think he can keep the appropriate weight on at LB. Even if he weighs 250 lbs at LB, he'd most likely lose 15 pounds when wrestling starts.
All depends on what position they want him to play.
If its a true linebacker, likely the 235-240 range because he'll have to drop in coverage.
If he's some form of an Edge rusher, with very little coverage responsibility - 250-255. But that's not really up to the coaches, per say. It just depends on what his capabilities are as a player.
The difference between multi-sporting in High School and DI is cavernous. Honestly, it is an insult to the elite guys training year round to think he can even begin to put the amount of work in that they are, only focusing 1/3 of the year. On top of that, you are ignoring the negative impacts that football absolutely has on wrestling during the football season.
Look, the kid is super talented and Spooner may be right. The talent pool may drop considerably over the next few years at 285. If so, maybe he is talented enough to still win it all at 75-80% of his capabilities. But, all the guys I listed had comparable abilities and are MUCH closer to 100% of their capabilities than Ben ever will be with Football being the primary focus...
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And for all we know, maybe it's Ben's turn to be that dominant guy at HWT after a run of elite HWT dudes. But that is only if he is 100% committed.
245 or so and be 235 for wrestling. He was 237 this year and is 227 now
Correct. There was a time when/years when you're right - he could have been a top 3 guy. But not with this generation of athletic heavys who can actually wrestle.
To clarify - we all get official reports when a journalist basically chooses to tweet. But unless you have a coaches login to trackwrestling, weights are not publicly available.
LOL. well, i was going to completely sh*t on the year that was 2000, when John Lockhart from Illinois won the title by winning all the coin flips. Like, that was a year a part time Kueter could have won. But in googling - came across the below article. Lockhart became a freaking doctor.
https://dailyillini.com/uncategorized/2010/02/11/illini-of-the-decade-14-john-lockhart/
https://dailyillini.com/uncategorized/2010/02/11/illini-of-the-decade-14-john-lockhart/
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