This might be a little tougher than Putin thought...
- Thread starter Nole Lou
- Start date
May be a sign of Russian concern if not just helicopters-other aircraft are said to have been avoiding Ukraine airspace.
"NOW: Reports of massive Russian missile attack in #Mykolajiw . A total of ten missiles (unconfirmed) are said to have hit the city's two largest universities, including the Naval College."
"New attacks against Nikolaev. The target of the attack was the buildings of the Nikolaev Shipbuilding Institute, which were turned into a Ukrainian military base."
"New attacks against Nikolaev. The target of the attack was the buildings of the Nikolaev Shipbuilding Institute, which were turned into a Ukrainian military base."
If only their government would act upon it.
Love it. Every bullet, shell, round, etc blown up is one that cannot be used to kill children and commit war crimes. Light 'em up.
Saw a story this morning on TV (so can't link) of a Ukrainian pastor and his congregation held hostage by the Russians. The pastor was told that if he didn't give up Ukrainian positions they would shoot people in the head while he watched and that the pastor would be skinned alive when it was done.
Ukraine led a counter attack and the Russians fled, thank God.
Ukraine led a counter attack and the Russians fled, thank God.
I really want to know what the response will be at the end of all this. The war crimes are obvious for all to see. Nobody better get away with this stuff.
The ‘new report’ is citing the reports from the former Ukrainian human rights ombudsman (Denisova) that was sacked by their parliament for spreading disinformation about rapes. This is recycling a discredited report as a new report by simply repeating it:
The report also highlights a report by Commissioner for Human Rights Denisova that 25 girls aged 14 to 24 were kept in a basement in Bucha and gang-raped by Russian troops, resulting in nine becoming pregnant
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The precision of these weapons is amazing. Look at this post-strike ammo dump:
Another Russian reporter, Roman Sapenkov, said he witnessed the strike at the weekend on the Russian base at Kherson’s airport.
“I was struck by the fact that the whole packet, five or six rockets, landed practically on a penny. Usually MLRS lands in a wide area, and at maximum range they scatter like a fan,” he wrote, referring to multiple launch rocket systems that are less advanced than HIMARS or the M777.
The bottom one is just spectacular with what must be rockets and missiles flying out. Hope they did even more damage on the Russians.
Good to know this story was not true.
Link describes sexual violence around the world and how rape reports continue to increase as Russia uses it as another weapon of war. (Sick bastards.)
https://press.un.org/en/2022/sc14926.doc.htm
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I think they were correct to be cautious at the outset.
This far into the conflict, however, it is clear Russia saber-rattling is simply a bluff.
I don't want NATO troops, but I am 100% in favor of giving the Ukrainians even more and even better weapon platforms, including ones that can strike Russians in Russian territory. And definitely it is LONG past-due to supply fighter jets and bombers.
So yeah, currently, I think the administration remains on a too-cautious footing --- it is time to fully arm Ukraine as if it were already a NATO member, IMO.
I don’t know about all the way to Moscow, but we clearly need to up the abilities for Ukraine to strike 150-200 miles. We need to allow Ukraine to hit the bridge into Crimea. And, we need to make sure they have enough firepower to send a message to Lukashenko in Belarus. If your troops come across the border we blow up stuff in your country.
My Dad really enjoyed when the new auto models came out. Though he only bought family sedans.
"The LAST #Leopard2A6 leaves the #PzBtl393 and the #Kyffhäuserkaserne . From now on only #Leopard2A7V .
@Deutsches_Heer"
"The LAST #Leopard2A6 leaves the #PzBtl393 and the #Kyffhäuserkaserne . From now on only #Leopard2A7V .
@Deutsches_Heer"
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Ukraine today again repeated that they would not send the HIMARS into Russia. Too bad the West makes them fight with their hands tied.
I think if Belarus comes in to this by attacking Ukraine it’s the trigger for all out war. I think a 1 v 1 battle the Europeans are good with standing by and just providing weapons and support. Kind of like a bar fight, two guys going at it and others will just watch, someone else jumping in and making it two on one, bystanders won’t view that as fair and will jump in to help the lone guy(as long as he is not an assh@le😀)
I agree with everything you posted minus giving them the ability to strike deep into Russia....by deep I mean Moscow deep. Interdicting Russia's supply chains ect close to the border is fair game.
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I guess I can't understand the thinking that its OK for Russia to target Kyiv and every other major Ukrainian city, but Ukraine should be restrained from hitting Russian cities. It's a war -- in WWII, the Allies bombed the shit out of Berlin and Tokyo. Hit them where it hurts.
It's not ok to do that.
We give Ukraine the ability to rain missiles on the Kremlin that's pretty escalatory. That's regime change escalatory and Putin and crew will do what they need to do to put a stop to it.
How can they put a stop to it minus total withdrawal from Ukraine...which isn't in the cards IMO.
Obviously can't do it conventionally.
Maybe they decide it's time to launch a Nuke at a Ukrainian city and say "stop" or we continue.
What's the NATO/US response to that?
Russia still has that Trump card...just because they haven't played it doesn't mean they never will.
(I'd also add we're not privy to all the communications between Russia and the US......maybe this has been discussed. You do this....we do this. Who knows...)
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Yup, which is why I said in my opinion.
I don't believe Putin or the Russians are suicidal or crazy. They are cunning and willing to be global pariahs, but I absolutely believe they are not willing to go down the nuclear path.
If that is true, then the best way to accelerate the end of this conflict is to increase the military power of Ukraine to such a point Russia is forced to withdraw.
Torbee, I know you are just copy pasting so this isn't directed at you. I'm just helping clarify for others.The precision of these weapons is amazing. Look at this post-strike ammo dump:
Another Russian reporter, Roman Sapenkov, said he witnessed the strike at the weekend on the Russian base at Kherson’s airport.
“I was struck by the fact that the whole packet, five or six rockets, landed practically on a penny. Usually MLRS lands in a wide area, and at maximum range they scatter like a fan,” he wrote, referring to multiple launch rocket systems that are less advanced than HIMARS or the M777.
Roman Sapenkov is partially correct. HIMARS isn't more accurate than MLRS. The systems are essentially the same. It's their transportation platform that makes them different. HIMARS is a truck mounted rocket system. MLRS is a track mounted system. Both systems traditionally fire 6 x rockets that contain hundreds of bomblets inside each one. They "detonate" in the air over a target area dispersing bomblets all over. MLRS/HIMARS rockets can also fire 6 x GMLRS (Guided munitions) that have a single warhead. Both HIMARS and MLRS can also fire ATACMS.
M777 is just a Cannon that is lighter than traditional 155mm artillery allowing it to be more easily flown into area via helicopter. The M777 (towed) and M109A6 (self propelled) both fire the same 155mm rounds including the guided Excalibur rounds.
M777 and M109A6 with Excalibur
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Incendiary rounds use against troops is illegal. It's basically burning soldiers to death. In the army we used to fire both incendiary and regular impact rounds together and call it "shake and bake." That has since been outlawed.
Watching that happen right over me would get me moving away quick. Those guys are watching them like they are fireworks.
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So if Ukraine has 15 MLRS and the 12 HIMARS, the situation is a little better than what many of us thought it seems. (Wish they would give them more of the 360 HIMARS the US has.)Torbee, I know you are just copy pasting so this isn't directed at you. I'm just helping clarify for others.
Roman Sapenkov is partially correct. HIMARS isn't more accurate than MLRS. The systems are essentially the same. It's their transportation platform that makes them different. HIMARS is a truck mounted rocket system. MLRS is a track mounted system. Both systems traditionally fire 6 x rockets that contain hundreds of bomblets inside each one. They "detonate" in the air over a target area dispersing bomblets all over. MLRS/HIMARS rockets can also fire 6 x GMLRS (Guided munitions) that have a single warhead. Both HIMARS and MLRS can also fire ATACMS.
M777 is just a Cannon that is lighter than traditional 155mm artillery allowing it to be more easily flown into area via helicopter. The M777 (towed) and M109A6 (self propelled) both fire the same 155mm rounds including the guided Excalibur rounds.
M777 and M109A6 with Excalibur
- Sep 13, 2002
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I can’t wait to see what they do with the UK version. Apparently their version is even deadlier.
It can load and fire 12 missiles vs. 6 for HIMARS. Both can use the same array of missiles. M270 is tracked. HIMARS is on wheels.
Right on cue...
"
Ukraine's defense minister said on Friday that the first M270 multiple rocket launch systems had arrived in Ukraine, without specifying the country which handed them over.
"They will be good company for HIMARS on the battlefield," minister Oleksii Reznikov wrote on Twitter, referring to the US-donated systems which Ukraine says it has used to hit Russian ammunition depots and barracks.
Ukraine says it has hit over 30 Russian "military logistics targets" in recent weeks, hurting Russia's assault capability."
english.aawsat.com
"
Ukraine's defense minister said on Friday that the first M270 multiple rocket launch systems had arrived in Ukraine, without specifying the country which handed them over.
"They will be good company for HIMARS on the battlefield," minister Oleksii Reznikov wrote on Twitter, referring to the US-donated systems which Ukraine says it has used to hit Russian ammunition depots and barracks.
Ukraine says it has hit over 30 Russian "military logistics targets" in recent weeks, hurting Russia's assault capability."
First M270 Rocket Systems Have Arrived in Ukraine
Ukraine's defense minister said on Friday that the first M270 multiple rocket launch systems had arrived in Ukraine, without specifying the country which handed them over. "They will be good company for HIMARS on the battlefield," minister Oleksii Reznikov wrote on Twitter, referring to the...
english.aawsat.com
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