So?
Taurasi's stats as of June 11 were pretty much in line with CCs.
You can do your own math on that one; and Taurasi doesn't play as many minutes, either. Which is how things work on the Olympic level - you don't play the whole game.
The CC Show....
- Thread starter Joes Place
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Taurasi's stats as of June 11 were pretty much in line with CCs.
You can do your own math on that one; and Taurasi doesn't play as many minutes, either. Which is how things work on the Olympic level - you don't play the whole game.
You’ll even try to excuse 2 points and an assist from an Olympic starter. lol.
Your character trait of pretending to be an expert in everything , and never admitting you’re wrong apparently extends to Caitlin Clark too. I did not expect that.
Your character trait of pretending to be an expert in everything , and never admitting you’re wrong apparently extends to Caitlin Clark too. I did not expect that.
Taurasi had 14 pts in the All Star game
Clark had 4
& Clark played 6 more minutes than Taurasi.
Clark set an all star assist record in her first appearance. And they were actually double teaming Clark…in an all star game. And Clark lead her team to a win, over the Olympic team, who you know really wanted to beat her.
One had 10 assists and was on the team that won
Clark did not "lead her team to a win"
Arike did. Clark certainly made some important plays, but she was not Game MVP. Arike was.
'Compare her numbers at the selection cutoff if you want apples-apples. Clark has been playing ~4 pts, 4 assists and 3 rebounds better since then.'
Rebounds
Before 4.92 After 6.69 increase of 1.77 so almost 3 more? or closer to half
Assists
Before 6.00 After 10.38 increase of 4.38 so almost spot on 4 increase
Points
Before 16.31 after 17.92 increase of 1.62 not quite half of the stated 4 point increase
You chose to ignore my question on the assist ratios so I went to another of your claims.
"Her Assist/TO ratio around that time was 1.1, which is not good for any guard, let alone one you want to consider an All Star.
2:1 or better is what you want.
So, go compare her stat lines against the other guards thru then and let's see how they stack up."
Let's see how it stacks up with another Olympian
Clark 6 Assists to 5.38 TO not stellar
Olympian 1.58 assists to 1.50 TO also not stellar
So pre selection
0.17 more rebounds
4.42 more assists
.79 more steals
.68 more blocks
3.88 more turnovers uggghh
.28 less points
So very clear that it was obvious that Clark didn't have a case at all, in no shape or way..............
Similar to Jaylen Brown being the reason the Celtics won the title. Didn't need that Tatum guy at all Brown was 'the' reason since he was the MVP. Definitely not a team victory at all......
You basically made my point for me.
Her numbers are not substantially better than Taurasi. Her turnovers are much worse during the period of play we're referring to.
Ergo: Her performance BEFORE the cutoff was virtually no different than Taurasi
Her performance SINCE has probably been BETTER than Taurasi.
Which is what I've been stating here.
And she will probably go on to become one of the best players in the league and win some MVP awards. But her play was 'on the bubble' to be on Team USA.
"Ergo: Her performance BEFORE the cutoff was virtually no different than Taurasi"
"CC was not playing at an elite level in the early season WNBA games. "
"Her early league play was sporadic, and "league average". Not "league all star". Since that date, her play has substantially improved"
Let me see if I follow......
virtually no different than Taurasi, in spite of all of the turnovers that people mention her A/TO ratio was actually better than Taurasi.
Taurasi was then 'not playing at an elite level'
Taurasi was 'sporadic and league average and not league all star' caliber
According to the coach that Joe refers to that wouldn't warrant Taurasi being even considered for the team. Even after the vast improvement for CC(which Taurasi hasn't matched) she would only rise to 'high consideration' for the team.
There are just a few flaws in the coach and joe's logic on this one. Unless the 'tryout criteria' doesn't actually entail playing at a high level. Because as you have said Taurasi was 'league average' 'not playing at an elite level' since she was virtually no different than CC.
They were virtually the same, spud.
And CC has had far more TOs, something that can really hurt a team in close games.
You seem to continue to avoid Dawn Staley's comment that if the selection committee had been able to foresee CCs numbers AFTER the cutoff, they may have made a different decision. You've literally posted that her numbers improved quite a bit since that point.
And that wealth of experience added up to 2 points and 1 assist against Japan.
And 0 TOs
Against a team with relentlessly fast guard play.
In fact, Gray and Taurasi combined for 1 TO.
Maybe you should go back to Herb Brooks' quote when selecting Team USA that beat the Russians in 1980:
"I'm not looking for the best players. I'm looking for the right ones"
This is where I copy and paste link to a thread demonstrating the Joe will never ever never ever admit he's wrong. Should have known better than to engage him. Just let him live in his own world.
WOB or not WOB - you decide
If a car is pimped/optioned out, is it "tricked out" or "tripped out"?
iowa.forums.rivals.com
So she’s neither a liability nor an asset. She’s basically a placeholder.
I mean, that’s practically the Olympic motto.
High turnovers are a liability.
CCs turnover rates are among the highest in the WNBA.
Furthermore, against physical play, she did not adjust well in the WNBA in her first games - and that play gets even more physical in international play (which you witnessed in the Japan game).
Too many times, when CC gets fouled and turns the ball over, but the foul is not called, she stops playing and pleads to the refs. In international play, that is a HUGE liability. That is an aspect of her game she needs to improve upon, and "play through" vs. trying to pander to the refs. It will lose you games in the Olympics. The CC that played her first ~10-12 WNBA games would not have performed well at all under the pressure Japan's guards gave Team USA. If you watched that game, you'd understand.
‘Spud’
Nice work.
Essentially they were the same player. You are uniquely focused on turnovers yet Taurasi had a worse a/to ratio than CC. Ignore that all you want. Taurasi was a no doubter while CC had to improve a great deal to get high consideration. I even mentioned the coaches comments, odd way to ignore it.
So will CC be ignored next time? You know because of her ‘lack of experience’?
One player creates more, rewards more, the other is the safer choice with a worse a/to ratio. Because you know 2:1 is the criteria. Or is it something else?
My point exactly.
One had years of international top-tier experience.
Other had zero.
Unsurprising which one the decision tilted towards.
They are virtually the same.
But Taurasi has far fewer TOs in game play.
Pretty sure that CC's Assist/TO ratio has gotten better since those first 10+ games, and will continue to do so.
Taurasi has fewer turnovers because she doesn’t handle the ball as much and isn’t asked to facilitate the offense like Clark does and is. Taurasi had the second-highest turnovers per game last year and the most turnovers per minutes played.
Taurasi also doesn’t have the opposing team’s best defender matched up on her. Kahleah Copper has to deal with that. Clark not only has the other team’s best defender in her face from the moment she starts signing autographs after the pre-game shootaround, she frequently gets double-teamed as soon as she gets the ball.
Seems like all you want to do is post anecdotal stuff here and avoid actual numbers.
Lol, that’s rich coming from a guy who justified DT’s 2 points and 1 assist by declaring that Japan’s guards were relentless.
It's not anecdotal. They have played 26 games which we all have watched. Those are direct observations and the observations of commentators during and after the games. Because you have not watched the games does not mean that those observations are invalid.
Now do her 10 assists for the all star game, which was a rookie record, and which would have been more if she did not voluntarily take herself out the sub rotation when Ogunbowale was on fire.
In JP’s defense, the Olympic team did kind of embarrass the upstarts in that game.
Joe’s Place thinks Jordan McLaughlin & Tyus Jones are the best PGs in the NBA solely because of their assist-turnover ratio.
I think you had those teams swapped in that sentence, but I see what mean.
0-3 from the field
0 points
0 assists
0 rebounds
“Yeah, but she only had one turnover. Belgium’s guards were relentless.”
— Joes Place
0 points
0 assists
0 rebounds
“Yeah, but she only had one turnover. Belgium’s guards were relentless.”
— Joes Place
And yet you're citing anecdotal points and ignoring numbers.
The numbers did not clearly favor her. That's what I've pointed out to you for pages here.
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