Socialist Professors On Tenure

[fsu1jreed]

So I’m a professor. Am I a socialist? Do I indoctrinate my students? I’d really like to improve my performance. Could you please point to the day and time in which I spewed my socialist trap? I’d like to get that out of my curriculum, since that curriculum is approved by both the state of Iowa and the commission on accreditation of allied health programs.

Yea, I taught for four years for a Masters Degree program and still mentor Masters students for one of my alma maters (UWF)........I almost went your route, but really don't think said posters are smart enough to pick up on the sarcasm.

Oh I am definitely a college graduate, and I flat out had a few professors that spouted their left wing ideology more than teaching a subject.

What was your major and the classes that the professors that "spouted their left wing ideology more than teaching a subject"?

 

[Finance85]

Protip: College and university professors have absolutely "been on a payroll", and often they've worked their butts off to reach a tenure-track position.

Agree.

That said, many of them become complacent when they get that far. Graduate assistants take over. It's undeniable that many have a more liberal outlook.

 

[fsu1jreed]

Graduate assistants take over.

They take over more of the teaching, but it's because said professor's really focus on their research once they hit tenure. Which is another reason I call bullshit on the posters who said such professors spout such ideology........tenure level professor's really only teach senior level & master level classes.

 

[Joes Place]

Agree.

That said, many of them become complacent when they get that far. Graduate assistants take over. It's undeniable that many have a more liberal outlook.

...again, that's based on your definition of a 'liberal'.

People who analyze data, and question established theories for a living, tend to not follow the "conservative" mantra that "things are the way they are and we should not change them". That doesn't mean they are "liberal" or "socialists". And many actual conservatives have a similar 'what if?' mindset, but they are labeled as "RINOs".

 

[Joes Place]

Yea, I taught for four years for a Masters Degree program and still mentor Masters students for one of my alma maters (UWF)........I almost went your route, but really don't think said posters are smart enough to pick up on the sarcasm.



What was your major and the classes that the professors that "spouted their left wing ideology more than teaching a subject"?

They "made him think".

 

[strummingram]

Was this ever funny? It isn’t funny now.

I don't think it was intended to be funny. In fact, it's intended to be the exact opposite. If insults are funny, that is incidental. There's a general dislike for that poster. Eat Shit is intended to be harsh and critical... not funny

 

[thewop]

Tenure was a reasonable concept. Professors needed the ability to conduct research and further their field without having to worry so much about teaching. Great! We have universities to thank for MANY of our conveniences we enjoy today, and many other critically important things. However...

It's become a bit of a joke. It's more about "staying long enough" than actually accomplishing anything. I attended a top 20 MBA program and was surprised (and not surprised) at the number of professors who had little or no actual real world experience outside of academia. One professor I had Graduated from Florida in 2007, got a masters in 2009, then got a Phd from Iowa in 2013, and has been teaching ever since. No job listed on his profile other than professor. He had not yet achieved tenure but that was clearly his goal (he wasn't shy about saying it). I took an organizational behavior class from him. Yes, we were learning about managing organizational behavior at a top 20 MBA program from a guy who had never been a manager, let alone an HR director. He sure had read up on it though...

It always amazed me to hear tenured professors be introduced, or when they'd introduce themselves at the beginning of a term. They'd have all of these awards that had been given to them by other groups of professors, and been published in "prestigious" business journals that no business executive had ever heard of. It's like a club of you scratch mine, I'll scratch yours, and we'll all scratch each others... It's not that the information they were sharing wasn't good, it's just that most of it is theoretical since it was largely based in research and not real world application. It's not true of all professors.

I don't think this was the intended result of tenure when it was created.

 

[Rudolph]

All life is a conspiracy against OP and welders, too. Damn liberals.

 

[theiacowtipper]

Tenure was a reasonable concept. Professors needed the ability to conduct research and further their field without having to worry so much about teaching. Great! We have universities to thank for MANY of our conveniences we enjoy today, and many other critically important things. However...

It's become a bit of a joke. It's more about "staying long enough" than actually accomplishing anything. I attended a top 20 MBA program and was surprised (and not surprised) at the number of professors who had little or no actual real world experience outside of academia. One professor I had Graduated from Florida in 2007, got a masters in 2009, then got a Phd from Iowa in 2013, and has been teaching ever since. No job listed on his profile other than professor. He had not yet achieved tenure but that was clearly his goal (he wasn't shy about saying it). I took an organizational behavior class from him. Yes, we were learning about managing organizational behavior at a top 20 MBA program from a guy who had never been a manager, let alone an HR director. He sure had read up on it though...

It always amazed me to hear tenured professors be introduced, or when they'd introduce themselves at the beginning of a term. They'd have all of these awards that had been given to them by other groups of professors, and been published in "prestigious" business journals that no business executive had ever heard of. It's like a club of you scratch mine, I'll scratch yours, and we'll all scratch each others... It's not that the information they were sharing wasn't good, it's just that most of it is theoretical since it was largely based in research and not real world application. It's not true of all professors.

I don't think this was the intended result of tenure when it was created.

I teach a Career Technical Education program. I teach paramedics. I’ve been a paramedic for nearly 30 years and have taught for a decade or so. I’m going to be honest and say that I’m not sure there’s much value in practical experience in teaching this stuff. There’s a curriculum and you follow that curriculum. When someone starts into the path of “this is how it’s really done” they get into trouble.

I understand it may be different in the A&S world but that’s my opinion.

If you’re teaching business theory wouldn’t a well rounded education in theory be more valuable than anecdotal information obtained through experience?

 

[fsu1jreed]

If you’re teaching business theory wouldn’t a well rounded education in theory be more valuable than anecdotal information obtained through experience?

Exactly

 

[thewop]

I teach a Career Technical Education program. I teach paramedics. I’ve been a paramedic for nearly 30 years and have taught for a decade or so. I’m going to be honest and say that I’m not sure there’s much value in practical experience in teaching this stuff. There’s a curriculum and you follow that curriculum. When someone starts into the path of “this is how it’s really done” they get into trouble.

I understand it may be different in the A&S world but that’s my opinion.

If you’re teaching business theory wouldn’t a well rounded education in theory be more valuable than anecdotal information obtained through experience?

I'd be willing to bet the education you provide is much better than the one provided by someone who's read a lot of books and talked to a lot of people who do what you do. The buy-in from students is probably much greater for what you teach than for what someone less experienced would get too, which is just as important as the information itself.

Both can teach the theory, and there's value in it, but the one with experience can give examples of pitfalls that can happen in real life, and draw stories from their own experience. Avoiding potential problems is as valuable IMO as having the theory, and the guy who's done it can drive it home much better than the guy who hasn't, even if "in theory" both should be able to teach the same thing.

 

[joelbc1]

Welder will make more in a lifetime than a socialist snowflake with their gender studies degree.

Your point?

 

[joelbc1]

All life is a conspiracy against OP and welders, too. Damn liberals.

I said it before....that Obama fella was once tricky Muslim!

 

[sober_teacher]

I'd be willing to bet the education you provide is much better than the one provided by someone who's read a lot of books and talked to a lot of people who do what you do. The buy-in from students is probably much greater for what you teach than for what someone less experienced would get too, which is just as important as the information itself.

Both can teach the theory, and there's value in it, but the one with experience can give examples of pitfalls that can happen in real life, and draw stories from their own experience. Avoiding potential problems is as valuable IMO as having the theory, and the guy who's done it can drive it home much better than the guy who hasn't, even if "in theory" both should be able to teach the same thing.

That all depends on the quality of teacher involved. There are countless potential real-world examples that any teacher/professor can draw up to provide context, whether or not they personally have personal experience in a given field.

Similar to how some former players turnout to be good/great coaches and others don't. They can have difficulty with people who can't easily grasp what seems obvious to them.

 

[Milton Friedman disciple]

Any professors who teach something other than anything in STEM or skilled trade are useless to society.

 

[joelbc1]

Any professors who teach something other than anything in STEM or skilled trade are useless to society.

What if they teach “the importance of the union shop to the working man”? That should be a free pass.

 

[theVoicefromtheTomb]

Any professors who teach something other than anything in STEM or skilled trade are useless to society.

And yet, they make more money than you.

 

[Milton Friedman disciple]

And yet, they make more money than you.

I highly doubt that.

 

[LesClaypool]

Oh I am definitely a college graduate, and I flat out had a few professors that spouted their left wing ideology more than teaching a subject.

NO WAY you're a college graduate.

Which college?

 

[Joes Place]

Any professors who teach something other than anything in STEM or skilled trade are useless to society.

 

[FSUTribe76]

Spoken by people who have never been in ANY academic situation................I have two degrees, 7 years of college education, and 10 years of academic work and have never encounter ANY professor that spouted "socialist" ideas. The only time Marxism ever came up was in a Geographic Thought class when discussing political ideas throughout history and of the ~8 papers we had to read that week, it was only in one of them.

Both of you are talking out of your ass.

Same here. I have two separate bachelors one in Finance and one in Economics, a law degree, multiple post graduate certifications, and I am working on a doctorate in public health. Because I was dually enrolled in high school getting an AA only class and one semester after my high school degree, took summer classes at different schools while I was doing internships (at Tampa and Atlanta), and will have multiple bachelor and doctoral level degrees, I have taken classes at: THE College of William & Mary (screw you OSU, our THE is in the royal charter from 1693), Florida State University, Georgia Institute of Technology, University of Exeter, University of North Carolina, University of Florida (unfortunately), University of Tampa, Pasco-Hernando Community College and a school that’s changed names more than PDiddy in Georgia State University/Georgia Perimeter College/DeKalb College.

And at all of those colleges, getting degrees in Law, Public Health, Finance, Economics, Risk Management and some post grad certs, I NEVER had a single “Socialist” or communist professor. And I should point out that while my majors were always in areas conservatives would be attracted to, I also had credits that would have counted for minors in Music Performance, Psychology, Communications, and Film.

 

[ping72]

All I’ve taken away from this thread is that highly educated people are Democrats.

And that’s something pretty much all of us already knew.

 

[theiacowtipper]

I'd be willing to bet the education you provide is much better than the one provided by someone who's read a lot of books and talked to a lot of people who do what you do. The buy-in from students is probably much greater for what you teach than for what someone less experienced would get too, which is just as important as the information itself.

Both can teach the theory, and there's value in it, but the one with experience can give examples of pitfalls that can happen in real life, and draw stories from their own experience. Avoiding potential problems is as valuable IMO as having the theory, and the guy who's done it can drive it home much better than the guy who hasn't, even if "in theory" both should be able to teach the same thing.

The practical side of the course is led by experienced paramedic who conduct a field internship for the students which last a number of months. I’m talking about teaching skills. Teaching pathophysiology. I will grant the buy in from the students.

 

[BeepBeepInMyJeep]

One of the best professors I had at UI was a tenured professor by the name of Tim Hagle, who is very "open" about being a conservative. Additionally, my TA in the intro-level course made a point to avoid telling everyone how he leans politically and on the way out of the final, when I correctly identified him as conservative, he seemed quite impressed. When I later went back to school and got a STEM degree and could more easily pick up subtle hints, it's true that almost no instructors were all that open to discussing anything political although reading the tea leaves there seemed a pretty even cross-section of conservative and liberal.

It's pretty clear that a number of people making these posts in this thread have never completed a bachelor's degree, particularly at the University of Iowa. While I have no doubt there are more liberals than conservatives teaching at colleges, my guess is that has more to do with the number of people who obtain those advanced degrees than it does with any bias in the hiring process.

 

[thewop]

The practical side of the course is led by experienced paramedic who conduct a field internship for the students which last a number of months. I’m talking about teaching skills. Teaching pathophysiology. I will grant the buy in from the students.

Don't get me wrong, as a student I'd want my degree respected equally regardless, but I'd much rather take my chances with you, and experienced professional turned teacher, than a PhD with no experience outside academia.

 

[Herkmeister]

But your like ratio is, so thanks for stepping up.

You do have an impressive like ratio SoProud.

 

[LuteHawk]

Here is the truth: A tenured professor with a Ph.D.
is faced with the challenge to write books. He or
she must publish or perish. As it was stated upstream
they will only teach honor courses for seniors in
college and hold seminars for post graduate studies.

 

[theiacowtipper]

Here is the truth: A tenured professor with a Ph.D.
is faced with the challenge to write books. He or
she must publish or perish. As it was stated upstream
they will only teach honor courses for seniors in
college and hold seminars for post graduate studies.

The truth is you don’t really know what publish or perish means. Everyone one of my undergrad classes at Iowa, with the exception of rhetoric, was taught by associate or full professors.

 

[joelbc1]

Here is the truth: A tenured professor with a Ph.D.
is faced with the challenge to write books. He or
she must publish or perish. As it was stated upstream
they will only teach honor courses for seniors in
college and hold seminars for post graduate studies.

The one thing many a tenured professor faces is the duty to remain relevant in his/her chosen field of expertise. They either do that by writing or research. If they fail at this, they become irrelevant within their professional field.
Very few of you have this pressure upon your job performance. You might have to meet "standards and expectations" annually....but not the pressure cooker of writing or research. A few "professional" courtesy mandatory in-services to remain "current" usually suffice.....maybe a convention in Miami, Vegas, Palm Springs, LA od Hawaii......but hardly being forced to research/write and get published. Different pressures but pressure none the less.
The anti-intellectuals crowd has a tough time comprehending and absorbing the realities here.....but when was the last time you "published" or wrote a book based on your own idea(s)?

 

[joelbc1]

The truth is you don’t really know what publish or perish means. Everyone one of my undergrad classes at Iowa, with the exception of rhetoric, was taught by associate or full professors.

Me too. I attended a few colleges and many classes...and with the exception of "labs" or "discussion groups" I was always lectured too by an associate or full professor.....Not all Profs were very good/interesting at lecturing or presentation but they were all there giving it the old college try. A couple of them were excellent, however.

 

[fsu1jreed]

The truth is you don’t really know what publish or perish means. Everyone one of my undergrad classes at Iowa, with the exception of rhetoric, was taught by associate or full professors.

At UWF yea, but at FSU the PhD students were teaching ~80% of the undergrad courses (i.e. intro courses)...........I knew of 5 or 6 professors that maybe taught once a year/semester and they were always graduate courses.

 

[hawkedoff]

I teach a Career Technical Education program. I teach paramedics. I’ve been a paramedic for nearly 30 years and have taught for a decade or so. I’m going to be honest and say that I’m not sure there’s much value in practical experience in teaching this stuff. There’s a curriculum and you follow that curriculum. When someone starts into the path of “this is how it’s really done” they get into trouble.

I understand it may be different in the A&S world but that’s my opinion.

If you’re teaching business theory wouldn’t a well rounded education in theory be more valuable than anecdotal information obtained through experience?

Who develops the curriculum and sets the standards?

 

[hawkedoff]

Are people in here really saying that professors at the university level are not left of center politically by a wide margin? That is the position?

The question is whether they allow that personally held belief to influence their teaching and grading. I know some very socialist type professors at the university of Iowa. They are great people and while I don't agree with their politics I also have faith that they are professionals that teach the subjects well and to encourage critical thinking. I can think of only one professor in my personal history where this was not the case. A history class where she openly stated she blamed men for all the problems in the world and would kick men out of her class if they dared to speak anything other than what she proclaimed to be the truth. She was known to fail the guys or grade the downward. I dropped the class after two weeks

 

[sober_teacher]

Are people in here really saying that professors at the university level are not left of center politically by a wide margin? That is the position?

The question is whether they allow that personally held belief to influence their teaching and grading. I know some very socialist type professors at the university of Iowa. They are great people and while I don't agree with their politics I also have faith that they are professionals that teach the subjects well and to encourage critical thinking. I can think of only one professor in my personal history where this was not the case. A history class where she openly stated she blamed men for all the problems in the world and would kick men out of her class if they dared to speak anything other than what she proclaimed to be the truth. She was known to fail the guys or grade the downward. I dropped the class after two weeks

For me, I'm just seeing a lot of instances where socialist and liberal are being used interchangeably. Do universities have more liberal professors than conservative ones? Sure, though I have no idea what that ratio might actually be. As someone else pointed out, that can also vary greatly by field.

Sorry to hear about that bad experience with a professor - everyone seemingly has to have one. Mine was a journalism professor - she at one point had to apologize for how she had trashed someone's article/assignment...which got picked up by the Press-Citizen.

 

[WorldSeriesChamps2015]

Oh I am definitely a college graduate, and I flat out had a few professors that spouted their left wing ideology more than teaching a subject.

Trump University is not an actual college your fuggin moron.

 

[WorldSeriesChamps2015]

I highly doubt that.

My 8 month old makes more money than you.....

 

[preshlock]

One of the best professors I had at UI was a tenured professor by the name of Tim Hagle, who is very "open" about being a conservative. Additionally, my TA in the intro-level course made a point to avoid telling everyone how he leans politically and on the way out of the final, when I correctly identified him as conservative, he seemed quite impressed. When I later went back to school and got a STEM degree and could more easily pick up subtle hints, it's true that almost no instructors were all that open to discussing anything political although reading the tea leaves there seemed a pretty even cross-section of conservative and liberal.

It's pretty clear that a number of people making these posts in this thread have never completed a bachelor's degree, particularly at the University of Iowa. While I have no doubt there are more liberals than conservatives teaching at colleges, my guess is that has more to do with the number of people who obtain those advanced degrees than it does with any bias in the hiring process.

thread is a good indicator of the posters who have degrees and the ones that don't. I never encountered anything like the OP is describing while as an undergrad or grad student.

 

[theiacowtipper]

Who develops the curriculum and sets the standards?

NHTSA.

 

[TNHAWK79]

Just about every professor that is not at a private university. When have you not known the majority of professors to be liberal?

So I’m a professor. Am I a socialist? Do I indoctrinate my students? I’d really like to improve my performance. Could you please point to the day and time in which I spewed my socialist trap? I’d like to get that out of my curriculum, since that curriculum is approved by both the state of Iowa and the commission on accreditation of allied health programs.

First, back off the ledge. I said Liberal not socialist. Go back and reread.

 

[unIowa]

Why would anyone knowingly higher a socialist?