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Someone Explain how someone can think the Ukraine thing is OK?

Nat Algren said:
Are you a pothead, Focker? You've been smelling too many of your own farts. Where in effing hell does it say Ukraine is our common defense? How in bloody hell could you come to that determination? Kennedy rightly kicked Krushchev out of our hemisphere during the Cuban missile crisis when Soviet nukes were 1,100 miles from Washington. But, Moscow shouldn't be upset with NATO missiles 735 miles from them? Lay off the farts Dude.
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When Congress deems sending aide to any country is for commons defense, then it is approved. The constitution isn’t going to list Ukraine (or any country) specifically, brainiac. It’s called a Republic (if we can keep it).

I could give a crap if Russia cares there are missiles near by. Why do you care so much about what Russia cares about?
 
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ConvenientParking said:
Investigate through the proper channels if there is a concern there. Doesn't bother me. But Trump didn't do that, he instead decided to break the law.
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If there is a concern, contact AMERICAN authorities. Have them investigate the claims. It’s common sense.
 
The Tradition said:
I am absolutely exhausted by the dems' never-ending attempts to Get Trump.

It's despicable at this point. Defeat him at the ballot box. It really shouldn't be that hard.
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The Dems are exhausted at Trumps never ending corruption. Should they stop holding him accountable or should Trump stop the corruption?
 
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The Tradition said:
Biden did the EXACT SAME THING while serving as Vice President. He's on video bragging about doing it.
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Biden didn’t withhold hundreds of millions of dollars in Congressional-approved military aid. Please tell me you aren’t this stupid.

Do you think it is okay for the President to withhold Congressional-approved funding in an attempt to coerce an ally into investigating a political rival?

It’s a pretty simple yes or no question- I’m not interested in hearing a whataboutism.
 
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Bonerfarts said:
When Congress deems sending aide to any country is for commons defense, then it is approved. The constitution isn’t going to list Ukraine (or any country) specifically, brainiac. It’s called a Republic (if we can keep it).

I could give a crap if Russia cares there are missiles near by. Why do you care so much what Russia
cares about?
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Look Simpleton. Aiding an illegal government, which is what we did after overthrowing Yanukovych, that is thousands of miles from our shores cannot possibly be perceived as DEFENSE. Capiche? Party hustlers in Congress isn't what makes it legal.

As to your last moronic sentence: isn't it obvious that you couldn't give a crap? You're a knee jerk, blind-faith party reactionary. You don't think things through. Russia has more nukes than us, You damn well better care. Is it a hot war with Russia that you desire? If so, forget about climate change. Earth will be smoldering long after we evaporate.

They have wanted to be partners with us in the war on terrorism. We have rebuffed them at every turn. Your angst against them has pushed them into the arms of China. Now, we have an even bigger problem. Thanks!
 
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IAHawk2011 said:
Biden didn’t withhold hundreds of millions of dollars in Congressional-approved military aid. Please tell me you aren’t this stupid.

Do you think it is okay for the President to withhold Congressional-approved funding in an attempt to coerce an ally into investigating a political rival?

It’s a pretty simple yes or no question- I’m not interested in hearing a whataboutism.
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https://www.realclearpolitics.com/v...to_ukraine_to_force_firing_of_prosecutor.html
 
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The Tradition said:
What's the crime? Cite the CFR, counselor.
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The purposes underlying the impeachment process also indicate that non-criminal activity may constitute sufficient grounds for impeachment. The purpose of impeachment is not to inflict personal punishment for criminal activity. Instead, impeachment is a "remedial" tool; it serves to effectively "maintain constitutional government" by removing individuals unfit for office. Grounds for impeachment include abuse of the particular powers of government office or a violation of the "public trust"—conduct that is unlikely to be barred via statute.
 
mnole03 said:
18 USC 201 (b)(2)
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This is the opposite of bribery. Bribery means the president gets money for doing something. That's not what happened here.

Presidents withhold foreign aid for political reasons all the time. It's nothing new.
 
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Bonerfarts said:
The purposes underlying the impeachment process also indicate that non-criminal activity may constitute sufficient grounds for impeachment. The purpose of impeachment is not to inflict personal punishment for criminal activity. Instead, impeachment is a "remedial" tool; it serves to effectively "maintain constitutional government" by removing individuals unfit for office. Grounds for impeachment include abuse of the particular powers of government office or a violation of the "public trust"—conduct that is unlikely to be barred via statute.
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So, good luck with that. The House will impeach for political reasons and it'll be DOA in the senate.
 
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The Tradition said:
This entire thing is just another nothing burger in the wake of all the other nothing burgers that have gone before.

The Russians interference thing didn't work, Stormy didn't work, the parade of women who were supposedly raped didn't work, Billy Bush didn't work, kids in cages didn't work, Comey didn't work, Mueller didn't work, so now Trump is being impeached for the Ukraine thing. That's not going to work, either.

HOWEVER, the entire, never-ending wave of crap that didn't work might create enough Trump fatigue that it'll work at the ballot box a year from now.

So, soldier on, Trump-haters!
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If the "Ukraine thing" wasn't wrong/bad, why hide the facts of it as an administration? Tell people not to talk about it, tell people to disobey subpoenas. The same thing can be said of the Russian interference, why obstruct justice if nothing wrong was done? Why lie about paying off a porn star if it wasn't "bad"?
 
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ironside1 said:
If the "Ukraine thing" wasn't wrong/bad, why hide the facts of it as an administration? Tell people not to talk about it, tell people to disobey subpoenas. The same thing can be said of the Russian interference, why obstruct justice if nothing wrong was done? Why lie about paying off a porn star if it wasn't "bad"?
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This is not a "real" investigation! It's a political dog and pony show!

Do you not understand this?
 
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The Tradition said:
This is not opposite of bribery. Bribery means the president gets money for doing something. That's not what happened here.

Presidents withhold foreign aid for political reasons all the time. It's nothing new.
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The announcement of an investigation into your political appointment is something of value.
 
The Tradition said:
So, good luck with that. The House will impeach for political reasons and it'll be DOA in the senate.
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This doesn't make it right, let's wait and see how the public hearings go next week, if the poll numbers get bad enough your Republican Senators will abandon ship. You know, since it is all about what the public wants and being re-elected instead of doing what is right.
 
mnole03 said:
The announcement of an investigation into your political appointment is something of value.
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LOL! So the president of Ukraine makes some sort of announcement of an investigation into how Hunter Biden was installed into a position that he clearly was not qualified for.

I can just see this being a HUGE deal for voters in the USA. Then they go back to watching "Dancing with the Stars" and it's quickly forgotten.

Where's the value?
 
Formerly Rockymtnole said:
Trad, you’re a smart guy but you are embarrassing yourself in this thread.
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Okay, sure. It's amazing how Ukraine corruption has become the focal point of U.S. politics.

But yesterday it was the Russians.

Here's a thought... what if the focal point of U.S. politics was Main Street USA instead of Eurasia?
 
The Tradition said:
Okay, sure. It's amazing how Ukraine corruption has become the focal point of U.S. politics.

But yesterday it was the Russians.

Here's a thought... what if the focal point of U.S. politics was Main Street USA instead of Eurasia?
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Your guy is obsessed with Russia and Ukraine. What can we do?

The focal point is Trump’s brazen disregard for law, institution and the the truth. Sooner he’s gone the better.
 
The Tradition said:
LOL! So the president of Ukraine makes some sort of announcement of an investigation into how Hunter Biden was installed into a position that he clearly was not qualified for.

I can just see this being a HUGE deal for voters in the USA. Then they go back to watching "Dancing with the Stars" and it's quickly forgotten.

Where's the value?
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Stop with this nonsense. Hunter Biden graduated from Yale Law School, served on the board of directors of a major company (Amtrak, IIRC), worked as the Executive VP of a major bank holding company, worked for the US Department of Commerce, founded a successful lobbying firm, and founded a successful venture capital firm. What else does he need to accomplish to be qualified in your eyes?
 
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Formerly Rockymtnole said:
You really don’t see the difference?

Maybe you should be mad at Obama. Unless you think Biden was freelancing, then bragging about it. I’m sure that’s it.
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I think every president has done something similar. Hell, I know every president has done it.

I mean, Obama gave Iran their own money back in exchange for something that would help him politically.
 
The Tradition said:
I think every president has done something similar. Hell, I know every president has done it.

I mean, Obama gave Iran their own money back in exchange for something that would help him politically.
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How in Obama's second term was it going to help him politically?
 
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